Alex Burmistrov (Part II)

[surixon]

Still an option for a sign and trade. At the draft.

Yeah, the Jets will have more leverage in a trade if he's inked to deal.

They may or may not elect to go that route. I myself am pretty indifferent to him coming back. It wouldn't bother me one way or the other provided we get decent value for him in a trade.

 

[Romang67]

How often do sign and trades happen in the NHL? A legitimate sign and trade, not a player being signed the season before to an extension and then traded before the new deal kicks in.

 

[surixon]

How often do sign and trades happen in the NHL? A legitimate sign and trade, not a player being signed the season before to an extension and then traded before the new deal kicks in.

Not all that often although its pretty previlant in other cap leagues. The situation in this case is unique which opens the possibility at least IMO.

 

[Bob E]

How often do sign and trades happen in the NHL? A legitimate sign and trade, not a player being signed the season before to an extension and then traded before the new deal kicks in.

Turris is the guy that comes to mind for me. Wasn't going to play in Arizona, and was signed knowing he was going to be moved. I believe he returned to the Yotes and played some games before moving to the Sens, so even that is a bit different.

 

[ps241]

Interesting timing of the release of this information.

Which camp mentioned it and why?

 

[surixon]

Interesting timing of the release of this information.

Which camp mentioned it and why?

Could be either party trying to drum up trade interest.

 

[TS Quint]

Not all that often although its pretty previlant in other cap leagues. The situation in this case is unique which opens the possibility at least IMO.

Well, no. What would Froliks motivation be to do this? The reason it happens in other leagues is because resigning team can offer more money. So unless Frolik and another team are looking for that 8th year and the other team is not only willing to pay the money AND fork over some assets it doesn't make sense.

 

[surixon]

Well, no. What would Froliks motivation be to do this? The reason it happens in other leagues is because resigning team can offer more money. So unless Frolik and another team are looking for that 8th year and the other team is not only willing to pay the money AND fork over some assets it doesn't make sense.

We are talking Burmistrov not Frolik.

 

[Hank Chinaski]

Not really seeing how sign and trade makes sense. What is a signed Burmistrov actually worth at this point?His value to the Jets is no doubt going to be higher than his perceived trade value around the league.

 

[Hank Chinaski]

Interesting timing of the release of this information.

Which camp mentioned it and why?

I'm guessing Chevy. Bit of leverage in his talks with Stafford's camp.

 

[TS Quint]

We are talking Burmistrov not Frolik.

So in which case the value of the player is already decided by the CBA when the other team signs an offer sheet. Or you have a Kessel situation where they just traded the rights to the BLeafs for a larger package. Still no need to sign.

 

[jetsforever]

I can always count on HFBoards to post relevant news the very minute it is released

In other news, I sure hope they agree to a contract and Burmi (my old favourite player) returns to the Jets next year

 

[Whileee]

I like the idea of Burmi re-signing. If true, it would suggest that Chevy and Maurice feel that they can work him into the line-up. If so, they have 8 of their top 9 forward spots sorted out, I would think. It sounds like Stafford would take the other, which might be okay if they don't pay too much. Just don't put him on the same line as Wheeler. In fact, I'd put him on the 3rd line.

Here are a couple of possible line-ups that I wouldn't mind....

Perreault-Scheifele-Wheeler (Our top line offensive line... Scheifele is going to kill it)
Ladd-Little-Ehlers (Put the rookie in with a couple of vets and let them try to keep up)
Burmi-Lowry-Stafford (Solid 3rd line, with Burmi and Lowry driving possession and Stafford with a bit of scoring punch)
Petan-Copp-Thorbs / Stempniak (Petan plays the 4th line role like Drouin with the Bolts)

I'd like to see this shuffled around a bit during the season.

Ehlers-Scheifele-Wheeler (could be magic, and terrifyingly fast)
Ladd-Little-Burmi (strong possession line to match up with opponents' top lines)
Perreault-Lowry-Stafford (a bit more punch on the 3rd line with Perreault - he likes to play with big guys)
Petan-Copp-Thorbs / Stempniak (as you were)

 

[surixon]

I like the idea of Burmi re-signing. If true, it would suggest that Chevy and Maurice feel that they can work him into the line-up. If so, they have 8 of their top 9 forward spots sorted out, I would think. It sounds like Stafford would take the other, which might be okay if they don't pay too much. Just don't put him on the same line as Wheeler. In fact, I'd put him on the 3rd line.

Here are a couple of possible line-ups that I wouldn't mind....

Perreault-Scheifele-Wheeler (Our top line offensive line... Scheifele is going to kill it)
Ladd-Little-Ehlers (Put the rookie in with a couple of vets and let them try to keep up)
Burmi-Lowry-Stafford (Solid 3rd line, with Burmi and Lowry driving possession and Stafford with a bit of scoring punch)
Petan-Copp-Thorbs / Stempniak (Petan plays the 4th line role like Drouin with the Bolts)

I'd like to see this shuffled around a bit during the season.

Ehlers-Scheifele-Wheeler (could be magic, and terrifyingly fast)
Ladd-Little-Burmi (strong possession line to match up with opponents' top lines)
Perreault-Lowry-Stafford (a bit more punch on the 3rd line with Perreault - he likes to play with big guys)
Petan-Copp-Thorbs / Stempniak (as you were)

Your first set is how I'd see the lines if both Burmi and Stafford sign. I however see no way that management would keep Petan around for the fourth line given that unlike Drouin he's eligible for the AHL.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I like the idea of Burmi re-signing. If true, it would suggest that Chevy and Maurice feel that they can work him into the line-up. If so, they have 8 of their top 9 forward spots sorted out, I would think. It sounds like Stafford would take the other, which might be okay if they don't pay too much. Just don't put him on the same line as Wheeler. In fact, I'd put him on the 3rd line.

Here are a couple of possible line-ups that I wouldn't mind....

Perreault-Scheifele-Wheeler (Our top line offensive line... Scheifele is going to kill it)
Ladd-Little-Ehlers (Put the rookie in with a couple of vets and let them try to keep up)
Burmi-Lowry-Stafford (Solid 3rd line, with Burmi and Lowry driving possession and Stafford with a bit of scoring punch)
Petan-Copp-Thorbs / Stempniak (Petan plays the 4th line role like Drouin with the Bolts)

I'd like to see this shuffled around a bit during the season.

Ehlers-Scheifele-Wheeler (could be magic, and terrifyingly fast)
Ladd-Little-Burmi (strong possession line to match up with opponents' top lines)
Perreault-Lowry-Stafford (a bit more punch on the 3rd line with Perreault - he likes to play with big guys)
Petan-Copp-Thorbs / Stempniak (as you were)

What have you heard about Stafford? Don't play him on the same line as Wheeler. Do play him on the same side as Wheeler (hope he is better on his natural side). Third line would be good. Unfortunately he will be paid a little high for the 3rd line but that can't be helped.

Interesting 4th line you have there. If we have Stempniak I hope he is not alternating in the PB with Thor. He could play the right side with Petan and the left side with Thor giving Petan a turn watching (just not too often). I have resisted the idea of Petan on the 4th and PMo has stated that he doesn't like using the 4th line that way but it might be good all around.

 

[MrBoJangelz71]

I guess if we sign Burmi, then trade him quickly after, it replicates a sign and trade. In the NBA it happens when an UFA does not want to return to their previous team, but wants the max years and dollars on their next contract, which their current team can only ink. It also allows the current team to get value from the asset.

It also works when a team wants a pending UFA but does not have the cap space to sign them out right. If the other team obliges, they can ink the contract, then trade him to the team that wanted him, and receive a contract of equal or greater value, if they have cap space to absorb.

Not sure if this flies in the NHL. Are there trade exceptions in the NHL, where one team can send a higher contract back, and receive the difference of value in a trade exception?

 

[Bob E]

Not really seeing how sign and trade makes sense. What is a signed Burmistrov actually worth at this point?His value to the Jets is no doubt going to be higher than his perceived trade value around the league.

Team trading for Burmi knows what he will cost them (contract) and that he can't bolt back to KHL as he's signed an NHL deal.

Gives the acquiring team contract certainty, not performance or value certainty.

 

[TS Quint]

Team trading for Burmi knows what he will cost them (contract) and that he can't bolt back to KHL as he's signed an NHL deal.

Gives the acquiring team contract certainty, not performance or value certainty.

Why doesn't the other team just negotiate the contract them selves?

 

[IamAnton]

Why doesn't the other team just negotiate the contract them selves?

Less value to Winnipeg I would assume.

 

[garret9]

Closest guys to Burmi's 19-20 performance, and how they did at 23:
http://jetsnation.ca/2015/6/22/what-to-expect-from-alexander-burmistrov

 

[ellismate]

Re signing him to a bridge seems like the only sensible option. Him going to the khl seemed to be beneficial to both parties. He needed some extra time to develop and got paid more in the meantime, we weren't in dire need of him, we didn't have to pay him while he was gone and his little stunt killed a bid war for his rfa rights. Hoping to give him something along the lines of two years for no more than 2 per year. I saw all parties win here.

 

[jetsforever]

Closest guys to Burmi's 19-20 performance, and how they did at 23:
http://jetsnation.ca/2015/6/22/what-to-expect-from-alexander-burmistrov

Surprising that Tavares is a comparable, but if Burmi turns out even close to O'Reilly or Little it'll be great

 

[garret9]

Surprising that Tavares is a comparable, but if Burmi turns out even close to O'Reilly or Little it'll be great

Doesn't mean Tavares is a comparable. Mean's Tavares on-ice performance that season was comparable to Burmistrov's. Tavares value was always in that we knew his ceiling was much higher than the rest on the list. Just like how we all know looking at the list that Tom Wandall is worse than what we expect from Burmistrov.

Player's have up and down seasons. Some of those players comparable to Burmi when young would have been on a down year, and some on an up year. Some of those players comparable to Burmi would have been on a down year when they were 23, and some on an up year.

The nice thing is those down and ups cancel out when we combine all the players.
In the end you get something we all kind of expected (as long as you are logical or reasonable).

P/60 ~1.75 - around 2nd line average or elite 3rd line
relCorsi ~+2.5 - elite middle-six two-way numbers

Meh scorer, who is less meh with age and development, with premium two-way numbers.

 

[Aavco Cup]

Re signing him to a bridge seems like the only sensible option. Him going to the khl seemed to be beneficial to both parties. He needed some extra time to develop and got paid more in the meantime, we weren't in dire need of him, we didn't have to pay him while he was gone and his little stunt killed a bid war for his rfa rights. Hoping to give him something along the lines of two years for no more than 2 per year. I saw all parties win here.

I actually think a 1 year deal makes the most sense for both sides.. It's tough to figure out what he should be paid. He does have arbitration rights after 1 more season so he will get paid appropriately if he performs. 1 yr 1.2M show me.

 

[ellismate]

I actually think a 1 year deal makes the most sense for both sides.. It's tough to figure out what he should be paid. He does have arbitration rights after 1 more season so he will get paid appropriately if he performs. 1 yr 1.2M show me.

So what kind of free agent would a 1 year make him at the end? The whole thing about when they become RFA's or UFA's has always confused me.