2023 Draft Discussion

[WingsToPick4th]

If the season ended today and we were picking where we are (10th OA) who would you be happy to get?

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

If the season ended today and we were picking where we are (10th OA) who would you be happy to get?

Bedard or Leo Carlsson or Fantilli or Michkov.

 

[NickH8]

If the season ended today and we were picking where we are (10th OA) who would you be happy to get?

In my dreams but also possible due to his size and not being an elite skater: Andrew Cristall.

 

[Frk It]

If the season ended today and we were picking where we are (10th OA) who would you be happy to get?

I would be happy with Smith, Dvorsky, Yager, Sale, or Moore

My big complaints about Smith are the skating and the low motor.

He’s an OK enough skater but I don’t think it’s the strength some scouting reports say it is. He does a lot of gliding and puck watching when the puck is off his stick as well. I’ve also seen him actively shy away from contact where he could have taken a bump to make the play more than a few times.

Smith reminds me of Tim Connolly; super smooth and an excellent playmaker but if he hustled the guy would have been an 80 point guy.

I think you're way off on Smith (wouldn't be the first time )

 

[lilidk]

What are first 2 forward lines for US u18 team.?

I understand Moore is on the second line , who are his linemates

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

I would be happy with Smith, Dvorsky, Yager, Sale, or Moore


I think you're way off on Smith (wouldn't be the first time )

Me way off? Coming from a Geekie slappy that’s rich.

I’m not the only one that thinks that way about Smith. Go read his thread in the main prospect forum. There are even harsher critiques pointing out the obvious.

I’ve watched 4 full USNTDP games start to finish with Smith and as much of his shift by shift and highlight reel stuff as I can find. The dude does not move his feet when he does not have the puck. It’s infuriating because he IS very good.

 

[Frk It]

Me way off? Coming from a Geekie slappy that’s rich.

I’m not the only one that thinks that way about Smith. Go read his thread in the main prospect forum. There are even harsher critiques pointing out the obvious.

I’ve watched 4 full USNTDP games start to finish with Smith and as much of his shift by shift and highlight reel stuff as I can find. The dude does not move his feet when he does not have the puck. It’s infuriating because he IS very good.

The nhl scouts that McKenzie polled think he is the 6th best player in the draft.

HockeyProspect.com thinks he’s the 6th best player in the draft.

I don’t know where your criticisms are coming from, but I dont agree with them.

BTW how are Rossi/Eklund doing?

 

[jfrank21]

I would be happy with Smith, Dvorsky, Yager, Sale, or Moore

That's basically my short list as well. Barlow and Ritchie too, but I want to see more of them. I figure at least one of them has to be there at the Wings pick. Haven't decided who gives me the warm and fuzzies like McTavish or Kasper yet.

 

[NickH8]

The nhl scouts that McKenzie polled think he is the 6th best player in the draft.

HockeyProspect.com thinks he’s the 6th best player in the draft.

I don’t know where your criticisms are coming from, but I dont agree with them.

BTW how are Rossi/Eklund doing?

I don't have the live games inwatched recorded but I'll scour YouTube for some clips of what ogee and I are seeing and post them when I'm out of work.
In the end he's still great. For me it's a difference between 6th and 9th, idk where ogee has him so I can't speak for him but we both still think he's good and we'd be glad if Detroit got him.

 

[Michael Brand Eggs]

Ranking the top prospects in the 2023 NHL Draft: A midseason update

The 2023 NHL Draft class looks above average, mostly driven by the premium talent in the top four.

theathletic.com

Pronman has Danielson at #9. Says he's a top 2 line center. I could see the Wings being very interested. And #10 is Oliver Moore, who seems like another guy they could be interested in.

 

[Perfect Human]

Ranking the top prospects in the 2023 NHL Draft: A midseason update

The 2023 NHL Draft class looks above average, mostly driven by the premium talent in the top four.

theathletic.com

Pronman has Danielson at #9. Says he's a top 2 line center. I could see the Wings being very interested. And #10 is Oliver Moore, who seems like another guy they could be interested in.

Interesting that he has Sandin Pellikka ranked in the 20s. The kid has played in 20 SHL games this season as a 17 year old. I may be crazy, and please call me crazy if I am, but doesn't Pronman usually rank euro skaters a little lower/not have a great ability to evaluate euros in a men's league?

The guy put Joakim Kemell above Marco Kasper for cryin out loud.

 

[Frk It]

Interesting that he has Sandin Pellikka ranked in the 20s. The kid has played in 20 SHL games this season as a 17 year old. I may be crazy, and please call me crazy if I am, but doesn't Pronman usually rank euro skaters a little lower/not have a great ability to evaluate euros in a men's league?

The guy put Joakim Kemell above Marco Kasper for cryin out loud.

You have to evaluate the tools as well. Just playing in a pro league isn't the end all/be all. Eemil Viro was playing in a pro league when we took him.

My question with Sandin Pelikka is... what's his calling card?

On the list put out by Mckenzie with feedback from NHL scouts he was #17... so not like Pronman is way off there.

 

[Perfect Human]

You have to evaluate the tools as well. Just playing in a pro league isn't the end all/be all. Eemil Viro was playing in a pro league when we took him.

My question with Sandin Pelikka is... what's his calling card?

On the list put out by Mckenzie with feedback from NHL scouts he was #17... so not like Pronman is way off there.

That makes sense. I have only watched clips. I guess "translatables" are important and last year Kemell's shot appeared to be one of those calling card items for him where as Kasper just did everything well but nothing apart from skating excellent.

I suppose it also shows how deep this draft class is.

 

[norrisnick]

That makes sense. I have only watched clips. I guess "translatables" are important and last year Kemell's shot appeared to be one of those calling card items for him where as Kasper just did everything well but nothing apart from skating excellent.

I suppose it also shows how deep this draft class is.

Pretty sure Kasper's compete level was his calling card.

 

[Frk It]

That makes sense. I have only watched clips. I guess "translatables" are important and last year Kemell's shot appeared to be one of those calling card items for him where as Kasper just did everything well but nothing apart from skating excellent.

I suppose it also shows how deep this draft class is.

Yeah you nailed it, I just think it’s easier to get excited about some of the other players in this class.

I’ve only seen him in international play and he seems like a smart player with some poise.

I also wonder if some of these similar sized Swedish d men that were picked in round 1 having some struggles will work against him? Although I guess checking in some of these guys are starting to put it together (Boqvist/Lundqvkist, etc)

 

[Perfect Human]

Pretty sure Kasper's compete level was his calling card.

"motor" is what I should have said instead of skating

 

[Realgud]

For those who also watch prospects, I would be curious to hear what you think about Dvorsky and Ritchie, specifically. Both are players I want to rank very high because I really like their tools, maturity and intelligence but both of them leave you with a feeling that they don't do nearly as much as you'd expect them to do with their talent level but I can see how their game could seamlessly translate to the NHL level because of the way they play but that lack of urgency in their game is my concern. Ritchie, in particular, has shockingly low production, even compared to someone like Barlow but I much prefer Ritchie's game and upside but Barlow is a lot more efficient and found much better success in the same league and plays a more projectable, but lower upside game (in my opinion). Furthermore, I have a much easier time ranking someone like Danielson higher even though I don't think he's as smart as the other two.

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

The nhl scouts that McKenzie polled think he is the 6th best player in the draft.

HockeyProspect.com thinks he’s the 6th best player in the draft.

I don’t know where your criticisms are coming from, but I dont agree with them.

BTW how are Rossi/Eklund doing?

Eklund is doing ok. Rossi is doing ok when not being played like a grinder. Both aren’t turning out how I hoped but they both lost significant time from covid and other injuries.

 

[NickH8]

I don't have the live games inwatched recorded but I'll scour YouTube for some clips of what ogee and I are seeing and post them when I'm out of work.
In the end he's still great. For me it's a difference between 6th and 9th, idk where ogee has him so I can't speak for him but we both still think he's good and we'd be glad if Detroit got him.

1:47, 2:08 are some weird decisions.
7:08 is a good defensive play, that's an example of one of the times he is engaged without the puck.
7:58 he doesn't shoot and instead passes to a lower percentage area.
9:08 is exhibit A of one of the problems I have with him. Skates the puck into three defenders.

I felt nitpicky doing this so I want to stress I do really like the player. I actually had not seen this game and saw some good things. He made some real smart plays to offset some of these nitpicks. He was also more engaged off puck in this game than a few viewings I've had.
@Frk It @OgeeOgelthorpe

 

[Rzombo4 prez]

Yeah you nailed it, I just think it’s easier to get excited about some of the other players in this class.

I’ve only seen him in international play and he seems like a smart player with some poise.

I also wonder if some of these similar sized Swedish d men that were picked in round 1 having some struggles will work against him? Although I guess checking in some of these guys are starting to put it together (Boqvist/Lundqvkist, etc)

If you want to take an undersized defensemen early, he needs to be damn near elite offensively. There is no such thing as an undersized defensive defensemen and the two-way guys are quickly becoming unicorns.

 

[Frk It]

1:47, 2:08 are some weird decisions.
7:08 is a good defensive play, that's an example of one of the times he is engaged without the puck.
7:58 he doesn't shoot and instead passes to a lower percentage area.
9:08 is exhibit A of one of the problems I have with him. Skates the puck into three defenders.

I felt nitpicky doing this so I want to stress I do really like the player. I actually had not seen this game and saw some good things. He made some real smart plays to offset some of these nitpicks. He was also more engaged off puck in this game than a few viewings I've had.
@Frk It @OgeeOgelthorpe

I like that he is always trying to create. Like at 9:08 he actually gets a zone entry there and he drops it off and they play it to the corner and set up possession.

I think he tries risky stuff but I don't think he is dumb. Similar to Zegras in that way. I think he could be a good ying to Kasper's yang.

Eklund is doing ok. Rossi is doing ok when not being played like a grinder. Both aren’t turning out how I hoped but they both lost significant time from covid and other injuries.

Geekie has been disappointing for me this year tbh. Thought he would get more PP ice time and put up more points. Will have to see how that plays out.

Smith has a lot of offensive ability. Think he is someone who could develop a lot in college.

If you want to take an undersized defensemen early, he needs to be damn near elite offensively. There is no such thing as an undersized defensive defensemen and the two-way guys are quickly becoming unicorns.

And/or an elite skater.

 

[Reddwit]

McKeen’s has Danielson at #8, which is the highest I’ve seen post-season start. I’m curious how much Detroit likes him, cause he reads like he’s basically a less rambunctious version of Kasper: mature, complete player, defensive responsibilities as a younger teammate, no major holes in his game, etc. but questions on the offensive upside. From what I’ve seen though, he doesn’t lack high-end offensive skill but he also doesn’t look to make those plays, and that could just be a product of his role on Brandon.

 

[WingsToPick4th]

What position do you think SY targets with our pick in that range? C again ? any decent RHD projected in the top 12?

 

[NickH8]

McKeen’s has Danielson at #8, which is the highest I’ve seen post-season start. I’m curious how much Detroit likes him, cause he reads like he’s basically a less rambunctious version of Kasper: mature, complete player, defensive responsibilities as a younger teammate, no major holes in his game, etc. but questions on the offensive upside. From what I’ve seen though, he doesn’t lack high-end offensive skill but he also doesn’t look to make those plays, and that could just be a product of his role on Brandon.

My mind is open to it but idk about Danielson that high. He has the skill but his hands and feet don't work together, he's either using one or the other. He has a lot of tools he just has to put them together.

 

[Reddwit]

I like that he is always trying to create. Like at 9:08 he actually gets a zone entry there and he drops it off and they play it to the corner and set up possession.

I think he tries risky stuff but I don't think he is dumb. Similar to Zegras in that way. I think he could be a good ying to Kasper's yang.

Yeah I think that’s why I keep hearing about his “floating” and “low motor” but then someone submits a clip as evidence and I see a guy who is very much mentally involved in the play even if he’s dropping back or taking an indirect route. Sure, I can see why it doesn’t always look great, especially if you aren’t paying attention to the follow-up play or to his body language, but to me it sure looks like the wheels are turning at all times, like he’s always scheming to make a play. Weaselly almost. He’s not sitting back waiting for the play to come to him, and when he sees a route he likes, I see no problem with motor. But I’m high on him so maybe I’m seeing what I want to see.