Blue Jays Discussion: 2024 Season - Complete without a great title in keeping with the performance

[TheBeastCoast]

Juan Soto named a gold glove finalist like honest what tf are we even doing here at this point.

 

[hockeywiz542]

Buster Olney: Toronto Blue Jays among teams making a move on star 3B Alex Bregman this offseason | TSN

After finishing in last place in the AL East for the first time in 11 years, the Toronto Blue Jays (74-88) are expected to make a splash in free agency this off-season to try to address problems with the offence.

www.tsn.ca

ESPN's Buster Olney thinks that Houston Astros third baseman Alex Bregman could be a key name in play.

Olney joined First Up on TSN1050 on Tuesday morning to discuss the chances the Blue Jays make a move on Bregman, and what other teams could be in play for the veteran.

"He's a proven winner, he's a really good third baseman, he can hit, he would help to lengthen out their lineup," Olney said.

Bregman, 30, is coming off the final season of a five-year, $100 million deal signed with the Astros. The two-time All-Star has received Most Valuable Player votes in four of his nine MLB seasons, and was a member of both the 2017 and 2022 World Series champion teams.

He finished the 2024 campaign with a .260 batting average and 26 home runs, 75 runs batted in and 79 runs scored.

"We know the Blue Jays have been looking to fill the third base spot more permanently for the past couple of years," Olney said.

"They made [former Blue Jays third baseman] Matt Chapman [an] offer for about $125 million early in the 2023 season, and Bregman fits [the team's needs] in a lot of ways."

Toronto's 4.14 runs scored per game ranked 23rd in the MLB this season. They scored one or fewer runs in 32 games last season, which accounted for 31 of their 88 losses.

Per FanGraphs, the Blue Jays ranked 20th in home runs hit by third basemen (16), 22nd in runs scored (66) and tied for 18th in wins above replacement (2.1) in 2024.

Bregman is expected to be one of the most attractive pieces on the market in free agency this winter, and the Blue Jays will have no shortage of competition in acquiring his services, according to Olney.

"Here's the thing: Not only does Houston want him back - and I do think there are limits to what the Astros can offer him - but there's another team that's on the rise in the American League that also could use a third baseman, and that would be the Detroit Tigers."

"They are managed by A.J. Hinch, who was Bregman's manager in Houston. They've got a lot of payroll flexibility ... I think, given their late-season success, given the excellence of their players and what they're building there, and given Hinch's influence, it wouldn't at all surprise me if they made a run at Alex as someone who could be an anchor for these young players on the Tigers," Olney said.

 

[Bjindaho]

Buster Olney: Toronto Blue Jays among teams making a move on star 3B Alex Bregman this offseason | TSN

After finishing in last place in the AL East for the first time in 11 years, the Toronto Blue Jays (74-88) are expected to make a splash in free agency this off-season to try to address problems with the offence.

www.tsn.ca

ESPN's Buster Olney thinks that Houston Astros third baseman Alex Bregman could be a key name in play.

Olney joined First Up on TSN1050 on Tuesday morning to discuss the chances the Blue Jays make a move on Bregman, and what other teams could be in play for the veteran.

"He's a proven winner, he's a really good third baseman, he can hit, he would help to lengthen out their lineup," Olney said.

Bregman, 30, is coming off the final season of a five-year, $100 million deal signed with the Astros. The two-time All-Star has received Most Valuable Player votes in four of his nine MLB seasons, and was a member of both the 2017 and 2022 World Series champion teams.

He finished the 2024 campaign with a .260 batting average and 26 home runs, 75 runs batted in and 79 runs scored.

"We know the Blue Jays have been looking to fill the third base spot more permanently for the past couple of years," Olney said.

"They made [former Blue Jays third baseman] Matt Chapman [an] offer for about $125 million early in the 2023 season, and Bregman fits [the team's needs] in a lot of ways."

Toronto's 4.14 runs scored per game ranked 23rd in the MLB this season. They scored one or fewer runs in 32 games last season, which accounted for 31 of their 88 losses.

Per FanGraphs, the Blue Jays ranked 20th in home runs hit by third basemen (16), 22nd in runs scored (66) and tied for 18th in wins above replacement (2.1) in 2024.

Bregman is expected to be one of the most attractive pieces on the market in free agency this winter, and the Blue Jays will have no shortage of competition in acquiring his services, according to Olney.

"Here's the thing: Not only does Houston want him back - and I do think there are limits to what the Astros can offer him - but there's another team that's on the rise in the American League that also could use a third baseman, and that would be the Detroit Tigers."

"They are managed by A.J. Hinch, who was Bregman's manager in Houston. They've got a lot of payroll flexibility ... I think, given their late-season success, given the excellence of their players and what they're building there, and given Hinch's influence, it wouldn't at all surprise me if they made a run at Alex as someone who could be an anchor for these young players on the Tigers," Olney said.

He's an interesting option.

Soto has to be #1 on any list (because he's Soto). After that, Toronto could look at Bregman, Alonso and Christian Walker as the next tier (where Vladdy shifts to 3B for the latter 2).

 

[Discoverer]

Juan Soto named a gold glove finalist like honest what tf are we even doing here at this point.

Over the last few years, the Gold Gloves seem to be a bit more meaningful since they seem to be based more on actual performance than reputation/offensive ability. We don't seem to get as many Jeter (won multiple Gold Gloves while being arguably the worst defensive SS in the game) or Palmeiro (full time DH, won a Gold Glove playing 28 games at 1B) situations anymore.

Hell, I can even accept that the best defensive player in baseball the last two years likely won't end up with a single Gold Glove because of where he's played.

This one, though? This isn't far off Jeter level. Among the 30 AL players with at least 200 innings in RF, he finish 21st in DRS (-1), 28th in OAA (-5.5), and 30th - dead last - in UZR (-6).

Abreu's going to win it anyway, so it won't matter, but that's no reason to nominate one of the worst in the league for an award.

(Also, Kirk absolutely deserved a nomination.)

 

[Bjindaho]

Over the last few years, the Gold Gloves seem to be a bit more meaningful since they seem to be based more on actual performance than reputation/offensive ability. We don't seem to get as many Jeter (won multiple Gold Gloves while being arguably the worst defensive SS in the game) or Palmeiro (full time DH, won a Gold Glove playing 28 games at 1B) situations anymore.

Hell, I can even accept that the best defensive player in baseball the last two years likely won't end up with a single Gold Glove because of where he's played.

This one, though? This isn't far off Jeter level. Among the 30 AL players with at least 200 innings in RF, he finish 21st in DRS (-1), 28th in OAA (-5.5), and 30th - dead last - in UZR (-6).

Abreu's going to win it anyway, so it won't matter, but that's no reason to nominate one of the worst in the league for an award.

(Also, Kirk absolutely deserved a nomination.)

By SABR's Defensive Index, Soto was 3rd for RF as of Aug 11.

Also, Kirk was 4th for C.

 

[Bjindaho]

It should be noted that the SABR system is based on Zone Rating, UZR, TZR, Runs Effectively Defended and DRS (the original)

 

[Discoverer]

It should be noted that the SABR system is based on Zone Rating, UZR, TZR, Runs Effectively Defended and DRS (the original)

I'd love to know more about how they incorporate that information. It also says they use Statcast data. DRS, UZR, and Statcast all have Soto as one of the worst in the league.

 

[Bjindaho]

I'd love to know more about how they incorporate that information. It also says they use Statcast data. DRS, UZR, and Statcast all have Soto as one of the worst in the league.

UZR, Runs Effectively Defended and TZR are Statcast-based.

FWIW, I posted many times this year railing on the use of these stats for catchers (because they suck).

TZR had Soto 20th.

Here's the full description:

SABR Defensive Index Baseball Dictionary | Baseball Almanac

SABR Defensive Index from the Baseball Dictionary, on Baseball Almanac.

www.baseball-almanac.com

 

[Bjindaho]

It should be noted that if you are looking at the criteria and saying to yourself, "this seems problematic", you aren't going crazy.

25% of the gold glove decisions is based on SABR (whose formulas pick and pull from available data but blatantly ignore other points because they weren't devised by them or Bill James. As a result, framing gets no value (Kirk was 2nd in framing in baseball, while Fremin is a negative value framer) and there is no attention paid to home park (in other words, Soto gets a huge boost from playing in a couple of parks where extra balls go out of play that he couldn't get to but a decent RF could).