2024-2025 Blues Trade Proposals Thread.

[PocketNines]

I am not surprised to see the suggestion that disapproval of Krug is bad faith ("whipping boy") instead of earned, nor I am surprised to see who puts that forth. Imagine what kind of conversations could be had if criticism of a player were taken as if the person criticizing the player is doing so in good faith. The "whipping boy" people would have to critically think. Yikes

 

[Celtic Note]

The only centers that I'd be interested in acquiring are ones that are basically in between the development of Thomas and Dvorsky. If that player becomes available, I'd be somewhat interested, but I still wouldn't want to use the valuable trade pieces required to get them. A player like Mittelstadt or Frost to use as examples. Maybe a vet option is Scott Laughton, he's more of a 3rd line option though.

We are without our 2nd, 3rd, and 4th round picks this season, and our 2nd next season. It's not like we have picks to trade. I'm not sure which of our prospects we'd be willing to trade, and that's not an option I'd want to do. You'd probably have difficulty playing musical chairs with vets, a 3-way deal where we get a center, we send Saad somewhere, and that team sends picks/prospects to the team we get the center from might make sense on paper, but that's going to be pretty difficult to make happen.

To me, I see this season giving us the opportunity to know once and for all if Buchnevich has a future at C. I'm as pessimistic as everyone else, but at least we'll know for sure now. Faksa will allow Dvorsky to develop. If Buchnevich doesn't work, hopefully Holloway or Texier plays well enough to earn an opportunity. Next season, Dvorsky should be our 2nd or 3rd line center, so no point in getting someone that will block him.

Seeing that list of unavailable draft picks gives me pause. Sure we did a great job filling out our depth, but if we end up needing a #2/3C and a #1D, we don’t have a ton of supplementary draft capital.

 

[bleedblue1223]

Seeing that list of unavailable draft picks gives me pause. Sure we did a great job filling out our depth, but if we end up needing a #2/3C and a #1D, we don’t have a ton of supplementary draft capital.

We still have 1sts, so we have the assets for a #1D if one becomes available IMO. I still think each of the trades were easily worth it from a value perspective, it is important that Broberg and Holloway become long-term players for us though.

 

[Celtic Note]

We still have 1sts, so we have the assets for a #1D if one becomes available IMO. I still think each of the trades were easily worth it from a value perspective, it is important that Broberg and Holloway become long-term players for us though.

They both really need to hit.

 

[ChicagoBlues]

Is he a legit centerman? I can't recall the role he played in Buffalo early in his career, but he was a winger who sometimes slides into center duty as needed for all of Florida, Colorado, and Pittsburgh. I think he can play center at the NHL level (and he did in fact play games at center during the Panthers' Cup run). But I'm not sure that I'd consider him a legit NHL center. IMO, he is the kind of guy who is ideally the "4th" center in your top 9 who you pencil in as a winger when you are fully healthy and slide into the middle 6 center duty when a center gets hurt.

I think he'd absolutely be written in as a center on our current lineup, but I don't think that it makes sense to pay assets to acquire him for that role given his age/term and the current phase of our franchise.

The Panthers aren't in a cap crunch and I think his contribution as a middle 6 Swiss army knife at $3M AAV is pretty valuable to their effort to repeat. I think we'd have to make an offer 'too good to pass up' to convince them to trade him and I'm not really looking to do that for a short term fix to this current roster. I do like the player though.

Yeah, maybe legit is overstated. He's played center in his career, for sure, but not at the rate that could be considered legit. I like him, too, but maybe just got a little excited. I'll put down my actuarial Ouija board now. Thank you.

EDIT: What the heck was I thinking by wanting to bring in a 31 y/o player? Glad I'm not the GM. Excitement makes me do goofy things.

 

[Stupendous Yappi]

Seeing that list of unavailable draft picks gives me pause. Sure we did a great job filling out our depth, but if we end up needing a #2/3C and a #1D, we don’t have a ton of supplementary draft capital.

They’ll deal from the prospect pool as well. I think this shows that the Blues shaved a year or two off the rebuild timeline by acquiring players already breaking into the NHL instead of trying to draft them.

I think by 2 years from now we’ll be looking at an established Dvorsky, Snuggerud, etc, and will be starting to look at specific holes in the roster rather than a general rebuild. The 1D may be that hole, but I don’t think we’re going to draft that guy. We’ll be shopping for a big hockey trade then.

 

[Brian39]

To me, I see this season giving us the opportunity to know once and for all if Buchnevich has a future at C. I'm as pessimistic as everyone else, but at least we'll know for sure now. Faksa will allow Dvorsky to develop. If Buchnevich doesn't work, hopefully Holloway or Texier plays well enough to earn an opportunity. Next season, Dvorsky should be our 2nd or 3rd line center, so no point in getting someone that will block him.

Agree with pretty much everything in your post, but wanted to discuss the bolded.

I'm not even sold that the Blues view the Buch-at-center thing as an experiment for whether hus future is at center. The public comments suggest that, but it sounds a lot better to frame it that way than it does to say "we really suck at center after Robert Thomas. We know that Buch isn't as good there as he is on the wing, but we just need him to do the best he can there for a while until we can improve the position."

I wouldn't be at all surprised if the team and player have discussed this as an imperfect and temporary solution with the intention to slide him back to wing the instant someone else makes even a plausible case to be a long term 2C. That would be in line with all the reports that extension talks were focused on us selling him a long-term plan.

One reason to extend a guy like Buch (even though his prime doesn't perfectly align with the core) is to use him to help bring young guys along. Often that comes in the form of making them line mates. But it can also come in the form of making the vet eat the non-ideal minutes that you don't want youth playing yet. I think Buch at C is probably an example of the latter much more than a true experiment to see if he's in the plans to play center long term.

I view this year as a bridge year to contention and I think that Buch at center is just part of that bridge.

 

[bleedblue1223]

Agree with pretty much everything in your post, but wanted to discuss the bolded.

I'm not even sold that the Blues view the Buch-at-center thing as an experiment for whether hus future is at center. The public comments suggest that, but it sounds a lot better to frame it that way than it does to say "we really suck at center after Robert Thomas. We know that Buch isn't as good there as he is on the wing, but we just need him to do the best he can there for a while until we can improve the position."

I wouldn't be at all surprised if the team and player have discussed this as an imperfect and temporary solution with the intention to slide him back to wing the instant someone else makes even a plausible case to be a long term 2C. That would be in line with all the reports that extension talks were focused on us selling him a long-term plan.

One reason to extend a guy like Buch (even though his prime doesn't perfectly align with the core) is to use him to help bring young guys along. Often that comes in the form of making them line mates. But it can also come in the form of making the vet eat the non-ideal minutes that you don't want youth playing yet. I think Buch at C is probably an example of the latter much more than a true experiment to see if he's in the plans to play center long term.

I view this year as a bridge year to contention and I think that Buch at center is just part of that bridge.

Agreed, I think that's exactly how they see it. In an ideal world, this is how I view the situation. This season, you try and pair Schenn, Buchnevich, and Bolduc. Schenn with Buchnevich as a way to share center duties, and those 2 vets to help bring Bolduc along. On paper, it makes a lot of sense, we'll see how it plays out. And for next season, I could see an ideal plan of Dvorsky at C with Buchnevich on his wing, where they can share center duties and Buch helps bring him along.

I think it gives us the flexibility to move him to wing if someone like Dvorsky performs at a level at some point where he demands the 2nd line center spot. If we signed Chandler Stephenson to the contract that he got, we'd just be creating unnecessary and expensive roadblocks.

And I do really like the idea that we have 3 youngish players in Neighbours, Bolduc, and Holloway being able to be the 3rd part to their line and they are each with players with pretty solid track records. Lines will change, but I do like the initial plans. I think it's very intentional to both develop those younger players, but also be in a position to compete.

 

[Reality Czech]

Yeah, maybe legit is overstated. He's played center in his career, for sure, but not at the rate that could be considered legit. I like him, too, but maybe just got a little excited. I'll put down my actuarial Ouija board now. Thank you.

EDIT: What the heck was I thinking by wanting to bring in a 31 y/o player? Glad I'm not the GM. Excitement makes me do goofy things.

I'm just kidding, I don't think it's a bad idea in theory. But I don't expect any significant trades in the foreseeable future.

 

[LGB]

I think it’s very possible Buch ends up being a good center

 

[BlueDream]

Seeing that list of unavailable draft picks gives me pause. Sure we did a great job filling out our depth, but if we end up needing a #2/3C and a #1D, we don’t have a ton of supplementary draft capital.

We may recoup a couple picks when we eventually move Saad. We will also still have plenty to trade when it comes to prospects and future 1sts.

Not to mention, I’m not expecting to have a lot of holes after Dvorsky, Snuggerud and Lindstein hopefully fill some of those. I’m not too worried about it, we used those picks to accelerate our re-tool.

I think it’s very possible Buch ends up being a good center

I agree, people need to give him more of a chance. He seems super dedicated on improving his faceoffs and Steve Ott is one of the best guys to practice with and learn from. He has helped many members of our team on that exact skill.

And I just love Buch’s attitude of putting the team first and playing wherever we need him. The guy just wants to win and is truly a team player. I love that we kept him around, I have to think it boosted the morale of that locker room.

 

[ChicagoBlues]

View attachment 911085

I'm just kidding, I don't think it's a bad idea in theory. But I don't expect any significant trades in the foreseeable future.

Hi everyone!

My name is CB and I'm a serial poster.

Hi CB!

God, grant me the serenity.....

 

[TurgPavs]

On Snuggy. Since 2000, the Blues have drafted nearly 40 players, who have gone on to play college hockey. There is only 1 Blues Draft pick who spent 2+ years in a college program, that made the immediate jump to the NHL, and stuck without spending any time in the AHL, and that was TJ Oshie.

CP55, Schwartz, Stempy, all made the jump after spending a short time in the AHL.

Here is hoping Snuggy can make the jump next season straight to the NHL, however the Blues have 10 forwards under contract for next season, 2 additional forwards that will be RFA's, Neighbors and Torp, as well as prospects like Dvorsky, Dean, Bolduc, and others who will have had the experience of playing in the AHL this season.......IMO its going to be tough for Snuggy to come in and grab a top 6 or even top 9 role.......unless trades are made.

 

[Brian39]

On Snuggy. Since 2000, the Blues have drafted nearly 40 players, who have gone on to play college hockey. There is only 1 Blues Draft pick who spent 2+ years in a college program, that made the immediate jump to the NHL, and stuck without spending any time in the AHL, and that was TJ Oshie.

CP55, Schwartz, Stempy, all made the jump after spending a short time in the AHL.

Here is hoping Snuggy can make the jump next season straight to the NHL, however the Blues have 10 forwards under contract for next season, 2 additional forwards that will be RFA's, Neighbors and Torp, as well as prospects like Dvorsky, Dean, Bolduc, and others who will have had the experience of playing in the AHL this season.......IMO its going to be tough for Snuggy to come in and grab a top 6 or even top 9 role.......unless trades are made.

Schwartz made the jump straight into the NHL. He played a handful of NHL games in 2011/12 immediately following the end of his college year. His AHL time in 2012/13 was just because the NHL locked the players out and he was eligible to play in the AHL instead of sitting and doing nothing.

I'm not sold that Parayko's AHL time was based on perceived lack of readiness. Due to his age, his ELC was only 2 years. When he left school following his 3rd season, we sent him to the AHL on an amateur tryout deal rather than burning a year of his ELC to play him for 10-15 NHL games. I think that was a business move more than it was an assessment that he wasn't capable of jumping from the NCAA to the NHL. We were also a top 5 team in the NHL and were probably less eager to insert a rookie into the lineup than we will be this year.

Edit: I do believe that we will see a trade (or more) in the next 12 months to open up spots for incoming prospects. Schenn, Saad, Leddy, Faulk, and Krug all see their full NTCs become limited NTCs next summer. Army structured that group of guys to become easier to move in the summer of 2025 and nothing about the last 2 years tells me that he is more married to those guys than when he signed them. I will be very surprised if Saad is here in 12 months. I will also be surprised if both of M Joseph and Texier are here next year.

 

[Frenzy31]

Schwartz made the jump straight into the NHL. He played a handful of NHL games in 2011/12 immediately following the end of his college year. His AHL time in 2012/13 was just because the NHL locked the players out and he was eligible to play in the AHL instead of sitting and doing nothing.

I'm not sold that Parayko's AHL time was based on perceived lack of readiness. Due to his age, his ELC was only 2 years. When he left school following his 3rd season, we sent him to the AHL on an amateur tryout deal rather than burning a year of his ELC to play him for 10-15 NHL games. I think that was a business move more than it was an assessment that he wasn't capable of jumping from the NCAA to the NHL. We were also a top 5 team in the NHL and were probably less eager to insert a rookie into the lineup than we will be this year.

Edit: I do believe that we will see a trade (or more) in the next 12 months to open up spots for incoming prospects. Schenn, Saad, Leddy, Faulk, and Krug all see their full NTCs become limited NTCs next summer. Army structured that group of guys to become easier to move in the summer of 2025 and nothing about the last 2 years tells me that he is more married to those guys than when he signed them. I will be very surprised if Saad is here in 12 months. I will also be surprised if both of M Joseph and Texier are here next year.

Why? Especially Texier?

 

[Brian39]

Why? Especially Texier?

Texier and Joseph were low/no risk guys where you hope a change of scenery can lead to an improvement of play. I don't think that either has a ceiling higher than 'good middle 6 contributor' and I think it is pretty unlikely that both of them reach that ceiling.

Thomas, Kyrou, and Buch will 100% be ahead of them on the depth chart at the end of this season. Neighbours, Bolduc, and Snuggy's development is 100% more important to the organization long term than Texier/Joseph and all of them should be getting an extended NHL top 9 look by October of 2025. Schenn's contract and the C on his jersey ensures that he is here for the foreseeable future and he's going to be in the top 9.

I'm very comfortable predicting that the organization will prioritize getting those 7 into the top 9 in 2025/26 over keeping both Joseph and Texier.

Then you have Holloway, who required a greater asset cost to bring in than Texier/Joseph. He is noticeably younger, he has a noticeably better draft pedigree, and the early results see the coaching staff playing him higher in the lineup. Texier/Joseph have a lot of work to do to pass him up in our organizational plans.

That gives me 8 guys who I expect to be ahead of Texier/Joseph in the team's plans for 2025/26. And that is assuming we trade Saad AND before the potential of Dvorsky/Dean or an outside acquisition coming in to address center depth.

At the end of the day, Joseph and Texier were extremely low risk acquisitions that addressed an immediate depth issue and offered upside to join the team's medium-term plans. They were both acquired before we had any confidence of landing Holloway and at least one should be able to return a draft pick at the deadline/draft/summer (potentially requiring the team to retain salary). Having one of them force themselves into the medium-term plans while moving the other would be a damn good outcome.

But I just don't see a scenario where both force their way into the team's medium-term plans. If I were betting, I'd guess that Joseph is the one who gets moved. But it is certainly a reasonable possibility that Joseph outplays Texier or that we move Texier instead of Joseph because he returns a better trade package.

 

[simon IC]

Is anyone else concerned about Texier's defensive play? (Or lack thereof). I know it's early yet, but he really needs to settle down and focus.

 

[Linkens Mastery]

Is anyone else concerned about Texier's defensive play? (Or lack thereof). I know it's early yet, but he really needs to settle down and focus.

Yes, but I was also worried about Buchnevich's defensive play last game as well. I'm going to give it about 10 games. But if that line stays the same for a long period of time and Kyrou continues to be the best defensive player on that line I'm going to be very very worried.

 

[SirPaste]

Is anyone else concerned about Texier's defensive play? (Or lack thereof). I know it's early yet, but he really needs to settle down and focus.

Not concerned after 1 game no, but a month from now if he isn't settled than it might be time to be concerned. I thought his play really improved throughout the game as well, he looked bad at the beginning but settled into it and I thought was fine later on. I am not reading too much into his first and only game played so far.

 

[ChicagoBlues]

Is anyone else concerned about Texier's defensive play? (Or lack thereof). I know it's early yet, but he really needs to settle down and focus.

Yes, his first period was atrocious, but he settled down, for sure. He was skating around Kostin-like and it made me very nervous. Seemed like a lot of nervous energy needed to course through.

His pass on the 3rd goal was a beauty and required a calm touch. Nice finish. I'll be monitoring his toolbox.

 

[TurgPavs]

Schwartz made the jump straight into the NHL. He played a handful of NHL games in 2011/12 immediately following the end of his college year. His AHL time in 2012/13 was just because the NHL locked the players out and he was eligible to play in the AHL instead of sitting and doing nothing.

I'm not sold that Parayko's AHL time was based on perceived lack of readiness. Due to his age, his ELC was only 2 years. When he left school following his 3rd season, we sent him to the AHL on an amateur tryout deal rather than burning a year of his ELC to play him for 10-15 NHL games. I think that was a business move more than it was an assessment that he wasn't capable of jumping from the NCAA to the NHL. We were also a top 5 team in the NHL and were probably less eager to insert a rookie into the lineup than we will be this year.

Edit: I do believe that we will see a trade (or more) in the next 12 months to open up spots for incoming prospects. Schenn, Saad, Leddy, Faulk, and Krug all see their full NTCs become limited NTCs next summer. Army structured that group of guys to become easier to move in the summer of 2025 and nothing about the last 2 years tells me that he is more married to those guys than when he signed them. I will be very surprised if Saad is here in 12 months. I will also be surprised if both of M Joseph and Texier are here next year.

The Blues are going to have a hard time moving the last 3 years of Schenn's contract at 6.5. IMO he is here for the duration of that contract.
The Blues dont have anyone to take on top 4 minutes next season, going to be tough moving Faulk and Leddy, unless they plan on targeting a guy in UFA.
Krugs career maybe over.
If the Blues are out of playoff contention, sure maybe they try and move Saad, Faska, Joseph, Texier, Kappy, and Sunny.
None of those players are essential for the rebuild that is going on.

However the fan base

Schwartz made the jump straight into the NHL. He played a handful of NHL games in 2011/12 immediately following the end of his college year. His AHL time in 2012/13 was just because the NHL locked the players out and he was eligible to play in the AHL instead of sitting and doing nothing.

I'm not sold that Parayko's AHL time was based on perceived lack of readiness. Due to his age, his ELC was only 2 years. When he left school following his 3rd season, we sent him to the AHL on an amateur tryout deal rather than burning a year of his ELC to play him for 10-15 NHL games. I think that was a business move more than it was an assessment that he wasn't capable of jumping from the NCAA to the NHL. We were also a top 5 team in the NHL and were probably less eager to insert a rookie into the lineup than we will be this year.

Edit: I do believe that we will see a trade (or more) in the next 12 months to open up spots for incoming prospects. Schenn, Saad, Leddy, Faulk, and Krug all see their full NTCs become limited NTCs next summer. Army structured that group of guys to become easier to move in the summer of 2025 and nothing about the last 2 years tells me that he is more married to those guys than when he signed them. I will be very surprised if Saad is here in 12 months. I will also be surprised if both of M Joseph and Texier are here next year.

I think Army will be in a tough position is he wants to move out Schenn. That contract is not aging very well.

There are a handful of forwards that could be moved at the TDL, if the season doesnt go well, starting with Sunny, Kappy, Texier, Faska, Joseph, and of course Saad. However I dont see Saad agreeing to be moved until the NTC goes to Modified next July 1.

Iam not sure any forward outside of Saad is going to bring a whole lot of value, unless they play extremely well this season, and in that case, why move them?

I question if Snuggy will be able to make the jump straight into the NHL and into a Top 6 role.
Last Season Minnesota Returned 16 players from their 22-23 roster, the biggest names that didn't return where Snuggy's linemates, Cooley and Knies as well at Defensemen Brock Faber.
IMO Snuggy's numbers benefitted greatly from those linemates as well as Faber.

The whole situation this summer with his dad "Advisor" getting involved seemed odd. The mystic of Snuggy has grown to Ty Rattie Level.
Both Snuggy and Rattie where ranked 30-40 in the prospect rankings, 2-3 years after their draft year. Both players where said to have great shots, both surrounded by great talent in Junior's or College.
Hopefully Snuggy's size and game will transition to the NHL, however I can see Snuggy needing some time in the A before making the jump.

 

[BleedBlue14]

The Blues are going to have a hard time moving the last 3 years of Schenn's contract at 6.5. IMO he is here for the duration of that contract.
The Blues dont have anyone to take on top 4 minutes next season, going to be tough moving Faulk and Leddy, unless they plan on targeting a guy in UFA.
Krugs career maybe over.
If the Blues are out of playoff contention, sure maybe they try and move Saad, Faska, Joseph, Texier, Kappy, and Sunny.
None of those players are essential for the rebuild that is going on.

However the fan base

I think Army will be in a tough position is he wants to move out Schenn. That contract is not aging very well.

There are a handful of forwards that could be moved at the TDL, if the season doesnt go well, starting with Sunny, Kappy, Texier, Faska, Joseph, and of course Saad. However I dont see Saad agreeing to be moved until the NTC goes to Modified next July 1.

Iam not sure any forward outside of Saad is going to bring a whole lot of value, unless they play extremely well this season, and in that case, why move them?

Removed the Snuggerud part because I don't fully disagree that there's risk there, but there is with any prospect.

Wanted to touch on the Schenn part being hard to move. While I don't think you could expect a substantial return for Schenn I think that there are alot of teams looking to move out from the rebuilding phase going towards contending that could benefit and would like to add a guy like Schenn. The issue at hand is we are also in that spot. We don't really need the cap space, we've proven with Steen that a guy like that can still be rostered in a contention window and does add value. I don't really forsee them moving on from Schenn, but I do think eventually they're going to have to remove the captaincy from him and hand it over to Thomas. Your guess is as good as mine about how that plays out, and honestly with Steen taking over, there's a possibility it doesn't play out. it just seems like a rather logical move.

I think the most logical player to move is Saad, and i'm not really sure the organization cares about stockpiling the prospect pool as much as they did the last couple of years. In terms of his clause, I think it would be fairly easy if it got to the point to convince him that moving to a contender is a better career move for him than staying here for a year and a half to have his ice time limited because we need to see this younger core getting meaningful minutes.

The other players you listed, save Faulk/Leddy which I don't think they'd be someone that we would move, aren't really too meaningful in terms of where we want to be in the next couple of years. They were all pretty low risk bets. I don't think you'd see the Blues moving out Sunny, but instead moving him into an extra forward role, which for the player may not be the best situation, but at least he's still here where he wanted to be.

 

[ChicagoBlues]

I agree with @TurgPavs. I am not sold on Snuggerud. He must carry the entire team this season as the clear #1 Captain in order for me to start feeling Snuggly. Also, I hope his dad doesn't interfere.

 

[Reality Czech]

I agree with @TurgPavs. I am not sold on Snuggerud. He must carry the entire team this season as the clear #1 Captain in order for me to start feeling Snuggly. Also, I hope his dad doesn't interfere.

What will we get? The Snuggly part or the Rude part? Time will tell. Trying to predict how prospects will do is almost like throwing darts at the wall. Will he be more like Kyrou, Bolduc or (gulp) Rattie?

Regarding Schenn, I can't see them moving him any time soon. He's a big part of the culture and locker room and I am willing to bet he isn't interested in going anywhere. Saad will almost certainly be moved, but much more likely next season and not this one. Unless he really, really wants to stay and then he could sign a low-dollar team friendly deal to stick around in the bottom six.

 

[ChicagoBlues]

What will we get? The Snuggly part or the Rude part? Time will tell. Trying to predict how prospects will do is almost like throwing darts at the wall. Will he be more like Kyrou, Bolduc or (gulp) Rattie?

Yep! As much as we try to predict future behavior, it is almost impossible to know how a prospect will develop or perform in the NHL They have to be one of those can't miss, generational types, I guess. Rattie looked great with the Wolves for about two periods and then faded fast.