Blue Jays GDT: 2022 v13 | PLAYOFFS: Wild Card Rd | Gm #2: Sat, Oct 8 | vs SEA | 4:00pm ET/1:00pm PT | Ray vs Gausman

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This other than the bullpen being a bit of a mirage. Did you seriously trust them in pivotal moments in the playoffs? I wanted to believe in them and their strong stretches of play BUT from watching a ton of other teams I knew it wasn't going to come to fruition.

Totally agree with the poster you're backing other than the BP.
 
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It was an atrocious collapse in front of the home fans who were going nuts. The thing that softens the blow somewhat is that this was only game 2 - we'd still have to win another coin-toss game just to get to play a vastly superior Houston team.
It’s also bad because the players in this group need to win a playoff game. They’re winless so far. It’s demoralizing.
 
It was an atrocious collapse in front of the home fans who were going nuts. The thing that softens the blow somewhat is that this was only game 2 - we'd still have to win another coin-toss game just to get to play a vastly superior Houston team.

And that’s what sucks about it.
Jays fans were rocking all day, with an 8-1 lead this is a game locked up. Very demoralizing how this team collapsed.

You think we feel bad, I can’t imagine the players reaction right now. They completely blew it and they know it.
 
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We definitely need an OF revamp. Can't have 3 mediocre defenders there every night and can't be playing Tapia every night.
Tapia grew on me through the year, but ultimately he needs to be the 4/5th OF... You are correct. Missing Lourdes as weird as that sounds, was a HUGE loss for us.
 
Perhaps - but maybe this is the kick in the pants they need to finally take this more seriously. We have a few guys who are out of shape, a couple who seem to lose concentration defensively.
Maybe it’s the kick in the pants the organization needs. Get serious about winning. Don’t half ass the roster or coaching staff. Enough of going into the season with lots of “we’ll see how it plays out” or hopeful scenarios. Fill holes and be as certain as possible about player performances across all positions.
 


This hurts. Without Bo there, you make the play.

82 feet needed and Springer got 84 feet and that was with him peeling back to avoid Bo. Springer probably covers 90 feet without Bo there.

That definitely would have been an iconic play in Jays history instead it’s an iconic play in Jays history.

I want to cry..... Great post
 
Bichette does this all the time. He plays everyone else's position in addition to his own. He gets in the way and causes risk of injury, as happened today.

I blame poor coaching and weak management, because this has been going on all season long. Someone needs to firmly instruct Bichette that he is not the only fielder that can catch a ball, and to not get in the way of his teammates in their own territories.

Usually the others laugh it off, but this one was no laughing matter.

I'm certain the coaches have tried to coach him on this very issue. I think the real issue is the level of arrogance and ego that is overflowing throughout this roster. You can't teach players who think they hung the moon.
 
I know there are die hard supporters of this team here who will never agree with me but there is something seriously wrong with the attitude of the team's core. The egos here are beyond huge and the arrogance pours from the TV screen.

There is no denying the talent level but I'm not sure it's going to matter when the team acts like a bunch of frat boys at a party on most days. I don't see playoff success at any point in the future with this core. Too much ego and arrogance and not enough professionalism.

I do think this team and the core have had their praises sung a bit too much in their time here. Rogers owning both the team and the sports network they play on doesn't help as they're constantly blowing smoke up the teams ass, but also the Jays are the darling team of Canada. Everyone from coast to coast loves the boys of summer, and I'd reckon across Canada they Jays are more popular than the Raptors despite both teams being the only Canadian ones in their respective major leagues (give the Raptors another decade or two and that might change though). So unlike the Leafs, despite playing in the same city, they don't face as much criticism or scrutiny as they probably should. I also never got this arrogant vibe from the Raptors core en route to a Championship, or from the Leafs core despite both them and the Jays score being roughly the same ages. I think the Leafs core going to the playoffs early and often and losing has kept them from being overly confident like the Jays. Plus most of this country and media is just as eager to tear down the Leafs as build them up, whereas building up the Jays is a constant project by Rogers.

The likes of Vladdy, Bo, Lourdes, Kirk, Manoah, and Romano have all been hyped up to no end by Rogers. They've pushed the "this is our year" thing hard, desperate to re-live the 2015-2016 Jays who were exciting, contended, and won in the playoffs and had the whole country behind them and buying merch and jacked up ticket prices. Despite all the propaganda they can't will the Jays into a playoff run, and as such have only two sold out playoff games to show for their effort.

And as far as cockiness goes, maybe I'm making a mountain out of a molehill but I've never cared for how the Jays treat middle of the season wins compared to the Raptors or Leafs. Every bloody time they win at home Vladdy or someone has to come out with the tub of water and soak whoever Hazel or Arash is interviewing. Like come on, it's the middle of July, grow up. I'm not an "I hate fun" guy, the jacket for instance is more than fine, the goofing off in the dugout is fine, but Christ let's save the post-game dunking for wins in actual important games, something this team hasn't managed to do in four tries now. Don't recall the Lowry and DeRozan/Leonard Raptors celebrating every regular season win like this, nor the Leafs, not that they’re examples to hold up for playoff success.
 
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The more I watch the replay of the collision, the more I wonder what the heck was going through Bo's head in those few moments.

The #1 rule outfielders learn when playing the position is to ALWAYS concede to the centerfielder the moment he calls for the ball, even if you have the clearer path or are perched right under it.

Same applies to the middle infield. Bo's running back, into the short outfield, looking over his shoulder, and does not change his route at all even though he must have seen and/or heard Springer barreling in. And on top of all that, he throws out his right arm knocking Springer's head in doing so.

Dumb dumb dumb. :facepalm:
 
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This hurts. Without Bo there, you make the play.

82 feet needed and Springer got 84 feet and that was with him peeling back to avoid Bo. Springer probably covers 90 feet without Bo there.

That definitely would have been an iconic play in Jays history instead it’s an iconic play in Jays history.


That damn Bautista/Goins pop up vs KC and now this. Amazing.
 
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I honestly think Schneider forgot Santana is a switch hitter.

Righties hit .291/.342/.476 vs Mayza. Lefties hit .162/.205/.297 vs Mayza in the regular season.

Why would you bring Mayza into the game in that situation to face a guy who can hit RHP when righties have been teeing off him?

Also Santana hits lefties better... .265 vs lefties vs .178 vs righties. So this looks really, really bad to me. Although more power against rhp in more ab's but this doesn't look like the right decesion to me. The ESPN broadcasters were also ripping Schneider to shreds for this decesion.
 
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I honestly think Schneider forgot Santana is a switch hitter.

Righties hit .291/.342/.476 vs Mayza. Lefties hit .162/.205/.297 vs Mayza in the regular season.

Why would you bring Mayza into the game in that situation to face a guy who can hit RHP when righties have been teeing off him?

Also Santana hits lefties better... .265 vs lefties vs .178 vs righties. So this looks really, really bad to me. Although more power against rhp in more ab's but this doesn't look like the right decesion to me. The ESPN broadcasters were also ripping Schneider to shreds for this decesion.

If your data is accurate than this matchup was a horrible decision. Worse, if the team didn't realize he's a switch hitter. I just searched his R/L split data and his era is 4.73 vs righties and 1.23 vs left handed batters in 2022. Wow...

T.O teams are coddled and protected from too much criticism. That's a recipe for mediocrity.
 
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If your data is accurate than this matchup was a horrible decision. Worse, if the team didn't realize he's a switch hitter.

T.O teams are coddled and protected from too much criticism. That's a recipe for mediocrity.
I don't know what the reason is but here's the data from fangraphs for Mayza:


SeasonHandednessIPERATBFH2B3BRERHRBBIBBHBPSOAVGOBPSLGwOBA
2022vs L22.0- - -78122133240019.162.205.297.221
2022vs R26.2- - -11530401614582125.291.342.476.347
 
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I don't know what the reason is but here's the data from fangraphs for Mayza:


[TABLE=collapse]
[TR]
[TH]Season[/TH]
[TH]Handedness[/TH]
[TH]IP[/TH]
[TH]ERA[/TH]
[TH]TBF[/TH]
[TH]H[/TH]
[TH]2B[/TH]
[TH]3B[/TH]
[TH]R[/TH]
[TH]ER[/TH]
[TH]HR[/TH]
[TH]BB[/TH]
[TH]IBB[/TH]
[TH]HBP[/TH]
[TH]SO[/TH]
[TH]AVG[/TH]
[TH]OBP[/TH]
[TH]SLG[/TH]
[TH]wOBA[/TH]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2022[/TD]
[TD]vs L[/TD]
[TD]22.0[/TD]
[TD]- - -[/TD]
[TD]78[/TD]
[TD]12[/TD]
[TD]2[/TD]
[TD]1[/TD]
[TD]3[/TD]
[TD]3[/TD]
[TD]2[/TD]
[TD]4[/TD]
[TD]0[/TD]
[TD]0[/TD]
[TD]19[/TD]
[TD].162[/TD]
[TD].205[/TD]
[TD].297[/TD]
[TD].221[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2022[/TD]
[TD]vs R[/TD]
[TD]26.2[/TD]
[TD]- - -[/TD]
[TD]115[/TD]
[TD]30[/TD]
[TD]4[/TD]
[TD]0[/TD]
[TD]16[/TD]
[TD]14[/TD]
[TD]5[/TD]
[TD]8[/TD]
[TD]2[/TD]
[TD]1[/TD]
[TD]25[/TD]
[TD].291[/TD]
[TD].342[/TD]
[TD].476[/TD]
[TD].347[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

I just did the split data search from rotowire and posted his ERA lines above. This honestly changes the discussion on this loss. Santana also confirmed, .265 ba vs lefties, .178 ba vs righties. Of course the argument "he has less power in the situation" has as much to do with facing far fewer left handed pitchers as anything else. The argument also doesn't fly when the bases are loaded and a long single or double could cost you dearly.

If the Jays were playing the stats, I couldn't argue with his decision to go with Mayza. It was late in Gausmans day and data is everything in baseball. Far more relevant than in any major sport.

To not get this matchup right...I don't even know what to say to that observation. It's Baseball 101. No wonder ESPN ripped him.
 
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I just did the split data search from rotowire and posted his ERA lines above. This honestly changes the discussion on this loss. Santana also confirmed, .265 ba vs lefties, .178 ba vs righties. Of course the argument "he has less power in the situation" has as much to do with facing far fewer left handed pitchers as anything else. The argument also doesn't fly when the bases are loaded and a long single or double could cost you dearly.

If the Jays were playing the stats, I couldn't argue with his decision to go with Mayza. It was late in Gausmans day and data is everything in baseball. Far more relevant than in any major sport.

To not get this matchup right...I don't even know what to say to that observation. It's Baseball 101. No wonder ESPN ripped him.
It was actually not a bad pitch by Mayza, but no way on earth you take out Gausman at that point.

Bichette needs to be a full time DH, this is the second time this season that he nearly killed someone going for a ball he had no business going for. He has no clue how to play defence apparently.
 
It was actually not a bad pitch by Mayza, but no way on earth you take out Gausman at that point.

Bichette needs to be a full time DH, this is the second time this season that he nearly killed someone going for a ball he had no business going for. He has no clue how to play defence apparently.
He is obviously not going to be a full time DH lol moving him to 2nd should probably happen though.
 
I'm a total fair weather fan these days ("Go 'Topes!") so forgive a stupid question: Does Springer match the culture of this group? Seems like a bit of a drama queen to be honest (not the collision really, it's just that it seems like every game I watched this year he goes eth dressing room with something only to reemerge in a few minutes).

Also, who's ball was that? Seems to me like the guy running towards it (Springer) should have taken precedent so it should have been on Bichette to make sure Springer didn't have it. And did either guy call it? I haven't gone through this thread so I assume I'm not the first to say that was the whole game right there in one botched play.
 
i was shouting “ don’t do that” at my TV when Vladdy pushed Teoscar out to take a bow after the second homer. Yes be excited, but the game was far from over. Frankly I was ,ore worried it would be poster material for today.

This team can be fun loving, but they need to get a little more serious. And Bo plays like the hot dog that runs over the girls position in co-Ed softball. He can hit but he’s awful defensively.
 
I'm just here to say that the bullpen didn't take an at bat in game 1. They didn't leave players stranded in game 1.

This team is really poor in many ways. If you compare them to the 90's back to back champion Blue Jays they don't even come close.

Yeah the bullpen is not great at all, but do they deserve all the blame?
 
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I wonder if you move Bo to 2B permanently and sign one of the star SS's this offseason. That's a universal thing in baseball that Bo keeps ignoring. Literally everyone is taught that the CF has priority, even pitchers know who has priority on those things. This guy either has rocks for brains or doesn't care about his teammates safety. They're running full speed...how do you grow up the son of a major league player and still not know this is beyond me.
 
I wonder if you move Bo to 2B permanently and sign one of the star SS's this offseason. That's a universal thing in baseball that Bo keeps ignoring. Literally everyone is taught that the CF has priority, even pitchers know who has priority on those things. This guy either has rocks for brains or doesn't care about his teammates safety. They're running full speed...how do you grow up the son of a major league player and still not know this is beyond me.
I would put all of our $ and prospect capital into pitching not a SS. Like we need 4-5 new pitchers.

Manoah, Gausman, Berrios, Romano, Garcia, Bass, Cimber, Pop and Mayza can return but we need about 2 high end relief pitchers and 2 starters.
 
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