Jokinen was born late year so he was also almost year older at draft year
Prospect Info: Aleksander Barkov (signed 7/15/13)
- Thread starter flapanthersfan
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Jokinen was born late year so he was also almost year older at draft year
This model that predicts Barkov's production to be 104 points in his prime predicts Jokinen's peak NHL production to be 63 points. Despite the small difference in their production, Barkov did it a year younger so he has a different factor when translating from Junior to NHL. Jokinen had 2 points in 15 games at 17 year old season, so that couldn't be used. But Jokinen was a first liner in his 18 year old season so I used it instead.
Yeah he doesn't shoot much in shootouts. I think he went for the 5 hole once last season. He should shoot every now and then though, goalies start to pick up on this if he chooses to deke 100 % of time. AND his wrist shot is really good.
Also Barkov doesn't have the psychological problems Jokinen suffered from. Whose to tell Jokinen wouldn't have peaked earlier if he would have understood the importance of training like a professional or that his peak would have been more impressive if he didn't have the problem with alcohol.
And Jokinen was nowhere near the defensive player Barkov is already today. Even if Barkov would have similar offensive numbers as Jokinen, he might get many Selke's with his defense.
And actually. That 11% difference in their offensive output in their respective draft seasons isn't exactly small either. Even if we forget their age difference in the draft, if Jokinen's prime was 90 points and Barkov would have 11 percent more, his peak production would be exactly 100 points. So the difference isn't as small as you make it to be.
But you are free to feel scared, I'm not saying it as you shouldn't!
EDIT: and just to make sure, I'll add that Jokinen didn't crack his FEL team as a full timer at age 17, he did it as an 18 year old, while Barkov did manage that at age 16. That's TWO full years of more development Jokinen needed to become a FEL player.
And Jokinen was nowhere near the defensive player Barkov is already today. Even if Barkov would have similar offensive numbers as Jokinen, he might get many Selke's with his defense.
And actually. That 11% difference in their offensive output in their respective draft seasons isn't exactly small either. Even if we forget their age difference in the draft, if Jokinen's prime was 90 points and Barkov would have 11 percent more, his peak production would be exactly 100 points. So the difference isn't as small as you make it to be.
But you are free to feel scared, I'm not saying it as you shouldn't!
EDIT: and just to make sure, I'll add that Jokinen didn't crack his FEL team as a full timer at age 17, he did it as an 18 year old, while Barkov did manage that at age 16. That's TWO full years of more development Jokinen needed to become a FEL player.
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I think you're really missing any sense of proportion here. Jokinen's 41 points was a record for draft eligible youngster a year ago so you're not comparing Barkov to some other player, you're comparing him to all time best in this context. It was before internet but there was huge Jokinen hype in Finnish media back in summer/fall 1996 when he moved to HIFK, I mean before he scored those 41 points.
And Barkov broke this record when he was 9 months younger! How much he should have scored so that there wouldn't be "something to think about"... 60 points? 70?
Olli Jokinen was also highly inconsistent, his good and bad game were like night and day, while Barkov is said to be the most consistent FEL player. Was very consistent already as a 16 year old third liner. That comparison doesn't give me any kind of creeps because I just don't see similarity in them.
GrumpyKelly
Registered User
Jokinen is as impressive as Barkov at the same age? Oh yea, at 17 years old his 2 points is almost as impressive as Barkov´s 48!
lol
Lundell4Prez
Yandle = Bad
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I was comparing draft years.. Settle down, 41 to 48 points.
Still 0.82 to 0.91 PPG. In their draft years. And I'm one of those who think a year of difference in age matters heavily.
Lundell4Prez
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I never said anything negative about Barkov.. I'm actually quite a fan and very excited to see him, it just intrigued me on their draft year how the points weren't that far off.. Even if he's a year younger. Obviously , its a big factor.. Theres no doubting the difference in skill between the 2
Dread Clawz
LAWSonic Boom
I dont think theres any similarities between OJ and sasha, apart from both are big finnish centerman and are old and new record holders. theyre personalities, mentality and gameplay skills and styles couldnt be further away from each other.
JP Mick
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flapanthersfan
Registered User
Olli Jokinen had 89 and 91 point seasons in the NHL - which should only calm your fears as it proves Jokinen had the skills to be an elite player at this level, but unfortunately was just a complete nutbag/headcase which prevented him from consistently realizing his potential over his entire career.
StrangeVision
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I don't know why comparisons to Jokinen's offensive output would scare anyone. I would be thrilled if Barkov became a 90 point player. Obviously I'd like to see that peak last longer than Jokinen, but some of you are talking like Jokinen was a bum. He was at one point a very good player.
FrolikFan67
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jokinen scored 39G one year here, if barkov can consistently put up numbers similar to jokinen id be thrilled. i think (and hoping) that barkov ends up similar to kopitar. big, 6'3 210+lbs european left handed center man that can score 25G and 45-50+A as well as being a great 2-way player, if he can do that, we'd be fortunate. really looking forward to how he plays this season.
Dread Clawz
LAWSonic Boom
Barkov's personality and play style is much more similar to that of Kopitar than Jokinen. The only thing Jokinen and Barkov have in common is that they are both Finnish and play center.
Lundell4Prez
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SoupyFIN
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Seeing all these vids of Barkov makes me super excited about his debut.
I was a little unsure about this pick at first though.
I was a little unsure about this pick at first though.
Wasn't the FEL considered much more competitive back when Jokinen was there? I apologize if this is incorrect, but that was long before the creation of the KHL, which is now hands-down the premiere league in Europe. There are many great Finnish pros and ex-nHLers there in Finland, but I would think many similar players who played in SM Liiga back then would today be in the KHL. Not to diminish any of Barkov's achievements, but we cannot compare these leagues and eras in a vacuum.
agent082
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It seems that some poster isn't happy if Barkov put same numbers in NHL that Jokinen did. 
I would be thrilled if Barkov can put near 90 points with amazing 2-way play he has.
I think point vice Jokinen's 41 points was more impressive season than Barkov's 48 points, because FEL was much better league back then. But Jokinen was 9 months older and he was useful only in offensive zone.
I would be thrilled if Barkov can put near 90 points with amazing 2-way play he has. I think point vice Jokinen's 41 points was more impressive season than Barkov's 48 points, because FEL was much better league back then. But Jokinen was 9 months older and he was useful only in offensive zone.
SoupyFIN
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The team that OJ had 39 points in 30 games with (along winning the championship and playoffs MVP of course), is widely considered to be one of the best, if not the best that the league has ever seen.
OJ, Tim Thomas, Brian Rafalski, Kimmo Timonen, Jarkko Ruutu, Christian Ruuttu, Jarno Kultanen and Jere Karalahti to name a few. Compare that to Barkov's supporting cast, and yeah, there isn't really even a competition on which is better.
Yes, the level of talent in the league has dropped, but many other things that weren't so highly regarded in the 90s have risen to compensate for that. Goalies and their equipment, coaching, etc. The level hasn't dropped "that much".
Lundell4Prez
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It seems that some poster isn't happy if Barkov put same numbers in NHL that Jokinen did.
I think point vice Jokinen's 41 points was more impressive season than Barkov's 48 points, because FEL was much better league back then. But Jokinen was 9 months older and he was useful only in offensive zone.
Jokinen, 2-way play...? Now, I'm a big supporter of Barkov, but Jokinen was a selfish defensive liability, and still is. He gave effort for 2 seasons... Would I be happy if Barkov put up 90 pts a season, hell yeah.. Would I be happy if he had 2 90 point seasons, and then nothing else? No.
Instead of putting words in my mouth, try to read what's written.. I never compared Jokinen as a player to Barkov, ever. Jokinen in my eyes and in most people's eyes should be Barkov's low-end. All I pointed out was, in Jokinen's DRAFT YEAR, he put up similar numbers to Barkov in the FEL. He was then drafted 3rd overall.
