Red Sox/MLB 2023 Regular Season VIII - Chaim Bloom FIRED

[Johnnyduke]

Just seems like it's been almost 4 years and if you just test positive can't we just treat it like a cold at this point? Unless he's sick and can't go obv.

My interpretation would be if you get to a point where you are getting tested these days then you probably did so because you have bad symptoms. So at that point they'd probably keep you away from the team for x number of days. Like the flu. But I think we're just not seeing this a lot because for most people the symptoms won't be that bad and they probably aren't even bothering to test for it. I am also assuming Covid season will mimic Flu season on the calendar? Is that accurate? So probably something to watch for in the coming months.

 

[N o o d l e s]

My interpretation would be if you get to a point where you are getting tested these days then you probably did so because you have bad symptoms. So at that point they'd probably keep you away from the team for x number of days. Like the flu. But I think we're just not seeing this a lot because for most people the symptoms won't be that bad and they probably aren't even bothering to test for it.

I wasn't sure if they were even just still doing routine testing.

I wasn't being critical I was actually just a little bit surprised.

 

[EverettMike]

Just seems like it's been almost 4 years and if you just test positive can't we just treat it like a cold at this point? Unless he's sick and can't go obv.

...I'm not doing this.

 

[Johnnyduke]

I wasn't sure if they were even just still doing routine testing.

I wasn't being critical I was actually just a little bit surprised.

Oh I highly doubt anyone is doing routine testing at this point. Certainly not professional sports anyway. I think we're firmly in a spot now where you're only getting tested if you have bad symptoms.

 

[N o o d l e s]

Oh I highly doubt anyone is doing routine testing at this point. Certainly not professional sports anyway. I think we're firmly in a spot now where you're only getting tested if you have bad symptoms.

Ya most likely. I guess no more Michael Jordan flu games lmao

 

[Johnnyduke]

Ya most likely. I guess no more Michael Jordan flu games lmao

Eh that's actually a good point though. To date if an athlete played through the Flu nobody would bat an eye. If it came out that a guy has COVID is he gonna sit out the Super Bowl etc at this point? I wouldn't think so but you could also get scolded into submission and forced to disappear for a few days.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

This isn't what's being reported. Apparently Martin and Kenley were available. So the question is how do you manage the game from the point Sale has to exit. I don't care if Sale gets hurt again. If there's anyone to keep out there and run into the ground it's him. But either way this doesn't appear to be some master plan by Cora to sabotage the game.

If that was all that was available, yes, Cora should have left Sale in.

But he didn't, so I would assume he was still trying to win the game at that point.

And then he wasn't. When they were actually ahead.

 

[DKH]

We're really surprised the bullpen's arms are falling off? They've basically been on mop up duty for 130 games considering the staff (outside of Bello) is usually yanked by the 4th inning

The pitching staff was epically constructed

Just incredible

This was inevitable

Two of the best combo skills and character built for Boston/Fenway Park- Duvall & Turner could be gone in about a month

83-79 could have been 90+ by keeping Nate & Wacha

 

[RoccoF14]

The pitching staff was epically constructed

Just incredible

This was inevitable

Two of the best combo skills and character built for Boston/Fenway Park- Duvall & Turner could be gone in about a month

83-79 could have been 90+ by keeping Nate & Wacha

On a positive note, I think that if you told most Sox fans at the start of the season that they'd be in the Wild Card chase at the end of August, they'd have been satisfied.

Personally, I'm surprised that the Sox bullpen has held up as long as it has. I was expecting the implosion to happen about a month ago.

 

[Johnnyduke]

On a positive note, I think that if you told most Sox fans at the start of the season that they'd be in the Wild Card chase at the end of August, they'd have been satisfied.

At 5.5 out, that's not really in it with a month to go. Not good enough.

 

[DKH]

On a positive note, I think that if you told most Sox fans at the start of the season that they'd be in the Wild Card chase at the end of August, they'd have been satisfied.

Personally, I'm surprised that the Sox bullpen has held up as long as it has. I was expecting the implosion to happen about a month ago.

It’s just frustrating because they managed to spend crazy and go cheap at the same time

The rotation was two broken down vets - Paxton & Sale and Kluber who’s velo way down

Love Kluber - five top five Cy Young finishes but he’s at end

Pivetta

Then 3-4 kids who haven’t pitched over 120 innings and some have had arm issues

BELLO
WHITLOCK
HOUCK
CRAWFORD

the plan should have been no Kluber
Whitlock in pen
Anything from Sale or Paxton found money

2-3 year deals Eovoldi and Wacha

Both consistently get you 6 innings and throw strikes

I’m wanting 83-79 because they need to realize their cheap approach to the rotation cost them

I feel for Bear Claw last night but it seems like it was a Big F U from Cora to Bloom

Bloom fixed the Farm and bullpen

Let’s see about the starting pitchers

He had them right under his nose and he even signed Wacha

 

[McGarnagle]

It’s just frustrating because they managed to spend crazy and go cheap at the same time

The rotation was two broken down vets - Paxton & Sale and Kluber who’s velo way down

Love Kluber - five top five Cy Young finishes but he’s at end

Pivetta

Then 3-4 kids who haven’t pitched over 120 innings and some have had arm issues

BELLO
WHITLOCK
HOUCK
CRAWFORD

the plan should have been no Kluber
Whitlock in pen
Anything from Sale or Paxton found money

2-3 year deals Eovoldi and Wacha

Both consistently get you 6 innings and throw strikes

I’m wanting 83-79 because they need to realize their cheap approach to the rotation cost them

I feel for Bear Claw last night but it seems like it was a Big F U from Cora to Bloom

Bloom fixed the Farm and bullpen

Let’s see about the starting pitchers

He had them right under his nose and he even signed Wacha

Spot on. Rotation is clearly Bloom's weak point.

I've really come to believe that bullpens are dependent on their rotations. If you have a great rotation that gives you 6 plus innings on a regular basis which limits the overuse and exposure of middle relievers, you're most likely to have a great bullpen too. If you have pitchers who can't get out of the 4th and have a designed bullpen game every 5th day, you're going to burn through arms.

So whenever people in here go on about the bLoOm BuLlPeN1!1 I think it's more a consequence of the Bloom Rotation.

Bello is your #1. Paxton's been very good but slowing down from his hot start (might need a rest to reset). Kutter surprisingly serviceable. Sale when healthy okay.

If they just rounded that out by keeping one of Eovaldi or Wacha instead of Kluber, they're probably in a WC spot. if they kept both and had a rotation of Bello-Sale-Eovaldi-Wacha-Paxton-Crawford they're definitely in. That also would let them use Houck in a much more efficient bullpen swingman role and limit exposure on Whitlock and Martin.

Building a pitching staff for the regular season is a math problem. There are 1,458 innings a year plus maybe a dozen for games that go into extras. Maximize the amount of those innings to be thrown by effective pitchers, minimize the amount of innings being eaten by scrubs. With the playoffs and big games I admit the human factor where you need guys with icewater in their veins in big spots. But you've gotta get to October first and this staff was set up to fail.

 

[BigBadBruins7708]

It’s just frustrating because they managed to spend crazy and go cheap at the same time

The rotation was two broken down vets - Paxton & Sale and Kluber who’s velo way down

Love Kluber - five top five Cy Young finishes but he’s at end

Pivetta

Then 3-4 kids who haven’t pitched over 120 innings and some have had arm issues

BELLO
WHITLOCK
HOUCK
CRAWFORD

the plan should have been no Kluber
Whitlock in pen
Anything from Sale or Paxton found money

2-3 year deals Eovoldi and Wacha

Both consistently get you 6 innings and throw strikes

I’m wanting 83-79 because they need to realize their cheap approach to the rotation cost them

I feel for Bear Claw last night but it seems like it was a Big F U from Cora to Bloom

Bloom fixed the Farm and bullpen

Let’s see about the starting pitchers

He had them right under his nose and he even signed Wacha

Honestly, Wacha was the truly infuriating instance of cheapness

He only signed for 4 yr/ 26 m

That's peanuts for a guy who gave you 11-2/3.32/1.11 WHIP in 23 starts last year as a diamond in the rough signing and this year is at 10-2/2.84/1.10 WHIP in 18 starts this year and pretty dependably gave you 6 innings a start

 

[KesselBuiltMyHotrod]

They should have made a stronger push for Senga.

 

[BruinsFanSince94]

Honestly, Wacha was the truly infuriating instance of cheapness

He only signed for 4 yr/ 26 m

That's peanuts for a guy who gave you 11-2/3.32/1.11 WHIP in 23 starts last year as a diamond in the rough signing and this year is at 10-2/2.84/1.10 WHIP in 18 starts this year and pretty dependably gave you 6 innings a start

You wanted Wacha for 4 years?

 

[DKH]

Honestly, Wacha was the truly infuriating instance of cheapness

He only signed for 4 yr/ 26 m

That's peanuts for a guy who gave you 11-2/3.32/1.11 WHIP in 23 starts last year as a diamond in the rough signing and this year is at 10-2/2.84/1.10 WHIP in 18 starts this year and pretty dependably gave you 6 innings a start

Bloom hit on a bunch of guys - Turner, Duvall, Martin, Jansen, Yoshida but his rotation was a major fail and why in the end they will be on the outside

You wanted Wacha for 4 years?

I’d have done 3/27 easy so if he wants 4/26 all the better

 

[BigBadBruins7708]

You wanted Wacha for 4 years?

Yeah, its only age 30-34. Not like you're paying him in his late 30s and at only $6.5m a year. That's throwaway money.

 

[CDJ]

Damn shame Nate didn’t accept the superior offer he was given at the outset of free agency

 

[N o o d l e s]

Bloom hit on a bunch of guys - Turner, Duvall, Martin, Jansen, Yoshida but his rotation was a major fail and why in the end they will be on the outside


I’d have done 3/27 easy so if he wants 4/26 all the better

The way Tampa handles their pitching staff sucks imo. It works for them but it isn’t an appealing model, at least to me anyway. So it doesn’t surprise me Bloom continued that. It just hasn’t worked out the same way.

Part of that is due to there being no remote minor league pitching depth in the org whereas Tampa has is for years and years at every level. That takes time and things are looking up with some of the arms in the low minors. But those aren’t guaranteed so I have no clue how it’s going to go.

 

[Mr Cartmenez]

They should have made a stronger push for Senga.

Senga should have been the priority all along. And this isn't another hindsight thing. Many wanted Senga and thought he was the perfect fit for the team, especially when Wacha and Eovaldi weren't going to be re-signed. And the contract he got wasn't' even egregious at the time. In fact the contract was MUCH better than Yoshidas from day 1 and of today it's not even a debate anymore.

Cora is a proven winner. As a player, as a bench coach and as a manager. And he's a bright guy as well. I would never go that far that as a sportsman he's intentionally losing games, but it must be driving him crazy what Bloom has been doing with this franchise for the past several years. No team is flawless, but building a horrible defensive team means that you are gifting away outs, which leads to pitchers needing to throw more pitches.

 

[RoccoF14]

Spot on. Rotation is clearly Bloom's weak point.

I've really come to believe that bullpens are dependent on their rotations. If you have a great rotation that gives you 6 plus innings on a regular basis which limits the overuse and exposure of middle relievers, you're most likely to have a great bullpen too. If you have pitchers who can't get out of the 4th and have a designed bullpen game every 5th day, you're going to burn through arms.

So whenever people in here go on about the bLoOm BuLlPeN1!1 I think it's more a consequence of the Bloom Rotation.

Bello is your #1. Paxton's been very good but slowing down from his hot start (might need a rest to reset). Kutter surprisingly serviceable. Sale when healthy okay.

If they just rounded that out by keeping one of Eovaldi or Wacha instead of Kluber, they're probably in a WC spot. if they kept both and had a rotation of Bello-Sale-Eovaldi-Wacha-Paxton-Crawford they're definitely in. That also would let them use Houck in a much more efficient bullpen swingman role and limit exposure on Whitlock and Martin.

Building a pitching staff for the regular season is a math problem. There are 1,458 innings a year plus maybe a dozen for games that go into extras. Maximize the amount of those innings to be thrown by effective pitchers, minimize the amount of innings being eaten by scrubs. With the playoffs and big games I admit the human factor where you need guys with icewater in their veins in big spots. But you've gotta get to October first and this staff was set up to fail.

37 Quality Starts this season, tells you all you really need to know.

I agree with your post 100%. @DKH as well, however I don't agree with Bello-Sale-Eovaldi-Wacha-Paxton-Crawford being good enough. But I'm not a Sox fan and don't have a dog in this fight. I AM a baseball guy and do know a thing or 2 about pitching though, so humor me for a second....

Bello isn't a #1 yet. He's made a major step up from last year, and he's finally learned to actually Pitch vs Throw, and use his stuff to set up hitters instead of just going up there and throwing whatever is called and hoping for the best. He's got potential to be a #2-#3 guy in a good rotation, but I don't see him as a true staff ace, until he can show he can be effective against left handed hitters. They are killing him this year.

Sale is done. He can't consistently go above 90 pitches anymore and he's a strikeout guy who throws a lot of pitches per inning. Not a good combination. Get whatever you can for him and move on.

Eovaldi is another #2-#3 guy with durability concerns. Wacha and Paxton are solid middle-bottom of the rotation guys. I actually like Crawford alot. If he can improve his command just a little bit, I think he might be the best of the current bunch.

Bottom line, is the Sox need a legit #1 and probably a #2 rolling into next season if they wanna make some noise in the Post Season.

 

[Chevalier du Clavier]

 

[Johnnyduke]

Surgery for Duran, done for the year. The wake for this season was Mookie shoving it up their ass all weekend and the funeral was last night.

The way Tampa handles their pitching staff sucks imo. It works for them but it isn’t an appealing model, at least to me anyway. So it doesn’t surprise me Bloom continued that. It just hasn’t worked out the same way.

Part of that is due to there being no remote minor league pitching depth in the org whereas Tampa has is for years and years at every level. That takes time and things are looking up with some of the arms in the low minors. But those aren’t guaranteed so I have no clue how it’s going to go.

So this is me just going off prospect rankings but aren't basically all of the Red Sox top prospects position players?

 

[Chevalier du Clavier]

An unusual addition to the, “your momma is so fat” joke.

 

[KesselBuiltMyHotrod]

Senga should have been the priority all along. And this isn't another hindsight thing. Many wanted Senga and thought he was the perfect fit for the team, especially when Wacha and Eovaldi weren't going to be re-signed. And the contract he got wasn't' even egregious at the time. In fact the contract was MUCH better than Yoshidas from day 1 and of today it's not even a debate anymore.

That was the most frustrating part. When I saw the contract all I could think is, that's it? He's already outperformed it by a ton this year. Yoshida, not so much.