Speculation: - 2023-24-25-26 Sharks Roster Discussion | Page 1303 | HFBoards - NHL Message Board and Forum for National Hockey League
Toggle sidebar

Speculation: 2023-24-25-26 Sharks Roster Discussion

  • If you are having issues logging in, we have found opening the log in page in a new tab/window rather than using the pop out should resolve these issues. We are working to get this resolved and thank you for patience.
  • Congrats to our latest Sportsbook winners - GOLD MEDAL kihei, SILVER MEDAL fish7 and BRONZE MEDAL Sammy Kat - new tournament begins today 6/15
TheBeard said:
This isn’t being cutthroat. This is putting the team first. Toff signed here I imagine under absolutely no expectations of being a part of a competitive team and that’s reiterated by his insistence of having a NMC in order to NOT be traded to a contender. Playing 4th line minutes because he’s clearly struggling to keep up with his he kids needs to be considered a reality check for his game now.
Click to expand...
I don’t disagree… but I don’t know what is discussed inside those walls. It could be received poorly.

People didn’t like the MAF stuff… the reason it didn’t blow up on them, they kept winning.

SJ needs to do that before doing stuff like this.
 
Hodge said:
Let's say Edvinsson demands 8x10.5M and won't budge. Yzerman doesn't want to pay him more than Seider and is forced to trade him.

Would you trade #2 and #20 for Edvinsson and immediately sign him to that contract?
Click to expand...
No, because the sharks are probably just bidding against themselves at that point. Who else is trading that kind of package for him?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Jannik Hansen, Shark Finn, MackAttack71 and 6 others
Lebanezer said:
Toffoli was totally fine last year, he just didn't spend most of the season on Mack's wing.
Click to expand...
Right, exactly. I understand that Toffoli has his limitations for sure but why are we acting like he didn’t score 49 points in 79 games last year while barely playing with Celebrini at 5v5? He’s still a more than serviceable middle-six winger. I’d simply run back Graf-Wennberg-Toffoli as the 2A line (Eklund-Misa-Sherwood as 2B) and let them eat matchups.

I just see no reason to mess around with the top-9 this summer. Spend 2nd overall on Reid, then use Bystedt/Musty/20th/63rd on some good top-4 guys like Marcus Pettersson. I saw Sheng mentioned him as a possibility a few days ago and I fully endorse the idea, if he were willing to waive. A legit top-4 guy like Pettersson and a solid stop-gap like Sean Durzi, combined with re-signing Vinny and Mukh (which sound likely), and there’s at least a competitive group here. I remain intrigued by Kesselring if the price is right. But I just don’t see a reason to push moving Eklund or Graf unless a real top pairing guy (like Byram) shook loose.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Sharksfan66, Tw1ster, timorous me and 4 others
SJS1991 said:
I don’t disagree… but I don’t know what is discussed inside those walls. It could be received poorly.

People didn’t like the MAF stuff… the reason it didn’t blow up on them, they kept winning.

SJ needs to do that before doing stuff like this.
Click to expand...
The MaF stuff was bad because they flat out dumped him after he gave them a Vezina season. All I’m asking for here is to cut his minutes and show a little grace by letting the kids be the team.
 
One interesting trade target could be RD Henri Jokiharju from Boston. He did really well for Finnish World Team and maybe isn't overly expensive. He clearly needs more PP time and responsibility to shine. At least worth a try since Boston has their hands full with defencemen capable of taking PP time in McAvoy, Lindholm and Lohrei.

Edit: This doesn't really fit my formula of getting tower defence, but could be worth a try to bridge the RD position for couple of years.
 
  • Like
Reactions: OversKy
Hodge said:
Byram is a top pairing defenseman. Does saying they have a 5% chance to be better than him imply that they suck?
Click to expand...

Got to push back on the 95%.

I went ahead and tiered and ranked d-men drafted in the top 10 from 2012-2021. 31 d-men in all. I also tiered and ranked the top two d-men drafted each year. (edit: damnit I swapped blue and yellow- y'all figure it out)

Byram is a middle outcome for both. The percentage depends on where you rate him, but even if you rank him at the top of the tier, we're talking about a 55-70% ranking which is between 6-9x more likely than what you're projecting.

You could argue it's a bad year- 2012 and 2022 has come home to roost once again, but in a 10 year period (starting in '11 or ending in '22), it only happened once.

Remove those two years for a '9 year sample' and the only other top 2 drafted d-men who didn't become 2/3s or better are Juolevi (total bust) and Drysdale (4/5). Meanwhile 9 of them became franchise D, Bouchard or Chychrun.

Put another way from 2013 to 2021 50% of the top two dmen selected became top 20 d in the league in their prime.

I'm cool with it being Smits, Verhoeff, Reid, or Carels, but if there's really a coin flip chance of a top 20 d-man, take it!


Screenshot 2026-06-13 at 00.56.28.png
 
  • Like
Reactions: crankshaft mechanic, pavelskiTips and BaybayShark
OrrNumber4 said:
Dallas fans appears to have really soured on Harley; think he could be a very good buy-low candidate.
Click to expand...

I know some are pretty worried about his season, but I'd take a shot at him. He's a guy I'd move Ek/Graf and plenty more for while taking the full cap. I like Byram a good bit, but I think Harley is better and can grow into a better rounded top pair guy.

Hodge said:
Let's say Edvinsson demands 8x10.5M and won't budge. Yzerman doesn't want to pay him more than Seider and is forced to trade him.

Would you trade #2 and #20 for Edvinsson and immediately sign him to that contract?
Click to expand...

I suspect #2 would be sufficient. As someone else said, who's offering more than #2? Maybe St. Louis or Anaheim (need a RD) would offer a better package, but #2 seems hard to beat. I'd consider it.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Sharksfan66 and vortexx
Juxtaposer said:
Right, exactly. I understand that Toffoli has his limitations for sure but why are we acting like he didn’t score 49 points in 79 games last year while barely playing with Celebrini at 5v5? He’s still a more than serviceable middle-six winger. I’d simply run back Graf-Wennberg-Toffoli as the 2A line (Eklund-Misa-Sherwood as 2B) and let them eat matchups.
Click to expand...
As a player with absolutely no B-game beyond scoring that's really not great
 
  • Like
Reactions: Cas
Hodge said:
Who's getting bumped to the fourth line instead of Graf if we draft Stenberg? Toffoli? I'm sure he'd love that. Chernyshov? Sherwood in year one of his new contract? It's actually good asset management to get ahead of Graf losing value on our fourth line by using him to address an immediate need.
Click to expand...
Feels like the solution then is to not draft Stenberg!

But really, I just think if you're going to trade Graf, Stenberg or not, it needs to be for someone who's got more of a future with the team than as a stopgap who'll get bought out in a couple years. Other teams out there would love to have a guy like Graf locked up through his 20s, even if he's not on a rookie deal anymore.
 
  • Like
Reactions: mogambomoroo, gaucholoco3, MackAttack71 and 2 others
Lebanezer said:
How are you defining B game, because Toffoli was good defensively last season. He didn't score 30 goals, but his all around game was a net positive. He's not one dimensional.

View attachment 1253499
Click to expand...
He was not good defensively last year

There's a reason these cards use a 3 year window, to spread out the outliers, what happened last year is that Toffoli spent lots of minutes playing with Wennberg


and with Eklund

and he consistently dragged down their line performance in both xGA/60, GA/60 and CA/60

He has no B game, he just played with the best 2 B game forwards on the team for a lot of his 5-on-5 ice time


Edit: I don't know why the line tool links won't share, but that's Toffoli w/wo Wennberg, Eklund and both of them per natural stat trick
 
  • Like
Reactions: landshark, vortexx, Cas and 1 other person
matt trick said:
I know some are pretty worried about his season, but I'd take a shot at him. He's a guy I'd move Ek/Graf and plenty more for while taking the full cap. I like Byram a good bit, but I think Harley is better and can grow into a better rounded top pair guy.



I suspect #2 would be sufficient. As someone else said, who's offering more than #2? Maybe St. Louis or Anaheim (need a RD) would offer a better package, but #2 seems hard to beat. I'd consider it.
Click to expand...
Harley would be great, he fits a lot of needs and is only 24. I like Byram too, but who knows if he's actually available. His price seems to have gone up and rumor is the Buffalo wants to keep him. Those are the tier of dman we should be targeting. Unless one of Seider or Werenski, magically become both available, affordable, and willing to play here, it's about the best we can do.
 
weastern bias said:
He was not good defensively last year

There's a reason these cards use a 3 year window, to spread out the outliers, what happened last year is that Toffoli spent lots of minutes playing with Wennberg


and with Eklund

and he consistently dragged down their line performance in both xGA/60, GA/60 and CA/60

He has no B game, he just played with the best 2 B game forwards on the team for a lot of his 5-on-5 ice time


Edit: I don't know why the line tool links won't share, but that's Toffoli w/wo Wennberg, Eklund and both of them per natural stat trick
Click to expand...
That goes both ways though. Eklund and Wennberg don't necessarily matchup well with Toffoli, that isn't immediately an indictment on Toffoli. Everything is relative to the entire team, not just a specific pair of linemates.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Sandisfan
weastern bias said:
He was not good defensively last year

There's a reason these cards use a 3 year window, to spread out the outliers, what happened last year is that Toffoli spent lots of minutes playing with Wennberg

and with Eklund

and he consistently dragged down their line performance in both xGA/60, GA/60 and CA/60

He has no B game, he just played with the best 2 B game forwards on the team for a lot of his 5-on-5 ice time


Edit: I don't know why the line tool links won't share, but that's Toffoli w/wo Wennberg, Eklund and both of them per natural stat trick
Click to expand...
giphy.gif

:sarcasm:
 
  • Like
Reactions: weastern bias
weastern bias said:
As a player with absolutely no B-game beyond scoring that's really not great
Click to expand...
Toffoli is also 34, clearly lost a step last year, and has never been fast.

Will he manage to avoid falling off the cliff for a year? Maybe, but age comes at you fast.
 
Hodge said:
Who's getting bumped to the fourth line instead of Graf if we draft Stenberg? Toffoli? I'm sure he'd love that. Chernyshov? Sherwood in year one of his new contract? It's actually good asset management to get ahead of Graf losing value on our fourth line by using him to address an immediate need.
Click to expand...
If we draft Stenberg, we don't have to bring him over for next season nor start him in the top nine. He can start on the 4th line and earn his way up. And if he does, there's nothing stopping them from demoting whoever is playing the worst to make that spot available. It'd be nice to have a 4th line like Stenberg-Ostapchuk-Gaudette.
 
SJS1991 said:
The play for Rielly would be upgrading Klingberg and having a defenseman that can get the puck up to the forwards quickly.

I know he sucks defensively… so does a lot of Sharks players.

I hold no illusions of Rielly being some savior on the back end. He is a controlled asset to replace Klingberg’s role.

Click to expand...

Reilly sucked at any sort of puck moving for the last 2 years, even when on team canada. He just blind rimmed it like Mukhamadullin does. Age has really caught up with him
 
  • Like
Reactions: vortexx, Sandisfan and Star Platinum
You must log in or register to reply here.

Users who are viewing this thread

Total: 21 (members: 8, guests: 13)

Latest posts

Ad

Ad

Top Bottom