WJC: 2020 Canada Roster Talk Part II

[CycloneSweep]

Anyone think they will give Rodrigue a game at all or is he just here incase of injury!

 

[JackSlater]

Anyone think they will give Rodrigue a game at all or is he just here incase of injury!

Since they didn't even play him in the exhibition games, y0u'd have to think that he'll get one game as a backup and that's it.

 

[Michael Brand Eggs]

Second year in a row where he is outscoring Veleno. Hope he keeps it up, good stuff.

Why make this comparison? Veleno played a really good game. He doesn't need to be Hayton to be good. Let's remember that one guy was taken 5th and the other was taken 30th. Expectations are different.

 

[newfy]

Yeah, feels like I always like Hayton more than most too. He has such a “pro” game.

Disagree on a pro game. I think he tries to do too much and its a lot of stuff that really wont fly in the pros. Cant knock him, he had 2 goals but like others have said I really just dont see it with him. I mean, yes hes good but he definitely doesnt look 5th overall good out there.

Why make this comparison? Veleno played a really good game. He doesn't need to be Hayton to be good. Let's remember that one guy was taken 5th and the other was taken 30th. Expectations are different.

Yeah anyone who watched that game and came away more impressed with Hayton than Veleno was watching through some nice homer goggles for sure. Veleno got blatantly robbed of a second assist on the empty net goal where he caused the turnover that sealed the game. So it seems pretty dumb to be talking about how Hayton is outscoring Veleno again this year, they both should have 2 points. Theres a reason Veleno was out there at the end of the game and not Hayton.

Hayton didnt have a horrible game but coming in here bagging on Veleno and saying he should be taken off Lafrenieres line and that hes being outproduced is pretty funny.

What were their times on ice?

 

[Heldig]

Disagree on a pro game. I think he tries to do too much and its a lot of stuff that really wont fly in the pros. Cant knock him, he had 2 goals but like others have said I really just dont see it with him. I mean, yes hes good but he definitely doesnt look 5th overall good out there.

I am not sold on his offensive upside (though he created a lot of chances today) so the 5th overall may have been too high. All the other elements of his game - positioning, IQ, skating, defensive awareness, leadership - are absolutely pro level. At worst he should be a solid #3 C with a long career.

 

[GreytWun]

Despite all the doubters, Hayton has a monster game and leads the team by example with 2 goals.

Second year in a row where he is outscoring Veleno. Hope he keeps it up, good stuff.

Hayton wasn’t even that great. Veleno notched 1 assist, had some really good defensive plays and was 70% in face offs.

 

[McYoungGuns]

(when you’re on a tenor page, add .gif to the end of the url and hit enter, then copy/paste that new url)

 

[McYoungGuns]

It’s ok son, there’s always next year.

fathherrrr I did it

 

[TheGoldenJet]

Why make this comparison? Veleno played a really good game. He doesn't need to be Hayton to be good. Let's remember that one guy was taken 5th and the other was taken 30th. Expectations are different.

People have been pushing this comparison since the early goings of the part I thread (see the reach of a post just below yours).

While what you write about expectations is true, let’s not forget Veleno received CHL exceptional status and had high expectations earlier in his career as well. Additionally, many would say he raised his draft stock last season as well (and I am inclined to agree), so the 30th vs 5th comparison shouldn’t be taken purely at face value, as many now believe Veleno goes higher than 30th in a re-draft. In short, it’s good for Veleno to be compared to Hayton at all, even if Hayton comes out on top more often then not in these comparisons.

 

[Janne Niinimaa]

All this, plus he made some nice plays out there, including with Lafrenière whenever the two shared the ice together. Just a smart, underrated C who is one of the best players at this tournament.

The guy who hasn’t shown me anything yet is Byfield. Scoreless in 3 straight games playing with top players on his line, he needs to step it up.

I agree on Byfield. I've seen flashes of what he's capable but he needs to put it together. I would.t be opposed to him getting a more sporadic 5v5 role with some PP time.

With Byfield not really performing as expected, I have no issue with Hayton in the top 6 (I had him centering the 3rd line if Dach was made available). I still expect more chance creation offensively from Hayton given the fact that hes being deployed as the most important Canadian player.

Positionally sound
Very good defensively
Hard on the puck
Went to the front of the net

Are you this critical of all the other players that missed the net on opportunities? Or whiffed on a pass? Or do you have something against Hayton specifically?

ps HE SCORED 2 GOALS!

I'm mainly critical of guys that are overused and given more opportunities than they deserve. He was double shifted at one point on both power plays. He's being placed in situations that I don't necessarily think his play warrants. I think Veleno has actually shown more despite him not having as many points.

Now I'm not saying he shouldn't be on the team or that he shouldn't be captain. I think he deserves to be there but I expect more from a guy who is coming from the NHL and I expect his play to be up to par with the opportunities he is given. If not, I don't think he is good enough to get a free pass. Veleno, McMichael and Byfield (if he picks up) can take over his role offensively.

 

[hockeyanalyst99]

2 emergency drills with intensity should be run by the coaches on Friday:

1. Break out drills with 3 forwards apply pressure.
2. PK drill with apply pressure to the puck carrier and angling and shot block.

 

[newfy]

People have been pushing this comparison since the early goings of the part I thread (see the reach of a post just below yours).

While what you write about expectations is true, let’s not forget Veleno received CHL exceptional status and had high expectations earlier in his career as well. Additionally, many would say he raised his draft stock last season as well (and I am inclined to agree), so the 30th vs 5th comparison shouldn’t be taken purely at face value, as many now believe Veleno goes higher than 30th in a re-draft. In short, it’s good for Veleno to be compared to Hayton at all, even if Hayton comes out on top more often then not in these comparisons.

Lol @ me if youre going to call my post a reach. Theres a reason Veleno played 4 more minutes than Hayton yesterday and youre in here bagging on him and saying how much better Hayton is. Hayton scored 2 goals, he also continues to make frustrating plays that everyone in this thread except you point out constantly. One 1 timer goal on a PP where he doesnt even have to move doesnt all of a sudden automatically absolve him from some of these plays. Yes, he had a solid game overall, yes he also made some frustrating plays which many have pointed out. There is no reason to come in here and say he is outscoring Veleno (because he really shouldnt be) and because Veleno played a hell of a game yesterday. 4 more minutes of ice time including setting up the goal that sealed the win, winning every crucial draw etc.

I dont think youll find many people who think Hayton came out on top of the comparison yesterday even with his 2 goals. I'm starting to think youre related to him or hes a friend of yours or something.

 

[Nostradumbass]

I am not sold on his offensive upside (though he created a lot of chances today) so the 5th overall may have been too high. All the other elements of his game - positioning, IQ, skating, defensive awareness, leadership - are absolutely pro level. At worst he should be a solid #3 C with a long career.

So a Ryan Strome?

 

[Dominance]

@Dominance, what did you think of Lavoie's game? Do you still want him off the team?

I posted this in the GDT, but it is unheard of for a player of Lafreniere's age, size, and skill to play such a hard-working and physical game. He somehow manages to be both the most skilled and the hardest working player on the ice. Best prospect since McDavid in my opinion.

Lavoie is fitting pretty well on that line. I liked him a lot yesterday, he added to our team size and style, great buy-in. His play on our first goal will go unnoticed by many but was a perfect simple play to generate that chance. He’s at his best when he plays simply.

In Halifax, he’s consistently put up points but the engagement level is very streaky. It was against teams like USA and Russia that I was concerned about him. He looked good, albeit not particularly great, yesterday. I’m cheering for him to continue his quality play, just as I am for Dudas and Addison, two other guys I wasn’t thrilled to see on the team.

 

[JackSlater]

2 emergency drills with intensity should be run by the coaches on Friday:

1. Break out drills with 3 forwards apply pressure.
2. PK drill with apply pressure to the puck carrier and angling and shot block.

Definitely the second, particularly for Bernard-Docker.

 

[Isaac Nootin]

Man was Kevin Bahl an absolute monster yesterday. Best Dman for me by quite the margin. Not only the physical play, he was steady everywhere on the ice. So solid, complete confidence when he's on the ice.

 

[newfy]

Lavoie is fitting pretty well on that line. I liked him a lot yesterday, he added to our team size and style, great buy-in. His play on our first goal will go unnoticed by many but was a perfect simple play to generate that chance. He’s at his best when he plays simply.

In Halifax, he’s consistently put up points but the engagement level is very streaky. It was against teams like USA and Russia that I was concerned about him. He looked good, albeit not particularly great, yesterday. I’m cheering for him to continue his quality play, just as I am for Dudas and Addison, two other guys I wasn’t thrilled to see on the team.

I thought Lavoie was great. He didnt play a lot but to me he was really driving that fourth line and created a decent amount of chances in his limited time. It looks like Canada is getting an engaged Lavoie which is huge for them and the right choice for the team if hes playing like that.

Man was Kevin Bahl an absolute monster yesterday. Best Dman for me by quite the margin. Not only the physical play, he was steady everywhere on the ice. So solid, complete confidence when he's on the ice.

I've watched enough games of Bahl to get a read on how he plays the game and I think yesterday was clearly the most physical game i've watched him play. Hes always strong in the corners but I would never call him a hitter or even a physical player really. Hopefully he keeps that physical play going because if he can toss the Americans around like that, what are the European teams going to do against him?

 

[Jason MacIsaac]

Man was Kevin Bahl an absolute monster yesterday. Best Dman for me by quite the margin. Not only the physical play, he was steady everywhere on the ice. So solid, complete confidence when he's on the ice.

I disagree, I felt he struggled in open ice one on one. Smith, IMO, was by far the best defensmen and obviously the one Hunter leaned on most in the 3rd.

 

[jj cale]

Watched the replay of the game and Canada was pretty strong, looked far better 5 on 5 and it's a good skating team that looked physically bigger and stronger then the Americans while giving nothing up in skill at all. Need to keep our head in the game and cut down on penalties, especially in crunch time. When we do take some penalties which you can never be 100% at avoiding we must do a better job on the P.K. It was a good start overall.

I am sure the Russian coach will have talked to his players about their parade to the penalty box yesterday so if they get the message tomorrows game will be an even bigger test then the U.S as I still think Russia is the better team then them. Don't be surprised if our record after tomorrow has a blemish on it but if we continue to get better as a team and cut out some b.s we have a good chance to win.

 

[My3Sons]

I disagree, I felt he struggled in open ice one on one. Smith, IMO, was by far the best defensmen and obviously the one Hunter leaned on most in the 3rd.

I think Bahl was a bit indecisive on the PK at times and he was caught flat footed a couple of times but he also seemed to play very conservatively away from the boards. I think some of that may have been that every time he hit someone they fell down and he was wary of penalties. As it was he got called for a phantom one to my eyes.

 

[Jason MacIsaac]

I think Bahl was a bit indecisive on the PK at times and he was caught flat footed a couple of times but he also seemed to play very conservatively away from the boards. I think some of that may have been that every time he hit someone they fell down and he was wary of penalties. As it was he got called for a phantom one to my eyes.

Hesitation and poor gap control would be the easiest way to sum his weaknesses up. On international sized ice to be nit picking like this is probably a good thing. I knew this would be a challenge that will only make him better.

 

[ORRFForever]

Man was Kevin Bahl an absolute monster yesterday. Best Dman for me by quite the margin. Not only the physical play, he was steady everywhere on the ice. So solid, complete confidence when he's on the ice.

So New Jersey shouldn't be too upset?

 

[Chiarelli]

And without Hayton, we are talking about how Laf still needs to find his offence at the WJC level.

Lol. What game were you watching?

 

[TheGoldenJet]

Lol @ me if youre going to call my post a reach. Theres a reason Veleno played 4 more minutes than Hayton yesterday and youre in here bagging on him and saying how much better Hayton is. Hayton scored 2 goals, he also continues to make frustrating plays that everyone in this thread except you point out constantly. One 1 timer goal on a PP where he doesnt even have to move doesnt all of a sudden automatically absolve him from some of these plays. Yes, he had a solid game overall, yes he also made some frustrating plays which many have pointed out. There is no reason to come in here and say he is outscoring Veleno (because he really shouldnt be) and because Veleno played a hell of a game yesterday. 4 more minutes of ice time including setting up the goal that sealed the win, winning every crucial draw etc.

I dont think youll find many people who think Hayton came out on top of the comparison yesterday even with his 2 goals. I'm starting to think youre related to him or hes a friend of yours or something.

You’re reaching because I don’t think Veleno should have had that secondary assist on the empty netter as you claim. He swiped at a puck that then went off Dellandrea, which Laf picked up. Laf sent it back to Dellandrea for the goal, by IIHF rules there is no second assist on those plays (which is different than NHL rules). So you’re reaching (and incorrect) if you claim Veleno should have had two assists.

Also Veleno is getting more ice because he centers the best winger on the team in Laf. Being outscored by Hayton while having better wingers and more icetime is not exactly something to brag about.

 

[goonybird]

You’re reaching because I don’t think Veleno should have had that secondary assist on the empty netter as you claim. He swiped at a puck that then went off Dellandrea, which Laf picked up. Laf sent it back to Dellandrea for the goal, by IIHF rules there is no second assist on those plays (which is different than NHL rules). So you’re reaching (and incorrect) if you claim Veleno should have had two assists.

Also Veleno is getting more ice because he centers the best winger on the team in Laf. Being outscored by Hayton while having better wingers and more icetime is not exactly something to brag about.

the linemates fallacy is one of this site's sillier. Some players play better with others, in other situations, etc. The implication that Veleno would have no pts in Hayton's spot and Hayton would have even more pts in Veleno's is based on expectation, but there's not a whole lot of hard evidence to support it.

I'm sure Hunter has a decent idea of how these players work with one another, and I'd bet that Veleno speaking french is a huge boost for Lafreniere. Especially since he's the only centre on the team that can communicate effectively at the speed they're playing.