Player Discussion All Purpose Goaltending Thread

[TehDoak]

I was not surprised that Adams took the glass half full approach to how the season went.

He has a plan and he is sticking to it. And focusing on the 16 point improvement in the standings versus coming one win short of ending the playoff drought does not surprise me in the least. Adams said this was a building season last off season. They made minimal changes to the roster and banked on growth from within to lead to an improvement in the standings. That happened despite a lot of fans and media feeling they didn't do enough.

Adams isn't going to focus on the negative. Neither with Granato. That is not how they are wired.

Without this becoming a front office thread….I have no problems with focusing on the positives. My issue is the dismissal of any suggestions that this season was a missed opportunity. When you miss the playoffs by one point and the front office made no effort to address obvious holes in the roster last summer and you have 17 million in unspent cap space there should be some at least reflection on the choices made. Even if a “well if I knew five players were going to Have career years I would Done things differently”. When a the team fails to achieve even modest team success when you have a ton of individual success, there should be accountability. There wasn’t that. The suggestion of accountability to Adams elicited a literal laugh from Adams.

 

[Chainshot]

Without this becoming a front office thread….I have no problems with focusing on the positives. My issue is the dismissal of any suggestions that this season was a missed opportunity. When you miss the playoffs by one point and the front office made no effort to address obvious holes in the roster last summer and you have 17 million in unspent cap space there should be some at least reflection on the choices made. Even if a “well if I knew five players were going to Have career years I would Done things differently”. When a the team fails to achieve even modest team success when you have a ton of individual success, there should be accountability. There wasn’t that. The suggestion of accountability to Adams elicited a literal laugh from Adams.

Try.

 

[joshjull]

I would be surprised if they are so confident in Levi after the 7 game sample that they make a move to thin out their goaltending depth before training camp.

And I think Comrie clears relatively easily given his salary and how rough a year he just had.

My first instinct is to agree with that. But I could see a claim with how bad goaltending is around the league. Someone might chalk up his struggles to what was in front of him and injuries.

 

[LongWayDown37]

Without this becoming a front office thread….I have no problems with focusing on the positives. My issue is the dismissal of any suggestions that this season was a missed opportunity. When you miss the playoffs by one point and the front office made no effort to address obvious holes in the roster last summer and you have 17 million in unspent cap space there should be some at least reflection on the choices made. Even if a “well if I knew five players were going to Have career years I would Done things differently”. When a the team fails to achieve even modest team success when you have a ton of individual success, there should be accountability. There wasn’t that. The suggestion of accountability to Adams elicited a literal laugh from Adams.

Meh. I had the exact same visceral reaction to that question as Adams did.

This was a reporter who is really trying to get a printable quote as opposed to a meaningful response. I get your persective around accountability, but I honestly think the question was totally stupid and deserved that response.

 

[TageGod]

Without this becoming a front office thread….I have no problems with focusing on the positives. My issue is the dismissal of any suggestions that this season was a missed opportunity. When you miss the playoffs by one point and the front office made no effort to address obvious holes in the roster last summer and you have 17 million in unspent cap space there should be some at least reflection on the choices made. Even if a “well if I knew five players were going to Have career years I would Done things differently”. When a the team fails to achieve even modest team success when you have a ton of individual success, there should be accountability. There wasn’t that. The suggestion of accountability to Adams elicited a literal laugh from Adams.

That is more of the need to be right. It is fair to be happy and frustrated at the same time with the season. Why I am not more frustrated is Comrie was considered a good move in the moment, and the team really needed to develop and evaluate their talent. Bumping JJ and/or Quinn down so they could spend 10M on forwards was not a good idea. Bryson and Joker both still had potential coming into this year and Boosh was likely the original plan for next to power.

We can evaluate the decisions but I think Adams did what was needed for this team. The real failure was the lack of attention to detail from the forwards (and Bryson) in the Defensive zone. All of a sudden UPL might be .900 save % and we aren't complaining about goalies as much.

 

[Zman5778]

The real failure was the lack of attention to detail from the forwards (and Bryson) in the Defensive zone. All of a sudden UPL might be .900 save % and we aren't complaining about goalies as much.

And this is why I think we don't see much of anything happen at the goalie position this offseason. I think KA and DG are full well aware of our forwards' defensive liabilities and will trust that DG can teach that up among the forwards. Hell, DG has said as much several times: that it's much easier to teach defense than it is to teach offense.

 

[Jim Bob]

My first instinct is to agree with that. But I could see a claim with how bad goaltending is around the league. Someone might chalk up his struggles to what was in front of him and injuries.

Absolutely he could get claimed as he has before. I just think the fact that he is making more money next season than he has in the past helps get him through waivers.

Hellberg ($750K AAV) getting claimed by Seattle a day before Brossoit ($2.325M AAV) cleared for Vegas talks to how being cheap really factors into a goalie getting claimed or not.

Without this becoming a front office thread….I have no problems with focusing on the positives. My issue is the dismissal of any suggestions that this season was a missed opportunity. When you miss the playoffs by one point and the front office made no effort to address obvious holes in the roster last summer and you have 17 million in unspent cap space there should be some at least reflection on the choices made. Even if a “well if I knew five players were going to Have career years I would Done things differently”. When a the team fails to achieve even modest team success when you have a ton of individual success, there should be accountability. There wasn’t that. The suggestion of accountability to Adams elicited a literal laugh from Adams.

Adams looks at this very differently than you do and lots of fans and media do.

You can choose to feel however you like about it. I was just saying that I wouldn't expect Adams to handle that question any differently as he felt like this wasn't a playoff team yet and the plan for this past season was to continue the build.

 

[Jacob582]

Meh. I had the exact same visceral reaction to that question as Adams did.

This was a reporter who is really trying to get a printable quote as opposed to a meaningful response. I get your persective around accountability, but I honestly think the question was totally stupid and deserved that response.

My visceral reaction was different. My first thought was: Adams is a dick.

(And I like Adams otherwise)

Some version of that question should have been asked. For the many fans who do feel that way. I feel like some of the players feel that way too.

 

[Rowley Birkin]

Adams thinking Levi is the long term answer in net is not the same as the coach deciding to play him down the stretch because he played well. If Levi struggled in his first game, he’s not starting the rest of the way like he did. You're conflating two different things.

There's no point going around in circles, Josh.

If Adams had gone out to acquire a legitimate #1 starter it would have left a much tougher path for Levi - instead of doing what he did in ensuring there was no incumbent starter, nobody to 'block' Levi.

That's the initial point i was making & it's not even debatable.

 

[TehDoak]

There's no point going around in circles, Josh.

If Adams had gone out to acquire a legitimate #1 starter it would have left a much tougher path for Levi - instead of doing what he did in ensuring there was no incumbent starter, nobody to 'block' Levi.

That's the initial point i was making & it's not even debatable.

When you consider:

1. The goalie they signed (Comrie) and the goalie they were rumored to be after (Murray) both had expiring contracts in 23-24.
2. EF mentioned here that Levi, essentially, interviewed the Sabres before signing, specifically about his path to being a starter
3. Levi started 5 games in 7 nights despite there being 4 healthy goalies on the roster.
4. EF also mentioned that the Sabres front office was pissed that there were even rumors they were looking at goalies because they didn't want to spook off Levi from signing (I tried to find the specific pod to reference, but its out there)

The path for Levi being a starter has been paved, right or wrong. Yes, Granato makes the choice on who to start night in and night out. But the options he's been given are

-Backup Eric
-UPL who still had PTSD after getting left out to dry vs Boston
-Anderson, who by this point in the season was in a rocking chair and booking tee times for next fall

I mean, the eggs have all been put in one basket by the GM. We will see what path they take this summer, but I have to think the job (or at least a good share of) the job will be Levi's to lose.

 

[Rowley Birkin]

When you consider:

1. The goalie they signed (Comrie) and the goalie they were rumored to be after (Murray) both had expiring contracts in 23-24.
2. EF mentioned here that Levi, essentially, interviewed the Sabres before signing, specifically about his path to being a starter
3. Levi started 5 games in 7 nights despite there being 4 healthy goalies on the roster.
4. EF also mentioned that the Sabres front office was pissed that there were even rumors they were looking at goalies because they didn't want to spook off Levi from signing (I tried to find the specific pod to reference, but its out there)

The path for Levi being a starter has been paved, right or wrong. Yes, Granato makes the choice on who to start night in and night out. But the options he's been given are

-Backup Eric
-UPL who still had PTSD after getting left out to dry vs Boston
-Anderson, who by this point in the season was in a rocking chair and booking tee times for next fall

I mean, the eggs have all been put in one basket by the GM. We will see what path they take this summer, but I have to think the job (or at least a good share of) the job will be Levi's to lose.

Yeah - i don't think any of this is far fetched.

I wasn't even sure what was going to happen as recently as when Levi signed... But after they rode him down the stretch - everything became clear. This was (and is) the plan all along.

It's not like Adams & Granato are working against each other either - they're in synergy. I expect Granato has been on board with this from the outset.

And at this point - I'm even comfortable with it myself as a fan. But only on the condition a somewhat dependable, experienced 1B is added as a safety net.

 

[joshjull]

 

[Jim Bob]

LeBrun: What's going on with Andrei Vasilevskiy? Here's what goalie experts are seeing

Is it a flaw in his style, exhaustion or something else? One thing is sure: "It'll be interesting to see how he works through this."

theathletic.com

There are a few things to look at, as far as what’s going on with all these goals:

• Obviously, Vasilevskiy needs to play better. Is there fatigue setting in after three-plus years of incredible hockey? Since the beginning of the 2019-20 season, he’s made 217 regular-season starts and 75 playoff starts (including these four playoff games), which averages out to 73 starts per year. Is that taking its toll?

• The Lightning’s defensive play has to tighten up in front of Vasilevskiy, of course, but it’s also worth wondering if the offseason loss of Ryan McDonagh, traded for cap reasons, has been more impactful than anyone wants to let on. He was a minute-munching, shutdown beast in Tampa Bay’s three Cup Final runs. And obviously, losing rugged top-four blueliner Erik Cernak in Game 1 of this series has also hurt.

 

[oldgoalie]

LeBrun: What's going on with Andrei Vasilevskiy? Here's what goalie experts are seeing

Is it a flaw in his style, exhaustion or something else? One thing is sure: "It'll be interesting to see how he works through this."

theathletic.com

I was chatting with a friend yesterday who's a rabid Bolts fan. His thoughts were that he wouldn't care if they moved on from him. He'd rather not lose Point, Hedman or Kucherov. I'm not sure that they are in a good place after this run anyway, but losing a top tier goalie with shit in the pipeline isn't good for them in the near term. It's gonna be a desert in TB for a while methinks.

 

[TehDoak]

I was chatting with a friend yesterday who's a rabid Bolts fan. His thoughts were that he wouldn't care if they moved on from him. He'd rather not lose Point, Hedman or Kucherov. I'm not sure that they are in a good place after this run anyway, but losing a top tier goalie with shit in the pipeline isn't good for them in the near term. It's gonna be a desert in TB for a while methinks.

I'd gladly take a decade of bad for the run Tampa had.

 

[Jim Bob]

I was chatting with a friend yesterday who's a rabid Bolts fan. His thoughts were that he wouldn't care if they moved on from him. He'd rather not lose Point, Hedman or Kucherov. I'm not sure that they are in a good place after this run anyway, but losing a top tier goalie with shit in the pipeline isn't good for them in the near term. It's gonna be a desert in TB for a while methinks.

I doubt they move on from Vasy anytime soon. They are not going to move on from Point, Hedman, Kuch, or any of their other core guys like Cernak and Cirelli. They are all in on the roster building plan of investing in their 6-8 core guys and then supplementing them with cheap guys that they can attract given the winning they have done, the lifestyle TB affords, and the state tax free status they have.

This off season they may have to let Killorn walk and they will need to figure out things like re-signing Jeannot. But, I doubt they move a big money core guy this off season. But, you never know. They did have to move McDonagh last year. So, something like that could happen again.

If they feel like they have to move Cirelli, I would love it if the Sabres were in on that.

 

[oldgoalie]

I'd gladly take a decade of bad for the run Tampa had.

that's what I told him. Two cups and a finals? thank you very much.

 

[Jim Bob]

Check the whole thread. Context is key.

 

[Gras]

Check the whole thread. Context is key.

 

[dkollidas]

I might be one of the few… but I think I’m warming up to the idea of Levi in Buffalo next year. He’s shown a lot in a short amount of time. The composure he’s shown is really impressive.

I know teams will “get a read on him”, but he will also study and learn the tendencies of other teams’ players as well.

Also, I wonder if he’s better off behind our defense in Buffalo as opposed to the group in Rochester. And I understand there’s an entire off-season to improve those groups, but Buffalo will have Dahlin Power & Samuelsson and possibly another solid top-4 piece…. Rochester has who exactly? And I know defense isn’t just on the defensemen themselves, but I think there is something there.

 

[dortt]

I might be one of the few… but I think I’m warming up to the idea of Levi in Buffalo next year. He’s shown a lot in a short amount of time. The composure he’s shown is really impressive.

I know teams will “get a read on him”, but he will also study and learn the tendencies of other teams’ players as well.

Also, I wonder if he’s better off behind our defense in Buffalo as opposed to the group in Rochester. And I understand there’s an entire off-season to improve those groups, but Buffalo will have Dahlin Power & Samuelsson and possibly another solid top-4 piece…. Rochester has who exactly? And I know defense isn’t just on the defensemen themselves, but I think there is something there.

Yeah, Levi should be here. However, he needs to earn the starting position in camp. Do not gift it to him. If he struggles, he can play 25-30 games as backup. He would at least get a full practice load, which would be more than he was getting in the NCAA

 

[Jim Bob]

I might be one of the few… but I think I’m warming up to the idea of Levi in Buffalo next year. He’s shown a lot in a short amount of time. The composure he’s shown is really impressive.

I know teams will “get a read on him”, but he will also study and learn the tendencies of other teams’ players as well.

Also, I wonder if he’s better off behind our defense in Buffalo as opposed to the group in Rochester. And I understand there’s an entire off-season to improve those groups, but Buffalo will have Dahlin Power & Samuelsson and possibly another solid top-4 piece…. Rochester has who exactly? And I know defense isn’t just on the defensemen themselves, but I think there is something there.

My concern with Levi in Buffalo next year is that I worry about what the fallback plan will be if he hits a rookie wall. Especially if he hits it hard and really shows that he needs time in Rochester.

I loved most of what I saw at the end of the year. But, a small sample size like that can be a bit of a mirage. Mitts being a good example.

And while you can shelter F & D more, it is way harder to shelter a goalie.

 

[dkollidas]

My concern with Levi in Buffalo next year is that I worry about what the fallback plan will be if he hits a rookie wall. Especially if he hits it hard and really shows that he needs time in Rochester.

I loved most of what I saw at the end of the year. But, a small sample size like that can be a bit of a mirage. Mitts being a good example.

And while you can shelter F & D more, it is way harder to shelter a goalie.

I agree. I would be happy if they brought in a Raanta/Andersen type to pair with him, and moved UPL. Then Comrie would hopefully clear to Rochester. If he struggles the other guy gets more starts and then if necessary Comrie can come up. But at the same time, I just have a gut feeling about Levi and would like to see him take the job.

 

[joshjull]

There's no point going around in circles, Josh.

If Adams had gone out to acquire a legitimate #1 starter it would have left a much tougher path for Levi - instead of doing what he did in ensuring there was no incumbent starter, nobody to 'block' Levi.

That's the initial point i was making & it's not even debatable.

I think we’re talking past each other not going in circles.

Yeah - i don't think any of this is far fetched.

I wasn't even sure what was going to happen as recently as when Levi signed... But after they rode him down the stretch - everything became clear. This was (and is) the plan all along.

It's not like Adams & Granato are working against each other either - they're in synergy. I expect Granato has been on board with this from the outset.

And at this point - I'm even comfortable with it myself as a fan. But only on the condition a somewhat dependable, experienced 1B is added as a safety net.

We’ve known for some time that they weren’t looking to block the young goalies (UPL and Levi) just like they weren’t at other positions. I’m guessing this epiphany explains your zeal in the previous responses.


The number #1 goalie comment in the first post doesn’t make sense. There are two goalie spots. Having one filled by a NHL starter doesn’t block Levi from a NHL roster spot. But it would block UPL. Plus acquiring that level goalie is pretty hard to do

 

[Dingo44]

I think we’re talking past each other not going in circles.

We’ve known for some time that they weren’t looking to block the young goalies (UPL and Levi) just like they weren’t at other positions. I’m guessing this epiphany explains your zeal in the previous responses.


The number #1 goalie comment in the first post doesn’t make sense. There are two goalie spots. Having one filled by a NHL starter doesn’t black Levi from a NHL roster spot. But it would block UPL. Plus acquiring that level goalie is pretty hard to do

Agreed. It's a tall ask to sign a good veteran goalie knowing he's coming in as a stop-gap for Levi until he's ready. In the meantime, you lose UPL who had a good rookie season despite how some people around here feel about it.

It's the dream - but it's a tough thing to find - good, vet, cool with being a backup but can be a full-time starter....