World Cup: 2016 World Cup — Team Europe

[mattihp]

This is extremely sad. This thread has produced 12 times the pages the Czech Republic roster conversation has (24-2). Anyway, what if all Slovaks and Swiss boycott this tournament? It could look like this.

T. Vanek - A. Kopitar - P. Thoresen
M. Boedker - F. Nielsen - N. Ehlers
M. Zuccarello - L. Eller - M. Grabner
M. Raffl - Z. Girgensons - J. Hansen
J. Mursak - L. Draisaitl - O. Bjorkstrand

C. Ehrhoff - P. Larsen
D. Seidenberg - K. Dallman
O. Tollefsen - K. Holzer
R. Hrabarenka - J. Holos

F. Andersen
T. Greiss
P. Grubauer

If the NHL thinks this team would have a chance, thats certainly not the case so have Swiss and Slovaks would be a must. If they really want extra teams that can compete, why not take the top IIHF ranked team (Canada at this time) and let them enter a second team. Any team that is ranked #1 could certainly have a second team that could compete. CAN, RUS, USA, SWE, FIN, CZE, SVK and CAN 2 wouldn't look that bad (although I would prefer a 20 team format).

I doubt the leftover team will have non-NHL players. Who pays for travel and insurance?

 

[Hardyvan123]

I really hope that not just the Slovaks, but also the Swiss, German, Austrian and Danish players (and the other players that probably will play on this team).

This is really stupid and I would be offended, especially if I was Slovakian or Swiss since they were the two best candidates to play in the World Cup, to not represent my own country.

Imagine if only Canada, Sweden, Finland, USA, Czech Republic and Russia were to play at the 2018 Olympics, then they send two IOA (Independent Olympians Athletes) teams, one from Europe and one U23 team from North America. Ridiculous!

Why throw the strawman up like that?

This tournament isn't the Olympics is it?

The fact of the matter is that by having a NA 23 and under team and rest of Europe it will give more parity to the tournament and it's an interesting thing to try.

How about watching the tournament unfold before giving it a fail with a very closed mind?

It is what it is and it isn't the WHC or the Olympics so get over it already.

 

[Canuckistani]

The fact of the matter is that by having a NA 23 and under team and rest of Europe it will give more parity to the tournament and it's an interesting thing to try.

Slovakia and Switzerland weren't exactly getting blown out 6-0 against the top teams up until now so there was no need to replace them. Slovakia made the semifinals in Vancouver, for crying out loud!

And why expect parity from two teams that have absolutely nothing to play for? It's not like Zdeno Chara will be blocking shots for "Team Leftovers."

 

[JackSlater]

Why throw the strawman up like that?

This tournament isn't the Olympics is it?

The fact of the matter is that by having a NA 23 and under team and rest of Europe it will give more parity to the tournament and it's an interesting thing to try.

That is no fact, it is a complete guess on your part. A fact is that Slovakia and Switzerland already hold their own in actual best on best competitions, as they are legitimate threats to beat any other team in the tournament.

How about watching the tournament unfold before giving it a fail with a very closed mind?

It is what it is and it isn't the WHC or the Olympics so get over it already.

It's idiotic before it even unfolds. It is being presented as an international best on best, which it is not given that multiple teams are not national teams and other teams are not able to select all players from that nation. We have already have several excellent Canada/World Cup tournaments, so why settle for this idiotic creation?

 

[Canuckistani]

It is being presented as an international best on best, which it is not given that multiple teams are not national teams and other teams are not able to select all players from that nation.

As a Canadian this infuriates me.

Imagine the 1987 Canada Cup without Mario Lemieux or the 2010 Olympics without Crosby, Toews and Doughty.

While Canada doesn't look to be too badly hurt by this new U-23 idiocy, it will make the first time that Canada will enter a "best-on-best" with an age restriction.

 

[JackSlater]

As a Canadian this infuriates me.

Imagine the 1987 Canada Cup without Mario Lemieux or the 2010 Olympics without Crosby, Toews and Doughty.

While Canada doesn't look to be too badly hurt by this new U-23 idiocy, it will make the first time that Canada will enter a "best-on-best" with an age restriction.

Best is the 1984 Canada Cup, when Canada wouldn't have had Gretzky, Bourque, Anderson, Coffey, Messier, Sutter, Fuhr, Yzerman. This thread isn't about Canada, but having this stipulation in effect would have significantly impacted the results of multiple best on best tournaments.

 

[HunterSThompson]

This is about money.

 

[Frank the Tank]

This is about money.

So are the Olympics and most things in life.

 

[HunterSThompson]

So are the Olympics and most things in life.

This is about money for the players and the NHL. It is not about national pride, the worthiness of the international tournament results, or the legitimacy of hardware received because of age restrictions.

 

[xxxx]

This is about money for the players and the NHL. It is not about national pride, the worthiness of the international tournament results, or the legitimacy of hardware received because of age restrictions.

or, it's because of love of the game? The NHL wants to have the most NHL players possible. That's not only about money. It's about quality. Besides, I'm not sure how much this is related to money. Would a world cup without those all star team generate any less money? Doubtful. I bet that many people would even argue the opposite. And the money goes to the NHL and NHLPA anyway.

 

[JackSlater]

or, it's because of love of the game? The NHL wants to have the most NHL players possible. That's not only about money. It's about quality. Besides, I'm not sure how much this is related to money. Would a world cup without those all star team generate any less money? Doubtful. I bet that many people would even argue the opposite. And the money goes to the NHL and NHLPA anyway.

The NHLPA gets more money if more NHL players participate.

 

[Hardyvan123]

Slovakia and Switzerland weren't exactly getting blown out 6-0 against the top teams up until now so there was no need to replace them. Slovakia made the semifinals in Vancouver, for crying out loud!

And why expect parity from two teams that have absolutely nothing to play for? It's not like Zdeno Chara will be blocking shots for "Team Leftovers."

Slovakia had exactly 11 position players in the NHL last year, they are a non factor in any best on best tournament.

Switzerland had 10.

Yes it's different but the tournament will actually be more competitive with a rest of Europe and an NA U23 team.

 

[FiLe]

Slovakia had exactly 11 position players in the NHL last year, they are a non factor in any best on best tournament.

Switzerland had 10.

A nation's prowess in any international tournament can not be directly concluded from the amount of NHLers they have. Otherwise Finland, for example, would not be leading the tally of total amount of medals won on best-on-best in the modern hockey era.

Yes it's different but the tournament will actually be more competitive with a rest of Europe and an NA U23 team.

What makes an international tournament competitive is not the quality of players - what's also required is the players actually giving a damn for the thing they're playing for. In international competition, it's the crest of the nation they represent. If you're doubting me, just listen to the players themselves - they talk about the Maple Leaf, the Finnish Lion, the Three Crowns... and what a special thing it is to pull on that jersey.

Team Europe Leftovers is no nation, and has no such crest. Same goes for Team Youngstarz. So it truly boggles the mind what kind of boneheaded logic it takes to make a claim that these players will give it the same effort as they do when they're actually representing their people. Or should they draw that same special feeling and motivation from representing the NHL's business interests?

 

[hallhopkinseberle]

Vanek-Kopitar-Gaborik
Tatar-Girgensons-Zuccarello
Bodker-Eller-Hossa
Niederreiter-Nielsen-Grabner
Hansen-Drastaitl-Jurco


Josi-Streit
Chara-Ehrhoff
Sekera-Meszároš


Andersen
Halak
Berra

 

[JackSlater]

Slovakia had exactly 11 position players in the NHL last year, they are a non factor in any best on best tournament.

Switzerland had 10.

Yes it's different but the tournament will actually be more competitive with a rest of Europe and an NA U23 team.

I am amazed that anyone buys the NHL's boneheaded "competitiveness" excuse for this tournament. Some people will apparently believe anything put in front of them. There is no issue with the competitiveness of best on best tournaments. Slovakia nearly beat Canada in the 2010 semi final, and Switzerland has a better record against Canada in NHL Olympics than USA does. Are they favourites? Of course not, but they are competitive.

Is the European Leftovers team going to fare much better? There is a talent increase over Slovakia, but cohesion (which is how the less talented teams compete) is going to be limited, and motivation is questionable. The Young Gunz have no NHL goaltender, no number one defencemen, no cohesion from playing together over the years, no system in place that the players grew up together playing, no experience at the highest level of hockey outside of Saad, and once again little motivation.

Will these gimmick teams fare better than Switzerland or Slovakia would have? Possibly, but there is more than enough reason to think not. Should they even be involved in a supposedly international tournament? Definitely not.

 

[xxxx]

The NHLPA gets more money if more NHL players participate.

Sounds logical, but is there any info about this?

 

[ForumNamePending]

Slovakia had exactly 11 position players in the NHL last year, they are a non factor in any best on best tournament.

Switzerland had 10.

Yes it's different but the tournament will actually be more competitive with a rest of Europe and an NA U23 team.

Actually Slovakia had 12 position players last year and Switzerland had 11 (although 4 of them played less than 20 games)...

Finland showed up in Sochi with a roster featuring 10 position players employed by NHL teams and left with a bronze medal.

The '10 Slovak team that finished 4th and was a late post away from taking Canada to OT in the SF and a period away from winning bronze had 11 position players employed by NHL teams on their roster.

The '98 Czech team had 10 position players employed by NHL teams and they managed OK.

Despite Switzerland's lack of NHL talent, over the past decade, they have as many blowout loses as Russia and Slovakia has as many as the Czech Rep, Finland, Sweden and the US.

It's the NHL/NHLPA's tournament and they can run it how the like, but the "company line" doesn't hold up well to scrutiny.

 

[FiLe]

Finland showed up in Sochi with a roster featuring 10 position players employed by NHL teams and left with a bronze medal.

11, actually.

But yeah, like I said earlier, this guy is making a fool of himself by claiming it's the number of NHLers who will turn a country into a factor.

He's also seriously underestimating the motivation factors. Slovakia and Switzerland could easily field teams that could be about as competitive as a bunch of guys who instead of finding the inspiration from playing for their crest have to find it from playing for the glory and bursting coffers of the en-aech-ell.

 

[Canuckistani]

Slovakia had exactly 11 position players in the NHL last year, they are a non factor in any best on best tournament.

Switzerland had 10.

The Czechs won gold in 1998 with a roster than was mostly non-NHLers.

Yes it's different but the tournament will actually be more competitive with a rest of Europe and an NA U23 team.

If you think that you can replace national pride with the Leftovers and an age group then I don't know what to tell you.

You don't seem to have the slightest idea as to what makes international hockey what it is.

 

[mattihp]

Why not team Quebec instead of Team Leftovers?

 

[1Gold Standard]

Slovakia had exactly 11 position players in the NHL last year, they are a non factor in any best on best tournament.

Switzerland had 10.

Yes it's different but the tournament will actually be more competitive with a rest of Europe and an NA U23 team.

just curious, but to defend this Toronto non-star event so vigorously, one would have to be, imho, on the NHL payroll... I'm curious as to how much the NHL is shelling out to buy support... because even though I think this event is nothing but a dog's breakfast, for the right price I could be convinced to throw my support behind it. I don't know, 3 or 4 million is all it would take...peanuts. everybody has their price and that would certainly top up the retirement fund nicely.

 

[Elvs]

Slovakia had exactly 11 position players in the NHL last year, they are a non factor in any best on best tournament.

Switzerland had 10.

Yes it's different but the tournament will actually be more competitive with a rest of Europe and an NA U23 team.

Switzerland in 2010 Olympics:
Group loss 1-3 vs USA
Group loss 2-3 (SO) vs Canada
Quarter final loss 0-2 vs USA

Switzerland in 2014 Olympics:
Group loss 0-1 vs Sweden
Group win 1-0 vs Czech Republic

Slovakia in 2010 Olympics:
Group loss 1-3 vs Czech Republic
Group win 2-1 (SO) vs Russia
Quarter final win 4-2 vs Sweden
Semi final loss 2-3 vs Canada
Bronze game loss 3-5 vs Finland

Slovakia in 2014 Olympics:
Group loss vs USA 1-7
Group loss vs Russia 0-1 (SO)

Both teams combined against 'the big six' (12 games):
3 wins
2 shootout losses
2 one goal game losses (excluding the SO games above)
4 two goal game losses
1 blowout loss

On paper, Canada could ice a better C team than Finland and the Czech Republic. So why not remove those nations too and let Canada have three teams, to make it more 'competitive'?

 

[Sanderson]

Some actual news about the team:

Franz Reindl, head of the Germany federation, was appointed GM of the European All-stars. He coached Germany in the 2004 World Cup. Ralph Krueger (formerly with Switzerland, Edmonton Oilers) will be the head coach.

source (in german): http://www.sport1.de/eishockey/2015...iter-vom-team-europa-beim-world-cup-of-hockey

 

[Paul4587]

This team makes me sick. Slovakia and Switzerland got shafted. I can't believe Bettman is going with two gimmick teams instead of two capable hockey playing nations.

Imagine if Canada loses to and is eliminated by the u23 team because of a huge game from McDavid. Seems stupid.

And what national anthem plays if team rest of Europe wins the tournament?

What a ****ing joke.

 

[Hesher]

Some actual news about the team:

Franz Reindl, head of the Germany federation, was appointed GM of the European All-stars. He coached Germany in the 2004 World Cup. Ralph Krueger (formerly with Switzerland, Edmonton Oilers) will be the head coach.

source (in german): http://www.sport1.de/eishockey/2015...iter-vom-team-europa-beim-world-cup-of-hockey

According to Slovak sources Reindl will be the president, Miro Satan the GM and Krueger the coach.