All Encompassing Tortorella Thread Pt. II

[haveandare]

He will be here next year, unless there is a major MAJOR collapse.

IF we miss the playoffs then I'd say he is on very thin ice next season. If we do make the playoffs and lets say get knocked out in the first round I'd say he only has a couple months next season to prove he is still a good coach here. If this sort of play continues into next season I wouldn't be surprised to see him out of here.

I agree with this, and think that it would be the wisest course of action from a GM standpoint.

This season is a weird one schedule wise. A big part of NYR's success last year was that they were so well conditioned as a team, and this year it just wasn't possible to assure that like Torts normal does. Another part of the success was that they thought and played like a tight knit team. This year, half of the forwards turned over and the team was forced to get to know those new guys while also trying to cram a shortened camp in.

He should get at least the beginning of next season to show that he can or cannot get this team to repeat the type of play we saw last year. How long of a period he gets to prove that should be related to if/how this year's team turns it around. If they suck right till the end, he should get less time next year than if they pull it together at some point.

 

[The Gloaming]

We're 65% into the season. We really can't be using "shortened training camp" as an excuse anymore. It's getting really old.

 

[Callagraves]

He will be here next year, unless there is a major MAJOR collapse.

IF we miss the playoffs then I'd say he is on very thin ice next season. If we do make the playoffs and lets say get knocked out in the first round I'd say he only has a couple months next season to prove he is still a good coach here. If this sort of play continues into next season I wouldn't be surprised to see him out of here.

And this is exactly the kind of leeway he should have. He wants to say that this odd season ****ed everything up? ok. Your guys better start next season like the god damn blackhawks though.

 

[haveandare]

We're 65% into the season. We really can't be using "shortened training camp" as an excuse anymore. It's getting really old.

Training camp is an important part of the process of getting a team together, especially after turning over half of the forwards. It's a time to establish the base that the entire season is built off of. Especially with Torts and his conditioning obsession.

 

[Dorado*]

News flash every coach stresses conditioning . There are equal number of myths the Torts apologists propagate as do the detractors .
The guy has been tuned out and it appears the goaltender is on board with it

 

[The Gloaming]

Training camp is an important part of the process of getting a team together, especially after turning over half of the forwards. It's a time to establish the base that the entire season is built off of. Especially with Torts and his conditioning obsession.

I'm sorry, but this excuse sounded good 2 weeks into the season. But it's more than half way over, and all we keep hearing is "shortened training camp." These guys should be in mid-season form by now. Just more excuses for their craptastic play. I'm getting sick of it all.

 

[haveandare]

News flash every coach stresses conditioning . There are equal number of myths the Torts apologists propagate as do the detractors .
The guy has been tuned out and it appears the goaltender is on board with it

Newsflash - conditioning was very obviously one of the main strengths of last year's team. That's no myth. Lack of conditioning is very, very obviously hindering this year's team, especially Richards, the most important piece of this puzzle, who is sucking so hard that he's dragging the team down with him.

I just said like, 3 posts ago, that the guy should be fired if the team doesn't look good to start next season. That's not being an apologist, that's being realistic and not making emotional knee-jerk reactions to every goal against.

 

[Blueshirt Believer]

I'm sorry, but this excuse sounded good 2 weeks into the season. But it's more than half way over, and all we keep hearing is "shortened training camp." These guys should be in mid-season form by now. Just more excuses for their craptastic play. I'm getting sick of it all.

I agree that its probably wishful thinking at this point. I mean Torts did run a full training camp for his first two years. The result was we missed the playoffs and barely made the playoffs the following one.

This whole idea of having a full training camp fixing our problems is just denial.

It MAY help a couple of guys on the team. Then again, it may not...

 

[Callagraves]

News flash every coach stresses conditioning . There are equal number of myths the Torts apologists propagate as do the detractors .
The guy has been tuned out and it appears the goaltender is on board with it

This is complete and utter ********. Tell me what makes you say this.

 

[Callagraves]

I agree that its probably wishful thinking at this point. I mean Torts did run a full training camp for his first two years. The result was we missed the playoffs and barely made the playoffs the following one.

This whole idea of having a full training camp fixing our problems is just denial.

It MAY help a couple of guys on the team. Then again, it may not...

To be fair, those two years had much different, much much weaker teams than we have now. Those were legitimate bubble teams.

 

[haveandare]

I'm sorry, but this excuse sounded good 2 weeks into the season. But it's more than half way over, and all we keep hearing is "shortened training camp." These guys should be in mid-season form by now. Just more excuses for their craptastic play. I'm getting sick of it all.

I don't care how good it sounds, I care how much sense it makes, and to me, it makes a great deal of sense, way more than the popular narrative that the system is killing all the talent even though some of the same exact players had career years in the same exact system last year.

Watch Richards and tell me that he looks like a player who was conditioned properly. Watch Gaborik and tell me the same. Compare them to guys who played in Europe, Nash, MDZ, Stepan. Who's skating well? Who is playing up to the standards they're expected to? That's no coincidence.

 

[Dorado*]

This is complete and utter ********. Tell me what makes you say this.

His snapping at his defensemen deflecting goals into his Own net in stupid " pack the house " system and the saying two goals against is pretty much a loss . All pointing to systemic problems being compounded by pandering to " get Richie Going " and playing Gaborik out of position most of the season and subsequently disappearing .

 

[Maineice11]

Roenick was on Sirius XM's NHL Network Radio and was asked his opinion of Tortorella and the Rangers. Anyone that has Sirius XM may be able to find it on demand. Basically Roenick said he was not sure and that it is possible some players might have quit on him and some may be holding the stick to tight afraid to make a mistake. He was not decisive in his answering though, not really sure what was going on with the Rangers. He seemed to agree with some posters here that there's too much dump and chase maybe (again not very decisive in his answers).

Personally I think it is a confidence issue, and if Torts is acting the same calmness with the media recently with the team then he is not being too hard on the team. Also, he cannot be too hard on Richards because Richards seems so close to going over the edge.

 

[Thirty One]

His snapping at his defensemen deflecting goals into his Own net in stupid " pack the house "

He's always done this.

 

[The Gloaming]

I don't care how good it sounds, I care how much sense it makes, and to me, it makes a great deal of sense, way more than the popular narrative that the system is killing all the talent even though some of the same exact players had career years in the same exact system last year.

Watch Richards and tell me that he looks like a player who was conditioned properly. Watch Gaborik and tell me the same. Compare them to guys who played in Europe, Nash, MDZ, Stepan. Who's skating well? Who is playing up to the standards they're expected to? That's no coincidence.

And?

What, Richards couldn't board a plane and go play in Europe? Oh right, he decided to go to those ******** CBA negotiations instead. I'm sorry, but a veteran player should know what he has to do to prepare for the season. Another excuse. Wonderful. Anymore that are worth sharing?

 

[Dorado*]

Newsflash - conditioning was very obviously one of the main strengths of last year's team. That's no myth. Lack of conditioning is very, very obviously hindering this year's team, especially Richards, the most important piece of this puzzle, who is sucking so hard that he's dragging the team down with him.

I just said like, 3 posts ago, that the guy should be fired if the team doesn't look good to start next season. That's not being an apologist, that's being realistic and not making emotional knee-jerk reactions to every goal against.

Last year boiled down to :
Super career season goaltending
Besides Staal very few injuries ( part conditioning part fortune )
A fair share of puck luck
Players with a lot of unity and cohesiveness
No Crosby basically
A Flyers team that we beat up on padding our record . Just think we went 500 across them we might not be top seed .
Conditioning no question was a part but there was a ton of other things as well

 

[Vidic15*]

Last year boiled down to :
Super career season goaltending
Besides Staal very few injuries ( part conditioning part fortune )
A fair share of puck luck
Players with a lot of unity and cohesiveness
No Crosby basically
A Flyers team that we beat up on padding our record . Just think we went 500 across them we might not be top seed .
Conditioning no question was a part but there was a ton of other things as well

Last year should be looked at as an anomaly. Everything came together to produce such a good season. Won't happen again under Torts' system.

 

[Callagraves]

His snapping at his defensemen deflecting goals into his Own net in stupid " pack the house " system and the saying two goals against is pretty much a loss . All pointing to systemic problems being compounded by pandering to " get Richie Going " and playing Gaborik out of position most of the season and subsequently disappearing .

Every goaltender gets annoyed with defensemen deflecting goals in.

That same system helped him get a Vezina.

He didn't say 2 was a loss, he said going down 3 was going to be a tough night.

None of that has anything to do with Richards. Hank hates losing, and you saw the frustration. Extrapolating that onto Torts is nothing but silly.

 

[Thirty One]

Last year should be looked at as an anomaly. Everything came together to produce such a good season. Won't happen again under Torts' system.

Or are these 30 games the anomaly?

 

[Callagraves]

I think people who can't outline, in detail, Torts "system" should be banned from using the term as though they know what it means.

 

[ImIdaho]

Or are these 30 games the anomaly?

I think us finishing 1st is the anomaly. Since he's taken over the reigns we have finished 8th, 7th, missed the playoffs, and we're currently in 8th, so this season isn't out of the ordinary, really.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

And?

What, Richards couldn't board a plane and go play in Europe? Oh right, he decided to go to those ******** CBA negotiations instead. I'm sorry, but a veteran player should know what he has to do to prepare for the season. Another excuse. Wonderful. Anymore that are worth sharing?

Oh man, don't get me started on this one. I can rant at some of those lazy players for hours for this.

I can see a lack of training camp affecting guys who are unfamiliar with the system like Asham and Nash...but not the others.

A guy like Richards has no excuse for being out of shape at all. He, along with all the other Rangers, know exactly what the standards are for conditioning for this team. Plus, it's not like these guys were standing on the street corners begging for change during the lockout, as they obviously have the money and facilities available to stay in "Tortorella shape."

That's one area I'll give the coaching staff a big pass on. Short of kidnapping all the players and locking them up in a gym during the lockout, there wasn't much more they could do to keep these guys in shape.

To see guys this far into the season huffing and puffing on the bench like that is 100% on the players.

Of course, it's up to the coaching staff to also recognise the guys are gassed and at least attempt to roll the lines a little better.

 

[Callagraves]

I think us finishing 1st is the anomaly. Since he's taken over the reigns we have finished 8th, 7th, missed the playoffs, and we're currently in 8th, so this season isn't out of the ordinary, really.

But look at those teams. As the manpower improved, so has the finish. This year is the first one out of the ordinary.

 

[Dorado*]

Last year should be looked at as an anomaly. Everything came together to produce such a good season. Won't happen again under Torts' system.

Thank pretty much what I said ll last year , it was a wild ride and a ton of fun but I personally called it smoke , mirrors and the KING . Was after Torts head since he abandoned " safe is death" . What a crock that was . Torts is the ultimate self promoter magnanimous in victory , surly in defeat . Did he win a cup , absolutely and outside of that he's been pretty solid but his time as come and gone here and it's not all his doing but somebody has to hold the bag . I was never mesmerized by the Cult of Torts

 

[ImIdaho]

But look at those teams. As the manpower improved, so has the finish. This year is the first one out of the ordinary.

Others would say he still improved the man power, and we're still in 8th.