2024 Training Camp

[starsfan86]

If they're moving on from Lundkvist i sure hope its not by putting in Brendan Smith as an every day player.

Only way I can see it is if they’re ready for Bischel

 

[serp]

What are the PPs shaping up like this year?

Who are we going to see replace Pavs presence?

Wyatt and Stank plays in Wyatts spot on PP#2 . Thats the only things that changed from last year.

 

[Hinterland]

I don't know what he's talking about. DeBoer made his decision long ago. He played Lundkvist an average of 4:28 during playoff. Tells you everything you need to know. Alex Petrovic, who only played one (!) regular season game in the NHL, averaged 12:02.
Does Shapiro really think it was DeBoer's idea to bring back Lundqvist when he already demonstrated that he's willing to play pretty much everybody over Lundqvist? This isn't DeBoer's call...the question is at which point the Front Office is gonna give up on Lundqvist and stop protecting him.

 

[eartotheground]

I don't know what he's talking about. DeBoer made his decision long ago. He played Lundkvist an average of 4:28 during playoff. Tells you everything you need to know. Alex Petrovic, who only played one (!) regular season game in the NHL, averaged 12:02.
Does Shapiro really think it was DeBoer's idea to bring back Lundqvist when he already demonstrated that he's willing to play pretty much everybody over Lundqvist? This isn't DeBoer's call...the question is at which point the Front Office is gonna give up on Lundqvist and stop protecting him.

the fact that nils re-signed tells a different story. it reeks of someone who understands that they got a fair opportunity and hadn't done what was asked, but thinks they'll be able to next go around and then get the opportunity.

if you really think PDB told GMJN that he wouldn't play nils, and then they still went out and signed him again, idk what to tell you. there's no chance that happened.

 

[EddieTheEagle]

Wyatt and Stank plays in Wyatts spot on PP#2 . Thats the only things that changed from last year.

Appreciate you taking the time to reply. Amazing opportunity for WJ.

 

[Hinterland]

the fact that nils re-signed tells a different story. it reeks of someone who understands that they got a fair opportunity and hadn't done what was asked, but thinks they'll be able to next go around and then get the opportunity.

if you really think PDB told GMJN that he wouldn't play nils, and then they still went out and signed him again, idk what to tell you. there's no chance that happened.

So you think DeBoer still has the slightest bit of confidence in a guy he pretty much perma benched while giving a random AHLer almost 3x his TOI?

Or did DeBoer just change his mind over the summer?

You're free to believe whatever you want but I'd be shocked if, of all people, DeBoer suddenly wanted the guy back he pretty much refused to play previously.

 

[Troy McClure]

So you think DeBoer still has the slightest bit of confidence in a guy he pretty much perma benched while giving a random AHLer almost 3x his TOI?

Or did DeBoer just change his mind over the summer?

You're free to believe whatever you want but I'd be shocked if, of all people, DeBoer suddenly wanted the guy back he pretty much refused to play previously.

DeBoer has given Lundkvist a full time job to start the prior two seasons. Once Nill re-signed him, it was guaranteed Lundkvist would get a third opportunity to be a full time player. It's up to him to show he can handle it.

 

[Hinterland]

DeBoer has given Lundkvist a full time job to start the prior two seasons. Once Nill re-signed him, it was guaranteed Lundkvist would get a third opportunity to be a full time player. It's up to him to show he can handle it.

Right. It's Nill guaranteeing Lundqvist this opportunity. It's Nill who signed the player. I have a very hard time believing that De Boer asked Nill to sign the same player he basically refused to play when games matter the most.

This is very much Nill's idea, not DeBoer's. DeBoer made his decision long ago. Which is why I don't really understand Shapiro's comment. I think it would take a lot for DeBoer to be able to trust Lundqvist again. Lundqvist is most likely waived the minute Nill has seen enough. It's Nill and not DeBoer making that call. If it's DeBoer calling the shots then Lundqvist is gone already and most certainly doesn't get signed either.

If DeBoer doesn't play Lundqvist it's not because he's a big fan of Petrovic, Bichsel or whoever. It's because he lost trust in Lundqvist. I might be wrong but I think this is gonna be an uphill climb for Lundqvist. With the damage already done it may be too little too late.

 

[eartotheground]

Right. It's Nill guaranteeing Lundqvist this opportunity. It's Nill who signed the player. I have a very hard time believing that De Boer asked Nill to sign the same player he basically refused to play when games matter the most.

This is very much Nill's idea, not DeBoer's. DeBoer made his decision long ago. Which is why I don't really understand Shapiro's comment. I think it would take a lot for DeBoer to be able to trust Lundqvist again. Lundqvist is most likely waived the minute Nill has seen enough. It's Nill and not DeBoer making that call. If it's DeBoer calling the shots then Lundqvist is gone already and most certainly doesn't get signed either.

If DeBoer doesn't play Lundqvist it's not because he's a big fan of Petrovic, Bichsel or whoever. It's because he lost trust in Lundqvist. I might be wrong but I think this is gonna be an uphill climb for Lundqvist. With the damage already done it may be too little too late.

nill is not jerry. he has zero track record of functioning like that. nothing we've ever, ever learned about gmjn points to him just dumping a player on a coach that has zero interest in having him on the team.

could they both have agreed to give it one more shot? sure. but nill doesn't just go rogue

 

[Troy McClure]

nill is not jerry. he has zero track record of functioning like that. nothing we've ever, ever learned about gmjn points to him just dumping a player on a coach that has zero interest in having him on the team.

could they both have agreed to give it one more shot? sure. but nill doesn't just go rogue

And I think this is a collaboration. Nill wants to give his bad trade another shot, and I bet DeBoer would love to see Lundkvist be a good player. I don't think DeBoer minds because it's clear he and Nill work well together on these things. If this opportunity doesn't result in better play, DeBoer will start scratching him again with Nill's blessing.

 

[Hinterland]

nill is not jerry. he has zero track record of functioning like that. nothing we've ever, ever learned about gmjn points to him just dumping a player on a coach that has zero interest in having him on the team.

could they both have agreed to give it one more shot? sure. but nill doesn't just go rogue

I mean it's possible DeBoer's protest wasn't loud enough but after what happened last season I don't see how DeBoer possibly could have wanted Lundqvist back. This was purely Nill's idea.

 

[eartotheground]

I mean it's possible DeBoer's protest wasn't loud enough but after what happened last season I don't see how DeBoer possibly could have wanted Lundqvist back. This was purely Nill's idea.

guess we'll just disagree on this one

 

[piqued]

I'm with Hinterland on this one. It's a low-key power struggle. Nill's not asking for permission from the coaches before he tenders a contract. Every move he's made is a clear message to DeBoer to play Lundkvist, DeBoer just ignores it. This team would have absolutely been stronger with Hanley still as an option in the playoffs but Nill got rid of him to reduce PDB's options never thinking he'd actually f***ing play Alex Petrovic in the WCF. I also don't think there's any "agreement" to start off playing Nils this season and I'm sure PDB would have much preferred to go with Smith if he hadn't been hot garbage so far this camp/preseason. I'm sure PDB would also rather have Bichsel but Nill recognizes he needs AHL time.

 

[eartotheground]

I'm with Hinterland on this one. It's a low-key power struggle. Nill's not asking for permission from the coaches before he tenders a contract. Every move he's made is a clear message to DeBoer to play Lundkvist, DeBoer just ignores it. This team would have absolutely been stronger with Hanley still as an option in the playoffs but Nill got rid of him to reduce PDB's options never thinking he'd actually f***ing play Alex Petrovic in the WCF. I also don't think there's any "agreement" to start off playing Nils this season and I'm sure PDB would have much preferred to go with Smith if he hadn't been hot garbage so far this camp/preseason. I'm sure PDB would also rather have Bichsel but Nill recognizes he needs AHL time.

what has nill done in his tenure to make you think he would operate that way? everything we've ever heard is that he's s tier with relationships. i just can't fathom him playing silly power games with his coach, that's dysfunctional from a relationship perspective, and it goes against everything we know about the guy.

does he need permission to sign a player? ofc not. but alignment? that's something a healthy org would absolutely seek

 

[M88K]

I'm with Hinterland on this one. It's a low-key power struggle. Nill's not asking for permission from the coaches before he tenders a contract. Every move he's made is a clear message to DeBoer to play Lundkvist, DeBoer just ignores it. This team would have absolutely been stronger with Hanley still as an option in the playoffs but Nill got rid of him to reduce PDB's options never thinking he'd actually f***ing play Alex Petrovic in the WCF. I also don't think there's any "agreement" to start off playing Nils this season and I'm sure PDB would have much preferred to go with Smith if he hadn't been hot garbage so far this camp/preseason. I'm sure PDB would also rather have Bichsel but Nill recognizes he needs AHL time.

Just to clarify he got rid of Hanley for cap purposes. Not because he didn't want Deboer to play Hanley.

 

[piqued]

what has nill done in his tenure to make you think he would operate that way? everything we've ever heard is that he's s tier with relationships. i just can't fathom him playing silly power games with his coach, that's dysfunctional from a relationship perspective, and it goes against everything we know about the guy.

does he need permission to sign a player? ofc not. but alignment? that's something a healthy org would absolutely seek

Everything, this fits Nill's MO down to a tee. He has great interpersonal relationships but that doesn't mean it's necessarily healthy for the organization. He's old school through and through which means the manager doesn't tell the staff what to do directly, ever. Clearly his weakest point as GM has been hiring coaches who are aligned with his personal vision. Which I would argue is actually dysfunctional in the long run, but the reason it exists is so that it's impossible for a player to go over the coach's head and appeal to management.

As this relates back to Nils, it's obvious to me that Nill wants the team to play the same way Line 1 through Line 4, Pairing 1 through Pairing 3. Whereas PDB wants his Pair 3 to play no-event hockey, effectively adopting a different style than the others.

 

[eartotheground]

Everything, this fits Nill's MO down to a tee. He has great interpersonal relationships but that doesn't mean it's necessarily healthy for the organization. He's old school through and through which means the manager doesn't tell the staff what to do directly, ever. Clearly his weakest point as GM has been hiring coaches who are aligned with his personal vision. Which I would argue is actually dysfunctional in the long run, but the reason it exists is so that it's impossible for a player to go over the coach's head and appeal to management.

As this relates back to Nils, it's obvious to me that Nill wants the team to play the same way Line 1 through Line 4, Pairing 1 through Pairing 3. Whereas PDB wants his Pair 3 to play no-event hockey, effectively adopting a different style than the others.

fair 'nuf

 

[Troy McClure]

As this relates back to Nils, it's obvious to me that Nill wants the team to play the same way Line 1 through Line 4, Pairing 1 through Pairing 3. Whereas PDB wants his Pair 3 to play no-event hockey, effectively adopting a different style than the others.

I don't think this is what DeBoer wants from his third pair ideally. I think this is what DeBoer ends up going with considering the Stars have had trouble finding third pair guys capable of doing much more.

 

[Henderson33]

Nill in a power struggle with the coach who has taken this team to back-to-back Conference Finals and potentially souring the relationship over the #6 defenseman is an interesting take.

Makes Jerry Jones almost seem normal.

There's not a single hockey player out there that would have came back to the situation they were in if it wasn't discussed with the coach. Lundkvist will get every opportunity as the #6 because we are weak down that side, not because the GM is in the coaches ear.

 

[serp]

The team desperately needed RHD and could only find Dumba and Lyubushkin in free agency as solution who haven't exactly been very good in recent years. Nils gets another chance because there are just not that many RHD's out there .

If somehow Nils even slightly managed to tap in parts on his potential he can easily be the teams best RHD because the other two are not all that good.

 

[M88K]

The team desperately needed RHD and could only find Dumba and Lyubushkin in free agency as solution who haven't exactly been very good in recent years. Nils gets another chance because there are just not that many RHD's out there .

If somehow Nils even slightly managed to tap in parts on his potential he can easily be the teams best RHD because the other two are not all that good.

There was a ton of better RD options than either available.
They either were
A: Trying to be cheaper with the actual good RDs. then panicked overpaid these two losers.
B: Wanted big dumb physical defensemen with limited skillsets for some reason, of which there wasn't many available.

 

[Dallasman]

There was a ton of better RD options than either available.
They either were
A: Trying to be cheaper with the actual good RDs. then panicked overpaid these two losers.
B: Wanted big dumb physical defensemen with limited skillsets for some reason, of which there wasn't many available.

Keep an eye on Calgary and Rasmus Andersson

 

[M88K]

Keep an eye on Calgary and Rasmus Andersson

No cap space to make a move like that, and Nill doesn't have the balls to make those types of moves.

 

[Dallasman]

No cap space to make a move like that, and Nill doesn't have the balls to make those types of moves.

Again...

Keep an eye on him...DURING THE SEASON

 

[LT]

No cap space to make a move like that, and Nill doesn't have the balls to make those types of moves.

That's a trade deadline type of move.

Being able to run a top 4 like this during crunch time:

Miro - Andersson
Lindell - Harley

Is massive for the playoffs.

Andersson also has a relatively small cap hit (4.55M), is an upcoming UFA, and will almost certainly be available at the deadline.