Alex Edler - Part II

[Justin Disease]

Alexander Edler

What's up with Alexander Edler lately ? Last year have been very tough for him, just like the whole team. I expected his production to go up this year. He get a lot of ice time, he get power play time.

Except his +/- rating and his defensive play, I dont see much improvement in his offensive game.

Why is he not producing like in the good days ?

 

[Nucker101]

What's up with Alexander Edler lately ? Last year have been very tough for him, just like the whole team. I expected his production to go up this year. He get a lot of ice time, he get power play time.

Except his +/- rating and his defensive play, I dont see much improvement in his offensive game.

Why is he not producing like in the good days ?

His defensive game is a lot better this year, but his offensive game is definitely not what it used to be. I'm not sure if it's because of that back surgery in 2011 or just a confidence thing, but he hasn't looked as good offensively the past few years. The Canucks really lack a true PMD and "PP QB".

 

[Addison Rae]

He's playing great hockey, so frankly I don't care.

 

[Justin Disease]

He's playing great hockey, so frankly I don't care.

So why can't he produce more if he's playing great hockey ?


2008-2009 : 0.46 PTS/PG
2009-2010 : 0.55 PTS/PG
2010-2011 : 0.65 PTS/PG
2012-2013 : 0.49 PTS/PG
2013-2014 : 0.35 PTS/PG
2014-2015 : 0.30 PTS/PG after 30 games

All these years having a TOI/PG between 21 and 24 minutes.

Someone remind him he's not a defensive defensemen. There are plenty of them around the league at cheaper price. Hall Gill is still a UFA, he would play for 700k.

Decent 1st pairing offensive defensemen put over 40 pts a year. He's on pace for less than 25 pts (again)

 

[MS]

Given his godawful play last year, I'd never have guessed he could do well on a shutdown pairing this year, so I'm not complaining too much. I'll take a 20 point Edler who plays well defensively over a 50-point Edler who was the no-effort trainwreck we saw last year.

That said, his PP work has been awful and it's been 13 months since he scored an ES goal. He simply isn't a very good offensive player.

 

[opendoor]

Yeah, Edler's defensive play has been phenomenal and he definitely deserves credit for turning what wasn't a big strength into what has become the strongest part of his game this year. But at the same time that pairing is generating basically nothing offensively. You have to scroll pretty far down this list to find Edler and Tanev:

http://stats.hockeyanalysis.com/rat...378&teamid=0&type=goals&sort=F60&sortdir=DESC

Though I agree with the above. I'd gladly take this Edler over a poorer defensive version who put up a few more points.

 

[thepuckmonster]

So why can't he produce more if he's playing great hockey ?


2008-2009 : 0.46 PTS/PG
2009-2010 : 0.55 PTS/PG
2010-2011 : 0.65 PTS/PG
2012-2013 : 0.49 PTS/PG
2013-2014 : 0.35 PTS/PG
2014-2015 : 0.30 PTS/PG after 30 games

All these years having a TOI/PG between 21 and 24 minutes.

Someone remind him he's not a defensive defensemen. There are plenty of them around the league at cheaper price. Hall Gill is still a UFA, he would play for 700k.

Decent 1st pairing offensive defensemen put over 40 pts a year. He's on pace for less than 25 pts (again)

Because Edler never really has been an offensive defenseman outside of the PP at its peak. It's not a weird concept.

 

[Rotting Corpse*]

I think he's been a bit unlucky given the monstrous amount of PP time he's getting, but now that we don't have a Salo/Garrison to feed the puck to on the point, our PP set up is different than it's been in year's past, and Edler's weak wristers from the blueline are not really a big part of our set up.

 

[Scurr]

Because Edler never really has been an offensive defenseman outside of the PP at its peak. It's not a weird concept.

I agree with this. He wasn't the great offensive player people thought we had at that time. I think a little of the opposite is happening right now. Edler has been unlucky not to put up points and is being undersold now. He's contributed to the resurgence of the team offensively imo, despite the low point total. I still think that will come... though admittedly that looks worse with every passing game.

 

[Addison Rae]

So why can't he produce more if he's playing great hockey ?


2008-2009 : 0.46 PTS/PG
2009-2010 : 0.55 PTS/PG
2010-2011 : 0.65 PTS/PG
2012-2013 : 0.49 PTS/PG
2013-2014 : 0.35 PTS/PG
2014-2015 : 0.30 PTS/PG after 30 games

All these years having a TOI/PG between 21 and 24 minutes.

Someone remind him he's not a defensive defensemen. There are plenty of them around the league at cheaper price. Hall Gill is still a UFA, he would play for 700k.

Decent 1st pairing offensive defensemen put over 40 pts a year. He's on pace for less than 25 pts (again)

This is an awful analysis. Alex Edler was spoon fed time offensive zone starts and power play time with the twins, which obviously inflated his production. The Alex Edler of this year is carrying the play on a shutdown pairing playing against the NHL's elite. I don't know what the **** you're going on about with Gill, because you're out of your mind if you think that these two players would deliver similar results.

 

[MS]

I think his offensive production from 2008-2012 was a bit of a mirage. He was never much of an ES point producer, but did show that he could rack up 20-25 PP points every year as the secondary point man on a massively talented unit.

Without Ehrhoff and prime Sedins ... not so much. Just a very static PP player with poor shot selection and little creativity. OK on the 2nd unit but a far-below average first-unit PP guy at this level.

 

[Icebreakers]

I think his offensive production from 2008-2012 was a bit of a mirage. He was never much of an ES point producer, but did show that he could rack up 20-25 PP points every year as the secondary point man on a massively talented unit.

Without Ehrhoff and prime Sedins ... not so much. Just a very static PP player with poor shot selection and little creativity. OK on the 2nd unit but a far-below average first-unit PP guy at this level.

sorry but NO one can put up pp points without Ehrhoff and prime Sedins. Not even the Sedins.

 

[Proto]

I think his offensive production from 2008-2012 was a bit of a mirage. He was never much of an ES point producer, but did show that he could rack up 20-25 PP points every year as the secondary point man on a massively talented unit.

Without Ehrhoff and prime Sedins ... not so much. Just a very static PP player with poor shot selection and little creativity. OK on the 2nd unit but a far-below average first-unit PP guy at this level.

Exactly this.

I'd also add that outside of elite offensive defensemen, there are very, very few d-men who drive play offensively well enough to accumulate much in the way of 5v5 points. It just doesn't happen much. Most of the variation you see in ES point totals for d-men is a result of fluctuations in luck/teammate performance.

This is obviously not true in all cases, but it's typically the rule of thumb for defensemen. I do think Edler looks far less mobile in the offensive zone than he used to (he rarely moves down towards the net, never is in a prime shooting position, etc.), but at least he's playing oustanding defense now.

 

[Nucker101]

sorry but NO one can put up pp points without Ehrhoff and prime Sedins. Not even the Sedins.

Wait, what? Henrik has 10 PPP's in 30 games, Daniel has 11. 27-30 powerplay points over a full season is a good pace, the PP points are there for the taking for the Canucks defensemen, they're just not very good offensively or creative with the puck.

 

[alternate]

I think his offensive production from 2008-2012 was a bit of a mirage. He was never much of an ES point producer, but did show that he could rack up 20-25 PP points every year as the secondary point man on a massively talented unit.

Without Ehrhoff and prime Sedins ... not so much. Just a very static PP player with poor shot selection and little creativity. OK on the 2nd unit but a far-below average first-unit PP guy at this level.

Far below average? Oh boy, I'd like to hear who you consider "average" seeing as Edler has been a part of some very good power play units. He's not an elite offensive dman, but he does have some skilz. He just can't be the best offensive option from the blueline...give the team a better option to pair Edler with on the PP ( and a system that uses the point) and he's back to a 40ish point player.

 

[MS]

Far below average? Oh boy, I'd like to hear who you consider "average" seeing as Edler has been a part of some very good power play units. He's not an elite offensive dman, but he does have some skilz. He just can't be the best offensive option from the blueline...give the team a better option to pair Edler with on the PP ( and a system that uses the point) and he's back to a 40ish point player.

Absolutely, far below average. There are very, very few worse options getting regular top-unit PP time on the point in the NHL.

The guy has been on our top unit all season and has 1 PP assist as the main point man. That's just astonishingly bad. And his previous two seasons weren't much better. His puck distribution sucks - he does nothing other than make the obvious pass and take low-percentage shots. Never finds a passing seam to open up a PK unit, doesn't put pucks in good positions for deflections. And rarely activates forward or leaves the point (although this is possibly a system thing).

And pretty much any defender can score 40 points as the secondary PP guy on a great PP with a great PP QB and the Sedins. This isn't some sort of feat.

Kyle Quincey scored 38 points a few years ago. Do you want him on our #1 PP unit?

 

[Regal]

I agree with the idea that Edler was never that good offensively to begin with. When he first came up, he was considered more of the Tanev type: no mistakes type, who's confident with the puck and drives the play forward. Which is funny considering last season. But I think the high point totals were a mirage based on the team around him and being used in offensive situations. Despite the fact he and Ehrhoff produced at similar levels when they were here, I thought it was clear as day who was better offensively. Edler has some good offensive tools but just doesn't have the instincts to use them effectively. He's playing extremely well though, and this version is well worth the contract so I'm not too concerned. If the team could somehow replace Bieksa's role with legit offensive dman to play with Hamhuis, the defense would actually look pretty good.

 

[alternate]

Absolutely, far below average. There are very, very few worse options getting regular top-unit PP time on the point in the NHL.

The guy has been on our top unit all season and has 1 PP assist as the main point man. That's just astonishingly bad. And his previous two seasons weren't much better. His puck distribution sucks - he does nothing other than make the obvious pass and take low-percentage shots. Never finds a passing seam to open up a PK unit, doesn't put pucks in good positions for deflections. And rarely activates forward or leaves the point (although this is possibly a system thing).

And pretty much any defender can score 40 points as the secondary PP guy on a great PP with a great PP QB and the Sedins. This isn't some sort of feat.

Kyle Quincey scored 38 points a few years ago. Do you want him on our #1 PP unit?

Well then provide some context. Who do you consider an average PP blueliner? I'd like to hear who you consider Edler to be "much worse" than. Because it's hard to imagine a player that has been a mainstay on a top 5 PP for multiple years being "far below average."

Regardless, he's far and away our best option. He's light years ahead of our next best option. Not Edler's fault he's the best option we have. And just for the record I'm not claiming he's a great option, but he's certainly above average around the league, as shown by the success we've had with him. He's being put in a tough spot now with our 1 point man system, but that doesn't make him far below average.

 

[Amused To Death]

Regardless, he's far and away our best option. He's light years ahead of our next best option. Not Edler's fault he's the best option we have. And just for the record I'm not claiming he's a great option, but he's certainly above average around the league, as shown by the success we've had with him. He's being put in a tough spot now with our 1 point man system, but that doesn't make him far below average.

I'd actually like to give Tanev some minutes instead over Edler. Tanev moves the puck, is a fast skater, and has a decent shot. No bombs, but he can move the puck around.

 

[Rey]

The team is used to having Burrows or Kesler going into dirty areas, in front of the net, and digging for goals which requires more shots from the point. Now, with Vrbata, the Twins just focus on feeding Vrbata.

 

[MS]

Well then provide some context. Who do you consider an average PP blueliner? I'd like to hear who you consider Edler to be "much worse" than. Because it's hard to imagine a player that has been a mainstay on a top 5 PP for multiple years being "far below average."

Regardless, he's far and away our best option. He's light years ahead of our next best option. Not Edler's fault he's the best option we have. And just for the record I'm not claiming he's a great option, but he's certainly above average around the league, as shown by the success we've had with him. He's being put in a tough spot now with our 1 point man system, but that doesn't make him far below average.

Just on Canadian teams, nearly every guy on a first unit is better - Subban, Markov, Karlsson, Phaneuf (by a bit), Franson, Byfuglien, Enstrom, Schultz, Giordano, Brodie, Wideman.

He might be better than whoever Edmonton is playing as their 2nd point man. And that holds around the league. It's a major problem.

 

[shortshorts]

Edler = Erik Johnson

Mobile, strong defense men who have cannons from the point but a lack of creativity to run the power play.

 

[leftwinglockdown]

I don't think you can single out just Edler for his production. Lack of scoring from the back-end has been a team trait so far this year. I'd wager that it has something to do with how the Sedins like to setup in the offensive zone.

 

[19canuck90]

Ughh the problem with our fan base is it takes to long to realize these things. Alex Edler can't play defense...period. The series against the kings when we won the presidents trophy and got knocked out in the first round 90% of the goals given up were by Edler... Pinching at wrong times, missing assignments, delay of game penalties. We should have shipped him out then but our fan base loved him and gillis did what the fan base wanted so we were doomed. He can't play defense 1st goal in Dallas game tonight another example.

 

[Verviticus]

Edler = Erik Johnson

Mobile, strong defense men who have cannons from the point but a lack of creativity to run the power play.

they are not similar. erik johnson is bad