Buffalo Bills 2023 Summer - Post-Draft and Pre-Camp Talk

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What position do you want the Bills to draft round 1?

  • RB

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • WR

    Votes: 15 22.1%
  • TE

    Votes: 7 10.3%
  • OL

    Votes: 11 16.2%
  • DE

    Votes: 2 2.9%
  • DL

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • LB

    Votes: 7 10.3%
  • CB

    Votes: 2 2.9%
  • S

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Trade out of first round

    Votes: 24 35.3%

  • Total voters
    68
  • Poll closed .
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Kincaid is obviously not Travis Kelce and I’m not making this a comparison of talent levels, but Kincaid has the ability, like Kelce, of sliding into open areas. It is Bease-like. That said, if you wanted somebody to fill that role, Josh Downs was the obvious choice.
I know he didn't do it much in college, but I wonder if they think Kincaid can play out wide too (in addition to the slot and in-line), a la Kelce. That diversity may be why they had him over guys like Downs and Dell, who they may view as pure slot guys.
 
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I wouldn’t mind a long term pick at WR or G. Mingo or one of the guards would continue to add talent to important positions

But I don’t expect those guards to last to us
I doubt the Bills see the need at OG.

With Bates and McGovern as likely starters and Edwards and Boettger behind them, they likely feel set there.

If they do go IOL, I am thinking more like a C with G flexibility on Day 3 like Patterson.



At 6'5" 306 he does fit the size prototype for what the Bills like at C & G.

:dunno:
 
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I disagree on DT, especially if they go with Milano-Bernard-Johnson as their 2nd level in '23. If they are that small, they need to beef up at DT, IMO.

A day 2 pick at DT like Benton or Dexter or Ika would be an upgrade over Settle and Philips and give you at least one DT signed beyond '23. And with how they like rotating DTs and could really use an upgrade behind DQ as evidenced by the Cincy playoff game, I would be all about a DT pick.
They have four capable DTs on the roster. I know none of them are signed beyond the year - but deal with that next offseason.

If anything - the thing they need to add is a true 1T/0T - particularly with a small second level vs the run. But that type of player is your traditional day 3 pick IMO - not day 2. Ika is probably the only guy who fits the bill there.

If we're looking to the future - i do like the idea of moving on from Oliver though. I don't see how he fits the long term plan & the cap space opened up by trading him would be more than welcome.
 
I know he didn't do it much in college, but I wonder if they think Kincaid can play both in the slot and out wide (plus in line, of course), a la Kelce. That diversity may be why they had him over guys like Downs and Dell, who they may have viewed as pure slot guys.

Has played most of his snaps from the slot - seems difficult to consider as a strict tight end - more of a jumbo slot player


How he was used in college and translatability to the NFL

He was used from a variety of positions at Utah and ran a wide variety of routes making him maybe the most pro ready TE in this class.
 
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I disagree on DT, especially if they go with Milano-Bernard-Johnson as their 2nd level in '23. If they are that small, they need to beef up at DT, IMO.

A day 2 pick at DT like Benton or Dexter or Ika would be an upgrade over Settle and Philips and give you at least one DT signed beyond '23. And with how they like rotating DTs and could really use an upgrade behind DQ as evidenced by the Cincy playoff game, I would be all about a DT pick.
This. If Bernard is going to be the guy, protecting him with the best interior DL they can put on the field is critical. That's why I thought a guy like Mazi Smith might have been a sleeper pick at 27.

I think they know that as well, which is why I think DT will be the pick if the board falls to them tonight.
 
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They have four capable DTs on the roster. I know none of them are signed beyond the year - but deal with that next offseason.

If anything - the thing they need to add is a true 1T/0T - particularly with a small second level vs the run. But that type of player is your traditional day 3 pick IMO - not day 2. Ika is probably the only guy who fits the bill there.

If we're looking to the future - i do like the idea of moving on from Oliver though. I don't see how he fits the long term plan & the cap space opened up by trading him would be more than welcome.
I do not trust Settle or Phillips to be healthy and impactful in '23 after how last season went. Settle was disappointing and Phillips continued to struggle to be healthy and productive for the bulk of the season. I see DT as a huge need, especially if they go ultra small at LB. They need to keep their LBs clean or they will struggle to stop the run, most likely.

Since the Bills are in win now mode, I think a motivated Ed Oliver in a contract year will be more helpful than the pick and cap space since we are likely past the time in the off season where they would be able to leverage that cap space into a more impactful player.

Especially with the Cards GM throwing cold water on a DHop trade.
 
I know he didn't do it much in college, but I wonder if they think Kincaid can play both in the slot and out wide (plus in line, of course), a la Kelce.
Last year, Kincaid’s snap distribution was 55.1% in the slot, 9.5% wide, and 35.4% inline. I believe that's similar to what the Cover-1 guys said were Kelce's percentages.

 
Brugler on Kincaid:

STRENGTHS: Long, loose athlete with an adequate frame … uses lateral agility and flexible shoulders to quickly release off the line and accelerates into his routes …
outstanding focus to isolate the football and catch the ball cleanly … comfortable adjusting mid-air and expanding his catch radius, showing unwavering trust in his
ball skills … catches well in stride and stays balanced through contact (eight catches of 25-plus yards in 2022) … quickly collects himself to force overpursuit or make
the first man miss (one of only three FBS tight ends with 16-plus forced missed tackles in 2022) … his dynamic speed cuts out of breaks creates interference/holding
calls for the defense … willing and functional run blocker … shows the play speed to fit, hook and seal on cross-formation blocks … received positive character
feedback from his coaches and was a member of Utah’s leadership council … had a career performance versus USC in 2022 with 16 receptions (on 16 targets) and 234
yards – his 16 catches was the most by an FBS player in 2022 … only Georgia’s Brock Bowers had more catches and receiving yards in 2022 among FBS tight ends.

WEAKNESSES: Slender frame for the position and doesn’t have desired bulk … must continue developing his core strength … doesn’t have a strong blocking base and
finds himself upright and off-balance … reaches his landmarks, but his body angles are inconsistent when working up a level or pulling on perimeter runs … messy
pass-pro mechanics, often overextending, dropping his eyes and losing control … penalized four times as a senior (three false starts, one holding) … will round off his
routes and lean into breaks, telegraphing his intentions … missed time as a senior because of multiple injuries, including a shoulder (October 2022) and thoracic injury
(November 2022), which also sidelined him for the Senior Bowl and combine.

SUMMARY: A two-year starter at Utah, Kincaid was an F tight end in offensive coordinator Andy Ludwig’s offense. An FCS transfer, he became the main target in the
Utes’ offense as a senior after Brant Kuithe was injured and led all FBS tight ends in receiving yards (74.2) and receptions (5.8) per game, just ahead of Notre Dame’s
Michael Mayer in both categories (67.4 and 5.6, respectively). With his basketball background, Kincaid has fluid movement skills and flashes the short-area quickness
to open stride and accelerate in and out of his breaks. He is a natural ball winner and shows confidence in his hands, doing most of his damage when catching the ball
on the move (remarkable 35-to-4 touchdown-to-drop ratio in college). Overall, Kincaid is still developing his play strength and consistency as a blocker, but he is an
above-average pass catcher with the burst, body control and ball skills to be a weapon in the slot. He projects as a playmaking “move” tight end in the NFL.

GRADE: 1st Round (No. 20 overall)
 
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Mike Gesicki to Zach Ertz is probably the more reasonable comp range to me.

And I don't know who called him Swole Beasley after the Beane presser calling him a big version of Cole, but that nickname is awesome.

I completely agree with the comparisons. Kelce had a really nasty temperament coming out of college, I don't see that from Kincaid. For what it's worth Zierlein also used Ertz as his pro comparison.

1682686742864.png
 

28. Drew Sanders, LB, Arkansas (6-4, 235)​

A long, lean athlete, Sanders is cunning and agile with the instincts of both an off-ball player and pass rusher. He posted impressive numbers as a first-year starter, but there were too many “almost” tackles on tape, and he left production on the field with his tendency to over-pursue. Overall, Sanders must become a more skilled tackle finisher and take-on player, but he offers intriguing versatility as a “do-everything” front-seven defender thanks to his size and athletic range. He is an ascending player with the talent to be a matchup linebacker and occasional pass rusher in the NFL.

Grade: First-second round

33. BJ Ojulari, Edge, LSU (6-2, 248)​

Similar to his older brother (Azeez), Ojulari is quick, fast and bendy from anywhere on the field, closing with burst or creating movement at contact. He has a collection of pass-rush moves to frame his attack in different ways — his “go-to” is a long-arm that sets up his ghost move — but he can be covered up and give up the edge if he doesn’t win with quickness. Overall, Ojulari doesn’t have ideal size for every scheme, but he offers a dynamic pursuit package with his explosive traits and unrelenting effort. He offers scheme versatility as an NFL starter, projecting best as a stand-up edge rusher for an odd-front defense.

Grade: First-second round

38. Trenton Simpson, LB, Clemson (6-2, 235)​

An impressive size/speed athlete, Simpson plays physically to work off blockers and appears to be moving at a different gear than the rest of the pursuit thanks to his short-area burst and acceleration. Though he plays with urgency, he must show better control as a tackler and improve his coverage awareness to lock down a full-time gig versus NFL skill players. Overall, Simpson must continue developing his play recognition to translate his immense talent into playmaking production, but he is an active ball hunter with the pursuit speed and appetite for contact to fill multiple roles. He projects best in a fast-flowing defense where he can be a run-and-hit backer and handle overhang responsibilities.

Grade: First-second round

43. Joe Tippmann, C, Wisconsin (6-6, 313)​

Tippmann is an athletic blocker who shines on pulls, cutoffs and any move-block that shows off his range and eyes. With his bend and flexibility, he is able to play low for a taller player and generate explosive torque through his hips, but he gets off schedule when his pads rise, often ending up on the ground. Overall, Tippmann must be mindful of his body leverage/balance to match up versus NFL defenders, but his quickness, strength and vision are all plus traits for a starting interior lineman. He projects as an NFL starter (either center or guard), ideally suited for a wide-zone scheme.

Grade: Second round

45. Cody Mauch, G, North Dakota State (6-5, 302)​

Although he wasn’t often challenged on an island in pass protection, Mauch has the foot quickness and body control to comfortably operate in space and skillfully maneuver from block to block. His technical approach needs continued refinement, but he is a sticky blocker in the run game, using his hands to latch, create leverage and reset engagement. Overall, Mauch doesn’t have ideal length or sand in his lower body, but he has outstanding movement skills, fierce handwork and innate competitiveness to become a starter early in his NFL career. He should get a look at tackle first but also projects well inside, reminiscent of Mitch Morse.

Grade: Second round

47. Keion White, Edge, Georgia Tech (6-4, 285)​

White is a rangy mover for his size, capable of spot dropping with running backs or collapsing blocks off the edge with his physical hands. However, he needs to better understand his biomechanics and improve his pass-rush plan, as he prefers to surge into blocks instead of setting them up and countering. Overall, White is still developing his craft and pass-rush technique/instincts, but he is a high-motor height/weight/speed edge player with power as a bull rusher and the mass to anchor versus the run. Similar to Datone Jones, he is a scheme-proof prospect and projects as a rotational base end as an NFL rookie.

Grade: Second round

54. Matthew Bergeron, OT, Syracuse (6-5, 318)​

With his on-field demeanor and approach, Bergeron can generate movement in the run game and control pass rushers when his hands, feet and eyes stay on the same page. However, his inconsistent weight distribution leads to issues in pass pro and he doesn’t have repeatable hands, which were tough issues to mask against the better opponents on the schedule (Clemson, Notre Dame, Florida State). Overall, Bergeron is very efficient in his movements and grades well as a run blocker, but his inconsistent base and hand placement are gateway issues that disrupt his rhythm and ability to finish, especially in space. He has NFL starting talent, although his skills might be maximized inside as a zone-blocking guard.

Grade: Second round

55. Gervon Dexter Sr., DT, Florida (6-5, 310)​

Dexter carries his weight well with impressive foot quickness and pass rush potential, although you wish he had more backfield production to show for it. His impact can be traced to his ability to leverage — he is a very different player when he utilizes his long levers to put blockers on skates as a pass rusher or anchor, stack and work the point in the run game. Dexter must develop a more disciplined approach to turn the flashes into more consistent play, but he is an agile, coordinated big man who has yet to play his best football. He is a traits-based projection who can play up and down the line, which will interest both even and odd fronts.

Grade: Second round

56. Keeanu Benton, DT, Wisconsin (6-3, 309)​

With his push-the-pocket power, Benton consistently resets the line of scrimmage when his pad level is right and plays with the movement skills to get up and down the line of scrimmage. His mediocre college production is a product of his role for the Badgers and his pass-rush potential boosts his draft grade. Benton needs to play with consistent leverage and become a more consistent finisher for the NFL game, but his stout power base and above-average athleticism at his size are outstanding foundation traits. He has the talent to play all over the defensive line as a pro.

Grade: Second round

58. Derick Hall, Edge, Auburn (6-2, 254)​

Only two pounds and nine ounces when he was born, Hall grew into a long, rocked-up defender who wears down blockers with aggressive stabs and speed-to-power moves. He can set a physical edge versus the run, but hints of stiffness leave him tardy to disengage and work off contact. Overall, Hall doesn’t have fully fleshed-out counter maneuvers, but he is an urgent, hard-charging pass rusher with linear athleticism and power in his hands. He will be attractive to multiple schemes and projects as a potential NFL starter, similar to the Denver Broncos’ Jonathan Cooper.

Grade: Second-third round

60. Isaiah Foskey, Edge, Notre Dame (6-5, 264)​

Although his pass-rush plan and move-to-move transitions are undeveloped, Foskey is a tough player to contain because of his revving motor and rangy chase skills up and down the line of scrimmage. He has active hand work but requires time to disengage from sustained blocks once reached, which leads to questions about his position fit. Overall, Foskey needs to be more consistent versus the run and his pass-rush arsenal lacks variety. However, he has promising traits, and his play speed and non-stop hustle raise his floor as an NFL player. He projects an impactful sub-package rusher as a rookie with the talent to develop into a full-time edge rusher.

Grade: Second-third round

Those are some of the potential targets for the Bills on Day Two.


 
I doubt the Bills see the need at OG.

With Bates and McGovern as likely starters and Edwards and Boettger behind them, they likely feel set there.

If they do go IOL, I am thinking more like a C with G flexibility on Day 3 like Patterson.



At 6'5" 306 he does fit the size prototype for what the Bills like at C & G.

:dunno:

I’m pretty confident they don’t see an immediate need at guard either, but I could see a value/future pick there. But your right, center flexibility is more likely
 



Those are some of the potential targets for the Bills on Day Two.



Benton and Ojulari are two of my favorite prospects in the draft, I'm prepared for them to come off the board in the first 5 minutes of Day 2 :laugh:
 
On mobile using app so can't link, but Brugler is mocking us Dawand Jones in the second (over Josh Downs, to many peoples dismay I'm sure) and then Dorian Williams in the 3rd.

I'd be pleased with a Jones/Williams Day 2
 
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On mobile using app so can't link, but Brugler is mocking us Dawand Jones in the second (over Josh Downs, to many peoples dismay I'm sure) and then Dorian Williams in the 3rd.

I'd be pleased with a Jones/Williams Day 2
I posted that a couple posts above yours.

Personally, I wouldn't be thrilled as Jones might be "too big" with less than ideal movement skills for what the Bills like to do with the RT.

And I would rather go with another position than LB as I doubt Williams gives them more than Klein or Bernard in 2023.

I would much rather have DT & DE over Jones and Williams, for instance.

 
I like the pick, Allen needs a slot receiver since they function as his dump offs instead of RB. Round two I would be shocked if it was not DT. OL round 3 and the rest maybe WR DE LB. I doubt Beane drafts all these picks in the original slots.
 
So are folks happy with the TE?
I didn't think they would do it early with Knox and contract tbh, but I understood why they did it. They been chasing TE2 for 5 years now (although I thought they would get a blocking TE if they did go TE later), he creates big matchup issues, he has great hands (Bills high drop rate), runs a good route tree, and does his best work in the middle of the field and seam(slot). My worry is he will be another underused piece with Dorsey that gets lost in the offense and McD's disdain for trusting rookies.
 
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Kincaid is obviously not Travis Kelce and I’m not making this a comparison of talent levels, but Kincaid has the ability, like Kelce, of sliding into open areas. It is Bease-like. That said, if you wanted somebody to fill that role, Josh Downs was the obvious choice.
Except they obviously had a first round grade on Kincaid and not on Downs :laugh:

I like Downs quite a bit, but I think Kincaid brings a lot more to the table.
 
Bruglar had Jones as his #6 OT, and some had him even higher - I think it was Cosell that liked him better than Johnson. He had a cool quote from Nick Herbig in his draft notes:

Wisconsin pass rusher Nick Herbig called Jones the best blocker he faced (Herbig: “That guy is a monster.”)

However, he's also has some flags.

This is also from Bruglar's notes:

SUMMARY: A two-year starter at Ohio State, Jones lined up at right tackle in head coach Ryan Day’s zone/RPO-based offense. Although it took time for his mentality to change from “I’m a basketball player” to “I’m a football player,”

This is from a Steelers media outlet:

1682691520874.png


I personally think it's risky taking guys that don't eat, sleep, and breathe football. It brings back memories of busts like Mike Williams, or even guys that were good but never hit their athletic potential like Ricky Williams.
 

59. BUFFALO BILLS CB DJ TURNER, MICHIGAN

Turner is a unique athlete who has all the traits you could want, boasting excellent movement skills and speed. He's raw and needs a fire lit under him to become a difference-maker in the NFL, but Buffalo would be a perfect fit for that.

Turner over Downs, Bergeron, Ika, and a trio of Edge rushers...

91. BUFFALO BILLS: WR A.T. PERRY, WAKE FOREST

Give Josh Allen another weapon. Anyone not named Stefon Diggs isn't consistent enough at this point and Perry's vertical tree is deadly.

No thanks on this pick, either...
 

BUFFALO BILLS: EDGE DERICK HALL, AUBURN

An impressive athlete at the NFL combine in Indianapolis, Hall would be a good athletic fit for the Bills' defensive line. He won 17.7% of his pass-rushing snaps in 2022 and produced an 82.6 PFF pass-rushing grade.

I will not be upset with a DL pick unless it is an undersized DT.
 
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