OrlandK
Registered User
Yup - the Rangers have never recovered from the loss of Benoit Pouliot. That's the missing ingredient to another Cup run!
Player Discussion Alain Vigneault Part VI
- Thread starter Fugazy
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Yup - the Rangers have never recovered from the loss of Benoit Pouliot. That's the missing ingredient to another Cup run!
Hopefully the younger version Vinni Lettieri is that ingredient tonight - we will see!
Tawnos
A guy with a bass
Please let’s just ignore my entire point to mock one little part of it.
The Rangers haven’t really had a great forechecker on every line since that year.
That being said, I think players who could be great forecheckers aren’t playing that way... like Miller and Hayes.
haveandare
Registered User
Team takes the personality of their coach. This team is as soft, passive and easy to impose your will on as any team has ever been. AV lets this happen by fostering this "shucks, we'll get em next time" attitude.
On offense, they hang around the boards and lose battles. They don't shoot unless it's a slam dunk - including the shots every other team takes to create havoc, which result in slam dunk opportunities.
And talking about our D being bad in terms of the roster is hard to say with any authority given that they're still one of the only teams playing this horrendous man system. Let them play zone like literally everyone else for a season and then evaluate who is good and who is best to keep.
Coach needs to go yesterday before even evaluating what players need to go imo.
On offense, they hang around the boards and lose battles. They don't shoot unless it's a slam dunk - including the shots every other team takes to create havoc, which result in slam dunk opportunities.
And talking about our D being bad in terms of the roster is hard to say with any authority given that they're still one of the only teams playing this horrendous man system. Let them play zone like literally everyone else for a season and then evaluate who is good and who is best to keep.
Coach needs to go yesterday before even evaluating what players need to go imo.
haveandare
Registered User
I could envision a roster that could play man well but this isn’t itYeah I`m with ya - zone defense is the way to go.
I`ve never played hockey active, but I had 8+ years in soccer, and if we had man defense it ruin our offside trap - so zone defense all the way in soccer. ))
But the offside in hockey is a different ruleset so u can`t really compare.
But the offside in hockey is a different ruleset so u can`t really compare.
nyrage
Registered User
I've been following this team for about 47 years and I've never felt so numb watching it. I think numb is the stage past frustration. AV has to go. The signs have been there for years. Proactive people address issues when they first notice signs of a problem. It looks like we will wait for the wheels to completely fall off.
Regarding the defensive system, yeah AV is stubborn. This team can't play a man to man defense. Aside from perhaps physical limitations, this team has a lot of players that lack hockey sense in the defensive zone. They get out-manned and out-hustled on the boards for loose pucks. You get multiple players chasing the puck carrier and leaving guys wide open in front of the net. Forwards (and def) in no-man's land, neither covering a player, nor near the opposing forward the puck. When the opposition has a lot of movement in the zone, it's a disaster due to the lack of hockey sense and communication.
A different coach would simplify things with zone coverage. Hell, I was taught proper zone coverage when I was six years old. It's not hard. If I can coach it to 8 to 9 year olds, then surely AV could to professional hockey players. Even Mr. Magoo can see the flaws in our system. AV is just too stubborn.
Regarding the defensive system, yeah AV is stubborn. This team can't play a man to man defense. Aside from perhaps physical limitations, this team has a lot of players that lack hockey sense in the defensive zone. They get out-manned and out-hustled on the boards for loose pucks. You get multiple players chasing the puck carrier and leaving guys wide open in front of the net. Forwards (and def) in no-man's land, neither covering a player, nor near the opposing forward the puck. When the opposition has a lot of movement in the zone, it's a disaster due to the lack of hockey sense and communication.
A different coach would simplify things with zone coverage. Hell, I was taught proper zone coverage when I was six years old. It's not hard. If I can coach it to 8 to 9 year olds, then surely AV could to professional hockey players. Even Mr. Magoo can see the flaws in our system. AV is just too stubborn.
OrlandK
Registered User
Agreed. No wonder Smith gets benched all the time. He had the audacity to stand up to Ryan Reeves. Brendan clearly doesn't fit the AV mold.
Smith has been benched this season because he's played like crap from the beginning of training camp. It has nothing to do with the fact that he (can) play with snarl: which is something he hasn't consistently or regularly done at all. Hopefully, he will focus from this point on and start playing like he did when he first came to New York.
Is that on them or on the way that they are being coached to play?
As far as the missing fore checkers, I understand your point. But believe, just IMO, that AV's input into the roster construction has been to phase out those players and bring in more players that love pond hockey.
Agreed with this. A little damming when you are on your third different coach to look after the defense and they play the same awful style under each one.
Brief Candle
Hank's Forehead Sweat
Are you sure about that? This game has changed drastically over the last 25 years. I echo Kovie's recent statement. It's almost a force of habit that I even watch the rangers play anymore. People like to point to the lack of holding, increased scoring, blah blah blah, but has anyone stopped to think that those great players we once saw enjoyed the challenge of playing amongst that? There's no snarl to this league anymore, no personal responsibility for one's actions. In many ways it's dirtier than it used to be.
So I'd argue that these are the Dark Ages of the NHL.
Tawnos
A guy with a bass
It’s coaching for sure. I sometimes wonder if Hagelin would’ve been more like Grabner if he came up under AV and not Tortorella.
Tawnos
A guy with a bass
You shouldn’t mistake a lack of chippiness for a lack of emotion.
His in zone defensive system will always be what prevents us from being successful. Even if we had the right roster.
The unit of 5 collapsing with our wingers playing loose on the pointmen and not tight on the boards, running around the ice like pond hockey so that it can become a firing squad from the blueline is a disgrace. It is an extremely flawed system, one im sure he had in Vancouver and since it got him to the finals in 2011 he surely thinks it still works today 6 years later.
The unit of 5 collapsing with our wingers playing loose on the pointmen and not tight on the boards, running around the ice like pond hockey so that it can become a firing squad from the blueline is a disgrace. It is an extremely flawed system, one im sure he had in Vancouver and since it got him to the finals in 2011 he surely thinks it still works today 6 years later.
It got him to the finals with Vancouver for the same exact reason it got him to the finals in NY......world class goaltending. This system falls apart if the goaltender is not standing on his head on a nightly basis. The amount of opposing players walking in untouched is ghastly. As is the magical ability of the opposition to continuously hit cross ice passes right before the walk in.
I still don`t understand why AV use Kampfer when we have better options in AHL though concerning the defense. 17 games 1 assist is not great, and sometimes he struggle defensive.
Oscar Lindberg
Registered User
Because AV likes to play guys he is comfortable with.
Kampfer sucks but AV is more comfortable with him than a 22 year old with skill.
It’s just the way he is.
Kampfer sucks but AV is more comfortable with him than a 22 year old with skill.
It’s just the way he is.
mandiblesofdoom
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- May 24, 2012
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Opponents have had years to pick apart AV's system. Seems like most of them have figured out by now how to make the Rangers look bad.
“One of the reasons we felt that Shatty would be a good fit on this team was his ability to move the puck, his ability to jump up in the play, his ability to make plays with that puck,” coach Alain Vigneault said before the second leg of this team’s back-to-back on Sunday night against the Penguins. “And we have to see better than what we’ve seen so far.”
f*** you
f*** you
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