U18: 2025 Usa Roster Talk
- Thread starter Pavel Buchnevich
- Start date
I’m going to stick up for Phillips. He’s played a little less than 21 total minutes all tournament. You can’t really judge a player based on playing like five shifts per game. Trethewey hasn’t played well, but Phillips shouldn’t be dragged when he’s not getting ice time. That’s on the coach, not him.
I thought that was a pathetic performance. This Latvia team sucks, and we let them embarrass us by playing a close game with them.
I never felt it was close enough that we could lose, but still that was not a well played game by us.
Our defense continues to disappoint me. Very poorly constructed. Coach playing favorites for mediocre players. Too many no shows on offense. Our fourth line has been terrible all tournament. Moore and Horcoff are adding nothing. Potter is basically a one man line. McKinney needs to be better offensively than he has been.
I would probably predict we lose to Canada, but I think it’s a toss up.
I never felt it was close enough that we could lose, but still that was not a well played game by us.
Our defense continues to disappoint me. Very poorly constructed. Coach playing favorites for mediocre players. Too many no shows on offense. Our fourth line has been terrible all tournament. Moore and Horcoff are adding nothing. Potter is basically a one man line. McKinney needs to be better offensively than he has been.
I would probably predict we lose to Canada, but I think it’s a toss up.
WarriorofTime
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Between 2023 WJC Bronze Medal Game, 2023 U18 Gold Medal Game, 2024 WJC Gold Medal Game, I think the debt is re-paid lol
WarriorofTime
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If they go that high, it's because it's a weak draft. Guys will go 2nd round this year that would ordinarily go 4th round.
This is now similar scenario where Swedes are heavy favourites to win it all like we were in 2022. Those other games were either 50-50 games or we were heavy favourites. Now it is chance to take a upset against them like they did in 2022.
SanDogBrewin
Righteous bucks!
Felt like watching the 2022 gold medal game all over again. Can’t really be upset with that performance from this group
William H Bonney
Registered User
A failure of a tournament for the NTDP and USAH both in results and attendance. Embarrassing to put this tournament in Texas and play in front of empty seats all tournament.
The program needs to clean house on the coaching, management, and scouting staffs.
The program needs to clean house on the coaching, management, and scouting staffs.
Yea , my buddy is at the game and just text me on complete joke of attendance and who put it in Texas should be fired ! It’s embarrassing for USA hockey !
I mostly agree. Especially that this tournament in Texas was a joke. However, I don't think this tournament was a failure in terms of results if they win the bronze medal game. They pushed Sweden's very strong age group all the way. The criticism towards this age group has been exaggerated for a long time.
I am not against the closure of the NTDP as I have said. If it continues, I am especially tired of losing these games because the opposing coaches are tactically light years ahead. Investing that much money to the program and not being able to get a world class coaches is just beyond me.
Drew Shock certainly raised his stock the most out of the entire team during this tournament. Murtagh, Mckinney and Fiddler were especially big disappointments during the whole tournament. We needed more from them to get to the final.
WarriorofTime
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Issue is just they had no top line or top pair. Not really anyone’s fault. Just how the age group crumbled. Last year you’d have Hagens, Eiserman, Hutson on first powerplay. This year none of that.
Not too concerned with this age group producing depth players for a team at the wjc that can contend. For two years from now they’ll probably be pretty bad unless multiple players from within or without have big breakouts in college.
Not worth getting up in arms about. Just wasn’t a strong year. Happens. Until it’s a trend, but 04 and 05 were such strong years that I guess they were due for a down one.
William H Bonney
Registered User
It's not a great age group but it's most definitely a failure in terms of results nonetheless. USAH puts an exorbitant amount of resources into the NTDP. The NTDP hangs it hat on winning this tournament. It's what they're working toward for 2 seasons. It's a misguided goal. The U18s (Hlinka or IIHF) shouldn't be the be all end all. At this age, I care much more about player development, the best players getting the best opportunities, etc.
But there was very little progression for this team and its players from the U17 to U18 season. You can't put that many resources into one team and have poor player development for two seasons. But if you do, you damn well better win the tournament that's the goal for each birth year, misguided or not.
This team was a failure, and we knew it would be from when the roster was picked. They had the nerve to pick future undrafted guys over future early first round picks and try to tell us with a straight face it was in the interest of trying to win. We all know it was to preserve some of the shitty NTDP players and help them get drafted. It's just a joke that we don't get to see the best players. Third place working with these restrictions honestly wouldn't be that bad.
Next year they need to totally revamp the process. The NTDP players don't get free rides into the selection camp (that obviously wasn't much of a camp as they clearly had the team picked before it started). They need to pick the roster from scratch. If the NTDP players aren't the best players, they don't get spots on the roster. Should be that simple.
Next year they need to totally revamp the process. The NTDP players don't get free rides into the selection camp (that obviously wasn't much of a camp as they clearly had the team picked before it started). They need to pick the roster from scratch. If the NTDP players aren't the best players, they don't get spots on the roster. Should be that simple.
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ORRFForever
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You called the finals weeks ago, my friend. Well done.
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Game was close. Couple of lucky bounces there and USA had at least two breakaways but couldn´t finish. Small marginals.
How about getting rid of the younger team and only having one team . They are picking the team after u -15 midget year which it has been way too much political with super teams and agents . It would be easier for them to pick it after the kids play one full season of juniors whether its USHL or the CHL and the kids would develop I think even more . The first year ntdp gets destroyed in the ushl because you got 16 year olds team verse 19 year olds kids. It would be better for their development at 16 I think if mixed in a lineup with older kids without less pressure and would give them more time and space develop . In addition , when your picking 16 old kids it’s a 2 year contract so obviously going make mistakes but your stuck with the kids . Just have u -18 ntdp , save a fortune and then truly you get best kids for the tourny and draft year .
SanDogBrewin
Righteous bucks!
I felt like Sweden learned from the previous game against the US in the tourney. Sweden collapsed in front of their goalie all night. Not a ton of open looks in the slot for the US.
US has issues getting the puck out of their own zone against the better teams. And Dzone passing was sloppy as he'll.
And Sweden was the better team overall.
clevelandcane
Registered User
I guess I'm in the minority but I love everything about the NTDP save maybe the nepotism with picking the 17 U team.
I thought this team played okay vs SWE. Actually controlled more chances than SWE. Outshot them, had better chances. There were some really bad bounces on both sides. I still can't figure out how that puck bounced for SWE 2nd goal
Love the NTDP model. I will defer to those who think the coaching is weak. That part of the model HAS to be stellar or the model suffers greatly.
The US has had teams with more drafted/draftable talent in past years and had similar results.
I hope we win today. Yesterday was a wasted opportunity and a game they should have won. Onwards and upwards.
Go USA!
I thought this team played okay vs SWE. Actually controlled more chances than SWE. Outshot them, had better chances. There were some really bad bounces on both sides. I still can't figure out how that puck bounced for SWE 2nd goal
Love the NTDP model. I will defer to those who think the coaching is weak. That part of the model HAS to be stellar or the model suffers greatly.
The US has had teams with more drafted/draftable talent in past years and had similar results.
I hope we win today. Yesterday was a wasted opportunity and a game they should have won. Onwards and upwards.
Go USA!
This wasn't a strong birth class so no surprise that they are not playing for gold. You are 100 percent correct on the attendance though, just a terrible look!
Funny you should say it but a few months back there was talk picking up about just that!
There are going to be a lot of changes in the amateur hockey landscape over the next few years.
WarriorofTime
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The program was created before the IIHF U18 Tournament ever existed and was primarily meant to be a bridge for top players players to play domestically and have a solid pathway to college hockey. Before that it was largely kids scattered on prep teams throughout the country or feeling like they had no choice but to go to Canada and play in their junior system. The IIHF U18s becoming a focal point was really more of a coincidence that srpung about circumstantially. I know that one Dominance guy thinks it's cheating or whatever and makes a big stink every time USA loses, but it's just how it goes and in place if there was a big time junior system, they'd need some sort of Program of Excellence equivalency. Unlike European countries, they don't form age group national teams multiple years in advance and compete in a slew of competition against other countries a train ride away. The U20 results were a hot mess prior to the creation of a USNTDP because everyone was so scattered and unfamiliar. They can get rid of USNTDP if they want, but they need a suitable alternative that (a) gives top players a good domestic option and (b) gives some familiarity for everyone prior to assembling for big international events.
Juxtaposer
Outro: Divina Comedia
I think even relative to expectations, this team underwhelmed. I'd say the only guys who raised their stock were Schock and Horcoff. Fiddler's had some good and some back, stock steady. I still like Murtagh, though I have seen better from him. Mooney and Porter were solid but not as good as I expected (or as they needed to be to help their draft stock). More of the same mediocrity from Moore and Trethewey. Extremely disappointed with McKinney, whom I was hoping would be the best player on this team.
More than that, though, is that the bottom half of this roster just wasn't good enough.
More than that, though, is that the bottom half of this roster just wasn't good enough.
Happy for the boys that they at least won bronze at the end of a difficult season. It is still house cleaning time for the program.
2018 Final loss to Finland.
2019 semi-final loss
2021 QF loss
2022 Final loss
2024 Final loss
2025 Bronze
1 gold medal in seven years just doesn't cut it for the program. It's embarrassing and one way or another they need to find a way to fix this direction. Sure in 2019, 2022 and 2024 there were bad luck or some bad break that cost us those games but results don't lie. Every day I feel more and more that we can do better without the NTDP these days.
It's time for JV to move on to other challenges and significantly more investment needs to be made in coaching. In this tournament, the USA's PP was the worst of the entire tournament. You can't win with that. It's unbelievable that money is being invested in this program and then many of the coaches are still learning their craft. Many assistant coaches are just starting their coaching careers and sometimes even intern coaches have been there. That doesn't maximize success and player development. You need to get a quality coaching staff there. The players need to develop and the competitors can't be tactically lightyears ahead so often.
2018 Final loss to Finland.
2019 semi-final loss
2021 QF loss
2022 Final loss
2024 Final loss
2025 Bronze
1 gold medal in seven years just doesn't cut it for the program. It's embarrassing and one way or another they need to find a way to fix this direction. Sure in 2019, 2022 and 2024 there were bad luck or some bad break that cost us those games but results don't lie. Every day I feel more and more that we can do better without the NTDP these days.
It's time for JV to move on to other challenges and significantly more investment needs to be made in coaching. In this tournament, the USA's PP was the worst of the entire tournament. You can't win with that. It's unbelievable that money is being invested in this program and then many of the coaches are still learning their craft. Many assistant coaches are just starting their coaching careers and sometimes even intern coaches have been there. That doesn't maximize success and player development. You need to get a quality coaching staff there. The players need to develop and the competitors can't be tactically lightyears ahead so often.
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