Player Discussion Alexis Lafrenière
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SA16
Sixstring
From 2015-2016 to 2019-2020 Skinner had the 5th highest 5v5 goals/60 in the league and 5th most actual 5v5 goals. Calling skinner a "great goal scorer" in his prime isn't really something weird. The only ones ahead of him in that time period were Matthews, Ovechkin, Guentzel, and Pastrnak. It's an odd comparison since Lafreniere is not a volume shooter like him but Skinner was clearly an elite goal scorer in his prime.
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That would be a bust imo. What a mistake trading Buch when it is possible neither Kakko or Laf will be as good as him.
NickyFotiu
NYR 2024 Cup Champs!
- Sep 29, 2011
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People are hoping for so much that they are getting ahead of themselves. Laf is playing better. He is not playing anywhere near what some folks are saying imo. It is a process. When Laf was at a 1 people wanted to say he was at a 5. Now that he is at a 5 some want to say he is at an 8 on the way to a 10. I understand. I want him to be a 10 as well. Fact is he may or may not ever be a 10. We are going to have to be patient and go through the process. Guys are not fully mature physically or mentally at 20 years old. Nobody on this board can say for a fact he will be a 80 point scorer. Kreider never scored 80 points. Right now I think the goal should be closer to a 25 point scorer in his last 41 games. Neither has Zibs. They have both been close but not there. Saying Laf will score 80 next season is jumping the gun. We will have to wait and see. First he has to get to 30 points
EdJovanovski
#FreeRempe
I don’t know how truly physically immature Laf is, I’m pretty sure the science does say… you know how some people look 10 years older or 10 years younger than they are? It’s because biologically they ARE older or younger than their age in years. People don’t age the same. Lafreniere has looked like he was in his 30’s since he was 17. He very well could’ve just been fully matured while playing in the Q against kidsPeople are hoping for so much that they are getting ahead of themselves. Laf is playing better. He is not playing anywhere near what some folks are saying imo. It is a process. When Laf was at a 1 people wanted to say he was at a 5. Now that he is at a 5 some want to say he is at an 8 on the way to a 10. I understand. I want him to be a 10 as well. Fact is he may or may not ever be a 10. We are going to have to be patient and go through the process. Guys are not fully mature physically or mentally at 20 years old. Nobody on this board can say for a fact he will be a 80 point scorer. Kreider never scored 80 points. Right now I think the goal should be closer to a 25 point scorer in his last 41 games. Neither has Zibs. They have both been close but not there. Saying Laf will score 80 next season is jumping the gun. We will have to wait and see. First he has to get to 30 points
Shesterkybomb
Registered User
- Dec 30, 2016
- 17,488
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I look at Laf like Buch when he got here, the way he wanted to play he wasn't physically able to play against NHL players, Buch ended up getting there and Laf will too, the good thing is that Laf is a more skilled version of Buchnevich, unfortunately it might take an extra year or two than we hoped. Usually those types of players take longer, and i see the same with Kakko though im more concerned with him because confidence plays such a huge part in his game, Laf doesn't get frustrated like Kakko does.
NickyFotiu
NYR 2024 Cup Champs!
- Sep 29, 2011
- 16,835
- 8,739
Everyone is different but I have seen Laf get pushed around at times especially last season. In fact I think I saw him realizing okay these are grown men I'm playing against now looks at times. I do not expect that to happen as much as he gets in the 22-25 year old space as it happened in the 19-20 year old space. I expect he will get stronger physically and mentally as the years go on. That does not guarantee he will be an 80 point player though. We will have to just wait and see. I do think fans should stop talking about 80 until he gets to 30-40-50-60. Last year before Laf played a single game the guy on the NHL draft telecast said he could hop right in and score 70. Lets not repeat that kind of stuff.
EdJovanovski
#FreeRempe
I know people get annoyed by my love for Krav lol but when you watch him play it is very clear why he was drafted top 10. That is not the case with Laf or Kakko whatsoever. Does anyone doubt that Kravtsov gets traded and scores way more than Laf or Kakko while flashing all the speed & flashiness that the other young kids around the league are while our 1st & 2nd overall picks look like career bottom 6 guys. If you didn’t know better nobody would guess they were top picks. Even things like one timers, Krav has a 100mph rocket and isn’t afraid of shooting. Laf & Kakko are afraid of their shadow
Brief Candle
Hank's Forehead Sweat
I was team kravs. He had this swagger when he was on the ice that I felt was visibly noticeable. However what he pulled kinda reminds me of Messier post-playing career. He wants everything now and is banking on his past to get it rather than putting the work in. With hindsight, had he agreed to spend what would have been roughly a week in Hartford, this season would have been very different for him.
For Laffy, I doubt he ever lives up to being the #1 draft. I hope I'm proven wrong. Still, he is a heck of a hockey player who does a lot of little things right. He fits well on that top line, and it was good to hear why Turk moved him for the night. I totally agree with Kakko being afraid of his own shadow, but not Laffy. He's got balls. He's the one going into the corners digging out pucks. If there was tertiary assists given, he'd probably have a shitload more points.
ReddestRum
Sad even when winning
- Dec 19, 2013
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You think Laf is showing more skill than Buch?? Buch was a 63 point player after his first 2 seasons. Even after his worst season, he still winded up eking out nearly 40 points and since then, has been a nearly 50 point support player. I just don't see anything in Laf's game that screams he's a more skilled player.
Buch plays that grinder hockey that I wish we had right now.
Kravtsov looked good for like 5 games lol.
He looked pretty terrible after that. I doubt he'll amount to much of anything with that attitude of his no matter where he plays.
and LMAO at Laf's play recently being a "5."
No he doesn't lol. Buch is great off the rush but sucks at the grinder stuff. Its why hes always struggled in tighter checking games and why hes never produced in games of any consequence.
Also, Buch was 2 years older than Laf is now when he debuted in this league. All I know is down the stretch last year one of them actually played well while the other wilted. The vet was the one who wilted.
ReddestRum
Sad even when winning
- Dec 19, 2013
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I dunno man. I can't look at any of Buch's stats and go, man this guy was a terrible player and did nothing for the team. One of Buch's problems here was that he was a huge overpasser, but he doesn't seem to have that problem anymore and his goal production is actually going up with STL. And I know that you guys like to imagine Laf's age as a crutch, but seem to somehow forget there are players his age and younger who actually look like they have to skill to have consecutive 80 PT seasons.
No one said that he did nothing.
Facts are that when the games got big (we didn't play a ton of them while he was there, but we did play them) and the games got tougher, he wilted.
The age IS a factor though. Comparing him to other guys in the league right now at his age or younger is moving the goal posts, we're talking about Buchnevich.
- Apr 16, 2012
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Ahahaha. Watching people seriously trying to compare Buch's NHL stats, which he didn't even start till his D+3 season, to what Laf has done in the NHL in his D + 1 & half of 2. Come on guys. By his D+7 Buchnevich had still not broken 50 points. I'll tell you what if Lafreniere still hasn't broken 50 points by his D+7 I'll certainly agree that he's a disappointment. Hahaha.
And listen I like Buch, but this revisionism is a bit over the top. He's a GOOD player. Two way even. But no he's not a grinder, and he's not a "tough" player by any means, though he's capable of some sneaky dirty stuff with his stick. I get that, as long as you are doing it to survive out there, which is why I think he does it. He's not out there trying to injure people like some others.
Laf and Buch are not comparable players, and they won't be comparable as Laf matures in the league either. I mean right NOW D+1.5 Laf has only 6 less goals than D+7.5 Buch, only ONE less even strength goal...
And listen I like Buch, but this revisionism is a bit over the top. He's a GOOD player. Two way even. But no he's not a grinder, and he's not a "tough" player by any means, though he's capable of some sneaky dirty stuff with his stick. I get that, as long as you are doing it to survive out there, which is why I think he does it. He's not out there trying to injure people like some others.
Laf and Buch are not comparable players, and they won't be comparable as Laf matures in the league either. I mean right NOW D+1.5 Laf has only 6 less goals than D+7.5 Buch, only ONE less even strength goal...
KirkAlbuquerque
#WeNeverGetAGoodCoach
Because of 1 game where everyone was crap?
Jesus some of you are insufferable.
EdJovanovski
#FreeRempe
That's an intellectually dishonest statement, his D+5 & D+6 seasons were both shortened seasons. Had a 55pt pace in his D6, and 73pt pace in his D7. Even his D5 season he was on pace for 49 lol.
You're also ignoring the fact Buch is on pace for 44 assists, while Lafreniere doesn't even have half the assists Brett Howden does this season. 1 more assist than half of what Marc Staal has this season.
- Apr 16, 2012
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Hahahaha. Let's see if he stays "crap." I mean is it weird for a player, especially a player in his D+2, to have some ups and downs?
But I swear it's like some people decided he's a bust, and now are emotionally invested in being correct about it. (Not necessarily YOU KirkAlb, just happens to be a another thought I wanted to express.)
- Apr 16, 2012
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It's neither factually nor intellectually dishonest. It's ACCURATE. But how about this: if Laf hasn't broken 50 points by his D+5 I'll consider him a disappointment. EVEN IF HE GETS "ON PACE" FOR 49! And "on pace"... I get it if it's a COVID or strike shortened season, that's legit. But if he just wasn't able to get in the games, whether being sat or injured, pace means little to me. Staying healthy and not being scratched are part of what make a player valuable. Doesn't everyone say that about Blais?
My point stands: they aren't comparable players. You can't compare Buch's D+1 or D+2 NHL stats with Laf because he didn't even make the NHL for those seasons. When Laf gets to D+4 let's see how they stack up. You're right, he doesn't have the assists of Buch, nor the power play time, nor Tarasenko, but assists are twice as available as goals. Goals are what win games, "assists" are self explanatory and there is a reason there is no trophy for most assists. And Howden? Who cares? First, I never thought he was as terrible as many, and second he's in his D+6... But yes, of course I want Laf, and all of our players to get assists, it's not negligible, it just wasn't the point.
Everyone says they want to see signs that Laf is a good player trending up... until you give them an example like his goal scoring, then it's "but what about Howden's assists?"? Hahaha. Come on, this is silly.
I just laugh like a mental patient reading some of this stuff.
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KirkAlbuquerque
#WeNeverGetAGoodCoach
I think this says more about how you evaluate players than what actually makes a player good
The fact that you’re saying Laf doesn’t have a shot, let alone a one timer is hilarious and clear you either don’t watch the games or ignore anything that doesn’t fit your narrative.
- Jan 18, 2012
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