Player Discussion Andrei Kuzmenko

[Figgy44]

Sharky isn't a great centerman though. Zary's better but either way, locking up all these spots at the beginning of a rebuild is just bizarre management.

Kuzmenko's too similar to Huberdeau and the Flames are already stuck with the latter for basically forever.

Fair, but Rango is also a LHS RW. So the handedness is an issue.

I remember it being a debate in the Hartley years. Handedness isn't an issue that cannot be overcome, but having the alternate handedness as an option means you don't have to work as hard to overcome it.

Zary, Basha, Gridin, Honzek, Suniev, Pelts etc. are all LHS. Other than Coronato, I don't think we have a top 6 RHS possibility. Coronato and Kuzmenko are literally the only ones.

 

[Some Other Flame]

Fair, but Rango is also a LHS RW. So the handedness is an issue.

I remember it being a debate in the Hartley years. Handedness isn't an issue that cannot be overcome, but having the alternate handedness as an option means you don't have to work as hard to overcome it.

Zary, Basha, Gridin, Honzek, Suniev, Pelts etc. are all LHS. Other than Coronato, I don't think we have a top 6 RHS possibility. Coronato and Kuzmenko are literally the only ones.

Yeah, okay that's a fair point. And maybe on that basis alone a short (i.e. 2 years or less) extension could make some sense, especially if Coleman is moved. Anything longer than that would be a problem though.

Because at 29, Kuzmenko simply isn't a viable longterm solution. And either way, handedness is going to be ongoing problem unless the Flames find a way to draft Roger McQueen and he's probably going to go in the top 3.

For what it's worth, the Flames also have Lipinski, Laing, & Hoskin as right shot forwards.

 

[Yepthatsme]

“Scorched earth”. The Flames look like they’ll have 4 players under 25 on their roster. Wolf, Zary, Bahl and Pospisil. 5 if you count Pelletier.

And in two years here’s what our roster looks like with forwards who still have contracts:
X-X-X
Huberdeau-Kadri-X
X-X-Rango
X-X-Coleman

If you can find a spot for a young guy or two let me know. I’m pretty sure we can afford to re-sign a player.

 

[Figgy44]

Yeah, okay that's a fair point. And maybe on that basis alone a short (i.e. 2 years or less) extension could make some sense, especially if Coleman is moved. Anything longer than that would be a problem though.

Because at 29, Kuzmenko simply isn't a viable longterm solution. And either way, handedness is going to be ongoing problem unless the Flames find a way to draft Roger McQueen and he's probably going to go in the top 3.

For what it's worth, the Flames also have Lipinski, Laing, & Hoskin as right shot forwards.

Yep. Schwindt too. But that list is short and the likelihood of them being top 6 forwards or applicable on the PP is low. Bottom 6 RHS options I think we are OK long term.

I agree that a short extension is OK, but not a long one.

I've been beating the drum for wanting to see if there was a way to pry Wright from Seattle. At least that way we have a RHS forward as our 2C at minimum.

It's kinda crazy to think that we had no legitimate top 6 RHS player for a long time until we acquired Lindholm. Then he was the only one until Toffoli, but then he was the only one again until we swapped him for Kuzmenko. I hope we target another top 6 forward option RFA soon.

 

[Lunatik]

I'm not interested in extending Kuz. For a Christmas present send him to a playoff team and get back a pick/prospect. I love his personality, but he reminds me too much of Kristian "Useless" Huselius

 

[Rubi]

I just don't understand how a 29-30 year old (2025-26 season) Kuzmenko fits into Conroy's rebuild plans. If he gets extended, talk about an unforced error.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

Fair, but Rango is also a LHS RW. So the handedness is an issue.

I remember it being a debate in the Hartley years. Handedness isn't an issue that cannot be overcome, but having the alternate handedness as an option means you don't have to work as hard to overcome it.

Zary, Basha, Gridin, Honzek, Suniev, Pelts etc. are all LHS. Other than Coronato, I don't think we have a top 6 RHS possibility. Coronato and Kuzmenko are literally the only ones.

Handedness of wingers is severely overrated. It's pretty much only relevant for the powerplay and Kuzmenko is primarily a net front guy so it's not that relevant. Essentially you want your slot and 1 timer guy to both shoot the same way so that your play makers can always place it in their wheelhouse. Facing towards the net, if you are funneling the puck from the left side you want 2 left handed shots in the middle and the far flank, and vise-versa if you are funneling from the right. Tampa's powerplay the last couple years has been what I would call ideal. They had Hedman and Kuch funneling shots from the right side to Stamkos and Point who are both RHS.

 

[Lunatik]

Handedness of wingers is severely overrated. It's pretty much only relevant for the powerplay and Kuzmenko is primarily a net front guy so it's not that relevant.

It's overrated because some think it is this huge deal... it's not a huge deal but it is absolutely relevant at 5v5 too... If all your LW shoot Left, and all your RW shoot right, then all the shots from those sides are coming from similar angles. I'm a fan of having at least 1 right shooting LW and one left shooting right wing, just to switch up those angles a bit.

 

[Figgy44]

Handedness of wingers is severely overrated. It's pretty much only relevant for the powerplay and Kuzmenko is primarily a net front guy so it's not that relevant. Essentially you want your slot and 1 timer guy to both shoot the same way so that your play makers can always place it in their wheelhouse. Facing towards the net, if you are funneling the puck from the left side you want 2 left handed shots in the middle and the far flank, and vise-versa if you are funneling from the right. Tampa's powerplay the last couple years has been what I would call ideal. They had Hedman and Kuch funneling shots from the right side to Stamkos and Point who are both RHS.

Indeed it's overrated. But having only 1 or zero right shot forwards in your top 6 has its disadvantages too.

 

[Mobiandi]

Both Sharangovich and Kuzmenko should be shipped out. Keeping one is understandable. Signing both is ridiculous

 

[Anglesmith]

A Kuzmenko extension is good if it takes us to where there is a young replacement ready and no further. Extension doesn't have to mean 8 years.

 

[JPeeper]

If we extend Kuzmenko, no way it goes more than 3 years. Even that is too long for me (and probably everyone else here). He's going to be 29 in February.

 

[Lunatik]

A Kuzmenko extension is good if it takes us to where there is a young replacement ready and no further. Extension doesn't have to mean 8 years.

I don't want to sign one, but you are 100% right and there are many overreactions. A 2-3 year deal isn't a big issue

 

[Khrox]

If we extend, 1-2 years is fine. Still leaves a lot of room for the young guys to push the roster. That said, lets see how the season goes before working ourselves into a frenzy by criticizing hypothetical moves that haven't even happened.

 

[Rubi]

I think you guys are dreaming if you think, at age 29, Kuzmenko would sign a 1-3 year extension.

 

[Bounces R Way]

He's a talented player on the right side of 30. Sadly currently probably our most talented roster forward in his 20s although Zary has and continues to really impress me. Don't really see the hurry to get rid of Kuz, but neither do I see a hurry to extend him.

If he's having a great season where everything is going in I think you have to trade him to the highest bidder. If you don't get any trade offers you like, well why not talk extension. Not like we're hurting for cap space anymore. Just make it clear it needs to happen before the TDL if it were to happen. Yeah we have a lot of good winger prospects right now. That's all they are at this point though, and not very likely they all turn out.

Fans sometimes get this idea that a rebuild is entirely made up of high drafted prospects who all hit their stride at the same time. That's just not how it works. Good drafting can give you that foundation and core but the great teams are made up of all sorts. 2 years would be ideal but could be talked into 3 or even 4 if the AAV makes it likely he provides good value for the duration. Like the goofball but would ultimately prefer the traded this year option if it came down to it.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

If we extend Kuzmenko, no way it goes more than 3 years. Even that is too long for me (and probably everyone else here). He's going to be 29 in February.

Unfortunately him being 29 soon is why he will want a long term deal. Once you hit 30 is is significantly harder to get that big contract.

How do people feel about a trade involving Kuzmenko for Kakko+ at the deadline? I think Kakko could be a Sam Bennett like story where he could really benefit from a chance of scenery.

 

[Lunatik]

Unfortunately him being 29 soon is why he will want a long term deal. Once you hit 30 is is significantly harder to get that big contract.

How do people feel about a trade involving Kuzmenko for Kakko+ at the deadline? I think Kakko could be a Sam Bennett like story where he could really benefit from a chance of scenery.

Kuzmenko doesn't really have much leverage right now IMO. He's 29 with just 2 years of NHL experience, he had a great first season (with a ridiculously high shooting %), then in his second he was playing so poorly he was literally given away as a throw in to shed salary because he'd become such a liability. Then here, he started scoring again because we fed him the situations and ice-time he needs to succeed.

He's the kind of guy that needs to play in the right role, in the right system or he'll hurt your team more than he'll help it. Playoff contenders aren't going to throw a larger salary and/or term at him because they will be hesitant to dress him in the playoffs unless he's producing. I don't see why any team would be willing to give him more than 3 years. While older, he's kinda in a similar position to Sharangovich was when we acquired him last summer.

I'd put him in a similar position to Shane Gostisbehere in terms of leverage. He was dumped because he wasn't playing to his cap, and is the kind of player where he is a liability when not producing. Then was at 30 he was a free agent and only able to get a 1 year deal, at a paycut, despite putting up decent points in back to back seasons after being dumped in Arizona. And even after a 3rd decent season in a row, at 31, he only got 3 years, at an even lower salary.

 

[Yepthatsme]

He's a talented player on the right side of 30. Sadly currently probably our most talented roster forward in his 20s although Zary has and continues to really impress me. Don't really see the hurry to get rid of Kuz, but neither do I see a hurry to extend him.

If he's having a great season where everything is going in I think you have to trade him to the highest bidder. If you don't get any trade offers you like, well why not talk extension. Not like we're hurting for cap space anymore. Just make it clear it needs to happen before the TDL if it were to happen. Yeah we have a lot of good winger prospects right now. That's all they are at this point though, and not very likely they all turn out.

Fans sometimes get this idea that a rebuild is entirely made up of high drafted prospects who all hit their stride at the same time. That's just not how it works. Good drafting can give you that foundation and core but the great teams are made up of all sorts. 2 years would be ideal but could be talked into 3 or even 4 if the AAV makes it likely he provides good value for the duration. Like the goofball but would ultimately prefer the traded this year option if it came down to it.

It’s crazy, like some people are talking like it’s a failure if in 2 years our roster doesn’t look like:

Honzek-Zary-Gridin
Basha-Pospisil-Coronato
Stromgren-Misa-Battaglia
Huberdeau-Kadri-Klapka

Weegar-Parekh
Solovyov-Brzustewicz
Grushnikov-Poirier

It’s an aggressive strategy just breaking in 2 rookies into a forward lineup in a season, it’s already a struggle to hide them in spots you can ease them in to the lineup and give them easy matchups. It’s also very likely most of those names do not end up being NHL players. We also don’t have a single prospect who if they played in the AHL today I’d say they don’t have anything to learn from it, especially considering how successful that team should be compared to our NHL roster.

Personally I’d love to have him back, if nothing else than he (and Barrie) should actually give us a semblance of a good powerplay which I feel like we haven’t had most of the last decade. Until the day we got Kuzmenko our powerplay was 4th last, and from that day on it was 14th best, while being top 5 the last 2 months while he turned it on. 5 years at 6 million seems like a fair deal for both sides. If in year 3-4 we actually have a prospects who are proving they could be better producers or just need the minutes, you can slide him down to provide offense down the lineup or trade him for the spare parts people want him traded for this season.

 

[Anglesmith]

I think you guys are dreaming if you think, at age 29, Kuzmenko would sign a 1-3 year extension.

I don't honestly care if he does or doesn't want to. I'm just saying it's ok if the Flames offer a 1-3 year extension. And if he says no that's fine.

 

[Rubi]

I don't honestly care if he does or doesn't want to. I'm just saying it's ok if the Flames offer a 1-3 year extension. And if he says no that's fine.

Its also ok for the Flames to offer him $5m a year for those 1-3 years. He'll say no to that too. Which is fine... because his acceptance is about as likely to happen as the dream I had last night about me and Kate Upton.

 

[Figgy44]

Its also ok for the Flames to offer him $5m a year for those 1-3 years. He'll say no to that too. Which is fine... because his acceptance is about as likely to happen as the dream I had last night about me and Kate Upton.

I think your opinion is about as likely as whether you had a dream about yourself and Kate Upton. But it's OK, I think odds are about as big as the performance in your dream. (I kid! I kid! You are still brethren in my eyes Rubi!)

But Kuzmenko came to NA to play in the NHL at age 26. He signed a 1 year $950K ELC. Then a 2x 5.5 AAV contract. 1-3 years is all he's ever known and I'm not sure he's had enough track record to demand more. So if the Flames offer the Sharangovich contract, I don't think he would pause.

Whether the Flames should offer the Rango contract is a different story. But even Rango's AAV at <3 years, I think he'd easily consider it. The worst thing to do would be to get traded at TDL, get injured and looking at <$5AAV offers in UFA at 1-2 year terms. I don't think Kuzmenko would refuse short contracts for the sole reason of demanding term. I think term to him would be a bonus.

Now the other possibility is that his is going on because whoever acquires him at the TDL may want that info to determine if they want to be the ones to extend him. Conroy would request teams meet his asset demands or he'll extend. But meet the asset demands, Conroy will also toss in the contract negotiation stuff as a bonus so the acquiring team doesn't need to put in as much effort to potentially keep him.

 

[Mobiandi]

I don't honestly care if he does or doesn't want to. I'm just saying it's ok if the Flames offer a 1-3 year extension. And if he says no that's fine.

I trust the Flames will be wise about term because they found it easy to walk away from Toffoli after finishing as our top pointsman. Really, the only reason to extend Kuzmenko is prolong his value as a trade chip.

 

[Figgy44]

I trust the Flames will be wise about term because they found it easy to walk away from Toffoli after finishing as our top pointsman. Really, the only reason to extend Kuzmenko is prolong his value as a trade chip.

Or include the groundwork for an extension as part of the value offered in the trade, thus increasing interested parties/his trade value slightly.

 

[badi]

He should be gone and Put Coronato there who is a better player and futur key one