All Purpose Trade / Roster Building Thread II - The Search for More Depth

[NotOpie]

I think the team has the budget in mind for Dougie and Svech. If Gardiner gets moved or otherwise goes off the payroll, then I think that money is to preserve one of the 3rd/4th line guys (Foegele, McGinn, Martinook). I'm not sure that Paquette is in the company's future plans.

I still could see Foegele, picks, prospects, and a Gardiner package being part of the Seattle ED deal.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

We have a ton of 4th liners. We need to get that down to 4 (1 being the 13th forward) and get two players who can be expected to provide .4+ ppg and provide heavy minutes in the playoffs.

Assuming Fast is back, Martinook, Lorentz and Geekie are it for me. I would prefer Foegele over Martinook but Marty is a leader. If Edmonton or Toronto want to give up late round darts to sign McGinn or Paquette early then jump on it.

Bernier is my hopeful for 1B knowing that a few teams will be pursuing Ullmark as their starter. Bernier will be able to provide quality starts and veteran leadership.

Is Gardiner hurt or does Rod really not trust his play?

 

[AD Skinner]

Paquette could barely hold on to a roster spot here. I cant imagine he stays. I'd love to keep all of foegele martinook and McGinn but I imagine the borg will prioritize martinook as much as Brind'Amour loves him.

 

[Que]

Heyohh! Sens fan. What was your guys’ evaluation of Jani Hakanpää? Did he crack the top 4? I see he’s a coming UFA and he fits the mood of what Ottawa would be looking at.

 

[Unsustainable]

Heyohh! Sens fan. What was your guys’ evaluation of Jani Hakanpää? Did he crack the top 4? I see he’s a coming UFA and he fits the mood of what Ottawa would be looking at.

he’s a 3rd pairing guy, and perfect fit here, probably stays

 

[chaz4hockey]

Which one of the young guns from the AHL or Europe LY gets a roster spot next year?

 

[spockBokk]

Which one of the young guns from the AHL or Europe LY gets a roster spot next year?

Drury, if signed, has a real good shot I’d think. Seems like they’re real high on Suzuki, so with a good summer and camp, maybe him too. Jarvis would probably have to blow the doors off, but I think he’ll be given every opportunity to do so.

I expect Keane or Sellgren to be rotated on/off the 3rd pair all year/to be the 7D.

I also expect some prospects are packaged and shipped out for a Hamilton replacement and/or forward upgrade.

 

[GoldiFox]

Svech - Aho - Teravainen
Nino - Trocheck - Necas
Drury - Staal - (top-9 UFA/Trade)
Jarvis - Lorentz - Fast
Geekie

Slavin - Pesce
Skjei - (top-4 UFA/trade)
(bottom-pair UFA/trade) - (bottom-pair UFA/trade)
Keane/Sellgren

Nedeljkovic
(1B addition)

Assumes Hamilton + McGinn + Martinook + Paquette walk and Foegele + Bean + Gardiner are traded or involved in the expansion draft.

If Capfriendly is right, Svechnikov signs @ $7 million x 3 years, and Nedeljkovic signs for $2.25 million x 2 years - then the roster above should total around $61 million before the extra additions of one top-9 F, one top-4 D, two 3rd pair D, and a 1B goalie.

Highlights how spending $9 million on either Dougie or another impact forward means either 1) the forward group will be pretty much the same as last year with Dougie re-signed or 2) the defense is going to look much, much different but the offense will improve.

 

[spockBokk]

I think the Canes FO has been linked to Dunn before, here they are linked again (and more of the same thoughts we all have on Hamilton):




Vince Dunn, pending UFA

The Blues, of course, were swept by Colorado marking a second straight one-and-done playoff outing for St. Louis after winning the Stanley Cup in 2019. Now GM Doug Armstrong has his hands full with a handful of key UFAs and a couple of critical RFAs like Robert Thomas and Vince Dunn, who has arbitration rights after getting a one-year deal as an RFA last summer. Dunn’s name surfaced in trade rumors leading up to the trade deadline and the 24-year-old didn’t feel healthy enough to play in the Avs series. With other left-handed defenders coming like Jake Walman, Niko Mikola and Tyler Tucker hard to imagine Dunn returns to the Blues and certainly not in any kind of featured role. “I don’t see a fit here,” said one source. There will be teams who will be interested in Dunn’s attributes, his skating and offense, the source added. “He’s an analytics darling,” he said. Pending what happens with Dougie Hamilton the source suggested Carolina might be interested. Could the Blues sign Dunn and then deal him? That’s another option.

Dougie Hamilton, pending UFA

One of the top potential free agents in this summer’s marketplace is the smooth-skating, offensively gifted Dougie Hamilton who remains just this side of enigmatic. For the second straight year, the Hurricanes took a step back in the playoffs. This time, losing in five games in the second round to defending Cup champion Tampa Bay. The question is how to assess Hamilton’s value to the Hurricanes as he contemplated unrestricted free agency. We spoke with three separate sources who questioned whether you can win a Stanley Cup with Hamilton as a centerpiece player. Complimentary? Sure. Who doesn’t love his point production, one source said. Hamilton finished with 42 points tied for 7th among NHL defensemen and a plus-20 rating. He added five points in 11 post-season games but just one point, a goal, against Tampa. He’s got a great shot and is the focal point of one of the league’s most productive power play units. But when you’re talking let’s say eight years at $8 million, which is what John Carlson signed in Washington a couple of years back, that’s the kind of dollar and term that can bury a team if you assign it to a player who can’t deliver the goods. “My belief has long been you can’t win with him in the playoffs,” one veteran Eastern Conference source said. Another source suggests that while defending playoff MVP Victor Hedman plays “with the Viking way about him, that’s something I think Dougie is missing.” The Hurricanes walked away from talented forward Jeff Skinner because he didn’t fit what Rod Brind’Amour et al were trying to build. Will Hamilton follow a similar path or does he take below market value to stay with Carolina?

 

[spockBokk]

Highlights how spending $9 million on either Dougie or another impact forward means either 1) the forward group will be pretty much the same as last year with Dougie re-signed or 2) the defense is going to look much, much different but the offense will improve.

I think you’re onto something with expecting them to try to compensate for the likely loss of D scoring in Hamilton with upgrades up front.
This approach could end up a net positive if they actually improve the “defense” part of the D this off-season.

An another, somewhat related thought, on Dumba:

They weren’t willing to pay up for him when Hamilton went down last year. I’m not so sure they’d be willing to do so this year, with less term on his contract.

The ask is likely to be something like Suzuki + 1st. If they paid $6M in real cash for a 1st just a few years ago, what’s the likelihood they are willing to now spend another $6M (this year’s 1st) + $6M (Suzuki basically having the equivalent value of a late 1st) for 2 years of Dumba?

Dumba likely would be the best replacement for Hamilton, outside of Jones, likely available this summer, but I don’t really think they’d be willing to pay up for him.

 

[Svechhammer]

Svech - Aho - Teravainen
Nino - Trocheck - Necas
Drury - Staal - (top-9 UFA/Trade)
Jarvis - Lorentz - Fast
Geekie

Slavin - Pesce
Skjei - (top-4 UFA/trade)
(bottom-pair UFA/trade) - (bottom-pair UFA/trade)
Keane/Sellgren

Nedeljkovic
(1B addition)

Assumes Hamilton + McGinn + Martinook + Paquette walk and Foegele + Bean + Gardiner are traded or involved in the expansion draft.

If Capfriendly is right, Svechnikov signs @ $7 million x 3 years, and Nedeljkovic signs for $2.25 million x 2 years - then the roster above should total around $61 million before the extra additions of one top-9 F, one top-4 D, two 3rd pair D, and a 1B goalie.

Highlights how spending $9 million on either Dougie or another impact forward means either 1) the forward group will be pretty much the same as last year with Dougie re-signed or 2) the defense is going to look much, much different but the offense will improve.

I don't like pairing Slavin and Pesce together. They are both so good in the defensive zone that they really each need to be anchoring their own line unless we are in a batten all hatches situation late in a game. Their ability to practically single handedly dominate defensive play and shift momentum toward us gives us a lot of leeway to get creative with their pairs. So much so that we really shouldn't entertain negating that ability by putting them together.

This is also why I have far more faith in our defense to continue to play well if we do lose Dougie. Those two are the catalyst for so much that we do that as long as they are in place, we should be fine. Offensively, I am a bit worried that we are far too streaky without enough consistency to really get over the hump. If we are going to make a big swing upgrade, it needs to be there.

 

[Chrispy]

" For the second straight year, the Hurricanes took a step back in the playoffs."

From the 2019 peak? Sure, but I don't see this season as a step back from last season:

2019: won in round of 16, won in round of 8, lost to Boston in EC finals
2020: won in qualifying round, lost to Boston in round of 16
2021: won in round of 16, lost to Tampa in divisional finals

2021 is a step forward from 2020 by any objective measure.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

I like Dunn but how often are we going to continually chase defenders instead of fixing the offense? Dunn isn’t going to come cheap to trade for and re-sign.

 

[AhosDatsyukian]

What about Morgan Rielly? He really seems like a 'this years Devon Toews' candidate.

I like him but we'd be pretty short of RHD if he was the Dougie replacement

 

[57special]

I think most of us here would be in favor of making a move for Dumba, although it would likely require cooperation with Seattle in some form since we're not in a position to protect another defenseman.

Couple questions for you, what kind of role did Dumba usually play on the PP? I watched a little bit of the Wild in the playoffs and noticed he was playing on the right halfwall while Suter manned the point. Is that Dumba's typical spot or does he play at the point often, too? And what kind of assets would the Wild want in return if they do end up moving Dumba?

Dumba is a shooter more than a PP QB, but he can do the latter. He has a pretty good offensive IQ...aggressive, and sometimes risky, but that's what you get with that type. He can play the half wall or at the top...he has been constrained by Spurgeon and Suter playing on the PP(which a lot of Wild fans are thrilled about). He is decent defensively, but he is no Slavin or Pesce. Sometimes his natural aggression causes him to overcommit, and he tends to overthink his breakout passes. What saves him is his athleticism- he can skate, and while not the biggest guy(6' 185), is a physical specimen. Also pretty feisty, and actually a decent fighter, but the Wild banned him from fighting after he got a serious injury in a fight. He will be a presence in post whistle scrums, if needed.

Assets in return? Well, Victor Rask is our C on our #1 line. Nuff said.
Either a top 6 C , top 6 C prospect, or a pick(s) that can be turned into a top 6 C prospect. A guy like Geekie is not a need. We've got plenty of bottom six C's.

 

[Unsustainable]

I’m going to be Savage here.

let Dougie walk or trade rights.
keep McGinn, trade off Foegele

Necas + Drury for Tkachuk

sign Mason, sign Hakanpaa
1st + Bean to Seattle to take Gardiner

Nino - Aho - TT
Svech - Trocheck - Jarvis
Rees - Staal - Tkachuk
McGinn - Lorentz - ????

Slavin - Mason
Skjei - Pesce
???? - Hakanpaa

Ned
????

 

[Buenos Necas]

I think you’re onto something with expecting them to try to compensate for the likely loss of D scoring in Hamilton with upgrades up front.
This approach could end up a net positive if they actually improve the “defense” part of the D this off-season.

An another, somewhat related thought, on Dumba:

They weren’t willing to pay up for him when Hamilton went down last year. I’m not so sure they’d be willing to do so this year, with less term on his contract.

The ask is likely to be something like Suzuki + 1st. If they paid $6M in real cash for a 1st just a few years ago, what’s the likelihood they are willing to now spend another $6M (this year’s 1st) + $6M (Suzuki basically having the equivalent value of a late 1st) for 2 years of Dumba?

Dumba likely would be the best replacement for Hamilton, outside of Jones, likely available this summer, but I don’t really think they’d be willing to pay up for him.

But they were willing to pay up, they ended up giving the 1st round pick for a lesser player in Skjei. The problem is it also would have taken Minnesota being willing to deal him at that point and there's no indication they were.

Like you said, I think Dumba is probably the best we can do in terms of a like-for-like Dougie replacement, if that's the route we choose. And getting that player at a reasonable $6m for 2 years of our 3-year contention window? I'd say that's a fair amount of inherent value in a flat cap world where we need to address other areas. I'm comfortable giving up our 1st this year Suzuki, even with the risk he walks. We really need to maximize our ability to compete with the big boys and don't really have any time to risk taking a step backwards next season.

 

[bleedgreen]

I’m going to be Savage here.

let Dougie walk or trade rights.
keep McGinn, trade off Foegele

Necas + Drury for Tkachuk

sign Mason, sign Hakanpaa
1st + Bean to Seattle to take Gardiner

Nino - Aho - TT
Svech - Trocheck - Jarvis
Rees - Staal - Tkachuk
McGinn - Lorentz - ????

Slavin - Mason
Skjei - Pesce
???? - Hakanpaa

Ned
????

I don’t know about the rest but I would trade a lot for either Tkachuk. This team has been missing that kind of guy for a long time. Either one would be in our top six. Likely top 3.

 

[Unsustainable]

I don’t know about the rest but I would trade a lot for either Tkachuk. This team has been missing that kind of guy for a long time. Either one would be in our top six. Likely top 3.

Lines have no numbers under Rod, but a Rees - Staal - Tkachuk line would make teams pee their pants

 

[GoldiFox]

Lines have no numbers under Rod, but a Rees - Staal - Tkachuk line would make teams pee their pants

What is the NHL equivalent of a intentional walk? Just taking a penalty so you don't have to play against them?

 

[bleedgreen]

Heyohh! Sens fan. What was your guys’ evaluation of Jani Hakanpää? Did he crack the top 4? I see he’s a coming UFA and he fits the mood of what Ottawa would be looking at.

I think it’s a stretch to say top 4 in ink. He’s been great here in his role as a bottom pair guy that can step up in a pinch. He’s not the quickest fella, though he hustles. He does everything a little better than you expected, until you change your expectations and then he’s struggling to keep up.

 

[Svechhammer]

Rod would shoot Matthew Tkachuk and his antics into the sun if he played here.

 

[bleedgreen]

Rod would shoot Matthew Tkachuk and his antics into the sun if he played here.

Why? Rod says himself he loves characters and wants as many as he can get on our team. Our team has a bunch of vanilla and generally quiet players leading it.

 

[emptyNedder]

We spoke with three separate sources who questioned whether you can win a Stanley Cup with Hamilton as a centerpiece player. Complimentary? Sure. Who doesn’t love his point production, one source said.

I think even Hamilton's harshest detractors would love him as a player with no salary.

 

[Moosetache]

Rod would shoot Matthew Tkachuk and his antics into the sun if he played here.

I was hoping he was talking about Brady, not Matthew.