2024-25 USNTDP U17 Discussion
- Thread starter Pavel Buchnevich
- Start date
I'm going to be honest- I think Mutryn might be a first rounder by the time all is said and done. Really good size/skating combo, better defensive game than any of his fellows, and the production is pretty good, especially per game. Could be my BC-homerness, but I like him and Hurlbert more than any of the other forwards on the squad as future NHL guys.
I liked what I saw so I will try to keep a closer eye on him next year.
jtechkid
Guest
Team got destroyed 10-2 i think last night . Somebody on this board was saying heavy discussion of having just one u -18 team ? My view might make sense because picking kids coming from midget hockey which is very hard for lot of them on how they translate playing junior hockey .
Relax, the team loses by huge margins in their U17 year every year. And this team is dealing with losing their best 1-3 players every game for the last month due to promotions.
NTDP isn’t cutting a team, nor is losing by this scoreline a worry. Go check previous years score lines. Nothing new.
NTDP isn’t cutting a team, nor is losing by this scoreline a worry. Go check previous years score lines. Nothing new.
The NTDP has a pretty insane track record of good NHL players. Every time I watch NHL games it feels like a new former NTDP kid is getting a callup. There's no reason to think players would start running away from the program.
jtechkid
Guest
Well back to you on the 4-6 kids that should have made the team, wouldn’t it be easier picking u - 18 watching all the kids play ushl their u -17 year . The program for top end kids easy picks but they miss out development and have completely wrong picks maybe 30-40% of the team . Imagine , Whytenbach , Moe , Sychora , Simpson , Kevan , Fiddler , Rombach- ect on that team .
Im so confused where this argument about getting rid of the U17 team is coming from. Theyve been getting the crapped kicked out of them in the USHL for years. That's kind of the whole point. Is this year a little worse than past years? Probably but down years happen. The WJC group who just won gold lost like 17 out of their last 22 games in the USHL in their U17 year. Where is this even coming from?
jtechkid
Guest
Just think it would make the u -18 team dramatically better is the argument . It’s a 2 year contract so it’s just tough picking the right kids coming out of midgets . The program has been great but this would make it even better .
How would it make it better? The whole idea of the program is to develop players not about winning in the USHL. Just so I'm clear, you think players would develop more in their U17 year playing midget or for another USHL, NAHL, BCHL or CHL team than they would at the NTDP? I just can't disagree more
The whole idea is for them to learn what will and won't work at the next level, how hard they need to work to get there and develop against much stronger/older competition with more playing time than they'd most likely get otherwise. This all means the coach's #1 job is to develop players, winning in the USHL is about 10th on their priority list
If you think there's an issue with evaluation of players on who makes the NTDP, then that's a completely different conversation. If you think the current coaching staff sucks at developing players, that's another converstaion. But I think it's wildly off base to think a program that's revolutionized American hockey development into the NHL should change from a 2 year program to a 1 year program just because they're getting the wheels beaten off them in a meaningless USHL regular season game
I couldn’t agree more. The 17s have gotten waxed at the USHL for years this is a total nothing burger.
There are problems with the NTDP, some of which you allude to. I'm not saying the whole model is perfect, but I don't think the solution is getting rid of a team. If there's anything I'd like to change in a big way, I'd like the roster to be more fluid from year to year.
jtechkid
Guest
Like somebody had alluded their has been buzz going around that they are looking into just one team . I Don’t really care that much but more speculating on why that buzz is being talked about . My only guess is they have hard time picking kids coming out of midgets and they miss lot of good players every year . By having everybody play one year of juniors maybe it gives them the best option to pick the best team for more complete development . The team done great but it’s usually top heavy in my view and they usually miss 4-8 kids every year . For instance if Kevan or Rombach is now on NTDP this year - compete at junior events against kids their age they could actually move up in draft rankings maybe into first round .
There isnt any buzz. Someone mentioned it on HFboards and people ran with it.
Its impossible to nail down who will be the best 18 year olds at age 15/16. Kevan wasn’t considered because he had serious character issues if I recall. Rombach was just a case of a kid that wasn’t that good at 15-16 and now he is. It happens.
It's coming from the (anonymous) person four posts up from yours who insists ad nauseum that he has inside information that seemingly covers the entire landscape of youth hockey and that apparently no named reporters have access to. He has been called out on it by multiple people but continues on unperturbed.
To me, the program is about development. Not just on the ice but I'm guessing they do tons of off ice learning, weights, IQ activities. I think two years is warranted to try and develop these dudes. I get your point is interesting but if a kid commits to the program, the program should commit to them. Just my opinion.
Could some type of compromise work where for major tournaments or showcases they select whoever the best players are and at the same time not necessarily dump the the 20th best player in an NTDP age group at the side of the road? I don't see why you'd necessarily have to take away his spot and access to all the resources the NTDP has and the exposure of the week to week games.
Because I think you can have a National Team Development Program without mandating that those however players picked end up being the ones that represent the United States at these major tournaments and showcases. It seems to me like that'd solve a lot of the issues.
I like the ideas. I get messed up between development, what's best for the kid, the teams, and representing the US.
These are kids so I don't want them disappointed. However, life is competitive and the program is darn well competitive too. Plus I want to see Team USA win.
It's a delicate balance. It comes down to the US clearly defininig their goals for the program and very clearly communicating those goals to the kids up front.
There's only one major tournament, the IIHF U18s at the end of the program's run. They've brought in kids from the outside routinely and also promote kids from the U17 team. Nobody is guaranteed a spot in that tournament.
The other stuff like the x Nations or the U17 Hockey Canada Challenge are minor, and in the case of the Hockey Canada U17, it's right at the start of the U17s season, so there wouldn't really be enough time to evaluate who to dump off anyways.
Sammy Nelson for 17’s
First 32 games: 8+7=15 points in 32 games.
Last 13 games (Since January 1): 8+8=16 points in 13 games.
He’s been taking over since Berchild got promoted (Berchild played with the 17’s last night and both had two points).
This was there to see in his shifts that it was a matter of time, but a lot of these guys need a month or two to start adjusting and putting up points.
Would love to see both of them at the U18 Worlds. And Schairer.
First 32 games: 8+7=15 points in 32 games.
Last 13 games (Since January 1): 8+8=16 points in 13 games.
He’s been taking over since Berchild got promoted (Berchild played with the 17’s last night and both had two points).
This was there to see in his shifts that it was a matter of time, but a lot of these guys need a month or two to start adjusting and putting up points.
Would love to see both of them at the U18 Worlds. And Schairer.
Update on how many draftable players we may be looking at.
2026:
1st Round: Schairer, Hurlbert, Kemps
2nd Round: Berchild, Mutryn
3rd Round: Zajic, Beuker, Plante
4th Round: Barnett
5th Round: Cullen
6th Round: Stuart
7th Round: Francisco
2027:
1st Round: Nelson
2nd Round: Glance, Martyniuk
I think this team might end up a little low on draftable players for the NTDP (not terribly, but still looking low). I like the 2007's a little more, but the 2008's are infinitely more skilled. They're like polar opposite teams. The defense for this team is pretty weak. Has virtually zero depth. A lot of skilled forwards though. Also has good later birthdays, so we might not see the effects of the draft potential of this group materialize until a little later. I think there's a little more high-end draft potential than the 2007 group, but also probably a little less depth and this team's players don't project as well, even if they have more offensive skills. Goaltending is also pretty meh. They haven't been shut out for the draft at the goaltending position since the 2003's, and I would say the odds are probably like 50/50 right now that they do.
2026:
1st Round: Schairer, Hurlbert, Kemps
2nd Round: Berchild, Mutryn
3rd Round: Zajic, Beuker, Plante
4th Round: Barnett
5th Round: Cullen
6th Round: Stuart
7th Round: Francisco
2027:
1st Round: Nelson
2nd Round: Glance, Martyniuk
I think this team might end up a little low on draftable players for the NTDP (not terribly, but still looking low). I like the 2007's a little more, but the 2008's are infinitely more skilled. They're like polar opposite teams. The defense for this team is pretty weak. Has virtually zero depth. A lot of skilled forwards though. Also has good later birthdays, so we might not see the effects of the draft potential of this group materialize until a little later. I think there's a little more high-end draft potential than the 2007 group, but also probably a little less depth and this team's players don't project as well, even if they have more offensive skills. Goaltending is also pretty meh. They haven't been shut out for the draft at the goaltending position since the 2003's, and I would say the odds are probably like 50/50 right now that they do.
O'Neill and Hafele played with this team today. Those would not be the two players I'd demote, but they're not great players either, so it's the biggest deal.
Mutryn and Nelson (along with Berchild who has been locked in what that group for a while) played with the 18's this weekend in their two games.
I'm kind of wondering if maybe they're demoting those two kids to bring in a few forwards from outside the NTDP for the U18 Worlds roster, who aren't yet able to play with the team. If so, why not give two of the most promising 17's a weekend of games playing with the big club before they get sent back down?
Mutryn and Nelson (along with Berchild who has been locked in what that group for a while) played with the 18's this weekend in their two games.
I'm kind of wondering if maybe they're demoting those two kids to bring in a few forwards from outside the NTDP for the U18 Worlds roster, who aren't yet able to play with the team. If so, why not give two of the most promising 17's a weekend of games playing with the big club before they get sent back down?
