Confirmed with Link: Amerks name Mike Leone Head Coach

[Tijuana Donkey Show]

No sir, I don't like it.

Another USNT program coach where their teams are just head and shoulders better than their regular competition, and the entire emphasis within the program has always been play harder, not smarter and just ignore the details because you can win on physical superiority.

Was really hoping for some new blood who prioritized the cerebral aspect of the game over the motivational route.

Maybe Leone is not like the bulk of coaches that come from that program, so I am willing to give the guy a chance, but I am not feeling optimistic.

That's dead wrong. The whole reason the NTDP exists is for development.

As someone who has attended dozens and dozens of NTDP games, that's not true at all - especially for the U17 team. They are 16 or 17 years old and they're playing USHL teams where every player is 18 -20 - or they play college teams made up of guys 18 - 23. They get beat on a regular basis. It's good for kids because they usually come to the NTDP where they're used to winning all the time - and when they get to the program they have to learn to play the right way and how to play away from the puck because their raw talent isn't going to do it against players older, bigger, and stronger than them. Many players like Matthews has said going to the NTDP taught them how to handle adversity (that joke writes itself).

The NTDP (they count the U17 & U18 teams as one) came in dead last in their conference last season, and rarely finish above mid-pack.

View attachment 880117

The stated goal of the NTDP is "to prepare student-athletes under the age of 18 for participation on the U.S. National Teams and success in their future hockey careers. Its efforts focus not only on high-caliber participation on the ice, but creating well-rounded individuals off the ice".

Not to mention Leone is replacing Appert who has done a fantastic job of developing guys in Rochester. Drinking from the same well makes a lot of sense.

I can weigh in with some experience here.

I was on the Senior US National Team in another sport, I know a bunch of people who work for other NGB's (National Governing Body, ie USA Hockley, USATF, etc) and OC's, and have worked with the USOC and our NGB on very similar camps.

These camps aren't all good and they aren't all bad. I think you are both sort of right.

I will say that even though their mission statement is "development" or whatever, that isn't their true purpose although they provide "some" of it. They generally charge at on of money to just run a fairly long and grueling selection process based on quite a bit of survival. Then surround that with a lot of "rah rah, team USA" mantra. These sorts of camps are generally not a good place to actually "develop".

They can be good for kids who are part of bad programs and/or live in an area of the country not known for "x" sport. But if you are already part of a good program than these are generally not worth it.

Don't underestimate how much of a driving factor money is with these camps. They generally charge a ton and are a huge part of both balancing their budgets and requesting more money from the USOC.

The NTDP has only produced 27 Olympians and 23 Stanley Cup Champions. I sorted every Stanley Cup roster by nationality and there have been about 165 Americans to win. 23 came through the NTDP. When you consider that more Americans on Stanley Cup and Olympic rosters don't go through NTDP than those who do by a pretty wide margin.

 

[Chainshot]

And Jim Kelley operated in a completely different media environment that we live in today.

To compare the current state of things to the way that they were pre-internet and social media isn't doing it right to me.

And yet Bucky was still poor at his job. If you wanna split hairs over era, fine, that wasn’t the point. It’s that Bucky sucked. Or do you want to try and defend Bucky?

 

[Dingo44]

I can weigh in with some experience here.

I was on the Senior US National Team in another sport, I know a bunch of people who work for other NGB's (National Governing Body, ie USA Hockley, USATF, etc) and OC's, and have worked with the USOC and our NGB on very similar camps.

These camps aren't all good and they aren't all bad. I think you are both sort of right.

I will say that even though their mission statement is "development" or whatever, that isn't their true purpose although they provide "some" of it. They generally charge at on of money to just run a fairly long and grueling selection process based on quite a bit of survival. Then surround that with a lot of "rah rah, team USA" mantra. These sorts of camps are generally not a good place to actually "develop".

They can be good for kids who are part of bad programs and/or live in an area of the country not known for "x" sport. But if you are already part of a good program than these are generally not worth it.

Don't underestimate how much of a driving factor money is with these camps. They generally charge a ton and are a huge part of both balancing their budgets and requesting more money from the USOC.

The NTDP has only produced 27 Olympians and 23 Stanley Cup Champions. I sorted every Stanley Cup roster by nationality and there have been about 165 Americans to win. 23 came through the NTDP. When you consider that more Americans on Stanley Cup and Olympic rosters don't go through NTDP than those who do by a pretty wide margin.

It's cool you have experience in another sport with a similar program, but I don't believe the NTDP is set up like other US National Teams in other sports.

There is ZERO cost to try out for invited players. Per the NTDP's site:

The NTDP players are tracked and evaluated for two years prior to coming to the NTDP.

The culmination of the two-year scouting process is an annual, invitation-only NTDP Evaluation Camp that will be held in March here at USA Hockey Arena. The 22 members for the U.S. National Under-17 Team are selected from that process.

The stated goal of the NTDP is "to prepare student-athletes under the age of 18 for participation on the U.S. National Teams and success in their future hockey careers. Its efforts focus not only on high-caliber participation on the ice, but creating well-rounded individuals off the ice."

Before the establishment of the NDTP, between 1977 - 1996, the US medaled twice at the World Juniors, and they were both Bronze. Since the establishment of the NDTP in 1996, the US has won 6 Golds, including in 2024, two Silvers, and five Bronze medals. The U18 Team, which is all made up of players from the NDTP, has had the following results, pulled from Wikipedia:

Maybe you are talking about other USA Hockey camps, but you can't speak about the NDTP program. I'm not claiming to be an expert, but I've been going to NDTP games regularly since 2016 to the point I know a number of the staff, have toured the locker rooms and facilities, have met many of the players who have come through the system, and have seen first hand how players have developed from young 16 year olds to NHL stars.

Here is one last entry from Wikipedia: As of the 2018–19 season, more than 310 NTDP alumni were drafted in the National Hockey League. This includes Rick DiPietro, Erik Johnson, Patrick Kane, Auston Matthews, and Jack Hughes, all of whom were drafted first overall in the NHL Entry Draft. At the 2007 NHL Entry Draft, NTDP alumni Patrick Kane and James van Riemsdyk were selected 1st and 2nd overall respectively, being the first American-born players selected with the top two picks. A record 17 players were selected directly from the NTDP in the 2019 NHL Entry Draft.

 

[Jim Bob]

OK sure - but when has any team talked about the coaches they interviewed and didn't hire? Never.

That wouldn't be fair to them, because the next question would be "Why didn't you hire X instead?"

That's not a big challenge - that's just reality.

That is a big challenge in having any sort of reasonable discourse about the hire and who would be a better candidate.

Maybe [candidate X] was in the 100 they talked to and they were not interested in the opening because they liked the job they had currently. Like say Danny Hurley turning down the LA Lakers offer to stay at UConn.

Maybe [candidate x] bombed the interview and didn't move from the 25 to the 5.

We just don't know any of that stuff. So, it is tough to really have an informed, intelligent conversation about other options outside of promoting Paetsch or Prospal.

And yet Bucky was still poor at his job. If you wanna split hairs over era, fine, that wasn’t the point. It’s that Bucky sucked. Or do you want to try and defend Bucky?

I was talking about Kelley vs Fairburn and the other beat writers of today.

 

[Beerz]

Honestly it's more people complaining about a few people having some sort of issues with the hire more than anything else.

There has been very little push back on the hire overall in here anyways.

 

[DJN21]

Nah, I get it. This place is so filled with negativity, that it would be nice to have a piece of news and not have one poster shit on it, but it is the slow season before the draft and I wanted to get the discussion going, which actually motivated @Chainshot to post some info on his coaching history which was not on his profile and I was not aware of, so more info came out, which is always a positive.

And, if he turns out to be an awesome development coach, I get to come back in here and eat a a bunch of Crow and @Dingo44 gets to make fun of me, and that should be pretty entertaining for the board, so win-win

If it helps I won't make you eat crow and probably won't remember this convo at all lol

 

[MarkusKetterer]

Nah, I get it. This place is so filled with negativity, that it would be nice to have a piece of news and not have one poster shit on it, but it is the slow season before the draft and I wanted to get the discussion going, which actually motivated @Chainshot to post some info on his coaching history which was not on his profile and I was not aware of, so more info came out, which is always a positive.

And, if he turns out to be an awesome development coach, I get to come back in here and eat a a bunch of Crow and @Dingo44 gets to make fun of me, and that should be pretty entertaining for the board, so win-win

 

[Gras]

 

[HogtownSabresfan]

The big challenge is that we don't know the 25 nor the final 5.

That lack of information creates a vacuum that usually gets filled by preconceived notions.

You cannot believe anything the Sabres say anymore. Kevyn Adams twisted facts on who he interviewed for Ruff's job. I like Kevyn but when he said he had any resources he needed from ownership, you knew he was being a toady. It's simply not true that he has all the resources he needs. Well below the cap the last two years, makes this obvious.

Like everything else in the Pegula regime, this one hire is hardly make or break and he might work out well. But It just looks and feels like a less expensive route, which is the MO of the franchise. I'm still a massive fan and believe that can have success with talent but the nickel and diming seems obvious and makes me sad.

 

[Jim Bob]

You cannot believe anything the Sabres say anymore. Kevyn Adams twisted facts on who he interviewed for Ruff's job. I like Kevyn but when he said he had any resources he needed from ownership, you knew he was being a toady. It's simply not true that he has all the resources he needs. Well below the cap the last two years, makes this obvious.

Like everything else in the Pegula regime, this one hire is hardly make or break and he might work out well. But It just looks and feels like a less expensive route, which is the MO of the franchise. I'm still a massive fan and believe that can have success with talent but the nickel and diming seems obvious and makes me sad.

Thank you for reinforcing my point.

 

[HogtownSabresfan]

Thank you for reinforcing my point.

So, you actually believe Kevyn Adams has all the resources he needs, given the team was more than $8 M under the cap last year and more than $22 million the year before when we barely missed the playoffs, and our D was devastated. The excuses people make for one of the worst owners in NHL history are just amazing. Next, you will tell me he saved the team.

 

[Jim Bob]

So, you actually believe Kevyn Adams has all the resources he needs, given the team was more than $8 M under the cap last year and more than $22 million the year before when we barely missed the playoffs, and our D was devastated. The excuses people make for one of the worst owners in NHL history are just amazing. Next, you will tell me he saved the team.

Again, it is a lack of information that leads people to fill in the vacuum with their own pre-conceived notions about things.

We do not know if Pegula is giving Adams a low player payroll budget or the low player payroll budget is an outcome of Adams focusing on a slow build largely driven through drafting and developing players.

The Sabres are likely to be much closer to the cap this upcoming season with Power and Dahlin getting significant raises and now counting over $19M against the cap.

 

[Sabresfansince1980]

Again, it is a lack of information that leads people to fill in the vacuum with their own pre-conceived notions about things.

We do not know if Pegula is giving Adams a low player payroll budget or the low player payroll budget is an outcome of Adams focusing on a slow build largely driven through drafting and developing players.

The Sabres are likely to be much closer to the cap this upcoming season with Power and Dahlin getting significant raises and now counting over $19M against the cap.

In the end, it doesn't matter much. It's been so/too long of suffering through the same BS - watching the team trade or let good players walk at contract time. Either Pegula tightened the budget, KA is bad at cap management/player eval...or some combo of both. It's exhausting at this point.

 

[Jim Bob]

In the end, it doesn't matter much. It's been so/too long of suffering through the same BS - watching the team trade or let good players walk at contract time. Either Pegula tightened the budget, KA is bad at cap management/player eval...or some combo of both. It's exhausting at this point.

Inside the delicate art of NFL roster building: A dozen GMs go deep on QBs, culture and the cap

How do NFL front offices approach big QB contracts? Are there tricks to managing the salary cap? And does team culture matter?

www.espn.com

GMs in all salary cap sports need to make tough decisions on players with respect to identifying value and cap management.

Adams has extended Thompson, Cozens, Dahlin, Power, and Samuelsson to long term deals. Mitts is the only player of note that has been traded before a tough contract negotiation in this version of the build.

But, Adams will have to make more of those decisions over the next few years with UPL and Levi each being RFAs over this summer and next summer. Then you have JJP & Quinn hitting RFA next summer.

Add in all the prospects that have been slow cooking and there will be talented guys that leave the organization. That's part of team building.

The challenge is that the drought means that nobody in the Sabres front office or ownership has earned any sort of benefit of the doubt.

 

[Sabresfansince1980]

Inside the delicate art of NFL roster building: A dozen GMs go deep on QBs, culture and the cap

How do NFL front offices approach big QB contracts? Are there tricks to managing the salary cap? And does team culture matter?

www.espn.com

GMs in all salary cap sports need to make tough decisions on players with respect to identifying value and cap management.

Adams has extended Thompson, Cozens, Dahlin, Power, and Samuelsson to long term deals. Mitts is the only player of note that has been traded before a tough contract negotiation in this version of the build.

But, Adams will have to make more of those decisions over the next few years with UPL and Levi each being RFAs over this summer and next summer. Then you have JJP & Quinn hitting RFA next summer.

Add in all the prospects that have been slow cooking and there will be talented guys that leave the organization. That's part of team building.

The challenge is that the drought means that nobody in the Sabres front office or ownership has earned any sort of benefit of the doubt.

Montour, Reinhart, Ullmark. Don't bother trying to split hairs over each scenario...it won't change the bigger point.

 

[HogtownSabresfan]

Again, it is a lack of information that leads people to fill in the vacuum with their own pre-conceived notions about things.

We do not know if Pegula is giving Adams a low player payroll budget or the low player payroll budget is an outcome of Adams focusing on a slow build largely driven through drafting and developing players.

The Sabres are likely to be much closer to the cap this upcoming season with Power and Dahlin getting significant raises and now counting over $19M against the cap.

Our cap for the last two years is fact. It's actually four years well under. You are one the filling in a narrative that we couldn't have used that room the last couple of years because we were "slow-building" through the draft. It's such a laugh. As if you can't sign one or two-year deals to improve your roster as other teams do. (I won't even talk about feel-good moves to waste $7 M on Okposo, Girgensons, Jost)

You can also not explain why the Sabres wouldn't trade cap space for picks for the last two trade deadlines. I know, we don't need more picks. Heard this excuse so many times. Or my favourite, no one will sign here.

How long would you like this slow build to continue? We are on year 14 of the Pegula rebuild. LOL. Even if you tried, it would be hard to miss the playoffs every year in a league where half the teams make it.

 

[Jim Bob]

Montour, Reinhart, Ullmark. Don't bother trying to split hairs over each scenario...it won't change the bigger point.

They were all let go, along with Eichel and Ristolainen, in the tear down phase of the Adams build.

That is the nature of the tear down and rebuild phase of roster building in pro sports.

 

[HOOats]

He seems highly motivated to succeed and advance his career. In my experience there's something to be said for installing someone with drive who might be slightly underqualified at present. The momentum they create from getting themselves up to speed can be contagious.

The other thing I took from the interview is his experience working with this new young generation of players. I buy into the massive generational gap that the digital age/covid/etc has created and I think Karmanos was looking for a millennial to handle the Gen Zs/Alphas.

The big club may have needed a boomer with a velvet glove like Lindy to crack skulls, but Roch projects to be a young developmental team for the foreseeable future and Leone seems like a coach to match.

 

[Jim Bob]

Our cap for the last two years is fact. It's actually four years well under. You are one the filling in a narrative that we couldn't have used that room the last couple of years because we were "slow-building" through the draft. It's such a laugh. As if you can't sign one or two-year deals to improve your roster as other teams do. (I won't even talk about feel-good moves to waste $7 M on Okposo, Girgensons, Jost)

You can also not explain why the Sabres wouldn't trade cap space for picks for the last two trade deadlines. I know, we don't need more picks. Heard this excuse so many times. Or my favourite, no one will sign here.

How long would you like this slow build to continue? We are on year 14 of the Pegula rebuild. LOL. Even if you tried, it would be hard to miss the playoffs every year in a league where half the teams make it.

Again, we do not have all the information as to why Adams and company decided to spend the way they did while also saying that Pegula gave them every resource they need to build a winner.

It comes down to either:

A) Pegula gave Adams a small NHL payroll budget to work in and Adams lied to the media to cover for his boss

or

B) Adams decided to go with a slow build approach and did not want to "block prospects" by spending more on vets or he couldn't get guys to come to Buffalo for what he was willing to offer up and he has been honest with the media.

We tend to choose A or B based on our pre-conceived notions about the team.

 

[Sabresfansince1980]

They were all let go, along with Eichel and Ristolainen, in the tear down phase of the Adams build.

That is the nature of the tear down and rebuild phase of roster building in pro sports.

Thanks for another bland and so very obvious response. Clearly, some organizations are better at rebuilding, because they know who to keep and who to let walk. There's the rub.

 

[Gras]

Montour, Reinhart, Ullmark. Don't bother trying to split hairs over each scenario...it won't change the bigger point.

Montour wasnt very good when he was here, Sam didnt want to go through a rebuild, Ullmark wanted more money and term than what he got from Boston.

 

[Fjordy]

Montour wasnt very good when he was here, Sam didnt want to go through a rebuild, Ullmark wanted more money and term than what he got from Boston.

I think Montour was not bad, you just have to understand that our coach was a clown-fraudster, not Paul Maurice. As we see, some of our former players are achieving success in good organizations and with good coaches.

 

[WeDislikeEich]

Again, we do not have all the information as to why Adams and company decided to spend the way they did while also saying that Pegula gave them every resource they need to build a winner.

It comes down to either:

A) Pegula gave Adams a small NHL payroll budget to work in and Adams lied to the media to cover for his boss

or

B) Adams decided to go with a slow build approach and did not want to "block prospects" by spending more on vets or he couldn't get guys to come to Buffalo for what he was willing to offer up and he has been honest with the media.

We tend to choose A or B based on our pre-conceived notions about the team.

Personally, I think it was a bit of both.

I think we all know that when Adams was hired, it was to slash operating costs as Covid hit. I think that was really only 1 season though.

But I think he knew how Pegula felt about his return on investment under the previous 2 GMs (a salary cap ceiling team many years while still finishing at the bottom of the standings), and I think Adams probably made it a priority to make sure he wasn’t in the red while rebuilding the team, and to give Pegula a better ROI with the money he did spend.

I don’t know that Pegula gave Adams an internal budget, except maybe to just stay in the black (the team lost money a # of years under Murray and Botterill). But I do think Adams made it a priority to watch the bottom line.

I am expecting to see more spending this year and next as the Sabres transition to a true “win now” team (last year was just talk IMO).

 

[Sabresfansince1980]

Montour wasnt very good when he was here, Sam didnt want to go through a rebuild, Ullmark wanted more money and term than what he got from Boston.

And it's all circular, boiling down to poor ownership/management....cheap or bad judgement on so many levels.

 

[HogtownSabresfan]

Again, we do not have all the information as to why Adams and company decided to spend the way they did while also saying that Pegula gave them every resource they need to build a winner.

It comes down to either:

A) Pegula gave Adams a small NHL payroll budget to work in and Adams lied to the media to cover for his boss

or

B) Adams decided to go with a slow build approach and did not want to "block prospects" by spending more on vets or he couldn't get guys to come to Buffalo for what he was willing to offer up and he has been honest with the media.

We tend to choose A or B based on our pre-conceived notions about the team.

The only GM in the league actively trying to spend well under the cap on his own. Okay. Block prospects, couldn't get guys to come here. Are you on the Sabres PR team? How long are people going to accept these excuses? Judging by attendance, more and more fans are just not buying into all this BS. People are tired of this drek. If we are well under the cap yet again and a bottom-third team again, it will only get worse, and fewer people will have their heads stuck in the sand.