HF Habs: 2023 NHL Draft part 2

[SannywithoutCompy]

You were so close but you couldn't see it.

Stenberg looks like a peak early boy.



Smith is as much a C as Michkov is a C.

Hes not a C.

I am extremely confident that Smith plays at C in the NHL

 

[McGees]

As a Reinbacher stan myself.

We do have to be careful on some of these rumors. The Habs didn't know where they were picking for awhile, so it's natural they have done their due diligence on a lot of players they liked in their top 10.

We've heard that they like Reinbacher
We know our WHL scouts have talked extensively with Yager and Benson.
We've heard for awhile that they are fans of Will Smith.
We are also hearing the same of their appreciated for Ryan Leonard.

It's impossible to know which one of those guys are really in their sights at 5, and which may have been due diligence and consideration if they dropped a spot or two.

All this points to ——> picking Dvorsky

 

[Kent Nilsson]

Why do people seem to dissociate Reinbacher and “elite talent” in here ?

 

[Mrb1p]

Why do people seem to dissociate Reinbacher and “elite talent” in here ?

Because people are stupid and dont watch the players they comment on.

 

[WinterLion]

I don't think any team has finalized their picks yet. They are however sending out some smoke and mirrors regarding Michkov.

Why do people seem to dissociate Reinbacher and “elite talent” in here ?

The rankings.

Because people are stupid and dont watch the players they comment on.

ouch but yeah but ouch

 

[WeThreeKings]

All this points to ——> picking Dvorsky

I wouldn't draw that conclusion.

 

[NotProkofievian]

You were so close but you couldn't see it.

Stenberg looks like a peak early boy.

I'm not too down on Oscar, but that's what keeping me from giving him a high ranking. I would definitely pick him, but the price has to be right. Lot of good skaters in this draft.

The thing that I worry about with Stenberg is that he just turns into Janmark, or Johnsson. Some player who looks a lot better than they really are.

 

[SannywithoutCompy]

Because people are stupid and dont watch the players they comment on.

Depends how you define "elite". I don't believe Reinbacher has a single elite skill, but I think he is above average in nearly every area. I think that would have been enough to make him a viable candidate at 1 last year when there were no forwards with elite talent.

I think he has a very good shot to be a Seabrook type, which is great, and we do need a top pairing RD, I just think we are going to have more opportunities to pick someone like that later on and in future years, whereas I don't think we'll have another shot at an elite forward for a while.

Still a good chance he ends up a top 5 player in a redraft, but I'd rather take the gamble on forward talent.

 

[McGees]

I wouldn't draw that conclusion.

That’s the only rumour that hasn’t come out yet man!

 

[badfish]

If Mitchkov is the 2nd best player there must be a chance he goes 2nd. What chaos that would be, especially if McKenzie's survey is right and teams are high on Will Smith.

 

[SOLR]

I can't see Montreal doing that. It sounds like San Jose will select Michkov anyway.
People really need to stop agonizing over this. Michkov is part of the big 4. We're #5.

We missed getting into the Franchise player slot - per usual.

That's means, it's Smith, Leonard or Reinbacher for #5.

Why I'd rather get 2 of the top 12 than 1 if Arizona is desperate for Reinbacher.

Benson+Yager anyone?

*Assuming Toronto keeps Matthews

 

[DramaticGloveSave]

Yep, they are probably in rooms now debating, like we are, on who we love and like and where they should go relative to the rest of the class or their area of expertise.

They are gonna really focus that list in before the combine, and spend as much time watching, talking and meeting with their desired targets at 5.

Then they'll go back with all their information, watch more tape, debate more, talk to the prospects, teammates, coaches, family, friends, and really solidify it all.

And we'll hear information, disinformation, disinformation disguised as information, information disguised as disinformation until the pick is in.

They are actually in a relatively easy spot at 5. Unless they have some elaborate plan to trade up or down (unlikely), they just need a list of 5 names- and 3 are obvious, 4 if you include Michkov. Just need to settle on those other 1/2 names and order them on their board.

Why I'd rather get 2 of the top 12 than 1 if Arizona is desperate for Reinbacher.

Benson+Yager anyone?

Arizona isn’t desperate for a Reinbacher lol

The idea would be they could take their top D at 6 and then let a forward fall to them at 12.

 

[rochab]

There is almost zero chance that HuGo drafts Benson at 5. There will be bigger players available there who also skate better than him. Benson ain't coming here with that pick.

A player who almost every reputable scouting service has in their top 8 all season has an almost "Zero Chance" of being picked at 5???

Once again, Benson's above average hockey intelligence is a very good fit for MSL's system.... Last year HUGO spent 2 of their first 4 picks on players on the smaller side... (Mesar and Hudson) so I don't see the preference for "size" in their drafting history.

 

[SOLR]

Arizona isn’t desperate for a Reinbacher lol

The idea would be they could take their top D at 6 and then let a forward fall to them at 12.

Of course, that's the idea, I didn't say it was what I would do.

 

[Mrb1p]

If Mitchkov is the 2nd best player there must be a chance he goes 2nd. What chaos that would be, especially if McKenzie's survey is right and teams are high on Will Smith.

Yeah that would be nice, but not as nice as having HuGo grow a pair and actually picking Matvei. I wont cry over Fantilli or Carlsson if thats who the Habs get, lol.

Theres an off chance because, technically, Anaheim does have strong centers. MacTavish, Zegras, Lundestrom, Strome, BOG, Gaucher vs Tracey, Terry, Pastujov, Perrault and Comtois

 

[JoelWarlord]

For one Seider, there are many other stories of Ds that were overdrafted in the top 10... Griffin Reinhart, Thomas Hickey, Haydn Fleury, among others.

I don't think any of these guys have much in common with Reinbacher. None of these guys had anything close to his draft year. Not that he's immune to busting but Hickey/Fleury never had his skating or overall skill level, and Reinhart was a very different type of prospect who went at 4 for pretty fuzzy wish casting/archetype reasons.

Nobody's immune to busting but Reinbacher's season and tools are just flat out better than these guys were as prospects. I don't see Hickey/Fleury/Reinhart as a reason to pass on Reinbacher any more than I see eg. D. Strome, Galchenyuk, or Zadina as inherently being reasons to pass on the forwards available.

It really need to stop with Reinbacher at 5. I’m a fan of this team since 35 years and finding defenseman and goalie is what we do. We always find good and reliable D. Just look à Matheson this year. We will be good on the defensive side.

Eh. This same kind of thinking led to the Kotkaniemi pick because we wanted to fix the C problem we've had for years and years instead of taking Tkachuk because we had all kinds of gritty wingers. I hope they just pick the guy they want instead of somehow thinking we're destined to happen upon a top pair D or starting G.

Why do people seem to dissociate Reinbacher and “elite talent” in here ?

Yeah I don't get it. He does have a high floor but I don't really get the idea that he's somehow a "safe" pick. His floor would get him drafted in the mid 1st round but the ceiling is why there's a legitimate chance he's the guy at #5. I don't mind differences of opinion and I certainly don't fault people for preferring Smith/Benson or another forward (and my preference is still Michkov of course) but I find it odd that Reinbacher is seen as some "reach" or a low-upside pick relative to anyone but Michkov.

The upside is just clear when you look at the combo of tools and see how much creativity he's showing even without fully refined puck skills yet. Of all fanbases you'd think the ones that watched Petry, Weber, and have followed Guhle's development would be keenly aware that defencemen don't need to be dangling guys all game to be effective. It's also weird because like...even if you're just stat-watching he's a perfectly reasonable profile! 22P in a legit Euro pro league for a draft year defenceman is really enticing production, particularly because Reinbacher isn't cheating for offence either.

 

[le_sean]

Had Reinbacher played in Sweden instead of Switzerland, his position in the Top 6 wouldn’t be questioned.

 

[SwiftyHab]

Is that Montembault's cardiograph? His heart looks strong!

 

[Blame the referee]

I don't think any of these guys have much in common with Reinbacher. None of these guys had anything close to his draft year. Not that he's immune to busting but Hickey/Fleury never had his skating or overall skill level, and Reinhart was a very different type of prospect who went at 4 for pretty fuzzy wish casting/archetype reasons.

Nobody's immune to busting but Reinbacher's season and tools are just flat out better than these guys were as prospects. I don't see Hickey/Fleury/Reinhart as a reason to pass on Reinbacher any more than I see eg. D. Strome, Galchenyuk, or Zadina as inherently being reasons to pass on the forwards available.
Eh. This same kind of thinking led to the Kotkaniemi pick because we wanted to fix the C problem we've had for years and years instead of taking Tkachuk because we had all kinds of gritty wingers. I hope they just pick the guy they want instead of somehow thinking we're destined to happen upon a top pair D or starting G.

Yeah I don't get it. He does have a high floor but I don't really get the idea that he's somehow a "safe" pick. His floor would get him drafted in the mid 1st round but the ceiling is why there's a legitimate chance he's the guy at #5. I don't mind differences of opinion and I certainly don't fault people for preferring Smith/Benson or another forward (and my preference is still Michkov of course) but I find it odd that Reinbacher is seen as some "reach" or a low-upside pick relative to anyone but Michkov.

The upside is just clear when you look at the combo of tools and see how much creativity he's showing even without fully refined puck skills yet. Of all fanbases you'd think the ones that watched Petry, Weber, and have followed Guhle's development would be keenly aware that defencemen don't need to be dangling guys all game to be effective. It's also weird because like...even if you're just stat-watching he's a perfectly reasonable profile! 22P in a legit Euro pro league for a draft year defenceman is really enticing production, particularly because Reinbacher isn't cheating for offence either.

KK was a bad pick as soon as he was picked. And everybody knew it. Now we have a clear top 5. That’s not reaching for a position we need.

It’s overthinking the draft

 

[Vinceh]

KK was a bad pick as soon as he was picked. And everybody knew it. Now we have a clear top 5. That’s not reaching for a position we need.

It’s overthinking the draft

How was KK a bad pick? He was seen as a riser by many scouts at the time so no, its not like everyone knew it. With that said, I also personally believe we gave up way to quickly on him which is typical for big hockey markets unfortunately.

 

[Draft]

I am extremely confident that Smith plays at C in the NHL

You shouldn't be.

 

[JoelWarlord]

KK was a bad pick as soon as he was picked. And everybody knew it. Now we have a clear top 5. That’s not reaching for a position we need.

It’s overthinking the draft

Reinbacher is not a reach over Smith or any other forward beyond Michkov. It is fine if you prefer a forward but the idea that Reinbacher is some low-upside pick who's clearly behind Smith is not accurate IMO. It's not overthinking the draft to consider a player with #1D upside at 5th overall.

 

[JT3]

KK was a bad pick as soon as he was picked. And everybody knew it. Now we have a clear top 5. That’s not reaching for a position we need.

It’s overthinking the draft

People say every year there's a clear 'top x' and every year things change at the draft and players in that 'top x' don't end up as good as everybody thought. If you're making a selection based on what a perceived 'top x' is rather than your own evaluations you've already lost.

On a different note, another reason I would draft Reinbacher is that I strongly believe having a strong defense helps elevate your forwards. If you have a strong D core that can kill plays and transition the puck up ice well it makes your forwards that much more effective. Whereas on the other hand if you have a bunch of strong forwards but your D can't get them the puck, then what does it matter?

Reinbacher probably plays a year in the AHL and is ready to go for 24-25. We could bring in him and Hutson at the same time and have a d core that looks like:

Matheson - Barron
Guhle - Xhekaj
Hutson - Reinbacher

That's an incredibly well rounded (although young) d core and should really pay dividends in the long run. And then you've still got Mailloux, Engstrom, Harris, etc on top of that. Good D always have trade value, you can move some for forwards or whatever needed later on.

 

[KevSkillz4]

Ryan Leonard is a wildcard for the 5th spot. Look Matthew Tkachuk with Florida. Leonard will bring that type of game in NHL level. Slafkovsky and Leonard will bring what we wanted for years. The talented offensive players are Suzuki, Caufield and Dach. Complete that with Slafkovsky, Leonard and Dubois will be such a great thing.

But again, Matvei Michkov, Will Smith or Leo Carlsson should be the pick.

 

[le_sean]

Ryan Leonard is a wildcard for the 5th spot. Look Matthew Tkachuk with Florida. Leonard will bring that type of game in NHL level. Slafkovsky and Leonard will bring what we wanted for years. The talented offensive players are Suzuki, Caufield and Dach. Complete that with Slafkovsky, Leonard and Dubois will be such a great thing.

But again, Matvei Michkov, Will Smith or Leo Carlsson should be the pick.

Don’t think any team would want to play the Habs in a 7 game series if they got Leonard. Be like the Panthers, squeaking into the playoffs, but win a few rounds.