HF Habs: 2023 NHL Draft part 2

[Garbageyuk]

Recency bias is a hell of a drug innit?

Did we just forget that Tampa Bay won 2 straight cups with like 90% of their top 9 being 6ft or less AND arguably their top best forwards in Brayden Point and Kucherov being under 6ft?

Did we also forget that the Avalanche won with their best defensemen being under 6ft and also have Girard in their top 4? Paired with Lehkonen, who played a significant role into winning the cup as well as having Kadri (who's only 6ft) centering their 2nd line?

You can always find big guys that can skate if we want to insulate our smaller players (ex: our own Anderson or Hyman when he went to the Oilers). It's a lot harder to trade for a Point or Kucherov.

Just draft the best player available that you think has the most skill.

Avs didn’t win with Girard.

 

[le_sean]

Recency bias is a hell of a drug innit?

Did we just forget that Tampa Bay won 2 straight cups with like 90% of their top 9 being 6ft or less AND arguably their top best forwards in Brayden Point and Kucherov being under 6ft?

Did we also forget that the Avalanche won with their best defensemen being under 6ft and also have Girard in their top 4? Paired with Lehkonen, who played a significant role into winning the cup as well as having Kadri (who's only 6ft) centering their 2nd line?

You can always find big guys that can skate if we want to insulate our smaller players (ex: our own Anderson or Hyman when he went to the Oilers). It's a lot harder to trade for a Point or Kucherov.

Just draft the best player available that you think has the most skill.

And from an asset standpoint this should show you that regardless of how good Leonard becomes, a player like him will always have great value. That shouldn’t be ignored either. Sometimes you pick skilled guys and trade them for nothing significant (Galchenyuk, Kotkaniemi). Meanwhile there’s always a GM willing to pay a premium for Leonards. Same goes with Reinbacher. Luke Schenn still somehow is valued and he’s garbage next to an 18 year old Reinbacher.

 

[KevSkillz4]

Quentin Musty will be a star player. I really like his profile, he is going to be a good one. Teams should easily take him at range 11-16.

 

[bcv]

Quentin Musty will be a star player. I really like his profile, he is going to be a good one. Teams should easily take him at range 11-16.

He could also become Rene Bourque, he has all the tools, he needs to put it together.

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

People seem to conflate being a power forward with being big and mindlessly hitting everything in sight like Lucic.

Old school power forwards made your life a living hell. They'd crush people, score a goal and the beat the shit out of someone. 99% of the power forwards today can't do all that. Power forward has changed.



Iginla played at 6'1/6'2 depending on where you look/when.

Assuming it goes
Bedard
Fantilli
Carlson
Smith.

And Michkov doesn't meet with the Habs

Benson/Leonard would be good choices.

 

[Kennerback]

Again on Leonard. If we put aside his body checks for a second. Just stating the risk with him imo...

He plays with 2 magicians and he himself is a very simple predictable player. He goes to the high slot looking for a shot on goal opportunity. Wires his shot. Rinse and repeat.

To me, many of his goals consist of burying a pass ot picking up their rebound. Will he score as much if Einstein and Tesla are not playing with him?

Another way he score, is for example just outflanking by his speed (not deking) a USHL or College D. He’s fast but he doesn’t have Moore’s speed. Will those goals be open to him in the nhl?

His 2 linemates are exceptional stickhandlers. When they touch the puck they make it count. Leonard (perhaps a minority opinion) flubs passes, mis-stickhandles, fails a deke or wastes that puck touch because he doesnt act fast enough. Im willing to take a risk on him but @5 it’s an awfully expensive price to pay.

 

[ReHabs]

And from an asset standpoint this should show you that regardless of how good Leonard becomes, a player like him will always have great value. That shouldn’t be ignored either. Sometimes you pick skilled guys and trade them for nothing significant (Galchenyuk, Kotkaniemi). Meanwhile there’s always a GM willing to pay a premium for Leonards. Same goes with Reinbacher. Luke Schenn still somehow is valued and he’s garbage next to an 18 year old Reinbacher.

You mean if Lenny hits his ceiling and becomes the 60-70pt strong forward his admirers think he can become. A smaller Pierre-Luc Dubois for instance. Definitely would be in demand but isn’t much of a needle-pusher for a desperate team.

Your point that Jam (grit) tends to be valued more than Juice (skill) is correct to an extent. Competitive NHL teams have core players with plenty of Juice but they have an interest in churning through players with Jam until they find the right fit. It’s easier to have turnover of role players anyway.

Marc Bergevin loved to shuffle through Jammy bottom6 players — from Prust and Armstrong to Parros and so on to Dwight King and Joel Armia.

Just because Luke Schenn has admirers doesn’t mean the Habs need to blow a 5OA on a player who doesn’t project to have PPG-quality production him.

That said, Leonard would be a great medium risk pick if we didn’t have the 5OA and instead had the 13OA.

 

[le_sean]

You mean if Lenny hits his ceiling and becomes the 60-70pt strong forward his admirers think he can become. A smaller Pierre-Luc Dubois for instance. Definitely would be in demand but isn’t much of a needle-pusher for a desperate team.

Your point that Jam (grit) tends to be valued more than Juice (skill) is correct to an extent. Competitive NHL teams have core players with plenty of Juice but they have an interest in churning through players with Jam until they find the right fit. It’s easier to have turnover of role players anyway.

Marc Bergevin loved to shuffle through Jammy bottom6 players — from Prust and Armstrong to Parros and so on to Dwight King and Joel Armia.

Just because Luke Schenn has admirers doesn’t mean the Habs need to blow a 5OA on a player who doesn’t project to have PPG-quality production him.

That said, Leonard would be a great medium risk pick if we didn’t have the 5OA and instead had the 13OA.

No I mean I think Leonard can become a 60-70 point 1st line winger. If he doesn’t and is just a 40 point winger, he’ll still have inflated value around the league because of the type of player he is. Sort of like Blake Coleman (which I think is Leonard’s low-end). Coleman was traded for two 1sts. Just the way the league works.

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

Again on Leonard. If we put aside his body checks for a second. Just stating the risk with him imo...

He plays with 2 magicians and he himself is a very simple predictable player. He goes to the high slot looking for a shot on goal opportunity. Wires his shot. Rinse and repeat.

To me, many of his goals consist of burying a pass ot picking up their rebound. Will he score as much if Einstein and Tesla are not playing with him?

Another way he score, is for example just outflanking by his speed (not deking) a USHL or College D. He’s fast but he doesn’t have Moore’s speed. Will those goals be open to him in the nhl?

His 2 linemates are exceptional stickhandlers. When they touch the puck they make it count. Leonard (perhaps a minority opinion) flubs passes, mis-stickhandles, fails a deke or wastes that puck touch because he doesnt act fast enough. Im willing to take a risk on him but @5 it’s an awfully expensive price to pay.

You can literally do the same with Smith and Perrault.

Will Perrault being a slower skater and on the smaller side allow him to do what he does at the NHL level ?

Will Smith (hah) be able to produce enough at the next level to make up for his lackluster play in the defensive zone ?

Leonard also did a bunch of dirty work for those two in clips I've seen that they're not capable of doing.

I don't think people understand that the Habs are in a not so enviable position. They can choose from a bunch of really good prospect who have flaws.

Habs winning cost them Bedard, Fantilli, or Carlsson.

 

[SlafySZN]

Craig Button

Carlsson = Backstrom
Leonard = Konecny
Smith = Zibanejad
Michkov = Messi

We could have 2 messi on the team

 

[Kennerback]

You can literally do the same with Smith and Perrault.

Will Perrault being a slower skater and on the smaller side allow him to do what he does at the NHL level ?

Will Smith (hah) be able to produce enough at the next level to make up for his lackluster play in the defensive zone ?

Leonard also did a bunch of dirty work for those two in clips I've seen that they're not capable of doing.

I don't think people understand that the Habs are in a not so enviable position. They can choose from a bunch of really good prospect who have flaws.

Habs winning cost them Bedard, Fantilli, or Carlsson.

Perrault is a bad skater that’s why he‘s going later in the first round. He’s a total non starter @5. However at the USNTDP level he’s very slick and sharp, smart and creative. Leonard is a very good skater but he’s sloppy. Bungles the puck a lot. Has no imagination. It’s as big a project as you can get at 5.

 

[SlafySZN]

Perrault is a bad skater that’s why he‘s going later in the first round. He’s a total non starter @5. However at the USNTDP level he’s very slick and sharp, smart and creative. Leonard is a very good skater but he’s sloppy. Bungles the puck a lot. Has no imagination. It’s as big a project as you can get at 5.

I don’t qualify Leonard as a project. He’s the type of player that will adapt to the NHL in no time. Won’t be hard for him.

 

[Kennerback]

I don’t qualify Leonard as a project. He’s the type of player that will adapt to the NHL in no time. Won’t be hard for him.

He’s not a project per se. He should go later in the 1st round than Top-5. I’m saying picking him at 5 is scouting adventurism.

 

[JeffreyLFC]

Old school power forwards made your life a living hell. They'd crush people, score a goal and the beat the shit out of someone. 99% of the power forwards today can't do all that. Power forward has changed.



Iginla played at 6'1/6'2 depending on where you look/when.

Assuming it goes
Bedard
Fantilli
Carlson
Smith.

And Michkov doesn't meet with the Habs

Benson/Leonard would be good choices.

Iginla was never 6'2, he is probably closer to 6'0 than 6'2.

Iginla was very strong though, and strength and size on ice are way more important than being tall. You can be very powerful without being 6'2 or taller.

One of the strongest MF to ever play the game, he was stocky and very hard to move out of the crease was Tomas Holmstrom and he 6'0.

 

[River Meadow]

These are valid points from Granty Pooh:

 

[Skip Bayless]

These are valid points from Granty Pooh:

View attachment 718910

Why not a Nylander AND a Sam Bennett?

 

[badfish]

Musty will not be there at 31 (most likely)

I hope so. I watched him in Sudbury this year multiple times. I like him a lot, he really took off in the games I saw after the coaching change

 

[Kennerback]

These are valid points from Granty Pooh:

View attachment 718910

Just never tell fans you used your 5OA on the next Sam Bennett. They’ll lose their mind. Keep it vague: “He’s a character guy and he has lots of upside”.

 

[Balthazar]

Avs didn’t win with Girard.

If anything Girard is a proof that size matters in the playoffs. He either got overwhelmed or injured in every single playoff run with the Avs. Literally all of them.

Makar was only a quarter of an inch under 6" at the combine and is built like a rock. He isn't small.

 

[JeffreyLFC]

If anything Girard is a proof that size matters in the playoffs. He either got overwhelmed or injured in every single playoff run with the Avs. Literally all of them.

Makar was only a quarter of an inch under 6" at the combine and is built like a rock. He isn't small.

Size does matter.

 

[WinterLion]

I think Benson is very comparable to Cooley last year. A bit smarter, but not a C.. both are very competitive and a bit undersized. Cooley has better overall skills but Benson makes up for it with his boardwork and passing. Just putting it out there... probably not who I would take but will be a great pick to someone.

These are valid points from Granty Pooh:

View attachment 718910

Benson reminds me more of Bennett in their draft years. Leonard seems more like JT Miller with more skill.

 

[Saxon]

If we are choosing between Nylander and Bennett at fifth overall….. just trade the pick.

 

[Jack Skellington]

If we are choosing between Nylander and Bennett at fifth overall….. just trade the pick.

There's also a sort of Kucherov but he's a meanie and he may take 3 years to play for us, like the actual Kucherov.

 

[Saxon]

There's also a sort of Kucherov but he's a meanie and he may take 3 years to play for us, like the actual Kucherov.

I read here that he’s too small to be any good in the playoffs, like Kucherov……

 

[ginomini]

These are valid points from Granty Pooh:

View attachment 718910

Those aren’t valid points lol.

I don't think many GMs would pick Sam Bennett and his career high 49 pts over a PPG winger like Nylander or Fiala just because he had a good playoff run.

This type of narrative is just silly. Its nice and all to build a team full of Sam Bennetts, Andrew Shaws and Dustin Browns....until you miss the playoffs because oops you don't have Tkachuk, Barkov, Verhaeghe, Montour, Reinhart, Ekblad.....

And also, guys like Fiala and Nylander are only "soft" in playoffs until they make you win. Remember that last year Matthew Tkachuk was a playoffs chocker, and Phil Kessel was the biggest loser until he won three cups.

Edit: Also, William Nylander has 40 pts in 50 playoff games ffs, this is actually really good.