Post-Game Talk: #7 - 10/22/19 | coyotes @ RANGERS

[The Crypto Guy]

You're going to be endlessly screaming into the void trying to bring reason to these boards in the midst of a bad losing streak.

"Reason" to play a 4th liner with 2 all stars and give him the 3rd among of ice among forwards. Results showed, i guess you missed the game.

 

[TheBloodyNine]

I mean, perhaps if they were winning with this type of player deployment there'd be an argument. But they've lost 5 in a row. Clearly whatever is being done isn't working.

 

[FireGerardGallant]

There is only one rookie forward this year averaging over 16 minutes a game and it's an older rookie in Olofsson.

There were zero rookie forwards averaging over 16 minutes a game at this point last year.

But yea his usage is so bad.

There’s a difference between giving a player 16 minuets and giving a player 9 minuets. Also to not even try Kakko with Panarin and Zibs at 5 v 5? Hughes was struggling then the put him with Hall and Palmieri and he has 2 points in 2 games since then, Dach is currently playing 5 v 5 with Kane. Kakko has Kreider who hasn’t been bad but is snakebiten and one of Howden/Strome

 

[LieutenantLackluster]

Someone basically said it already but yeah this isnt even the fun type of garbage, it's just hard to watch

 

[SA16]

There’s a difference between giving a player 16 minuets and giving a player 9 minuets. Also to not even try Kakko with Panarin and Zibs at 5 v 5? Hughes was struggling then the put him with Hall and Palmieri and he has 2 points in 2 games since then, Dach is currently playing 5 v 5 with Kane. Kakko has Kreider who hasn’t been bad but is snakebiten and one of Howden/Strome

I would like to see Kakko start a game with either Panarin or Zibanejad. I do not expect Kakko to be moved up in the middle of the game to the top line when he has not done anything in the game yet.

Also through two periods tonight Dach has the least TOI of any player on the Blackhawks.

 

[FIRE DRURY]

everytime I think nothing can be less enjoyable than watching this team play, i come here and read the reactions and realize i was wrong. the doom and gloom is unreal. did people not realize we were gonna be awful?

Great post.

Rebuilding is not as pretty as some expected. Especially when your veterans are mostly mediocre.

I remember a lot of people hating Quinn with the way he handled ADA (I was one of them). Meanwhile, ADA is playing the best he’s ever had in his career.

Maybe there’s more to the weird lineups and annoying icetime our prospects are getting than we realize...

The more I watch, the more skeptical I get though...

 

[BBKers]

Fast experiment over

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Someone basically said it already but yeah this isnt even the fun type of garbage, it's just hard to watch

the first 2 games were fun garbage. Then the 2 week bye hit and every other team ironed their kinks out and we didn't.

 

[Tob]

Someone basically said it already but yeah this isnt even the fun type of garbage, it's just hard to watch

kids all suck. vets all old. can't even lasucknier for lafraniere when it's going to cost an important developmental year and trajectory for Fox, Yak, Lias, Howdy, Le Mew, Fil, and Vitaly.

 

[aufheben]

You're going to be endlessly screaming into the void trying to bring reason to these boards in the midst of a bad losing streak.

I mean everyone's been really well-behaved albeit freakin' macabre so maybe I should tone down the stickling and just leave people to take it out on David Quinn.

 

[Tob]

The good thing is that if the kids continue to suck, it's human nature for management and the scouting staff to say, we drafted well, these are good players and we traded for good players in Hajek and Howden so it's all on Quinn's staff for not getting it done.

 

[BBKers]

ADA, Fox, Trouba and Hajek still instill some hope. Skjei, Smith and Staal, not so much (suspect all 3 are gone before 2021 TDL). Georgiev & Shesty too. Good to have our defensive pipeline now. More talent up front still needed. Likely 2 first rounders, a new 2nd rounder, 2 3rds and at least one more prospect coming our way this TDL/offseason (via trades) should finish off this step in the process,,, And plenty of 7ths too...

 

[FIRE DRURY]

Fast experiment over

That was Fast.

 

[Ori]

Rangers need to recall players to get some new lines going Kravtsov & Chytil need to play NHL.

 

[Irishguy42]

There’s a difference between giving a player 16 minuets and giving a player 9 minuets. Also to not even try Kakko with Panarin and Zibs at 5 v 5? Hughes was struggling then the put him with Hall and Palmieri and he has 2 points in 2 games since then, Dach is currently playing 5 v 5 with Kane. Kakko has Kreider who hasn’t been bad but is snakebiten and one of Howden/Strome

If we're going to experiment with Kakko on the top line/give him more minutes, then I'd rather do it from the start of the game than move him up in the middle of the game (unless he's killing it on another line that isn't doing hot, which hasn't happened so far).

Hall/Hughes/Palmieri have played 13 minutes together at 5v5 over 8 games and have generated 0G 0A

Dach has played a whopping 4 minutes with Kane at 5v5 tonight after two periods, and his goal wasn't even with Kane on the ice.

It's not like these guys are being given massive minutes with top line players either.

 

[Anzi]

I don't need Kakko on the 1st line. I just need him to be playing good minutes with decent linemates. Kreider is not in his best form and we don't have a legit 2C so that makes things difficult.

 

[Machinehead]

There is only one rookie forward this year averaging over 16 minutes a game and it's an older rookie in Olofsson.

There were zero rookie forwards averaging over 16 minutes a game at this point last year.

But yea his usage is so bad.

Your ability to equate 8 and 16 is incredible.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

A coach's job is getting his players ready to play, to give that effort, so yes, it's coaching.

It's also a coach's job to deploy the players. Quinn has done an awful job at that.

That's not true really, he prepares them for the game yes, he isnt supposed to make someone want to play and earn their paycheck. These are professional athletes, nobody should have to hold their hands and make them skate. The third period of the Vancouver game showed that the system is fine when the players put the effort in to execute it. They haven't done it enough and they are losing games because of it. If these pros need someone to tell them to work hard at this level we have the wrong players.

 

[Ori]

At least LA is winning good in the tanking race #2020!

 

[will1066]

Reunion with our old friend Vesey next.

His new team is going to smack us around

 

[Shesterkybomb]

I mean, perhaps if they were winning with this type of player deployment there'd be an argument. But they've lost 5 in a row. Clearly whatever is being done isn't working.

If you put a line of Gretzky's out there and none of them put the effort in the result would be the same. Effort is the issue here,outside if Zibanajad and maybe Fast there are a lot of passengers on this team waiting for something to happen.

 

[TheBloodyNine]

That's not true really, he prepares them for the game yes, he isnt supposed to make someone want to play and earn their paycheck. These are professional athletes, nobody should have to hold their hands and make them skate. The third period of the Vancouver game showed that the system is fine when the players put the effort in to execute it. They haven't done it enough and they are losing games because of it. If these pros need someone to tell them to work hard at this level we have the wrong players.

It's 100% true. If he can't make someone want to play for him then he isn't doing his job. It's a coach's job to make sure that each one of his players is buying into what he is preaching, and that he's teaching them the right way to play. It has nothing to do with them being "professional athletes." With that analogy, might as well not have coaches at all. The coach is supposed to be THE leader of the team.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

It's 100% true. If he can't make someone want to play for him then he isn't doing his job. It's a coach's job to make sure that each one of his players is buying into what he is preaching, and that he's teaching them the right way to play. It has nothing to do with them being "professional athletes." With that analogy, might as well not have coaches at all. The coach is supposed to be THE leader of the team.

He prepares a game plan, puts the system in place and it's up to the players to execute it on the ice. If you are saying they are tuning him out that's one thing but it's not up to him to do much other than allocate ice time in a reward/punishment for poor executing for motivation. Hes not gonna stand in front of them with pom poms and make them skate. These guys have to get off their asses and play.

 

[Mac n Gs]

"Reason" to play a 4th liner with 2 all stars and give him the 3rd among of ice among forwards. Results showed, i guess you missed the game.

This is an overblown reaction just for the sake of being reactionary, and you know it. Fast played well tonight, and Quinn wasn't wrong to put his best-performing RW from the last game on the top-line, especially when Kreider wasn't a fit there. Quinn rotated the lines later only because he was shortening his bench. I get it that people want Kakko to see time in that spot, and I do too, but c'mon now.

I mean everyone's been really well-behaved albeit freakin' macabre so maybe I should tone down the stickling and just leave people to take it out on David Quinn.

And your argument wasn't invalid either, especially with how well Fast played in the prior game. He does have a history of playing with Zibanejad and doing it very well from a perspective of driving possession, scoring chances, and actual goals. When the entire team has been playing poorly, it's not outrageous to move up a reliable player to try to shift some players down and balance out the rest of the lineup. Besides, Panarin-Mika-Fast was one of the few lines that didn't get their teeth kicked in tonight.

The real solution should be splitting Mika and Panarin to stabilize the rest of the top-6. If Quinn wants to roll 3 lines more heavily, he needs to make sure more than just 1 of those lines is actually performing. For the time being, just go back to the following and see if the lineup can get back on track:

Kreider-Zibanejad-Buch
Panarin-Howden/Lias-Kakko
Lemieux-Strome-Fast
McKegg-Howden/Lias-Smith

Side note: Adam Fox has been really freaking good to start this season.

 

[Anzi]

He prepares a game plan, puts the system in place and it's up to the players to execute it on the ice. If you are saying they are tuning him out that's one thing but it's not up to him to do much other than allocate ice time in a reward/punishment for poor executing.

Maybe the game plan sucks? It working for 1 period against a tired Canucks team playing a back to back doesn't mean its a good system.