Value of: Andrei Kuzmenko

[Gman88]

With Kuzmenko not playing upto his pace last season (he was unlikely to score 39 again), what's his value right now? It would have been best to offload him last season for the most value but that ship has sailed and with how unhappy Tocchet is with Kuzmenko's play, I'm sure the Canucks would consider moving on from him if it means getting back a top 6 winger or top 4 Dman in a package.

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[I am Canadian]

It's been ~20 games and the Canucks are close to the top of the league, you don't trade an underperforming player when there is time to recover.

 

[Neutrinos]

It's been ~20 games and the Canucks are close to the top of the league, you don't trade an underperforming player when there is time to recover.

That depends entirely on the return being offered

 

[mkatcherin00]

I would say not much. Looks like a lazy player half of the time and refuses to play the right way.

 

[Sergei Shirokov]

He's still a good player but I think it's becoming clear he's just not a fit for our team.

Canucks would be looking for a hockey trade, a better fitting winger or a D. Or assets that we could move for one.

 

[Qwijibo]

I'd argue this season's Kuzmenko is far closerr to the reality of what he is. He's scoring on 11.6% of his shots (which is about league average) I dont think he's under performing. Or if he is it's not by much. He's pacing for 15-16 goals and 50-55 points. His contract isn't bad fir that level of production. He doesn't shoot that much, but A team looking for a top 6 setup guy could do worse.

I'm not sure who would be looking for a player of his ilk but as long as Canuck fans aren't expecting to get a return based on what he did last season There could be a hockey trade to be made. I assume Vancouver would still like to upgrade their D a bit more

 

[Canucks LB]

Team could steal him away honestly.
I would still think he gets a 1st or 2nd++

 

[Double Dion]

I don't think there would be a lot of interest. He isn't underperforming. This is what he was last year too. The shooting percentage was just a lot higher. It's similar to Mangiapane. He got the deal based on a career high shooting percentage.

 

[innitfam]

I was actually just about to post a very similar thread.

Canucks would want a hockey trade for sure. Problem is that Kuzmenko would leave a big hole in the top 9.

Could see the Rangers having interest

 

[AhosDatsyukian]

He's on a good contract and I think would fit well with the Canes. The issue there is I don't think the Canes would part with any current contributors in a trade and Vancouver is also trying to contend and wouldn't want futures. I don't follow Vancouver super closely but is there a reason they would trade him right now? Are there other forwards who should be or are getting ice time over him and now he's just not being utilized ideally? I'd gladly trade a pick & B prospect.

 

[UrbanImpact]

He is a Millstein client. He isnt going anywhere.

Its not a good look if the Canucks wined and dined him, sign him to an extension only to trade him 20 games into it.

Millstein has been doing a great job funneling clients to us, thats not a bridge you want to burn.

 

[oceanchild]

He is a Millstein client. He isnt going anywhere.

Its not a good look if the Canucks wined and dined him, sign him to an extension only to trade him 20 games into it.

Millstein has been doing a great job funneling clients to us, thats not a bridge you want to burn.

We changed coaches and philosophies.

Things change.

 

[Petey O]

The Canucks fans wanting him gone are going to look silly very soon, that's all I have to say. Tocchet is hard on him because he believes in him, not cause he wants him off the team.

 

[Hodge]

Absolutely idiotic move not to cash in on his 20% shooting or whatever it was at the deadline last season. Tampa would have probably offered the Jeannot package and then some since Kuzmenko was making close to league minimum. Every contender could have easily fit him under the cap.

 

[Petey O]

Absolutely idiotic move not to cash in on his 20% shooting or whatever it was at the deadline last season. Tampa would have probably offered the Jeannot package and then some since Kuzmenko was making close to league minimum. Every contender could have easily fit him under the cap.

It was an idiotic move to not trade a wicked 1st line sniper who clicked incredibly well with the team's franchise center? Please explain. You act like it was all luck that was the reason Kuzmenko had such a good season last year. Did you watch him play?

 

[Hodge]

It was an idiotic move to not trade a wicked 1st line sniper who clicked incredibly well with the team's franchise center? Please explain. You act like it was all luck that was the reason Kuzmenko had such a good season last year. Did you watch him play?

His shooting percentage was 27.3%. You didn’t need to watch a single shift to know this guy was never under any circumstances going to come close to that goal scoring rate ever again. Especially since we’re talking about a 27 year old in his first NHL season and not prime Mike Bossy.

 

[Petey O]

His shooting percentage was 27.3%. You didn’t need to watch a single shift to know this guy was never under any circumstances going to come close to that goal scoring rate ever again. Especially since we’re talking about a 27 year old in his first NHL season and not prime Mike Bossy.

Did you watch him play or are you just looking at his shooting percentage? You realize he actually played up to the standard of the points he put up, right? He also had 35 assists with his goals. He played like a 1st line winger. If you watched him play, you'd realize how well he clicked with EP and why the Canucks weren't going to trade him for futures of all things.

 

[Hodge]

Did you watch him play or are you just looking at his shooting percentage? You realize he actually played up to the standard of the points he put up, right? He also had 35 assists with his goals. He played like a 1st line winger. If you watched him play, you'd realize how well he clicked with EP and why the Canucks weren't going to trade him for futures of all things.

Andrei Kuzmenko played up to the standard of someone scoring on almost twice as many shots as Auston Matthews, the league's best finisher, has over his career? If that's true the Hall of Fame should make an exception and induct him while he's still playing.

Nobody is saying Kuzmenko had 20 goals go in off his ass but the fact remains nobody in the NHL sustains anything close to a 27% or even 20% shooting percentage in the long run. He could compensate for this by generating far more shots but he's not a good enough player to do so. This was the most glaringly obvious sell high moment in recent history and the Canucks whiffed.

 

[SirSamofHouseBennett]

Andrei Kuzmenko played up to the standard of someone scoring on almost twice as many shots as Auston Matthews, the league's best finisher, has over his career? If that's true the Hall of Fame should make an exception and induct him while he's still playing.

Nobody is saying Kuzmenko had 20 goals go in off his ass but the fact remains nobody in the NHL sustains anything close to a 27% or even 20% shooting percentage in the long run. He could compensate for this by generating far more shots but he's not a good enough player to do so. This was the most glaringly obvious sell high moment in recent history and the Canucks whiffed.

The goal of a team is not to generate incremental asset growth. The goal is to win.

The team feels that this player contributes to that goal and therefore isn’t concerned about selling high.

There is no prize for most asset growth!

Only fan boi’s think of selling players like it’s their financial balance sheet.

 

[Hodge]

The goal of a team is not to generate incremental asset growth. The goal is to win.

The team feels that this player contributes to that goal and therefore isn’t concerned about selling high.

There is no prize for most asset growth!

Only fan boi’s think of selling players like it’s their financial balance sheet.

Vancouver was not close to winning anything when they extended Kuzmenko. I would argue that despite the hot start they're still not close and it's partially because of decisions like this and the Mikheyev contract. If a contender like Carolina or Edmonton had won the 2022 Kuzmenko sweepstakes and operated in the same manner as the Canucks I wouldn't be criticizing them nearly as much for it.

Also your initial premise is itself flawed because you're starting from the assumption that Kuzmenko on this contract helps a team win. This assumption was formed on the basis of one of the craziest individual shooting percentage seasons in recent memory. The player had no other NHL history to draw upon and at 27 was already at or near his athletic prime unlike a typical rookie. Based on what we've seen so far this season, it appears to have been a wrong assumption.

 

[SirSamofHouseBennett]

Vancouver was not close to winning anything when they extended Kuzmenko. I would argue that despite the hot start they're still not close and it's partially because of decisions like this and the Mikheyev contract. If a contender like Carolina or Edmonton had won the 2022 Kuzmenko sweepstakes and operated in the same manner as the Canucks I wouldn't be criticizing them nearly as much for it.

Also your initial premise is itself flawed because you're starting from the assumption that Kuzmenko on this contract helps a team win. This assumption was formed on the basis of one of the craziest individual shooting percentage seasons in recent memory. The player had no other NHL history to draw upon and at 27 was already at or near his athletic prime unlike a typical rookie. Based on what we've seen so far this season, it appears to have been a wrong assumption.

u r thnking like a fan boi. no team sits in their boardroom and says "meh, we are no good, lets not make moves to keep good players".

also, they have to show their core guys, especially EP, that they are committed to winning now. not later. trading the player on his line that he has great chemistry with (at that time of the deadline) would not help show EP that they want to build around him long term.

not too mention, they also have a fan base, and season ticket holders to create value for. trading the guy who is exciting, has media personality and clicks with their best player isnt a reasonable expetaction for their business.

 

[Hodge]

u r thnking like a fan boi. no team sits in their boardroom and says "meh, we are no good, lets not make moves to keep good players".

also, they have to show their core guys, especially EP, that they are committed to winning now. not later. trading the player on his line that he has great chemistry with (at that time of the deadline) would not help show EP that they want to build around him long term.

not too mention, they also have a fan base, and season ticket holders to create value for. trading the guy who is exciting, has media personality and clicks with their best player isnt a reasonable expetaction for their business.

So Kuzmenko, who had been in Vancouver for ten minutes, was essential to keep in order to prevent a locker room, fan and corporate sponsor revolt but it was fine to dump their literal captain and 10 year Canuck Bo Horvat in the same week? You're making a lot of sense.

 

[dm1371]

We'll give you Dvorak for him

 

[Hodge]

We'll give you Dvorak for him

Canucks should take this and run. Gives them a legit 3C and a guy who had success under Tocchet.

 

[Peter Griffin]

So Kuzmenko, who had been in Vancouver for ten minutes, was essential to keep in order to prevent a locker room, fan and corporate sponsor revolt but it was fine to dump their literal captain and 10 year Canuck Bo Horvat in the same week? You're making a lot of sense.

They chose to sign Miller instead of Bo and used the primary asset acquired in the Horvat trade to acquire Hronek. I’d say they made the right choices there.