2016-2017 Kings Roster Talk Part IV

[CowMix]

That's not what he is saying. If LV signs Bishop then that satisfies the Kings' expansion draft requirement. So he is saying it would be equivalent to losing Cernak, not that LV is targeting Cernak.

wait what you can use UFAs in the expansion draft?

Edit: Interesting just read up on the rule, didn't know about this.

 

[BigKing]

Some guys on here are really having a difficult time comprehending a simple, calculated trade in Ben Bishop.
Did we need another not really, was Budaj wearing down? Absolutely, was Quick an injury risk having takijgvso much time to return from such a severe injury ?? Of course... Therefore, when we couldn't afford to trade for a much needed forward we settled on a going forward with 2 #1 goalies and hoping we could sneak into the playoffs... did it work, no it did not.. but it was a very good trade/try on DL's part and if LV doesn't try and sign him we could always trade his rights for a pick...
Now some also try to convince themselves that the Cernak deal was either a bad trade or a bad pick.. the truth is it was neither, he was passed up by other Dman and became expendable much like McKeown was and he's not doing great either... I trust our scouting when it comes to these deals and other than losing the 13th pick everything we've traded has turned out better for us!

Says he "trusts the scouting" when they throw 2nd round prospects away for nothing.

Forgets it is the same scouting that drafted all of these expendable players.

I can't even wrap my head around the bolded statement.

 

[YP44]

So part of the reason for trading for Bishop was to "save Quick" with a long term look at his health since they couldn't play him every game and they had little faith in Budaj.

Team is officially eliminated.

Quick is in net tonight.

may well call up Campbell and see how he fairs the last two days. I read that his game has drastically improved...although any worse and he would have been out of the AHL.

 

[Peter James Bond II]

I can't get on board with that.

The glut of young D in Ontario is currently on the Kings roster, at least those players that are expected to be NHL'ers.

Clague is a LHS as well.

Dean thought it would get the Kings in to the playoffs so he made the deal. They obviously aren't as high on him as when they drafted him, but I don't think Clague made him expendable.

More like the reality of missing the playoffs for the second time in three seasons made Cernak expendable.

Matt Roy has really emerged and from the same draft as Cernak....Roy is RH and just signed and playing with the Reign already. There's a lot of young D: Clague, Moverare, Roy, Reddekopp, and while MacDermid is a longshot...still could get a shot. He's one determined player. Oh, and Leslie and Lintuniemi.

 

[BigKing]

Matt Roy has really emerged and from the same draft as Cernak....Roy is RH and just signed and playing with the Reign already. There's a lot of young D: Clague, Moverare, Roy, Reddekopp, and while MacDermid is a longshot...still could get a shot. He's one determined player. Oh, and Leslie and Lintuniemi.

I understand there is a lot of young D. Thankfully they've seemingly been able to do well in later rounds with LaDue/Gravel and maybe Roy since they have apparently whiffed on McKeown and Cernak.

Lintuniemi is another 2nd rounder that hasn't blown anyone away.

Now, I know they take time and all. Here's the thing: If I say he's a bust right now, I'll get everyone telling me that big defensemen take time and he is only this old etc.

If DL trades him for a nothing rental, it will be that he hasn't developed, has been passed up by whoever we drafted most recently and we have enough defensemen in the system since DL is known as a guy that always says "You definitely can have enough defensemen."

This isn't directed at you, more just a statement on how the board handles this stuff. I feel like every team has a lot of young defensemen: they have a lot of young forwards too. Doesn't mean that anywhere from all to none of them are NHL players though.

 

[Herby]

Good post.

What you are talking about is the good old Colten Teubert defense. Who cares if he sucked ass in junior so bad that as a 1st rounder he wasn't worthy of going to the AHL as an 18 or 19 year old. People failed to acknowledge that when he used to be defended.

If a guy goes two years in a row without making any progress he is probably going to be a bust, just the way things are. Doesn't matter how old you are and where you were drafted.

 

[BigKing]

Good post.

What you are talking about is the good old Colten Teubert defense. Who cares if he sucked ass in junior so bad that as a 1st rounder he wasn't worthy of going to the AHL as an 18 or 19 year old. People failed to acknowledge that when he used to be defended.

If a guy goes two years in a row without making any progress he is probably going to be a bust, just the way things are. Doesn't matter how old you are and where you were drafted.

How can I be talking about something that doesn't exist?

 

[Herby]

How can I be talking about something that doesn't exist?

LOL. Least talented 1st rounder I've ever seen.

The guy had his defenders on this board though, he went to the ECHL because the AHL defense was so loaded, not because he was awful.

And bigger defenseman like him take longer to developer
And he just needs to get meaner and learn to use his size.

 

[BigKing]

LOL. Least talented 1st rounder I've ever seen.

The guy had his defenders on this board though, he went to the ECHL because the AHL defense was so loaded, not because he was awful.

And bigger defenseman like him take longer to developer
And he just needs to get meaner and learn to use his size.

I love tough guys so I was fine with the pick at the time but it became clear pretty quickly that he was struggling.

Doesn't help getting dropped by Taylor Pyatt in pre-season when toughness is supposed to be your best asset.

Thankfully they were able to snag Voynov in Round 2.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

LOL. Least talented 1st rounder I've ever seen.

The guy had his defenders on this board though, he went to the ECHL because the AHL defense was so loaded, not because he was awful.

And bigger defenseman like him take longer to developer
And he just needs to get meaner and learn to use his size.

I remember Futa raving about him, Lombardi comparing him to a Bryan Marchment, and both being blown away by his swagger during interviews.

Guess they had some influence with the Canadian U20 team as well seeing how somehow Teubert was on a couple of those teams, paired with Thomas Hickey. I'm sure the Kings envisioned a future Niedermayer-Stevens pairing right there with those two.

 

[BigKing]

I remember Futa raving about him, Lombardi comparing him to a Bryan Marchment, and both being blown away by his swagger during interviews.

Guess they had some influence with the Canadian U20 team as well seeing how somehow Teubert was on a couple of those teams, paired with Thomas Hickey. I'm sure the Kings envisioned a future Niedermayer-Stevens pairing right there with those two.

I think he went #1OA in his junior draft.

Classic case of a young kid bigger and stronger than everyone else until everyone else grew up.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

I think he went #1OA in his junior draft.

Classic case of a young kid bigger and stronger than everyone else until everyone else grew up.

Too bad he wasn't mentally mature. I recall reading things about him having attitude problems in juniors, talking crap to other players about how he had an NHL contract.

Another example of a big, stiff defenseman with limited upside being taken high because foolish scouts think they're drafting the next Chris Pronger.

The Rangers learned that lesson as well with Dylan McIlrath. I'd harp on the Kings passing on Tarasenko in that draft, but the Rangers took McIlrath with the 10th overall pick, ahead of Cam Fowler.

It's almost as bad as Teubert being taken ahead of Erik Karlsson.

 

[BigKing]

Too bad he wasn't mentally mature. I recall reading things about him having attitude problems in juniors, talking crap to other players about how he had an NHL contract.

Another example of a big, stiff defenseman with limited upside being taken high because foolish scouts think they're drafting the next Chris Pronger.

The Rangers learned that lesson as well with Dylan McIlrath. I'd harp on the Kings passing on Tarasenko in that draft, but the Rangers took McIlrath with the 10th overall pick, ahead of Cam Fowler.

It's almost as bad as Teubert being taken ahead of Erik Karlsson.

Was at the draft. Obviously wasn't happy about the trade up to get Forbort was more upset that Fowler fell to the Ducks and that they also got Etem.

At the time, it seemed like the Ducks one-upping the Kings again in their own building. Thankfully, Etem didn't come back to haunt us.

 

[kings11]

Says he "trusts the scouting" when they throw 2nd round prospects away for nothing.

Forgets it is the same scouting that drafted all of these expendable players.

I can't even wrap my head around the bolded statement.

When you consider that those second rounders were once 1st projected prospects who fell for various reasons then you'll understand that it's the same best player available approach that has also landed guys like Quick, Gravel, Martinez, Roy.. etc..
Wrap your head around this then, other than the core of a team every player and prospect is expendable. How's McKeown doing?? Projected 1sr rounder that the Kings got in the second and everyone thought he was a steal but has plateaued and is average... JDub for POS, Versteeg for Zykov was a good trade but of course DS didn't like him, and so on...
so how about you quit your whining about guys that have been surpassed by other players

 

[BigKing]

When you consider that those second rounders were once 1st projected prospects who fell for various reasons then you'll understand that it's the same best player available approach that has also landed guys like Quick, Gravel, Martinez, Roy.. etc..
Wrap your head around this then, other than the core of a team every player and prospect is expendable. How's McKeown doing?? Projected 1sr rounder that the Kings got in the second and everyone thought he was a steal but has plateaued and is average... JDub for POS, Versteeg for Zykov was a good trade but of course DS didn't like him, and so on...
so how about you quit your whining about guys that have been surpassed by other players

We have different opinions of what constitutes a good trade.

Nice to go in the way back machine for the Williams trade. That trade has nothing to do with sending 2nd round picks for rentals, never mind the 1st rounders that have gone out for rentals as well.

Point remains that you don't knock the scouting for making poor draft choices but praise them for giving them away for nothing.

 

[kings11]

We have different opinions of what constitutes a good trade.

Nice to go in the way back machine for the Williams trade. That trade has nothing to do with sending 2nd round picks for rentals, never mind the 1st rounders that have gone out for rentals as well.

Point remains that you don't knock the scouting for making poor draft choices but praise them for giving them away for nothing.

What I'm telling you is that you can't knock them when the guys they snagged in the 2nd round were surefire 1st rounder leading up to the draft and considered steals for the Kings... But just like any other sport with drafts, it's really a crap shoot and your only "surefire" picks are usually your 1st rounders which we've lacked...
Also, the reason to bring up JDub is simple, the Kings felt they could compete and made the move just like they did for Lucic (which I didn't like) , Sekera(which I did) , Bishop ( I understood why they did it ) and Versteeg who I thought should have been resigned ..
DL went for broke and the team didn't capitalize on it... now, as in starting with this draft you have to look at the big picture and reload the pipeline.... acquire more picks, shed salary and give the kids a chance...we'd be no worse for it as our core is still playoff caliber...

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

If they were surefire 1st rounders, there must be a reason why they dropped to the 2nd round, and that doesn't make them "surefire" picks. Just because a publication has them ranked highly shouldn't mean anything.

Williams wasn't a UFA rental. He was still in his mid 20s and entering his prime. It is completely unlike the other trades you mentioned. Trading for Williams is closer to comparison with the Carter trade.

 

[KingsHockey24]

Daryl Sutter pissed that Jordan Nolan wasn't at practice lol.

He'll be gone by next season.

 

[Nizar]

Daryl Sutter pissed Jordan Nolan wasn't at practice lol.

He'll be gone by next season.

Who? Sutter or Nolan? Or both?

 

[Peter James Bond II]

Roster talk:

Good to see the kids get some icetime and play more freely last game.
Shore, Dowd and Brodzinski all played well.

I saw Shore play at Denver U several times (and it was a treat when St Cloud was there , as I got to see Dowd and Gravel as well) and Nick is looking more like the player we drafted...and he emerged the last yr in Manch, scoring 20 goals in 38 games there.
Then in training camp, 14-15, looked good. I attended the pre-season game in Denver where O'Reilly spun around with Voynov doing nothing alongside him the last 20 feet - and put it past Jones, to end the game in OT....anyway, Shore was our best forward that night. He was fast, making plays at top speed, creating scoring chances and scored a goal....that game was the last time he was seen playing like that. The game against Edmonton, he was closer to that player. I sincerely believe DS has neutered him and have turned him into defensive first, second and last type of player...and be good in the faceoff circle.

I bet if DS is replaced, we see the best Nick Shore and possibly 15 goals, 35 pts. Maybe 3rd line center. Heck, he's at 6 goals 11 assists now. Not too horribad, for this team. My new fear is that Vegas will see this and take him over Dowd, McNabb, etc.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

I know we're not privy to behind the scenes stuff, but I have a hard time buying that Nolan of all people is milking an injury.

I'm tired of Sutter.

 

[BigKing]

Don't think he is milking it but Sutter is putting it out there that he can't rely on the guy.

I'm Nolan's biggest fan probably, but the truth is that he can't stay healthy. He has barely fought this year as well. Sutter might think there is some "crusher/rusher/usher" type stuff happening with him.

Who knows.

I'm just hoping for some Tkachuk punishment tonight.

 

[WHOneedsSOX]

I know we're not privy to behind the scenes stuff, but I have a hard time buying that Nolan of all people is milking an injury.

I'm tired of Sutter.

Apparently Nolan is still dealing with a hamstring injury. No reason to risk it at this point in the season.

Side note, I had no idea Nolan was already 27 years old (28 this year) and this is already his 6th NHL season. Man time has flown by.

 

[BigKing]

Apparently Nolan is still dealing with a hamstring injury. No reason to risk it at this point in the season.

Side note, I had no idea Nolan was already 27 years old (28 this year) and this is already his 6th NHL season. Man time has flown by.

Yep.

The magic of 2012 was a long time ago.

Three years of awesome followed up by three years of ****.

 

[head eyes]

I know we're not privy to behind the scenes stuff, but I have a hard time buying that Nolan of all people is milking an injury.

I'm tired of Sutter.

We all know how important these next few games are, what with the fight for the playoffs and all. No time for pansies and their injuries.

Or maybe he's mad no one will be able to get Tkachuk back.