Blue Jays GDT: 2023 v9 | Thu, Aug 24 | @ BAL | 7:00pm ET/4:00pm PT | Berrios vs Gibson

[MK78]

Even the errors aside, not a good start for Gausman.

 

[dredeye]

Ya by one run.

Reading through the last page's comments one would think the Jays are losing by 10+ runs. The amount of pissing and moaning is ridiculous.

You just have to give it time lol. They are losing because of terrible fundamentals. Poorly managed team that is playing as such

 

[shaner8989]

Just get Espinal off the team. Guys a disgrace. He’s killing the team.

 

[CherryToke]

Once Bo is back I don’t want to see Espinal in a game unless it’s as a pinch runner in late innings. He shouldn’t be out there and he shouldn’t be hitting

He can't run either. Looks like he has something wedged up his butt

 

[mikeyz]

Espinal is the only really backup 3rd baseman on the roster.

Yeah their depth outside of their starters is very very thin at best.

 

[red devil]

Well after that loss it is time to take quote from a another coach

We are onto Cincinnati, nothing about the past, nothing about the future right now we are preparing for Cincinnati

 

[Puckstuff]

Yeah their depth outside of their starters is very very thin at best.

The depth is fine. So much so that we have guys like Clement and Horowitz stuck in the minors. If anything, the depth is this teams strength imo. Espinal and Dejong are just in major ruts. And with Bichette and Chapman back soon (hopefully Friday) they should be back to the bench.

 

[Hellcat]

You just have to give it time lol. They are losing because of terrible fundamentals. Poorly managed team that is playing as such

That has been the story of this year not executing on fundamentals, the amount of needless base running mistakes, poorly executed pitch selection, poorly executed game plan with RISP, their super star hitter couldn't identify a ball/strike if his life depended on it. I can handle mistakes related to hustle but mistakes related to your head is up your ass, unacceptable.

That throwing error last night that put the Phils up 5-4 was a head up your ass error, even if we acknowledge that it was a shitty throw, a gold glove 1st baseman should have caught that one hop. Without Vlad's dugout dance partners he's is a shell of the player he was and should be.

 

[Nineteen67]

With 42 games remaining they‘re still on pace for 88-92 wins.

 

[Da Cool Rula]

I know Atkins got DeJong as an emergency from the Bichette injury, but boy is he a worthless pickup. Zero idea at the plate

Wonder if the hitting coach can help? Wait? Do we even have one?

 

[Da Cool Rula]

With 42 games remaining they‘re still on pace for 88-92 wins.

There's just no urgency with this team

 

[TheTotalPackage]

With 42 games remaining they‘re still on pace for 88-92 wins.

That's a solid win total in the grand scheme of things, but wouldn't that be considered a disappointing season for this group? There was talk they'd be pushing 100 wins this year. Don't think matching last year's win total will show much in the progression of this team.

 

[metafour]

That's a solid win total in the grand scheme of things, but wouldn't that be considered a disappointing season for this group? There was talk they'd be pushing 100 wins this year. Don't think matching last year's win total will show much in the progression of this team.

Of course it's a disappointment, but go take a look at how many wins Manoah, Kirk, Springer, and Vlad were worth last season versus this season. That's your difference right there.

 

[Nineteen67]

There's just no urgency with this team

That's a solid win total in the grand scheme of things, but wouldn't that be considered a disappointing season for this group? There was talk they'd be pushing 100 wins this year. Don't think matching last year's win total will show much in the progression of this team.

They are what we thought they were.

 

[McFly2544]

As frustrating as this year has been, Jays are 7th in MLB

When you watch every game you’re witnessing ALL of the ups and downs

this is a really great team…just unlucky with RISP

the improved pitching, especially bullpen and overall defence will be HUGE down the stretch and into the playoffs

I think we’ll see a run when Bo, Kiermier, Jansen, Chapman get healthy and Richards and Green added to BP

 

[Hellcat]

Wonder if the hitting coach can help? Wait? Do we even have one?

Is there any chance he comes back next year?

 

[mikeyz]

Is there any chance he comes back next year?

If we miss the playoffs. Not a chance.

The depth is fine. So much so that we have guys like Clement and Horowitz stuck in the minors. If anything, the depth is this teams strength imo. Espinal and Dejong are just in major ruts. And with Bichette and Chapman back soon (hopefully Friday) they should be back to the bench.

Then how do you explain DeJong in the lineup right now??

Clement and Horowitz are not MLB ready.

 

[The Nemesis]

Another stupid Apple game on friday. Boo.

 

[Eyedea]

If we miss the playoffs. Not a chance.


Then how do you explain DeJong in the lineup right now??

Clement and Horowitz are not MLB ready.

They’re absolutely ready but they aren’t going to get playing time up here. Horwitz because he’s blocked by Vlad/Belt and Clement because Schneider doesn’t trust his defence.

DeJong’s been hilariously awful. Really Brad Handing it out there but he’ll also get stapled to the bench or possibly even cut with Bichette being ready. He’s only getting playing time right now because both Bo/Chappy have been out of the lineup and Schneider isn’t putting Biggio or Davis at 3B.

 

[Hellcat]

Then how do you explain DeJong in the lineup right now??

Defence, defence, defence.

His bat is horrendous, his Outs Above Average is elite (94%)

 

[Puckstuff]

They’re absolutely ready but they aren’t going to get playing time up here. Horwitz because he’s blocked by Vlad/Belt and Clement because Schneider doesn’t trust his defence.

DeJong’s been hilariously awful. Really Brad Handing it out there but he’ll also get stapled to the bench or possibly even cut with Bichette being ready. He’s only getting playing time right now because both Bo/Chappy have been out of the lineup and Schneider isn’t putting Biggio or Davis at 3B.

It would be nice to see what Horwitz could do at the MLB level so we see if we have a Belt replacement in 23-24, but we just can’t get him AB’s this year with 1B/DH set. Then we have a million back up 2B’s and most of these guys can play corner outfield. Jansen/Kirk at C. CF we have KK and Varsho. So really only back up SS/3B is thin… but that’s just because Espinal is oddly brutal this year. Overall this team is the definition of deep.

 

[tmlfan98]

Espinal is the only really backup 3rd baseman on the roster.

I'd prefer Clement as the backup 3B over Espinal when Bo is back. If Bo didn't get hurt before the deadline it's possible Espinal would have already been optioned a while ago, as his only utility to the team during this time has been splitting SS time with DeJong, plus Clement can actually PH vs LHP.

Some have said maybe DeJong could also be the backup 3B, and while it is his natural position, he hasn't played it since 2016 when he was in AA. In 2017 when he was promoted to AAA he switched to SS after only playing 11 games total there in the lower levels of the minors, and has only player there (or some 2B) since then.

Something else that I don't like about the bench construction, and I said this before the Schneider callup was made official and basically foreshadowed it, but Schneider and Biggio both being on the roster was just going to make the other Schneider misuse them.

The funniest/saddest thing about Biggio is that even if I'm as generous as possible to his season splits, there's no way he should have been playing over Schneider while KK was out. If I remove Biggio's only month where his wRC+ was under 100 (April), since May 6th (because I'm being even more generous and removing Biggio's first 6 PA of May when he had a wRC+ of 26 in the Boston series) Biggio has accumulated only 0.7 fWAR in 155 PA despite having a wRC+ of 129.

Since August has been Biggio's hottest month of the season I can be even more generous to his splits and look at only the August numbers for both players, and I'll even ignore his 1st PA of the month when he did nothing in a PH appearance on the August 3rd game of the Baltimore series. Since August 4th (also when Schneider was called up), Biggio has only 0.3 fWAR in 36 PA despite having a wRC+ of 159! Compared to Schneider who already has 0.6 fWAR in 32 career PA so far, there is no way Biggio should have been playing 2B over him while KK was out. Biggio's defense is so bad at any position other than 1B that it's the only position he's played this season where he's been a positive fWAR player, despite only having 13 appearances there this season compared to his 55 appearances combined at 2B/RF.

If the other Schneider continues to do what he started doing before Kiermaier got hurt (playing Varsho more in CF and Whit more in LF), Schneider would be way more useful in Biggio's roster spot slotting in at 2B. Despite how bad DeJong has been so far, I think he keeps the backup SS spot over Espinal too because Espinal's declining defense was the secondary reason for acquiring DeJong. I believe Blair and Barker have said when discussing why the FO felt the DeJong trade was necessary, they were apparently told by team sources that Espinal wouldn't be trusted to play SS every day anymore in the event of a Bo injury.

Also goes to show how bad DeJong has been so far too, that towards the end of Bo's IL stint they started getting Espinal some SS reps every other game even though they were originally trying to avoid this. The only way DeJong might get cut is if the team would be comfortable with a Barger/Espinal SS platoon in the event of another Bo injury.

 

[Discoverer]

I'd prefer Clement as the backup 3B over Espinal when Bo is back. If Bo didn't get hurt before the deadline it's possible Espinal would have already been optioned a while ago, as his only utility to the team during this time has been splitting SS time with DeJong, plus Clement can actually PH vs LHP.

Some have said maybe DeJong could also be the backup 3B, and while it is his natural position, he hasn't played it since 2016 when he was in AA. In 2017 when he was promoted to AAA he switched to SS after only playing 11 games total there in the lower levels of the minors, and has only player there (or some 2B) since then.

Something else that I don't like about the bench construction, and I said this before the Schneider callup was made official and basically foreshadowed it, but Schneider and Biggio both being on the roster was just going to make the other Schneider misuse them.

The funniest/saddest thing about Biggio is that even if I'm as generous as possible to his season splits, there's no way he should have been playing over Schneider while KK was out. If I remove Biggio's only month where his wRC+ was under 100 (April), since May 6th (because I'm being even more generous and removing Biggio's first 6 PA of May when he had a wRC+ of 26 in the Boston series) Biggio has accumulated only 0.7 fWAR in 155 PA despite having a wRC+ of 129.

Since August has been Biggio's hottest month of the season I can be even more generous to his splits and look at only the August numbers for both players, and I'll even ignore his 1st PA of the month when he did nothing in a PH appearance on the August 3rd game of the Baltimore series. Since August 4th (also when Schneider was called up), Biggio has only 0.3 fWAR in 36 PA despite having a wRC+ of 159! Compared to Schneider who already has 0.6 fWAR in 32 career PA so far, there is no way Biggio should have been playing 2B over him while KK was out. Biggio's defense is so bad at any position other than 1B that it's the only position he's played this season where he's been a positive fWAR player, despite only having 13 appearances there this season compared to his 55 appearances combined at 2B/RF.

If the other Schneider continues to do what he started doing before Kiermaier got hurt (playing Varsho more in CF and Whit more in LF), Schneider would be way more useful in Biggio's roster spot slotting in at 2B. Despite how bad DeJong has been so far, I think he keeps the backup SS spot over Espinal too because Espinal's declining defense was the secondary reason for acquiring DeJong. I believe Blair and Barker have said when discussing why the FO felt the DeJong trade was necessary, they were apparently told by team sources that Espinal wouldn't be trusted to play SS every day anymore in the event of a Bo injury.

Also goes to show how bad DeJong has been so far too, that towards the end of Bo's IL stint they started getting Espinal some SS reps every other game even though they were originally trying to avoid this. The only way DeJong might get cut is if the team would be comfortable with a Barger/Espinal SS platoon in the event of another Bo injury.

I know Schneider has looked excellent and the defensive numbers for Biggio look pretty bad, but I have no problem giving more playing time to Biggio when he's been playing at a ~3 WAR pace over the last 3+ months (and played at that same pace last year). They're an elite defensive team that need a bit of help on offense, and Biggio has been providing it for a while now.

 

[Tufted Titmouse]

As frustrating as this year has been, Jays are 7th in MLB

When you watch every game you’re witnessing ALL of the ups and downs

this is a really great team…just unlucky with RISP

the improved pitching, especially bullpen and overall defence will be HUGE down the stretch and into the playoffs

I think we’ll see a run when Bo, Kiermier, Jansen, Chapman get healthy and Richards and Green added to BP

Who gives a shit about 7th in the MLB. We're 1 game up on Seattle for the 3rd wild card (lol), Seattle sold their closer at the deadline and has had brutal injuries all year. A healthy Seattle is probably 5 games up by now. Meanwhile, we've basically been completely healthy outside a couple short stints.

Brutally dissapointing season, this core was supposed to be so much more. Luckily for them, just getting into the playoffs gives them some small chance of pulling some magic out of their asses and winning a few series on heater.

Better watch out, though. Yankees and Sox wont stay down long, and Baltimore, Houston and Texas are all here to stay.

 

[Eyedea]

Who gives a shit about 7th in the MLB. We're 1 game up on Seattle for the 3rd wild card (lol), Seattle sold their closer at the deadline and has had brutal injuries all year. A healthy Seattle is probably 5 games up by now. Meanwhile, we've basically been completely healthy outside a couple short stints.

Brutally dissapointing season, this core was supposed to be so much more. Luckily for them, just getting into the playoffs gives them some small chance of pulling some magic out of their asses and winning a few series on heater.

Better watch out, though. Yankees and Sox wont stay down long, and Baltimore, Houston and Texas are all here to stay.

Outside of Ray who have they really been missing? And is he a bigger loss than Manoah’s been a disappointment?