Speculation: 2021-21 LA Kings News/Rumors/Roster discussion

[Sol]

no

google what detailed means

Im sure even you are competent enough to use the internet

 

[Sol]

exactly lol -- he literally said nothing.
Easy to endlessly complain and say "do something". Any drunk no-nothing fan can do that. It's another thing to back up those comments with actual ideas.

View attachment 447588

Why don't you try reading rather than being a clown? Lol

 

[tomd]

How is Jakub Vrana a better 5 on 5 scorer than Jack Eichel?

Jack Eichel ES points

19 YO - 35 in 81 games
20 YO - 33 in 61 games
21 YO - 42 in 67 games
22 YO - 56 in 77 games
23 YO - 50 in 68 games
24 YO - 9 in 21 games

Jakub Vrana

20 YO - 2 in 21 games
21 YO - 24 in 73 games
22 YO - 43 in 82 games
23 YO - 40 in 69 games
24 YO - 31 in 50 games

Vrana played in Washington on teams that finished 3rd, 9th, 5th, 4th, and 5th in GF. Eichel's Buffalo teams have finished 26th, 25th, 31st, 23rd, 21st and 28th in GF. I just don't know how on Earth anyone could come to the conclusion that Vrana is a better 5 on 5 scorer than Eichel.



Yeah I know the feeling. It's like being called

"a hater"
"having an irrational hatred of a player"
"player living in head rent free"
"no idea what you're talking about"
"just a stat watcher who's never seen him play" (my fav since I was prob only person on this board who actually saw him play in person at the time)

All of this because I questioned the ceiling of a player and said I'd prefer players taken after him, the second part a view that is basically consensus now if you place any value on expert consensus (you don't have to if you don't want to, just saying)

The optimists can say some annoying things to the pessimists sometimes too. It's a two-way street.



I know this is directed at someone else.

- I look at the history of Stanley Cup winning teams and I immediately determine that with Kopitar and Doughty's age making it unlikely they ever will still be elite players when QB develops I immediately realize I need to add more high end players to my championship window which I hope to open in 2023-2024 with possibly 2022-2023 if things fall into place. I have a surplus of youth, but really only one potential game changer, I have to fix that this summer by either acquiring a game changer or putting myself in position to draft one the next two drafts.

- I absolutely do not bring in any late 20's bridge players trying to chase a wildcard, worst possible thing the franchise could do would be to pick 12th or get trounced by Vegas in a quick series like in 2018. That season set this franchise back greatly and I do everything I can to not repeat it.

- I know that a 24 year old franchise 1C is available on the trade market, a unique situation that happens perhaps maybe once every dozen years or so in the NHL. I call up Buffalo and say, I am not trading QB but would be open to a combination of any of my other surplus assets. If Buffalo is open to doing a deal without QB I do everything I can to make it happen. The most important and necessary pieces to a successful franchise are world class centers. If I get this deal and I trust the projections and the historical returns on #2OA picks I have loaded center depth for the rest of this decade, probably the best in the NHL. I make QB's life insanely easier by breaking in behind Eichel and AK and then I make AK's life easier playing a lesser but still important role as he enters the twilight of his career once QB emerges as the Kings 2C. I also buy some insurance on the possibility of QB being say a RyJo type player, if that happens I can still win SC's with Eichel and RyJo caliber down the middle, I am winning no cups and the rebuild is likely torpedoed if QB is RyJo staying the course since I don't have a 1C.

- If the Rangers offer Kaako or the Ducks offer Drysdale and I miss out on Eichel and assuming no other young star player is available then it's time to have a talk with Drew. I explain to Drew that I made a run for Eichel but wasn't comfortable giving up such a huge young piece like QB and that I am not going to make black hole moves to try and win a WC spot to appease him. I ask Doughty if he would be open to a trade to a contender for a couple more kicks at the can, something he isn't going to get in LA for the next 3 years atleast. The return on Doughty and losing his salary is secondary to putting the Kings in a great position to be picking at the top of the 2022 and 2023 drafts which will provide me with two chances to draft the type of players necessary to win Stanley Cups in the NHL. With my team being so young and on ELC's I am easily able to retain money on Doughty making it easier for a team like Toronto, Pittsburgh or Colorado to both acquire him and to increase the assets I get.

- If Drew was bluffing on his previous threats and doesn't want to move I immediately tell Kopitar that I am going to attempt to move on from him as he no longer really fits into the plans for the next time the team is ready and he only has a limited NTC. Like with Doughty before, the return and cap space are less importantl than being really bad the next two seasons. Although I do think that if the Kings retained (and they could) that they can get a pretty nice haul that includes a decent young player. In an ideal world Drew wants to move on and Anze ends up being the Kings Yzerman or Sakic and never plays a game elsewhere but if Drew won't go the tough decision has to be made, Anze is a historical Mount Rushmore player for this team but at the end of the day he is still just an asset like anyone else.

-If I trade Drew or Anze and go very young, I keep Brown, giving him an extension beyond next season as a veteran presence in the room with the experience of winning championships for this squad. I want Brown around when Wright, Bedard, Fantilli type comes on board. In addition to that I sign 1-2 non-impact veteran players who are good in the room and willing to be on awful teams, much like Dean did with Scott Thornton.

I'll keep it short...If Blake can't meaningfully improve the team this summer and tells 11 and 8 that they no longer fit into the organization's plans then he is absolutely the wrong GM to be running this team...or any team quite frankly.

 

[DryIslandBartender]

Eichel is a great talent, but if you look at AK as a 1st rounder in a redraft, that is three first round picks, a #4 defenseman and two 2nds.

Pretty rich considering he wants out and needs a neckyotomy.

Rich yes, but that’s the going rate for a top 5-10 nhl player. We’re not going to get Eichel for free, and nobody has said his neck problem is career ending. It’ll be treated, a lot of great players have recovered from serious injuries because they have access to the best round the clock care on the planet. He can go to Europe like Peyton Manning did and come back even stronger.

 

[Docgonzo]

All this and yet no one see the Tampa Bay Lightning as the perfect trading partner?
$ millions over the cap, UFAs that need to be resigned...
maybe we can work out a big trade that helps both teams and I’m not just talking salary..
Kings
Killorn+Palat+ Serg

TBL
8OA+Kempe+Walker+Kupari+?

Tampa won’t trade Sergachev and Palat and Killorn have to waive their NTC to come here. Why would they?

 

[Lt Dan]

You have actually used more energy with snarky replies than it would have been to answer the question. Here's how easy it is Sol, this is without any googling. just off the top of my head

I have a feeling a forward prospect will surprise us a make a team. Leaving us needing to add
We need two top 6 forwards and a top 4 D.

We have what 20 mil on cap space.
I would be working the phone right now seeing who needs to give up salary like Vancouver for L Erickson in Vancouver.the buyout is 3m I would weaponize some cap space but probably not anything more than 2 years. We could do this to do a buyout or as part of a trade to get a player at a big discount.

I would talk to Buffalo for D help and maybe Renhart. I think there is going to be changes there
Otherwise
The goal is to bring in a 20-30 goal scoring scoring winger. hopefully someone with a little more size via trade. Hopefully a Stoll and Greene type of deal with a different kind of d-man and forward.

I think we could get a forward in free agency. I would love to get Brandon Saad. But people will be available this year.

 

[DryIslandBartender]

With Eichel injury history I wouldn't give that much up.I would just move on from Eichel than giving up that much..

Kings are going to have to though, because nobody is getting him for a pick and a prospect. You look at the trades in nhl history, and the going rate for a top player is expensive.

We’re not getting the Patrick Roy special here.

 

[No Name The Nameless]

I like Eichel, and do hope the Kings trade for him (if the price is reasonable). But can we stop calling Eichel a superstar/generational player. He’s Columbus era Rick Nash except he whines and complains and has a neck injury. Or even Tavares, on the side of very good but not great.

When the Kings trade for Eichel and he’s sidelined for a bit because of injury, do we bring back the “do the Kings even know what a MRI is” jokes from Vilardi’s back panic?

Eichel is absolutely, positively and unequivocally a superstar. Holy crap. This is why we argue. Sensationalism leads to strong rebuttals. It's coming from both sides.

I think the only common denominator is that we all want Eichel IF the price is right.

 

[No Name The Nameless]

Regarding an Eichel trade, people forget that Buffalo probably wants NHL ready, or close to NHL ready players rather than prospects. They already have the top pick this year and are picking early in the second and third etc.

Probably looking at Turcotte, AK, Roy, 2022 1st, 2021 2nd, 2022 2nd.

Easy pass for me.

 

[MBH]

The Kings need 5v5 scoring. Vrana is better than Eichel, Laine, and Reinhart there. He would probably come cheaper than any of those 3 too since he is an RFA. He is fast, young, and has experience in the playoffs.

Yeah, but Detroit isn't giving away Vrana and won't let him walk.
So you'd have to pay.
Here are your 5 on 5 scoring leaders in LA last year.

Athanasiou 2.03
Kopitar 1.76
Vilardi 1.67
Iafallo 1.63
Carter 1.61
Brown 1.61
Anderson-Dolan 1.56
Moore 1.52
Andersson 1.41
Lemieux 1.35
Lizotte 1.22
Kempe 1.07
Wagner 1.07
Grundstrom 1.01
Amadio .29

Breaking the league down into 4 levels (277 NHL forwards with 500 minutes or more)
70 per level

Level 1
NOBODY.
-----
AA just misses.
Nobody else even close
-----------
Level 2
Athanasiou 2.03
Kopitar 1.76
Vilardi 1.67
Iafallo 1.63
--------------
So 4 Kings qualify for the top half of the NHL.
-----
Level 3
Carter 1.61
Brown 1.61
Anderson-Dolan 1.56
Moore 1.52
Andersson 1.41
Lemieux 1.35
----
So a majority of the team is in that 50-75 percent range.
-----
Level 4
Lizotte 1.22
Kempe 1.07
Wagner 1.07
Grundstrom 1.01
Amadio .29
---

The guy I'm surprised with is Kempe. That's 4th line production from a guy who is often on Line 1.

Granted, with a better defense, everyone's offense should improve somewhat.

 

[Lt Dan]

Eichel is absolutely, positively and unequivocally a superstar. Holy crap. This is why we argue. Sensationalism leads to strong rebuttals. It's coming from both sides.

I think the only common denominator is that we all want Eichel IF the price is right.

After Deadmarsh, I am very skeptical of injured players.
Neck injuries are no joke either.

 

[kings11]

Tampa won’t trade Sergachev and Palat and Killorn have to waive their NTC to come here. Why would they?

Maybe a slight extension for both to agree to come here.. the west is weak and they’d help us make a serious playoff push..
Serg or Cernak might be moved to take $20 mill in salary from TB.. consider it a semi sweetener since we’d be sending cost controlled, NHL ready players to Tampa

 

[Kudelski37]

How is Jakub Vrana a better 5 on 5 scorer than Jack Eichel?
66 ev goals over the last 3 seasons for Vrana and 67 ev goals for Eichel his last 4 seasons. Vrana played less games, has a higher shooting %, and played less minutes a game. Eichel has averaged over 20 minutes a game in his career. Vrana played a career high of 15 minutes a game this year. Plus, the Caps probably didn't face back up goalies as often as the Sabres.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

Rich yes, but that’s the going rate for a top 5-10 nhl player. We’re not going to get Eichel for free, and nobody has said his neck problem is career ending. It’ll be treated, a lot of great players have recovered from serious injuries because they have access to the best round the clock care on the planet. He can go to Europe like Peyton Manning did and come back even stronger.

Sure, but Peyton Manning was a free agent. That's a different deal than giving up 4 1st-round-caliber assets.

 

[Kudelski37]

Kings are going to have to though, because nobody is getting him for a pick and a prospect. You look at the trades in nhl history, and the going rate for a top player is expensive.

We’re not getting the Patrick Roy special here.

The Kings don't have to since they don't have to trade for Eichel. Let the Ducks wipe out their prospects to get the guy that has missed more than 10 games in half his seasons.

 

[Bandit]

Am i the only guy who still wears my Kings Sean Avery jersey?

No. I’m sure Avery still wears his too.

 

[Docgonzo]

Eichel is absolutely, positively and unequivocally a superstar. Holy crap. This is why we argue. Sensationalism leads to strong rebuttals. It's coming from both sides.

I think the only common denominator is that we all want Eichel IF the price is right.

Eichel is #33 in the NHL in scoring for the last 5 years. Old ass Kopitar is #25. Eichel maybe a star but he is no means a superstar.

 

[Kingspiracy]

What contract would you offer ufa Oleksiak? He'd add some beef to the d core without being a liability. Limited offense but a left D with a huge wingspan and about the right sort of age, 28.

4x 4.5? or 3x5?

 

[johnjm22]

Eichel is #33 in the NHL in scoring for the last 5 years. Old ass Kopitar is #25. Eichel maybe a star but he is no means a superstar.

This is an intentionally misleading stat. Kopitar played more games.

Eichel is tied for 14th in points per game over the last 5 years while playing on the worst team in the league.

Kopitar is 37th.

 

[Johnny Utah]

What contract would you offer ufa Oleksiak? He'd add some beef to the d core without being a liability. Limited offense but a left D with a huge wingspan and about the right sort of age, 28.

4x 4.5? or 3x5?

We have big MacD - he’s a younger Oleksiak.

 

[King'sPawn]

This is an intentionally misleading stat. Kopitar played more games.

Eichel is tied for 14th in points per game over the last 5 years while playing on the worst team in the league.

Kopitar is 37th.

He's also primarily been used in an offensive role, averaging 25 seconds on the PK/game since he joined the league. And averaging 3:36 on the power play.

Kopitar has averaged 2:01 on the PK in the same span, and 2:53 on the PP.

Even if you want to overlook all that... Durability is kind of important. Especially if you're talking about parting with blue chip assets.

 

[Vino]

We have big MacD - he’s a younger Oleksiak.

Oleksiak is a lot better hockey player.

 

[Docgonzo]

This is an intentionally misleading stat. Kopitar played more games.

Eichel is tied for 14th in points per game over the last 5 years while playing on the worst team in the league.

Kopitar is 37th.

Ok so Eichel has 299 points in 294 games.
Wheeler has 367 points in 366 games.

Is Blake Wheeler a superstar or just a star?

 

[Docgonzo]

Even if you want to overlook all that... Durability is kind of important. Especially if you're talking about parting with blue chip assets.

Out of the top 50 scorers in the past 5 years only 3 haven’t played over 300 games.

Malkin
Stamkos
Eichel

Kopitar has played 71 more games than Eichel in the past 5 season of just the regular season.

Availability is the best ability.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

I've said it before, when you're talking about the best of the best, health is a 'skill' as it often plays into not only availability but consistency.

It's one of the things that comes up re: Doughty and IDGAF if you say Prime Karlsson is better if he only shows up 30 games out of 82 since he's hurt, recovering from hurt, or just for whatever reason not prime the rest of the time. Give me Doughty, or in this case the ol reliable Kopitar who has played what was 97% of his possible NHL games last time I checked.