An idea to remove the cap advantage for no tax states
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MikeyMike01
U.S.S. Wang
How many threads on this unhinged state tax theory do we really need?
Turin
Erik Karlsson is good
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It's a variable but it's not a massive one.
JPT
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Notice his qualifiers. Your dollar goes "a little" farther. It doesn't impact the talks with high end guys, but it does help out the middle group "a little bit."
Trotz: 'No question' teams in tax-free states have advantage
Nashville Predators general manager Barry Trotz knows his team has an edge over the majority of NHL clubs.Being situated in Tennessee - one of the U.S.' nine states that doesn't levy a state income tax - Predators players are able to keep more of their money.In a league with a hard salary cap...www.thescore.com
A topic that gets debated on a lot, we have a GM of one of these markets admitting it is an advantage.
You have a GM talking about how it's a bit of an advantage, and you're using it to try to justify a solution that is so complex you can't even give a good idea as to what that solution is. We have been saying since this thread opened that it is an advantage, just not such a big advantage that it outweighs advantages other markets have.
I'm sorry but if a team in a higher taxed area can't put together a group of role players strong enough to compete, that's on them and not the area's tax rate.
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teams send players packing all the time, this act in itself is going to remove any sort of tax advantage had by any team. The players are not stupid
That's kinda the point?
It's to try and level an already uneven playing field for teams that normally wouldn't get the ufa signings. Why sign in winnipeg when I could get paid MORE to play for florida?
JPT
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The portion in bold isn't something that should be leveled. Building teams is part of the competition of the game. The league shouldn't be trying to negotiate something into the CBA to hand-hold teams who can't build a team, particularly when whatever solution to the "problem" would have to be incredibly complex.
Besides, Winnipeg has had competitive teams not even all that long ago. They seem to be able to overcome whatever disadvantages geography causes. Edmonton, too. Vancouver is a nice area, but their taxes are pretty high. They're competitive. Some people in this thread are acting like the higher taxed areas have teams consistently at the bottom of the league.
Just ban Canadian hockey players from playing abroad, bring the lost sheep back into the northern fold. Or have all games played on natural ice and if that would mean the game gets played in the bottom of a lake, home team takes automatic loss. Reclaim the climate advantage!
Golden_Jet
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- Sep 21, 2005
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Beukeboom Fan
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Has anyone stated that it is not an advantage? AFAIK it has just been stated that there isn't necessarily a correlation to winning.Trotz: 'No question' teams in tax-free states have advantage
Nashville Predators general manager Barry Trotz knows his team has an edge over the majority of NHL clubs.Being situated in Tennessee - one of the U.S.' nine states that doesn't levy a state income tax - Predators players are able to keep more of their money.In a league with a hard salary cap...
A topic that gets debated on a lot, we have a GM of one of these markets admitting it is an advantage.
Pia8988
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- May 26, 2014
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Amazing the loser franchises always bringing this up
FiveTacos
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Because the same money goes a lot farther in Winnipeg. It probably makes no difference to the stars making big money either way, they're rich no matter where they go, but a guy on a 1-4m salary will afford and maintain a much nicer home for less money in Winnipeg, and have more left over to do other things with. In Miami millions more will need to be budgeted towards housing, property taxes, insurance, etc. than in Winnipeg. And in a competitive real estate market a lot of that is up front cost, as most desirable homes these days are won with cash offers in markets like that.
Amazing the amount of childish comments on a topic that is very relevant in the NHL today.
JPT
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It's only relevant insofar as people like to use it as an excuse. It has no measurable impact on team success, as has been shown in this thread and promptly ignored by anyone who wants to continue using the excuse.
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Pia8988
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It's been beaten into the ground and is only ever brought up in bad faith by fans of teams that lose.
They only ever want to close this one specific 'loophole' that hurts them in their eyes and never the big picture or anything that benefits them.
You're trying to boil this down to a binary conversation.
Tax Free teams win.. Non tax free teams lose.
Nobody is making that argument that I've seen. So stop trying to twist it that way.
Winning and Losing at the NHL level is insanely complicated. It's not just Tax Free. It's not just Management. It's not just Destination. It's not just scouting, Coaching, etc. It's ALL of them and more.
But if you think Tax Free has 0 impact on a teams success. Then I completely disagree with you.
Just as Southern Market teams enjoy destination/anonymity advantages.
Take a look at NTC and NMC and try telling me that it's not an advantage to not be on any of them.
A teams ability to draw free agents and trade for players with NMC/NTC is sizeable advantage. That is the point I'm trying to make. Tax free helps in those regards.
Gentle Man
09/12
Good thing we used our tax advantage to attract this star in 2014.
Life altering
Life altering
JPT
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It isn't "tax free." They are paying taxes, just in different ways.
Golden_Jet
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It’s definitely in this thread. A few went on and on about it.
Guys are signing in Edmonton because they want to win a Cup. There's reasons to want to play for the Oilers right now. It's not like players were all scrambling to play for the Panthers a decade ago.
There's plenty of people who honestly enjoy things like fishing, ice fishing, other snow activities etc over being in the heat all year. And as I said above, nobody was rushing to sign in Florida a decade ago.
This is exactly it. It's a small to medium factor for some players, but not enough of a variable for enough players to need to change any rules or amend the CBA or anything like that.
cptjeff
Reprehensible User
Housing is a big one. You know how states with no or low income tax almost always make their money? High property tax rates. Athletes buying big, flashy homes will pay a LOT in taxes for them.
Taxes are complex and generally pretty closely related to the city services available, and those services often correlate to how desirable a place to live it is. I don't see many players complaining about playing in NYC, despite the high taxes and cost of living. People pay a huge premium to live there. Yet they sign good players to competitive contracts constantly. Why? Because people want to play in New York.
It's not about taxes. It's about having a good team and a place people want to live.
Gentle Man
09/12
And I am not even gonna glance through every post but I doubt that contract structure has been mentioned enough.
The only players that will maximize their tax advantages are the ones that get paid in mostly bonuses vs even salary.
If you get paid in salary, then the jock tax kicks in and your tax advantages are minimized. Bonuses get paid out in the summer so I dont THINK they are subject to the jock tax as that is based on where the games are played.
And no, tax haven stats arent just going to sign everyone to a bonus laden structure as that puts them at lockout and buyout risks.
The only players that will maximize their tax advantages are the ones that get paid in mostly bonuses vs even salary.
If you get paid in salary, then the jock tax kicks in and your tax advantages are minimized. Bonuses get paid out in the summer so I dont THINK they are subject to the jock tax as that is based on where the games are played.
And no, tax haven stats arent just going to sign everyone to a bonus laden structure as that puts them at lockout and buyout risks.
Golden_Jet
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Gentle Man
09/12
And I am not even gonna glance through every post but I doubt that contract structure has been mentioned enough.
Yea I am not going to sift through 31 pages
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