2019/20 Roster Thread XXIX

[Tripod]

There’s no bias in pointing out that 5 on 5:

Hagg 425.55 minutes, 1 goal, 6 assists, 7 points, TOI% QoT 26.61

Ghost 582.35 minutes, 2 goals, 3 assist, 5 points, TOI% QoT 26.77

Sure seems like you are ACTING like Hagg is the superior player with that 5 on 5 point comparison.

 

[bobbythebrain]

He also wouldnt fire the worst coach in team history. Lets not look back on Hextalls tenure with rose-tinted glasses and ignore the issues. He had to go before we could move forward.

As for Fletcher, he's barely done anything yet. As far as major stuff goes, he's made a good trade (Niskanen), a mediocre trade (Braun), a polarizing signing that has so far improved the team (Hayes), nailed his first draft, and did a good job on all of the RFA extensions. He also called up Farabee and Frost quickly. Too soon to tell how his tenure will go though. It's not like he is Chiarelli or early Benning with his head up clearly up his ass.

Neither did Fletch...till he absolutely had too. Those timeout decisions were so crazy that you have to think he was just so rattled or he was forcing his firing.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but it is mine Fletch was legit gonna give Haks a chance and reevaluate in the summer

 

[Starat327]

"Getting hayes for cheap"


Whoo boy they keep coming.

 

[Tripod]

Neglected the goalie position , What . He drafted one every year and fairly high as well . He wanted to draft and get one from within instead of searching the UFA market and causing us to over pay . You have a cap in the show and just thinking you can just go sign a top UFA is just going to cause you pain else where .

You can pile on Hexy for a few things for sure , Hak and micro managing etc ... but the goalie thing is a reach .

Not moving on from a brittle Neuvirth was a big miss.

We gave him a 2 year deal coming off a .891 SV% season. That 2.5 million could have been spent on someone more reliable.

 

[baudib1]

Lots of good takes on Hextall here. My favorite was the one where he's like the Oilers but better at drafting and worse at tanking.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

What are you trying to say here? That Hagg is better than Ghost? His equal? Let's clarify exactly what you're trying to do.

I’ve explicitly stated what my reason is for comparing Ghost’s 5 on 5 stats with Hagg’s: To support my opinion that the team won’t miss Ghost nearly as much as many appear to believe.

 

[TCTC]

Neither did Fletch...till he absolutely had too. Those timeout decisions were so crazy that you have to think he was just so rattled or he was forcing his firing.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but it is mine Fletch was legit gonna give Haks a chance and reevaluate in the summer

Nah, I think Fletcher always had a bigger solution in mind. He added experienced players and he wanted an experienced coach. Hakstol was a failure and why would any new GM in his right mind keep a coach like that around?

 

[Beef Invictus]

I’ve explicitly stated what my reason is for comparing Ghost’s 5 on 5 stats with Hagg’s: To support my opinion that the team won’t miss Ghost nearly as much as many appear to believe.

Maybe you should try comparing defense too, as well as transition ability. Those are super important aspects of being a defenseman.

Anything else is disingenuous. And, it sure does look like you're trying to say Hagg is Ghost's equal or superior. Why won't they miss him? Because Hagg replaces him? Is that your belief?

 

[backburner]

There’s no bias in pointing out that 5 on 5:

Hagg 425.55 minutes, 1 goal, 6 assists, 7 points, TOI% QoT 26.61

Ghost 582.35 minutes, 2 goals, 3 assist, 5 points, TOI% QoT 26.77

problem solved... trade Hagg he is worth more

 

[Striiker]

Credibility Suicide: Episode 317

 

[bobbythebrain]

Nah, I think Fletcher always had a bigger solution in mind. He added experienced players and he wanted an experienced coach. Hakstol was a failure and why would any new GM in his right mind keep a coach like that around?

Maybe you're right. But it was really odd he didn't fire him immediately ....no?

You had an entire fanbase and media screaming for his head, and there was still enough time to attempt to salvage the season, yet they praised him in the media and took it to awhole other level bioling point.

A headscratcher to say the least.

 

[Lord Defect]

I simply don’t think trading Ghost is anywhere near the big loss many are making it out to be.

He’s an 18 minute 3rd pairing, PP2, non-PK defender with 12 points in 40 games.

Trading him for Getzlaf or even Carter would be an immediate substantial team improvement.

He’s NOT that, he’s being USED as that.

 

[TCTC]

Maybe you're right. But it was really odd he didn't fire him immediately ....no?

You had an entire fanbase and media screaming for his head, and there was still enough time to attempt to salvage the season, yet they praised him in the media and took it to awhole other level bioling point.

A headscratcher to say the least.

They probably were just trying to handle it as professionally as they could. The season was lost anyway and they had to replace Hakstol. AV probably wouldn't sign mid-season.
And firing Hakstol immediately also would've been a giant middle finger to Hextall.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Maybe you're right. But it was really odd he didn't fire him immediately ....no?

You had an entire fanbase and media screaming for his head, and there was still enough time to attempt to salvage the season, yet they praised him in the media and took it to awhole other level bioling point.

A headscratcher to say the least.

It wasn't odd at all. Fletcher had his hands full coming into a new situation mid-year. He had to familiarize himself with an NHL squad, AHL squad, ECHL squad, and the rest of our prospect pool. Throwing new coaching into the mix straight off the bat is a hell of a lot of upheaval to deal with at once.

Had they fired Hak with Hextall they'd have been making Fletcher's job harder to begin with. If Fletch had fired him first thing, he's making his own job harder.

 

[Tripod]

Credibility Suicide: Episode 317

"I barely even post about Ghost anymore"

-he said about a week ago

 

[LegionOfDoom91]

Both Ron Hextall & Chuck Fletcher aren’t/weren’t particularly good at their jobs. The routes might be different but the end game is the same.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

Maybe you should try comparing defense too, as well as transition ability. Those are super important aspects of being a defenseman.

Anything else is disingenuous. And, it sure does look like you're trying to say Hagg is Ghost's equal or superior. Why won't they miss him? Because Hagg replaces him? Is that your belief?

Not disingenuous at all. Don’t you think if you’re getting outproduced 5 on 5 by ROBERT HAGG, who has played 160 fewer 5 on 5 minutes, chances are you won’t be that insurmountable of a loss if you get traded?

It would be one thing if he were a defensive stalwart, but he’s not. He doesn’t PK. He doesn’t match up against the other team’s best players. He has *by far* the highest ZSR among the team D, showing they don’t trust his defensive zone play.

The disingenuousness is coming from those who are acting like Ghost is some kind of defensive stud.

 

[Starat327]

Lol. Stop it.

 

[Magua]

At 5v5, Hagg is outproducing Provorov too (7 points), who actually has the lowest 5v5 points/60 on the team. Hagg is beating every defensemen not named Myers in points/60.

That’s a whole lot of expendability back there. I mean that not not not not disingenuously.

 

[bobbythebrain]

It wasn't odd at all. Fletcher had his hands full coming into a new situation mid-year. He had to familiarize himself with an NHL squad, AHL squad, ECHL squad, and the rest of our prospect pool. Throwing new coaching into the mix straight off the bat is a hell of a lot of upheaval to deal with at once.

Had they fired Hak with Hextall they'd have been making Fletcher's job harder to begin with. If Fletch had fired him first thing, he's making his own job harder.

Ok. So tell me this. Fletch just came out and said he isn't risking development for wins with Frost.

But he risked it in a riskier and more illogical call up with Hart.........with a interim coach? Does that make sense?

I don't believe everything i hear, but i did believe it when they said they were still high on Hak and he has alot of respect around the league.

I couldn't believe my ears and certainly didn't agree w it...but i believed it. I believe the higher ups wanted to keep him

 

[Beef Invictus]

Not disingenuous at all. Don’t you think if you’re getting outproduced 5 on 5 by ROBERT HAGG, who has played 160 fewer 5 on 5 minutes, chances are you won’t be that insurmountable of a loss if you get traded?

It would be one thing if he were a defensive stalwart, but he’s not. He doesn’t PK. He doesn’t match up against the other team’s best players. He has *by far* the highest ZSR among the team D, showing they don’t trust his defensive zone play.

The disingenuousness is coming from those who are acting like Ghost is some kind of defensive stud.

Are you under the impression that offense is the only aspect of a defenseman's job, or what? And frankly, he is fine defensively. He's been able to carry Hagg and Myers defensively. He anchors those pairings while performing well. This was just covered pretty thoroughly, but I'm sure you still reject all statistics and results that don't confirm your feelings.

Again, you should clarify: Do you think Hagg is equal to or better than Ghost? Because your current single-minded obsession with a single aspect of play sure is making it seem like that's what you're trying to assert.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Ok. So tell me this. Fletch just came out and said he isn't risking development for wins with Frost.

But he risked it in a riskier and more illogical call up with Hart.........with a interim coach? Does that make sense?

I don't believe everything i hear, but i did believe it when they said they were still high on Hak and he has alot of respect around the league.

I couldn't believe my ears and certainly didn't agree w it...but i believed it. I believe the higher ups wanted to keep him

I think that you shouldn't put a lot of stock into anything a GM publicly says about what they're doing. Nor should you expect them to be consistent, nor even assume they have a reliable plan. These are very fallible humans who often make mistakes, or might just be winging the whole thing within something that is at best a framework rather than a master plan.

 

[Curufinwe]

Ok. So tell me this. Fletch just came out and said he isn't risking development for wins with Frost.

But he risked it in a riskier and more illogical call up with Hart.........with a interim coach? Does that make sense?

It's neither riskier, nor more illogical. Hart was called up to be a starting goalie, and he played well enough to stay in the league in that role. He got just as much playing time in the NHL as he would have done in the AHL.

That is not the case for Frost who gets a much bigger role on the Phantoms than he would get on the Flyers.

 

[wasup]

Not moving on from a brittle Neuvirth was a big miss.

We gave him a 2 year deal coming off a .891 SV% season. That 2.5 million could have been spent on someone more reliable.

I still liked Neuvirth when he was healthy but yea he was brittle . I think that's a Flyer thing . sigh

 

[deadhead]

But you know it's more complicated than that.

They want to get in the playoffs for playoff money
They want to get in the playoffs for hopefully more season tickets sold next year
They want to get in the playoffs to give the kids experience(which is why Frost should be called up)
They want to get in the playoffs so this PAST summers moves(Nisky, Braun and Hayes) don't look as wastes

We could get a "doubling down" move or 2. I just hope the initial reaction isn't "oh no"...or "wtf".

Of course, the summer moves were made with Hart coming off a promising spring, and Lindblom, Patrick and TK poised to take the next step up.
At that point, adding Hayes and veteran RHDs should have been enough to put them over the top and around 100 points.
While they were concerned about Patrick's migraines, I doubt they saw him missing the whole season in June.

Crap happens.