Speculation: 2023-24-25 Sharks Roster Discussion

[hohosaregood]

It'd really be something if we grab Fabbro. We'd pretty much have a brand new defense compared to last year.

 

[Juxtaposer]

Absolutely claim Fabbro. Worst case he doesn't work out and I'm sure someone will pay a 4th round pick for him at the deadline as a depth RHD for playoff insurance.

 

[hohosaregood]

For whatever reason, I have Grier, Briere, and Trorz in the same class of GMs and I enjoy it any time Grier can do something to outdo the other guys. So it'd be funny if Grier just keeps f***in with Trotz

 

[The Nemesis]

It feels like such an obvious choice to claim Fabbro that I will not be surprised if it doesn't happen. Because it often feels like the more we expect things to happen the less likely they are to actually do so.

 

[CanadienShark]

We better claim Fabbro.

 

[Juxtaposer]

It feels like such an obvious choice to claim Fabbro that I will not be surprised if it doesn't happen. Because it often feels like the more we expect things to happen the less likely they are to actually do so.

I'm feeling this too. If Mike really wanted him, I think he would have just gone out and traded for him.

 

[Patty Ice]

I'm feeling this too. If Mike really wanted him, I think he would have just gone out and traded for him.

We had the rumors they were interested last year. Maybe the price was too high? But you can't beat free.

 

[Juxtaposer]

We had the rumors they were interested last year. Maybe the price was too high? But you can't beat free.

Last year we had Quinn who coached him at BU. Makes a difference IMO.

Claiming Fabbro would basically mean Rutta is in the box. I don't trust this org to do that unfortunately.

 

[The Nemesis]

I'm feeling this too. If Mike really wanted him, I think he would have just gone out and traded for him.

It does seem like getting him for the low, low price of "free to a good home" would be better than the team having to pay some marginal mid/late round pick for him and could be a motivator to make the claim over striking a trade. Or that the Preds weren't offering favorable terms for a deal (for all we know Trotz could've asked for the moon. Or like a 2nd or 3rd round pick with no retention or whatever. Or even if the price was a 4th or 5th, if that's what the Sharks figure they could get for him in trade at the deadline then it's a mild net loss giving up their own high-in-the-round pick for some playoff team's bottom-3rd-of-the-round selection).

The most significant wrench I can think of that could dissuade the Sharks is that while a $2.5m cap hit isn't exorbitant, the Sharks will be mildly hamstrung trying to move him at the deadline by the fact that they can't offer retention on it to sweeten the deal until the Burns slot expires this off-season. So the market may be shrunk by the fact that whatever teams might be interested will have to take on the whole pro-rated $2.5m portion for the rest of the year. How many teams butting up against the cap by that point will have to turn Grier down if they can't take that money? Or would it require the Sharks to take some dead weight cap hit back the other way? does that make moving him become too much hassle for not enough return?

I would like to believe that if nothing else there's value in being free of Rutta for the next 4 months or so, but we can't have nice things so even if Fabbro was on the roster we'd probably be stuck with Ferraro-Rutta until the sun dies.

 

[Patty Ice]

Last year we had Quinn who coached him at BU. Makes a difference IMO.

Claiming Fabbro would basically mean Rutta is in the box. I don't trust this org to do that unfortunately.

Agreed and I was going to mention that but Sharks director of player personnel Fitzgerald heavily scouted him for the Bruins along with McAvoy so it could have been more than the Quinn connection.

 

[TheBeard]

It feels like such an obvious choice to claim Fabbro that I will not be surprised if it doesn't happen. Because it often feels like the more we expect things to happen the less likely they are to actually do so.

I honestly think the decision to sign him comes down to the current health of Vlasic. Seems like they have a ridiculous cap number for their RD already considering the ROI.

The most significant wrench I can think of that could dissuade the Sharks is that while a $2.5m cap hit isn't exorbitant, the Sharks will be mildly hamstrung trying to move him at the deadline by the fact that they can't offer retention on it to sweeten the deal

It seems like Grier's going to make TDL to get back similarly priced pieces with term instead of picks/prospects so he can go through the process every year until he's got slots to open up.

 

[The Nemesis]

I honestly think the decision to sign him comes down to the current health of Vlasic. Seems like they have a ridiculous cap number for their RD already considering the ROI.

Realistically, possibly.

Logically though, Vlasic is a sunk cost. If he's not on LTIR by now then it seems reasonable he won't be put there short of suffering some kind of setback in his rehab or whatever. And it's not like he's single-handedly keeping them above the floor (from what I can tell the floor is $65m and the Sharks are at $79m against the cap. Wiping Vlasic off the books onto LTIR would still leave them $7m clear of the floor before you even account for bringing Fabbro in or whatever other corresponding moves would happen)

Given that, I don't think there's any point to considering Vlasic in making a decision. He is irrelevant to the team's cap situation in either direction and there's no way in hell he ever becomes an attractive trade asset before his contract expires so there's no value in playing him to build value. It's harsh math, but if the team is in any way made better by the acquisition of Fabbro, either through direct contributions on the ice, mentorship, or as a trade asset at the deadline, Vlasic and his money should have absolutely no impact on that decision whatsoever because they're already paying him no matter what else they do.

 

[OrrNumber4]

It feels like such an obvious choice to claim Fabbro that I will not be surprised if it doesn't happen. Because it often feels like the more we expect things to happen the less likely they are to actually do so.

To be fair, the Liljegren acquisition was like this...

 

[TheBeard]

Realistically, possibly.

Logically though, Vlasic is a sunk cost. If he's not on LTIR by now then it seems reasonable he won't be put there short of suffering some kind of setback in his rehab or whatever. And it's not like he's single-handedly keeping them above the floor (from what I can tell the floor is $65m and the Sharks are at $79m against the cap. Wiping Vlasic off the books onto LTIR would still leave them $7m clear of the floor before you even account for bringing Fabbro in or whatever other corresponding moves would happen)

Given that, I don't think there's any point to considering Vlasic in making a decision. He is irrelevant to the team's cap situation in either direction and there's no way in hell he ever becomes an attractive trade asset before his contract expires so there's no value in playing him to build value. It's harsh math, but if the team is in any way made better by the acquisition of Fabbro, either through direct contributions on the ice, mentorship, or as a trade asset at the deadline, Vlasic and his money should have absolutely no impact on that decision whatsoever because they're already paying him no matter what else they do.

I agree with it mostly, however I imagine it's a harder sell to bring in more expensive pieces considering the lackluster ticket sales. Hasso may have his limits and already spending 16 million on two pieces (Vlasic and Logan) who may never play again may prompt him to tighten the purse strings.

 

[Cas]

Realistically, possibly.

Logically though, Vlasic is a sunk cost. If he's not on LTIR by now then it seems reasonable he won't be put there short of suffering some kind of setback in his rehab or whatever. And it's not like he's single-handedly keeping them above the floor (from what I can tell the floor is $65m and the Sharks are at $79m against the cap. Wiping Vlasic off the books onto LTIR would still leave them $7m clear of the floor before you even account for bringing Fabbro in or whatever other corresponding moves would happen)

Given that, I don't think there's any point to considering Vlasic in making a decision. He is irrelevant to the team's cap situation in either direction and there's no way in hell he ever becomes an attractive trade asset before his contract expires so there's no value in playing him to build value. It's harsh math, but if the team is in any way made better by the acquisition of Fabbro, either through direct contributions on the ice, mentorship, or as a trade asset at the deadline, Vlasic and his money should have absolutely no impact on that decision whatsoever because they're already paying him no matter what else they do.

Theres zero reason whatsoever to put Vlasic on LTIR until we're up against the cap, because we'd stop accruing cap space if he's on LTIR. Same reason why Couture isn't there, even though he's retired (just the sort of retired where everyone pretends it's not a requirement).

 

[TheBeard]

Theres zero reason whatsoever to put Vlasic on LTIR until we're up against the cap, because we'd stop accruing cap space if he's on LTIR. Same reason why Couture isn't there, even though he's retired (just the sort of retired where everyone pretends it's not a requirement).

Zero reason to, but Hasso still has to pay em both regardless. The question isn't if Fabbro is better than whomever we have at RD on the 2nd and 3rd pairings, it's whether he's 2.5 million dollars better. That's the sell.

 

[vortexy]

Shark lines at practice today (Granlund missing would be Dellandrea's spot and Dellandrea would go back to 4th line)

Dellandrea-Celebrini-Toffoli
Eklund-W. Smith-Zetterlund
Kunin-Wennberg-Goodrow
G. Smith-Sturm-Grundstrom

Walman-Ceci
Ferraro-Liljegren
Thrun-Rutta

Things that stand out, Will Smith gets promoted to 2C but with Eklund instead of Granlund (I would prefer Granlund). Also confused why it looks like Thompson might be scratched and how Rutta has not been scratched yet...

 

[coooldude]

I would be quite surprised if we don't claim him. Thompson is playing well, but the swap for Rutta makes too much sense. You waive Rutta or you send Thompson back down until the next injury.

 

[fasterthanlight]

me: We should totally claim fabbro, but aren't we not in last anymore? maybe chicago wil---

...

damn the preds suck lol

 

[vortexy]

I'm feeling this too. If Mike really wanted him, I think he would have just gone out and traded for him.

Grier big brain predicted the future that he could get Fabbro for free on waivers, instead of having to trade assets for him

Claiming Fabbro would basically mean Rutta is in the box. I don't trust this org to do that unfortunately.

But realistically this is probably the case as Rutta has never been healthy scratch yet somehow and it's looking more likely he will still play next game even with Walman coming back...

 

[The Nemesis]

Also confused why it looks like Thompson might be scratched and how Rutta has not been scratched yet...

Because Rutta is a veteran. He could probably literally skate away from the play and leave the team functionally shorthanded so they give up a goal, then admit to the media that he did it because he just didn't care what would happen and he would still be in the lineup because vets can't lose their spots unless a better vet comes along.

 

[Pavelski2112]

Please for the love of God just claim Fabbro already and get this whole "will they, won't they" saga over with

 

[TheBeard]

Because Rutta is a veteran. He could probably literally skate away from the play and leave the team functionally shorthanded so they give up a goal, then admit to the media that he did it because he just didn't care what would happen and he would still be in the lineup because vets can't lose their spots unless a better vet comes along.

Jan: "What are you gonna do, trade me? Hah, good luck finding a willing trade partner for my sorry ass."

 

[Juxtaposer]

It does seem like getting him for the low, low price of "free to a good home" would be better than the team having to pay some marginal mid/late round pick for him and could be a motivator to make the claim over striking a trade. Or that the Preds weren't offering favorable terms for a deal (for all we know Trotz could've asked for the moon. Or like a 2nd or 3rd round pick with no retention or whatever. Or even if the price was a 4th or 5th, if that's what the Sharks figure they could get for him in trade at the deadline then it's a mild net loss giving up their own high-in-the-round pick for some playoff team's bottom-3rd-of-the-round selection).

The most significant wrench I can think of that could dissuade the Sharks is that while a $2.5m cap hit isn't exorbitant, the Sharks will be mildly hamstrung trying to move him at the deadline by the fact that they can't offer retention on it to sweeten the deal until the Burns slot expires this off-season. So the market may be shrunk by the fact that whatever teams might be interested will have to take on the whole pro-rated $2.5m portion for the rest of the year. How many teams butting up against the cap by that point will have to turn Grier down if they can't take that money? Or would it require the Sharks to take some dead weight cap hit back the other way? does that make moving him become too much hassle for not enough return?

I would like to believe that if nothing else there's value in being free of Rutta for the next 4 months or so, but we can't have nice things so even if Fabbro was on the roster we'd probably be stuck with Ferraro-Rutta until the sun dies.

Okay but Rutta is Big and Has Reach and Won a Stanley Cup. What had Fabbro done?

 

[coooldude]

Okay but Rutta is Big and Has Reach and Won a Stanley Cup. What had Fabbro done?

This may very well be the reason no claim is made by us. Maybe Grier was talking to TOR for Lily and NSH for Fabbro and went with Lily and is now "happy" with the right side. With SJ off the list, no trade partners for Fabbro (although you'd think there might have been...).