WJC: 2021 Russia Roster Talk

[VVP]

That is a welcome improvement, but you're still only halfway back to the investment level of the late Soviet Union: Gross fixed capital formation (constant LCU) - Russian Federation | Data

Russia is moving in the right direction in terms of construction. That is pretty much the thing for me - if I hear a Russian complain, no jobs, no money - I tell everyone, either you are lazy or dumb. If you can't find career anywhere else Russia has unbelievable opportunities in construction or design, 3D modeling etc. Problem is that lots of people are not interested.

 

[Zine]

I would agree with that - Russian skill development is remarkable given how few players they have to begin with. I would hope that Fetisov in his desperation doesn't try to fix what is not broken.

I have something I'm curious about - perhaps birthplaces are reported differently in Russia, but I've noticed that almost all of the players are coming from large cities. Like it is surprising to me when I see that Voronkov is from Angarsk, which is only ~200k people, because everyone else is from a bigger city. In Canada we have hockey rinks in every town, whether they have ~10k people or ~100k, and occasionally players like Cozens come from those small places. It is actually becoming a rarity in Canada though because those smaller places don't get advanced skills training. It used to be that a disproportionate number of players came from small prairie towns, like Gordie Howe did. Now they disproportionately come from Toronto, because you need to be there and have a lot of money in order to hire skills coaches. For instance in my home province of Nova Scotia, we have Mackinnon, Crosby, and Marchand from Halifax, where half the population lives, while the players from the rest of the province are incapable of winning a tournament at any level. Russia needs to add more rinks but expanding skills training to cover that area is a whole other problem.

Take into consideration that while hockey is the #2 sport behind football, it's popularity is still very regional. In many ways it mirrors the United States, except that the national team is universally popular when they play. I mean for all intents and purposes Moscow isn't even a hockey city.
You can't think of 'sports entertainment' in Russia the same way you do in North America.

Of course that somewhat goes hand-in-hand with building rinks and spreading the game, but it's not that simplistic.

 

[ViD]

Fetisov says dumber and dumber things with the age. Him and Larionov have done a lot but OMG, we need fresh faces.

He said “hockey is like the 10th most important thing for me now, I’m all in the ecology research at this moment”. Lolz.

 

[kabidjan18]

I think Russian hockey is in a fine place.

A lot of Russian prospects are the more project types but that's fine. I think, all clubs are kinda learning still how to develop these projects, but once someone cracks the code you'll get a lot of good players.

And people criticizing the old man...please...he's allowed to hyperbole just like you are.

 

[majormajor]

Take into consideration that while hockey is the #2 sport behind football, it's popularity is still very regional. In many ways it mirrors the United States, except that the national team is universally popular when they play. I mean for all intents and purposes Moscow isn't even a hockey city.
You can't think of 'sports entertainment' in Russia the same way you do in North America.

Of course that somewhat goes hand-in-hand with building rinks and spreading the game, but it's not that simplistic.

I can understand that. And I don't expect a lot of kids to play hockey in Rostov-on-Don. But what about all the small cities in Siberia? It is too cold and wet for football much of the year, yet there is no hockey rink. Siberia (and I mean the whole area from Urals to Pacific) has the same population as Canada, and the cities are colder than even Canadian cities. I suspect in those areas if there is a rink and some equipment, boys will play.

 

[Antonglk]

So all good right? 4th place is good. Russia is fine. Is this correct? Well deserved defeat for all those mediocre patriots who are OK with 2nd and 3rd places.

 

[Zine]

I can understand that. And I don't expect a lot of kids to play hockey in Rostov-on-Don. But what about all the small cities in Siberia? It is too cold and wet for football much of the year, yet there is no hockey rink. Siberia (and I mean the whole area from Urals to Pacific) has the same population as Canada, and the cities are colder than even Canadian cities. I suspect in those areas if there is a rink and some equipment, boys will play.

That's the long-term plan though. It won't happen overnight. Because with investment in rinks you also need existing interest from a population/city. Hockey's boom in the American SW is a good example of this. It took decades after the NHL's expansion into these areas for rinks to start sprouting up in these places.

 

[Fantomas]

One of the worst Russian teams I've seen.

 

[VVP]

Can't believe there will be another year of this hockey.

 

[Antonglk]

One of the worst Russian teams I've seen.

As many patriots say here, that's OK, Russia is fine. 4th place is also good. We still in semis.

 

[VVP]

That was a team without brains.

 

[Fantomas]

As many patriots say here, that's OK, Russia is fine. 4th place is also good. We still in semis.

Many people seem to think Bragin's track record is good. What a joke.

 

[Zine]

These guys are trash. Beyond unacceptable.

 

[majormajor]

That's the long-term plan though. It won't happen overnight. Because with investment in rinks you also need existing interest from a population. Hockey's boom in the American SW is a good example of this. It took decades after the NHL's expansion into these areas for rinks to start sprouting up in these places.

I suppose I just could be ignorant of what Siberian boys like to do. Without hockey what else is there? Jump in the snow? Probably video games like everywhere else. I say the government should support the rinks, you don't have a ton of middle-class and wealthy parents to support them like in North America.

 

[Antonglk]

This is philosophy of mediocracy and stability. Rotenberg yesterday told that we have stability, our results - medals every year is good. This was Rotenberg, who made all these changes and hired Larionov. This is his system that doesn't work. Next year will be better for Red Drandulet? Yeah, we will believe.

 

[Antonglk]

I suppose I just could be ignorant of what Siberian boys like to do. Without hockey what else is there? Jump in the snow? Probably video games like everywhere else. I say the government should support the rinks, you don't have a ton of middle-class and wealthy parents to support them like in North America.

I believe we could just ignore the fact, that in 2011 we had a bunch of new born superstars without all those rinks. Of course these rinks built on government money via bribes and corruption will make russian red machine great again.

 

[DivochLubo]

Take into consideration that while hockey is the #2 sport behind football, it's popularity is still very regional. In many ways it mirrors the United States, except that the national team is universally popular when they play. I mean for all intents and purposes Moscow isn't even a hockey city.
You can't think of 'sports entertainment' in Russia the same way you do in North America.

Of course that somewhat goes hand-in-hand with building rinks and spreading the game, but it's not that simplistic.

Guess in hockey you need a lot of money. You need rinks, you need money for equipment, parents also need time to bring kids to rink. Of course do not forget that you need best coaches to teach youngest skill without loosing fun, and those need to be well educated and well paid.

 

[VVP]

Hockey coaching consists of two major parts - skills development and in game coaching. Russia's skills development is fine but we are now behind again in the level of head coaches the we have. Again and again we find people who are not good at it. Larionov, Plyuschev, Nemchinov back 12 years ago (he could be better now), then that idiot from 2005 who Bragin assisted to.

FHR should develop 5-7 people who can coach at the highest level. Today we are being outcoached by Finns, Canadian, Czech and even by 30 yo kid from Sweden. Pretty sure American team was unlucky, if they played Russia now they would have killed them.

Scary thing is the more time the players spent with Larionov the worse they played. I think the team would be better without a coach, just someone who managed the lines would do.

 

[VVP]

Guess in hockey you need a lot of money. You need rinks, you need money for equipment, parents also need time to bring kids to rink. Of course do not forget that you need best coaches to teach youngest skill without loosing fun, and those need to be well educated and well paid.

Russia trippled number of rinks in the last 20 years. Skills development is great, there are lots of skilled kids in Russia now and much more to come. Our game coaching is way behind.

 

[Fantomas]

Russia trippled number of rinks in the last 20 years. Skills development is great, there are lots of skilled kids in Russia now and much more to come. Our game coaching is way behind.

Russia isn't developing centers or defensemen.

 

[Antonglk]

Hockey coaching consists of two major parts - skills development and in game coaching. Russia's skills development is fine

If you say that those rich kids, who can't shoot, can't skate fast and can't fight - "fine" then not sure what is "not fine" for you.

Just a note, this team has 6 players from rich SKA.

 

[Antonglk]

Russia trippled number of rinks in the last 20 years. Skills development is great, there are lots of skilled kids in Russia now and much more to come. Our game coaching is way behind.

and no gold in 10 years. and now 4th. You must be kidding me again. How coach can make these kids shoot with better accuracy? This is completelly wrong development.

 

[majormajor]

I believe we could just ignore the fact, that in 2011 we had a bunch of new born superstars without all those rinks. Of course these rinks built on government money via bribes and corruption will make russian red machine great again.

I suppose if they all come out like Omsk Arena then my plan will fail.

But c'mon let's not make it seem like it is impossible for the government to fund functional rinks in Siberia.

 

[VVP]

Russia isn't developing centers or defensemen.

Yep, this is continuation of the problem. Podkolzin is a natural born center. How the heck he ended up a wing I have no idea. It is because he had at some point a coach who probably couldn't put two and two together and convince him.

 

[Zine]

I suppose I just could be ignorant of what Siberian boys like to do. Without hockey what else is there? Jump in the snow? Probably video games like everywhere else. I say the government should support the rinks, you don't have a ton of middle-class and wealthy parents to support them like in North America.

Now you're just thinking like a Canadian. Hockey isn't always the 'thing to do' in other places of the world. Hockey isn't as engrained in Russian culture like it is in Canada.

We've made gigantic strides in recent years in terms of building rinks and making the game more accessible, but it's a long-term process. It's not as easy as "if you build it, they will come".