Prospect Info: #8OA, Marco Kasper

[lilidk]

Pretty good.... at creating concern.

Just like all our prospects

 

[Roomba With a Bauer]

Just like all our prospects

Our Swedish league draftees get to develop with Kronwall and all do great until they come to NA and turn to shit.

Our NA drafting and development is absolute ass and Yzerman needs to rebuild the whole structure from Draper down.

That side of the org is a lot of Holland-era holdovers and it really shows. We can't keep drafting Kris Draper clones.

 

[Henkka]

It's kind of interesting, that players developed under Kronwall, when he was at Grand Rapids.

Horcoff needs to go and Yzerman should hire some developmental people from Michigan U.

 

[raymond23]

8th overall

D+2

On pace for 24 points in the AHL

Not good, a big second half would be nice to see

 

[Frk It]

If he could finish the year around ~.5 PPG, I would feel a bit better.

Connor Zary had a pretty bleh year in the AHL in his +2 year then had a jump in the AHL in his +3 year and is having an impact for Calgary this year. Would hope Kasper could do something similar.

 

[Roomba With a Bauer]

If he could finish the year around ~.5 PPG, I would feel a bit better.

Connor Zary had a pretty bleh year in the AHL in his +2 year then had a jump in the AHL in his +3 year and is having an impact for Calgary this year. Would hope Kasper could do something similar.

I think we have overblown expectations for 8/9 OA picks. A .5 ppg agitating center is a decent outcome for that draft position.

It gets even worse at 9OA. Only 31 players drafted 9OA from 1963 to 2022 had more than 200 NHL points.

It's really, really hard to run a rebuild when the best draft position you get when repeatedly finishing bottom 3 in the league is 4OA and you are constantly getting leapfrogged by teams like NJ, CHI, and NYR who have better rosters to begin with.

Chicago will probably make the playoffs before us after they get 1OA this year. With the way the draft is now structured, if all the lottery picks go to teams higher than 11OA Chicago can still get 1OA. The only competition they have for bottom in the league is SJ. The NHL has a ridiculous hard-on for Chicago, so I could see that happening.

 

[Frk It]

I think we have overblown expectations for 8/9 OA picks. A .5 ppg agitating center is a decent outcome for that draft position.

It gets even worse at 9OA. Only 31 players drafted 9OA from 1963 to 2022 had more than 200 NHL points.

It's really, really hard to run a rebuild when the best draft position you get when repeatedly finishing bottom 3 in the league is 4OA and you are constantly getting leapfrogged by teams like NJ, CHI, and NYR who have better rosters to begin with.

Yeah, I’ve made multiple posts/threads that say as much. The most likely scenario with this current lottery system is that teams at the bottom will stay stuck there. They had a choice between helping the teams at the bottom or deterring teams from tanking and they pretty firmly planted their flag on the latter. Will imagine they will start to get some pressure to change that system in the near future, at least I can only hope.

I guess my separate thought is if you know the conditions are what they are, I’m a little surprised we aren’t seeing the teams at the bottom being a bit bolder with their drafting (guess Arizona was in this last draft.)

Like Marco Kasper at 8 is a fine pick to make in a vacuum, but I don’t think it’s the pick I make if I know that I have to have my picks significant outperform their draft a lot for my rebuild to work.

And the last setting is kind of what you’re missing… what a draft slot normally yields can’t be the expectation for our picks, or this rebuild just won’t happen.

 

[Rzombo4 prez]

I think we have overblown expectations for 8/9 OA picks. A .5 ppg agitating center is a decent outcome for that draft position.

It gets even worse at 9OA. Only 31 players drafted 9OA from 1963 to 2022 had more than 200 NHL points.

It's really, really hard to run a rebuild when the best draft position you get when repeatedly finishing bottom 3 in the league is 4OA and you are constantly getting leapfrogged by teams like NJ, CHI, and NYR who have better rosters to begin with.

Someone (Bench?) put together a good chart of this last year. I agree that there is a big difference between a top 3 pick in the first round and everything else in the first round. A lot of expectations, however, are driven by hope and a desire that a player will work out.

 

[Roomba With a Bauer]

Yeah, I’ve made multiple posts/threads that say as much. The most likely scenario with this current lottery system is that teams at the bottom will stay stuck there. They had a choice between helping the teams at the bottom or deterring teams from tanking and they pretty firmly planted their flag on the latter. Will imagine they will start to get some pressure to change that system in the near future, at least I can only hope.

I guess my separate thought is if you know the conditions are what they are, I’m a little surprised we aren’t seeing the teams at the bottom being a bit bolder (guess Arizona was in this last draft.)

This is why I keep saying Yzerman needs to start/keep trading firsts for established players. He did it with DeBrincat. You could almost certainly get Hanifin with a first and a mid-tier prospect and he's a top-pair talent in his mid 20s. Just don't make the Ottawa mistake and make sure you can sign him long-term.

 

[Frk It]

This is why I keep saying Yzerman needs to start/keep trading firsts for established players. He did it with DeBrincat. You could almost certainly get Hanifin with a first and a mid-tier prospect and he's a top-pair talent in his mid 20s. Just don't make the Ottawa mistake and make sure you can sign him long-term.

That’s another route we could go, and it might not be a bad option at this point.

 

[Go Wings]

This is why I keep saying Yzerman needs to start/keep trading firsts for established players. He did it with DeBrincat. You could almost certainly get Hanifin with a first and a mid-tier prospect and he's a top-pair talent in his mid 20s. Just don't make the Ottawa mistake and make sure you can sign him long-term.

We aren't going to have the cap space to sign Hanifin long term though.

 

[Frk It]

Someone (Bench?) put together a good chart of this last year. I agree that there is a big difference between a top 3 pick in the first round and everything else in the first round. A lot of expectations, however, are driven by hope and a desire that a player will work out.

I had a site I used for years that had data on what a draft pick usually produces and all kinds of odds related to that, but it looks like it was taken down

I could find some of my old posts that referenced it if need be.

 

[saska sault]

We aren't going to have the cap space to sign Hanifin long term though.

The Wings have so much cap flexibility I don't see how there is any player they could not fit in long term. Perron, Reimer, Sprong, Kane (although I hope he's back) all are off the books. Fabbri or Mattaa would be picked up if we need more space, 3-4 million for either of their production on an expiring contract would be valuable on alot of teams. A combination of Berg, Veleno, Rasmussen could all be moved on from also. Not many guys are married to the roster besides Larkin.

 

[Frk It]

The Wings have so much cap flexibility I don't see how there is any player they could not fit in long term. Perron, Reimer, Sprong, Kane (although I hope he's back) all are off the books.

I don’t know why anyone has a view on our cap situation that’s anything but this.

The only player I was worried about taking up a lot of $ was Seider and we refuse to play him significant minutes (which if that is intentional by us, I think that’s stupid for a number of reasons.)

 

[Snuggs]

Just like all our prospects

He was a Walking Hall of Famer in this forum just six months ago. Actually, maybe just six weeks ago.

 

[Roomba With a Bauer]

We aren't going to have the cap space to sign Hanifin long term though.

Yeah, with all these marquee players in our system we might be looking at a major cap crunch in 10 years.

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

Our Swedish league draftees get to develop with Kronwall and all do great until they come to NA and turn to shit.

Our NA drafting and development is absolute ass and Yzerman needs to rebuild the whole structure from Draper down.

That side of the org is a lot of Holland-era holdovers and it really shows. We can't keep drafting Kris Draper clones.

This 100%. Rebuild the NA side. Keep Drapes as AGM with minimal duties. Give Kronner a raise and a bigger role.

 

[ShanahanMan]

I think we have overblown expectations for 8/9 OA picks. A .5 ppg agitating center is a decent outcome for that draft position.

It gets even worse at 9OA. Only 31 players drafted 9OA from 1963 to 2022 had more than 200 NHL points.

It's really, really hard to run a rebuild when the best draft position you get when repeatedly finishing bottom 3 in the league is 4OA and you are constantly getting leapfrogged by teams like NJ, CHI, and NYR who have better rosters to begin with.

Chicago will probably make the playoffs before us after they get 1OA this year. With the way the draft is now structured, if all the lottery picks go to teams higher than 11OA Chicago can still get 1OA. The only competition they have for bottom in the league is SJ. The NHL has a ridiculous hard-on for Chicago, so I could see that happening.

I mean, most scouts said he was a projected 3rd line center with limited offensive upside and he’s turning out to for that bill perfectly, yet there were guys ranked much better than Kasper and yet we still seemed okay with a middle of the lineup grinder. In other words, we had our chance to make a better pick and didn’t want to.

 

[Shaman464]

I had a site I used for years that had data on what a draft pick usually produces and all kinds of odds related to that, but it looks like it was taken down

I could find some of my old posts that referenced it if need be.

It is hard, but there's something wrong with Detroit's ability to scout forwards. Their two best picks are looking like Mo and Ed, so their ability to assess d-men seems good, but given the fact that there's a lot of hold over between Kenny and Stevie in the scouting and player development department, there are clear problems in assessing forwards.

 

[GMR]

He was a Walking Hall of Famer in this forum just six months ago. Actually, maybe just six weeks ago.

And now we couldn't trade him for Zadina.

 

[Frk It]

It is hard, but there's something wrong with Detroit's ability to scout forwards. Their two best picks are looking like Mo and Ed, so their ability to assess d-men seems good, but given the fact that there's a lot of hold over between Kenny and Stevie in the scouting and player development department, there are clear problems in assessing forwards.

For a guy who pretty much had his ass saved by hitting on Kucherov and Point in the later rounds, it continues to mystify me that Yzerman does not take more shots on high upside forwards with the amount of picks we have had.

 

[Detroit Knights]

I think we have overblown expectations for 8/9 OA picks. A .5 ppg agitating center is a decent outcome for that draft position.

It gets even worse at 9OA. Only 31 players drafted 9OA from 1963 to 2022 had more than 200 NHL points.

It's really, really hard to run a rebuild when the best draft position you get when repeatedly finishing bottom 3 in the league is 4OA and you are constantly getting leapfrogged by teams like NJ, CHI, and NYR who have better rosters to begin with.

Chicago will probably make the playoffs before us after they get 1OA this year. With the way the draft is now structured, if all the lottery picks go to teams higher than 11OA Chicago can still get 1OA. The only competition they have for bottom in the league is SJ. The NHL has a ridiculous hard-on for Chicago, so I could see that happening.

dont want to turn this into a lottery ball discussion, but why don't they just put the logo of the team on the ping pong balls and show their weight to the camera for every ball and make sure they are the same. Then, whatever gets pulled would literally be random and it would be a lot easier for the people viewing it to see who wins.

The year they showed the numbers then panned over to the guy with the clipboard and had all those number sequences on it never seemed right to me. I mean, they never showed the actual number sequence next to the the team that got chosen. So how do we know those sequences went to that team? Unless I missed them showing that idk.

Just show me the damn balls with the logos!

 

[drw02]

For a guy who pretty much had his ass saved by hitting on Kucherov and Point in the later rounds, it continues to mystify me that Yzerman does not take more shots on high upside forwards with the amount of picks we have had.

One would have thought Yzerman would have realized the importance of having a top notch amateur scouting department from his time in TB. Really a total head scratcher why he then just handed such an important job to his buddy with no experience in that role and continues to let him remain in that role despite still having very little talent to draw from after 5 years of drafts with numerous top 60ish picks. Sadly looking more like Al Murray was the real brains behind Tampa's run

 

[Frk It]

It is hard, but there's something wrong with Detroit's ability to scout forwards. Their two best picks are looking like Mo and Ed, so their ability to assess d-men seems good, but given the fact that there's a lot of hold over between Kenny and Stevie in the scouting and player development department, there are clear problems in assessing forwards.

Yeah and then you look at them drafting ASP this year too. I mean for the most part the picks that either have worked or seem to be working best are all defenseman.

I don't know if we are going to course correct here, or what.

It's kind of funny because that first draft of his I really liked the strategy as far as the forwards drafted - Mastrosimone, Phillips, Soderblom, Tyut. Even though the first two didn't work out, those are more of the kinds of forwards I would like to see us pick.

 

[Gniwder]

Yeah and then you look at them drafting ASP this year too. I mean for the most part the picks that either have worked or seem to be working best are all defenseman.

I don't know if we are going to course correct here, or what.

It's kind of funny because that first draft of his I really liked the strategy as far as the forwards drafted - Mastrosimone, Phillips, Soderblom, Tyut. Even though the first two didn't work out, those are more of the kinds of forwards I would like to see us pick.

Maybe the team should just stick with what it does best, draft more defensemen and then trade them for forwards. Stevie is realgud at trading.