Speculation: Acq./Rost. Bldg./Cap/Lines etc. Part LXXXIV -- The Doggiest Days (Woof!) 2017

Status
Not open for further replies.

Jags

Mildly Disturbed
May 5, 2016
1,967
2,348
Central Florida
Do you guy watch the games? The dream of Calzner being the long term top pair is over. Alzner is already gone and Carlson has taken more steps backwards then ones towards being the true #1 we hopped he would become.

Look at the contracts that are being signed. You really think we would be able to get him for 6x6? On top of the fact that BMAC does not seem to be able to save any money anywhere.

Trading Carlson is a great opportunity to restock the farm. And don't bother bring up a playoff run. This core has never been close.

I'm not as down on his chances to rebound as you are. I'm not opposed to trading him for the right return, but he has value either way. He has more value with a contract and doesn't figure to pose a cap problem for us next year, so it could be worth it to keep him.

He's 27. It's not as simple as "It's smarter to trade him" or "It's smarter to keep him." It depends 100% on the terms of the potential contract or potential trade.

Not sure I'd give him up for something like what we gave for Shattenkirk IF we could lock him up for the right balance of cash/term. And I'd be thrilled to get what we gave for Shattenkirk IF he wants crazy money and max term. See what I mean?

It all depends on what he wants, and we have no idea.
 

Ridley Simon

HFBoards Sponsor
Sponsor
Feb 27, 2002
19,022
10,338
Marin County — SF Bay Area, CA
Sorry to disappoint.

So let's be more succinct. I'm really interested to know the benefits of developing Bowey as a left defenseman.

What do players and their agents gain by being anything but candid with their demands?

What are the intangible leadership qualities Orpik provides that none of the other defensive vets and coaches can that make having him at 3LD better than having Schmidt at 2LD with zero cost difference?

If they are so bereft of LD's and need one, then why wouldn't they try him there? Orlov did it as well (has switched sides).

Agents and players do NOT come out with their final offers, right up front. At least, most don't. So until you see the actual interest from other teams (or in this case, other leagues), you won't know what's bravado versus realism. And again, they only botched ONE contract situation. So to sit and say they did nothing for a year and 6 weeks and were totally unprepared is your hyperbole to fit your anti management stance. It's not pragmatic, it's dramatic. But that's your choice.

Gee, you want me to answer what a veterans leadership qualities are? I've never been one, so I can't say. I'm sure you can state how little it is, and how little it helps? We've had Orlov (amd Schmidt?) blossom over the last year plus, under a coach who isn't good w youth (allegedly). So the team says Orpik has a lot to do with it, but of course that's just them slanting to try and look good (another piece of your hyperbole to fit your narrative). It's not actually happening.

And lastly....you send out Orpik at 50% retained, that 2.75m is gone for good. You can't make a better deal later, or perhaps trade him with no rentention later this year, or next summer. All assuming you can even sign Schmidt for 2.75m multi year. Maybe he signs for that...maybe he doesn't. And that dead 2.75m is a problem next summer. No matter what. No other options. All easy to say.

I'm sure you will spin all of this in a contrarian manner, that's what you do. Have at it.
 

Corby78

65 - 10 - 20
Jan 14, 2014
11,839
8,114
Ramstein Germany
Do you guy watch the games? The dream of Calzner being the long term top pair is over. Alzner is already gone and Carlson has taken more steps backwards then ones towards being the true #1 we hopped he would become.

Look at the contracts that are being signed. You really think we would be able to get him for 6x6? On top of the fact that BMAC does not seem to be able to save any money anywhere.

Trading Carlson is a great opportunity to restock the farm. And don't bother bring up a playoff run. This core has never been close.

This core has gotten closer to a cup, then you have to a positive post. I'm just glad this forum wasn't around when Chris Simon was leading the team in goals.
 

g00n

Retired Global Mod
Nov 22, 2007
31,227
15,792
This core has gotten closer to a cup, then you have to a positive post. I'm just glad this forum wasn't around when Chris Simon was leading the team in goals.

It was, but in an earlier incarnation. I'm sure all the discussion was well-reasoned and entirely polite. :sarcasm:
 

Skrudland2Lomakin

Registered User
Jan 1, 2011
7,698
5,721
With Latta signing in Arizona I am reminded of how we inexplicably let him walk last year for no reason and how he could be extremely useful right now.
 

RandyHolt

Keep truckin'
Nov 3, 2006
34,905
7,329
With Latta signing in Arizona I am reminded of how we inexplicably let him walk last year for no reason and how he could be extremely useful right now.

I thought he was an asset and bummed to see him leave. It's like BMac was trying to get rid of any semblance of the trade ;)

I think it has to be said Eller as our 3C failed. I had no idea a guy with washboard abs could be so soft in the dot, but here we are. Beagle can largely do what Eller did.

Sure, lats was just a guy to many, but he brought solid faceoffs, energy, toughness and a bit of that youthful exuberance we seem to struggle to ascertain. Things few others do in these parts.
 

OV Rocks

Registered User
Jan 5, 2014
1,116
432
Beach with Beer
I had the thought of Orpik and Alzner on the ice against the Penguins where the break away goal was scored, yes I am still in the depressed mode.

All of the talk of having Orpik on a 3rd pairing with a young guy like Djoos, Bowey, Ness, whoever it is, what happens when that kid makes a questionable pinch, gets beat, and then Orpik has to get back and cover for him. At this point the only guy Orpik is catching in a foot race is Brooks Laich.

But who knows, time to take the wait and see approach, maybe playing with less stress to win every game helps them in the long run as the underdogs.
 

OV Rocks

Registered User
Jan 5, 2014
1,116
432
Beach with Beer
He was a great 4th liner. People here seem to expect 4th liners to post 50 points. He also had NHL experience, something we will be lacking a lot of.

When he first started here in Washington I thought if given the opportunity he could have developed into a Boone Jenner type player. Plenty serviceable on the 4th, especially cheap with all the young guys the Caps have coming up and lack of PK bodies.
 

Ridley Simon

HFBoards Sponsor
Sponsor
Feb 27, 2002
19,022
10,338
Marin County — SF Bay Area, CA
I had the thought of Orpik and Alzner on the ice against the Penguins where the break away goal was scored, yes I am still in the depressed mode.

All of the talk of having Orpik on a 3rd pairing with a young guy like Djoos, Bowey, Ness, whoever it is, what happens when that kid makes a questionable pinch, gets beat, and then Orpik has to get back and cover for him. At this point the only guy Orpik is catching in a foot race is Brooks Laich.

But who knows, time to take the wait and see approach, maybe playing with less stress to win every game helps them in the long run as the underdogs.

Holtby needs to make a save, or they get scored on. This isn't a team without holes. They need to let the youth learn and get beat. That's part of the process.

Pens had holes. But their top players allowed them to win 4/7 games, with help sprinkled in by their youth. That's where the Caps need to go. Odds are they won't, but every year is a new chance.
 

Hivemind

We're Touched
Oct 8, 2010
37,454
14,097
Philadelphia
Latta was not a great fourth liner. He was too slow to keep up with the pace required, and didn't do enough at the faceoff circle to warrant keeping him as a defensive zone/PK faceoff specialist. He was a replacement level player, at best. There's a reason he was in the AHL all year and a reason why even Arizona only gave him a two-way contract.
 

OV Rocks

Registered User
Jan 5, 2014
1,116
432
Beach with Beer
Holtby needs to make a save, or they get scored on. This isn't a team without holes. They need to let the youth learn and get beat. That's part of the process.

Pens had holes. But their top players allowed them to win 4/7 games, with help sprinkled in by their youth. That's where the Caps need to go. Odds are they won't, but every year is a new chance.

I got nothing more to say, great answer.

Second question then, what does Trotz do when the young kid pinches, Orpik doesn't catch the guy, and Holtby lets in the shot? With Barry's 20 year history behind him, that kids isn't seeing the ice for the rest of the game and will watch the next game from the top of the rink. THat is not good for their development and makes things worse.
 

Corby78

65 - 10 - 20
Jan 14, 2014
11,839
8,114
Ramstein Germany
Holtby needs to make a save, or they get scored on. This isn't a team without holes. They need to let the youth learn and get beat. That's part of the process.

Pens had holes. But their top players allowed them to win 4/7 games, with help sprinkled in by their youth. That's where the Caps need to go. Odds are they won't, but every year is a new chance.

Don't forget the pens have struggled during the season before and found ways to pull it together at the end of the season. There was a coaching change that contributed to that, but even more than last year this season should be focused on getting ready for the playoffs. We will probably not be in the 1 seed race so don't get wrapped up in every mistake, goal against, or loss. Just keep developing and learning. Hopefully in that regard Orpik does earn more of his money
 

Corby78

65 - 10 - 20
Jan 14, 2014
11,839
8,114
Ramstein Germany
Latta was not a great fourth liner. He was too slow to keep up with the pace required, and didn't do enough at the faceoff circle to warrant keeping him as a defensive zone/PK faceoff specialist. He was a replacement level player, at best. There's a reason he was in the AHL all year and a reason why even Arizona only gave him a two-way contract.

Yeah I loved Latta, and I hope he finds a role in zona, but that's not a guy I feel we need on our roster.
 

Caps8112

Registered User
Sponsor
Aug 12, 2008
3,546
1,998
This core has gotten closer to a cup, then you have to a positive post. I'm just glad this forum wasn't around when Chris Simon was leading the team in goals.

Oates made Simon an almost 30 goal scorer and a lot of money. How underrated was Oates
 

twabby

Registered User
Mar 9, 2010
14,142
15,621
I wonder if we see Kuznetsov on the PK this year? You can't have two players making $7.5+ that don't play the PK at all.

Crosby, Malkin, and Kessel combined for ~12 minutes of shorthanded time last season. They all make more than Kuznetsov against the cap it worked out just fine for them.

Being highly paid doesn't mean you should be expected to PK. Let the plugs block shots, let the skilled players take advantage of PP/ES time and avoid injury.
 

AlexModvechkin8

At least there was 2018.
Sponsor
Feb 18, 2012
27,529
27,172
District of Champions
Crosby, Malkin, and Kessel combined for ~12 minutes of shorthanded time last season. They all make more than Kuznetsov against the cap it worked out just fine for them.

Being highly paid doesn't mean you should be expected to PK. Let the plugs block shots, let the skilled players take advantage of PP/ES time and avoid injury.

Yeah, no thanks to Kuznetsov on the PK. Beagle, Eller, Wilson, and whoever else is on the 4th line can PK. He's actually probably the last guy on the team I want to see on the PK. Last thing we need is Kuzy to go full-on Burakovsky and break his hand blocking a shot.
 

MrGone

Registered User
Nov 18, 2009
2,270
91
This core has gotten closer to a cup, then you have to a positive post. I'm just glad this forum wasn't around when Chris Simon was leading the team in goals.

We don't want to go to far back. Or we will hit the point when you had standards and expectations.
 

hockeykicker

Global Moderator
Dec 3, 2014
35,769
13,815
According to capfriendly, caps have 4.09 mil cap space with 2 goalies,5 defenders and 10 forwards
 

strungout

Professional Killer
Jul 1, 2002
31,851
928
North Carolina
So I have....

Bura - Kuzy - Oshie
Ovie - Backstrom - Vrana
Connolly - Eller - Wilson
Walker - Beagle - Smith-Pelly

Orlov - Niskanen
Djoos - Carlson
Orpik - Bowey
Chorney

Holtby
Grubi

Leaves $1,223,227 in cap space. Could add an extra depth forward (Stephenson or Boyd) at 650K to drop it to $573,227.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Ad

Upcoming events

Ad

Ad