Prospect Info: 2015 21st overall - Colin White (C/RW) USNTDP, going to Boston College

[Othello*]

Oh man Andre Burakovsky would fit right in with the Sens.

 

[Larionov]

I like Konecny a ton, but I freely admit that's a homer thing. Watching him play for the 67s (probably saw 5 games this year) I see a very complete, NHL ready player who has a great work ethic and, thanks to Jeff Brown, a 200 foot game. The knock on him is injuries - his size and game reminds many of Gilbert Brule, and scouts feared that he would end up exactly like Brule did, peaking in junior and struggling with the physicality of the NHL night after night. Clearly the Sens had the "Brule" tag hung on Konecny - time will tell if that's accurate or not.

 

[freddy61]

Tim Murray said he will score 30 goals in this league.

and then under his breath he added.... Even if it takes him 10 years to do it.

Sorry that was just too good to pass up.
--------------------

I trust Dorion.

Although he's moved up to Assistant GM he is still very much involved in scouting. He said there were only 2 guys that they drafted that he didn't get to watch the rest he saw multiple times and spoke to those around them to confirm his opinion. Although they work as a team and all the amateur scouts have a say he says he reserved the right to override his chief scout on the 1st round pick(s) since he's pretty much seen them often too. The way they get along, I doubt he has had to override anyone but it shows how important drafting right for the top picks is to him.

Dorion looks like the next GM for sure. With untested kids no one can be 100% right all the time but they seem to stick to certain criteria. During the draft I heard mention of a kid who scores a lot but is not a team player because he doesn't involve his teammates he dropped pretty far it seems. Also it's possible certain picks are made based on projected future needs.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

I think, when we look at picking 1-dimensional, pure high end skill guys over decent skill + character....it's more of a position of where we are in the draft.

There are a lot of 1-dimensional elite skill guys who go in the top 5 in most drafts. That is the kind of one way skill you want to get. But once you exit the top 10 in most drafts, those kind of skill guys start to become less "projectible" as NHLers. That's when you need to start transitioning towards guys who have more than one golden tool in the toolbox.

What I mean is, if the typical draft had that many first line superstar type guys, that we could grab one picking after pick 15 on a regular basis, we would have a league full of them by now....right?

Where we are, you really need to focus your first and second round picks on guys who have a solid foundation that you can work with and build into something better. That's why you need kids with multiple tools in the toolbox....a more complete game means less things that need a complete overhaul, and more time to fine tune the skills that are there and move forward.

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

Guys look at White's production in WJC-17 and WHC-18 and look at his corresponding +/-

Ridiculous numbers. He has skill. Consider the points he got this year while losing 30 points and illnesses all year and that just means he still had enough skill to keep him in convo for 1st rounder.

I wanted Konecny badly too but after hearing this about white, he sounds like a more sure-fire NHL player while not being that far in terms of ceiling.

 

[Othello*]

I fully expect White and Bracco to tear up the NCAA with Boston College. Unfortunate that Bracco had to be drafted by the Leafs

 

[danishh]

the quote (forgot which scout it was) was something along the lines of:

talent is god given
skill is gained through practice/hard work/repetition

I get the distinction he's making. Using his terminology, i wish we took players with more talent, and gambled on their ability to work hard and use it.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

That's why you wouldn't make w good manager I guess. Taking a 20 goal head case locker room cancer over a 15 goal character player is the dumbest thing I've heard all weekend.

Mantha is already looking terrible in the pros. Have you heard his team talk about him lately? Burkas sky is skilled, but not a high end player by any means. Lazar is a skilled player with a goal scorers touch who plays all three zones and wins and leads at every level. Literally a dream prospect and without a doubt he was blue chip. He's a better prospect than Konecny at the same age. Third line projection? Give me a break. Tim Murray said he will score 30 goals in this league.

Haha "that's why you wouldn't make a good manager".
I think some of us are just a little bummed that konecny wasn't taken. We've watched him play. Love his style. 67. And kinda shocked that we went another route. Cuz you know. We are like, fans. Just hoping one of the MANY pro scouts disguised as HF posters could sell us on this Colin white. Cuz once the draft hit pick 16 I was jumping up and down think we would get 1 of barzal Connor or konecny. I like the chabot pick quite a bit. But I don't see why we took white. I feel as though a lot of our players are already play his style. And I feel our team is really missing some dynamic presence that I felt konecny could bring.

 

[Sens Rule]

the quote (forgot which scout it was) was something along the lines of:

talent is god given
skill is gained through practice/hard work/repetition

I get the distinction he's making. Using his terminology, i wish we took players with more talent, and gambled on their ability to work hard and use it.

Well we have 3 players in Hoffman, Stone and Pageau that have tons of talent... That all worked tremendously hard to make the NHL because they needed to improve one skill. If skill can be related to size? Pageau plays like he is 230 lbs and is relentlessly physical and aggressive. He kinda maybe overcompensates for being so small?

So I guess the key is to pick a guy that has all the tools but one... And is relentlessly dedicated to fix that one part of his game he is weak at?

I totally do not like they idea of picking a guy that oozes talent and doesn't work hard though. Not being dedicated is a sign you will fail. Take a guy like Daigle... And all the top 10 picks like Brendl, Falloon... And on and on. The guys that aren't totally dedicated often fail even with out of this world talents. There are a lot of Mark Stone's and Borowiecki's that will take their jobs because while they might lack speed... Or in Borowiecki's case... Everything... Their desire is off the charts.

 

[Knave]

the quote (forgot which scout it was) was something along the lines of:

talent is god given
skill is gained through practice/hard work/repetition

I get the distinction he's making. Using his terminology, i wish we took players with more talent, and gambled on their ability to work hard and use it.

I think he actually disagreed with "talent is god given" and talked about putting in thousands of hours of hard work - and the guy he was referring to would do it or osmething.

Think Joe Sakic in his basement for thousands of hours shooting pucks until he perfected it.

 

[Sens Rule]

Haha "that's why you wouldn't make a good manager".
I think some of us are just a little bummed that konecny wasn't taken. We've watched him play. Love his style. 67. And kinda shocked that we went another route. Cuz you know. We are like, fans. Just hoping one of the MANY pro scouts disguised as HF posters could sell us on this Colin white. Cuz once the draft hit pick 16 I was jumping up and down think we would get 1 of barzal Connor or konecny. I like the chabot pick quite a bit. But I don't see why we took white. I feel as though a lot of our players are already play his style. And I feel our team is really missing some dynamic presence that I felt konecny could bring.

Konecny may well be an awesome player. The first 60 picks are all awesome players. We got to see Konecny in Ottawa for several years while the scouts follow hundreds and hundreds of guys for years all over the world.

With the Sens under Murray going local with many picks and guys they bring in by trades... Ceci, Prince... Clearly Ottawa considered Konecny seriously and did not think they should draft him at 18 or 21. Even the geekiest prospect nerd on HF who is a good judge of talent knows a small fraction compared to the entire senators scouting staff. And most of us... Especially myself know almost nothing about any of the draftees... While knowing a little bit about the 67's.

I mean everyone in Ottawa thinks Monahan, Toffoli, Couture.... And sees Konecny... Being like those guys... Maybe he will be similar or at least a great NHLer and the guys we drafted at 18 and 21 might be better still.

 

[Vesa Awesaka]

Well we have 3 players in Hoffman, Stone and Pageau that have tons of talent... That all worked tremendously hard to make the NHL because they needed to improve one skill. If skill can be related to size? Pageau plays like he is 230 lbs and is relentlessly physical and aggressive. He kinda maybe overcompensates for being so small?

So I guess the key is to pick a guy that has all the tools but one... And is relentlessly dedicated to fix that one part of his game he is weak at?

I totally do not like they idea of picking a guy that oozes talent and doesn't work hard though. Not being dedicated is a sign you will fail. Take a guy like Daigle... And all the top 10 picks like Brendl, Falloon... And on and on. The guys that aren't totally dedicated often fail even with out of this world talents. There are a lot of Mark Stone's and Borowiecki's that will take their jobs because while they might lack speed... Or in Borowiecki's case... Everything... Their desire is off the charts.

I love this quote awesome lol. Im not sure what to think. There are tons of players who work hard and will never make it and there are some players who dont work hard and make it although most players in the NHL do work extremely hard.

The sens said Filips Ahl didnt work hard this season and they think he knows he screwed up and thats why his draft stock fell

 

[Vaclav Varada]

I love this pick. Going into this season he was a top 10 guy. Close to top 5. Injuries and sickness slowed him down but when he got healthy he was pretty damn good in the tourny's he played in.

 

[QuietOnTheFront]

I hate that we picked the Captain of The WJC Team Canada team who already made the NHL as a teenager and was so good he kept earning a spot on the third line a year because he was better then a half dozen NHL veterans we had signed who played less minutes or were scratched.

I hate that we picked a player at 17 that a year later I watched the Team repeatedly choose to face Sidney Crosby defensively in the faceoff dot in a one goal game in the third period... And was at worst a draw in the faceoff dot with Crosby that game. I mean what a putz... He ended up a winger after being trusted as a centre vs Crosby to take defensive draws vs the best player in world... As a rookie.

I saw it live but my eyes must have decieved me?!?!

I can't believe that calling Lazar a third liner is even a thing. I mean he is already. At both wing and centre. Was he a bad centre? Somehow he was 49% in the dot... Unheard of as a rookie. Somehow he was a part of Stone and Hoffman going frim
The 4th line quickly to the third... To the top lines soon enough. Part of an extremely good checking line as a Winger. Took a vacation to the WJC and the best 17,18,19 players from Canada they make him Captain and play him with McDavid.

Playing uber-safe hockey as a teenager in your first season... Doesn't make you a forever third liner... It makes you GET TO PLAY IN THE LEAGUE. Drouin is almost certainly better... He was in
The stands because he is not capable of playing safe enough hockey for Tampa. I can almost guarantee Lazar is stapled to the 4th line for Tampa in the playoffs if he was there.

Lazar's is really safe so far... He is already an above average defensively and in physicality forward in the NHL. He got 8 goals this year and people say he is a "15 goal" player? At his best? Really? Who thinks that?

How is he not a top end talent type of prospect? Were we picking 3rd overall and went with a safe pick? We picked freaking 17th!!!!

To me Lazar projects to be a centre you play vs the absolute best line of the other team every shift and who can score some too. Whether he gets 60 points or 30 goals? Idk... I bet within 2 years he is the guy that is out every shift McDavid or Crosby or Stamkos is playing vs ottawa.

Was just re-reading posts over the last two days and I have to say you've been on fire. Keep up the level headed reasonable posts.

 

[Vesa Awesaka]

Dorion said Lazar is better offensively at wing.

I can get behind a lot of what you said about Lazar but if hes just a defensive player its a disappointing pick. I dont think Lazar ends up just a defensive player though

You imo are going to get the best offense out of Lazar on the wing and theres nothing wrong with that. This guy can be a very good goal scoring winger. You want someone to take draws against McDavid? Thats why you draft guys like Paul in the 4th. Not saying that Paul is a sure thing but Paul projects to be that type of players at the NHL level.


Lazar's skill is also underrated but he has been overcoached imo. The tools are there to be a good offensive player but it remains to be seen if he can develop that offensive mentality. He probably can as he did say he chose to play very safe this year because that was his role. He did say he was disappointed that he wasnt scoring much though

You could see some junior style plays in him. He got a fair number of breakaways this year and chose to go five hole on his back hand. He needs to learn what works and what doesnt at the NHL level.


Defensively hes already good for an NHL players. Not many young players have that level of defensive ability coming right out of junior

Also Lazar scored 6 goals this year not 8

Side note my friend played with Lazar. They went to hockey school together. He had some glowing reviews about him before the sens drafted him and before i knew who he was. Im not sure if my friend keeps in contact with him or knows him well anymore though. I went to university and his hockey career puttered out and he got a job in the oil fields. I havent talked much with him in the last while and i never thought to ask him about lazar or if he kept in contact with him. My friend also called Jamie Benn being a super star when he was drafted and would always pick him on NHL games when he was like a 59 overall prospect.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Dorion said Lazar is better offensively at wing.

Lazar has been overcoached.

I've seen you mention this a few times. Care to explain why you think he has been overcoached?

 

[Coco the Monkey*]

I've seen you mention this a few times. Care to explain why you think he has been overcoached?

Yeah it makes no sense. He doesn't even have to be coached because he knows spwhat he has to do on the ice more than any other player

 

[Vesa Awesaka]

I've seen you mention this a few times. Care to explain why you think he has been overcoached?

I kinda doubt i can explain it but ill try.

Because he had a more offensive mind set and developed into a safer player. His mentality went from being a top scorer to being more a two way guy. Thats not a problem but to me he took it to the extreme. I dont question his skill i question his creativity and his mentality. His tools are better then people say. He has soft hands and is actually very skilled he just didnt have the mentality to use them. He plays within a box. You can look back at his junior scouting reports and im sure some say he plays safe to a fault. So no its not just me saying this.

Lazar also could be a bit more of a playmaker, as he does show good vision and passing skill at times, but doesn’t do it often enough.

I remember when Mckeens asked Lazar this question awhile back

McKeen’s: You’re a talented offensive player, how important is learning to play defense, especially if you want to advance to the NHL level, and to be a more complete player?


It’s huge, and that’s why I’m learning, and taking pride in playing a better defensive game. It’s important to look after the defensive zone first, before transitioning without the puck. You can’t take any short cuts, it’s a lot of hard work, and paying attention to detail in practice. Winning the battles in the corner, blocking shots, and getting the proper defensive position on opposing players. The coaching staff have definitely stressed how important it is to play a good two-way game.


Now two way isnt bad but Lazar has more then enough skill to put up better numbers then people think he can. The only thing that holds him back is his mentality


Flaws/Aspects He Needs To Work On:

Sometimes errs on the side of caution when seams open in opposition defenses; could easily jump into the rush a bit more and take more chances

 

[usascout1]

I am paraphrasing so maybe i misinterpreted what he said. You might be better off watching the video and seeing if my interpretation is correct. He made a point of noting he believes White couldnt play to his full ability this year because of his illness. I think he said he had a spleen problem, Mono and a broken wrist

I have watched White for 2 years in the midwest, NCAA games and Internationally. This guy is very skilled. Actually highly skilled. When you play at the NTDP you play in a system and you stay in that system or you don't play. White also is extremely explosive but was pigeon holed into playing with Bracco for two years. White played the 200 ft game while Bracco waited on the Wall for White to get the puck up to him. White had to hump it back up into the play as Bracco waits at center ice. His job was to get to the net. If ever out in front of Bracco he had to slow down and wait. Bracco slows the game down and White had to control his various levels of speed to help make the line successful.

This past season White developed mono which he came tried to come back from to early which then caused him to relapse. He continued to play not realizing the mono caused his spleen to enlarge. He had to take more time off until his spleen recovered. The spleen caused him to drop a lot of weight. When he did come back he was obviously not as strong and couldn't take more time off until the season ended. He hurt his wrist during his comeback game against University of North Dakota. He continued to play with it hurt but couldn't shoot - hence why he was passing the puck off to Bracco and going hard to the net. It was all he could do. Wrist finally recovers and he gets some strength back by U18 worlds - he's then back to 75% and he dominates - Sweden, Canada and then the Golden goal in Finland in OT. USA played him 20 lbs underweight and not feeling well all season and he still managed a pt per game and was named 2nd best player overall on USA at U18 Worlds. He was only second to Auston Matthews.

Another side note. I saw him play against Barzal head to head several shifts, and White shut him down easily and out skated Barzal. He had a hat trick and killed the 5 on 3 for USA when score was 2-1 going into the 3rd. I think Ottawa will really enjoy this guy. One thing he is not is unskilled.

 

[usascout1]

I also meant to include this is the above post if we are going off something a scout inferred...http://www.ottawasun.com/2015/06/28/nhl-scouts-offer-high-praise-for-prospect-colin-white

 

[Vesa Awesaka]

I have watched White for 2 years in the midwest, NCAA games and Internationally. This guy is very skilled. Actually highly skilled. When you play at the NTDP you play in a system and you stay in that system or you don't play. White also is extremely explosive but was pigeon holed into playing with Bracco for two years. White played the 200 ft game while Bracco waited on the Wall for White to get the puck up to him. White had to hump it back up into the play as Bracco waits at center ice. His job was to get to the net. If ever out in front of Bracco he had to slow down and wait. Bracco slows the game down and White had to control his various levels of speed to help make the line successful.

This past season White developed mono which he came tried to come back from to early which then caused him to relapse. He continued to play not realizing the mono caused his spleen to enlarge. He had to take more time off until his spleen recovered. The spleen caused him to drop a lot of weight. When he did come back he was obviously not as strong and couldn't take more time off until the season ended. He hurt his wrist during his comeback game against University of North Dakota. He continued to play with it hurt but couldn't shoot - hence why he was passing the puck off to Bracco and going hard to the net. It was all he could do. Wrist finally recovers and he gets some strength back by U18 worlds - he's then back to 75% and he dominates - Sweden, Canada and then the Golden goal in Finland in OT. USA played him 20 lbs underweight and not feeling well all season and he still managed a pt per game and was named 2nd best player overall on USA at U18 Worlds. He was only second to Auston Matthews.

Another side note. I saw him play against Barzal head to head several shifts, and White shut him down easily and out skated Barzal. He had a hat trick and killed the 5 on 3 for USA when score was 2-1 going into the 3rd. I think Ottawa will really enjoy this guy. One thing he is not is unskilled.

Thats why i found what our scout said odd. He sounds like a solid candidate for a bounce back who will quickly raise his stock back to having a highier ceiling then a 2/3 line center that some have called him.

 

[Vesa Awesaka]

I also meant to include this is the above post if we are going off something a scout inferred...http://www.ottawasun.com/2015/06/28/nhl-scouts-offer-high-praise-for-prospect-colin-white

Yes.. this is the quote i found odd

"In my opinion, I think talent is God-given. Sometimes skill comes from thousands of hours of working your craft. When I look at him, he's the type of player, his skill will get better because he will spend all the hours necessary to building his craft and I think that's key

I assumed he's was already very skiiled after reading a bit about him and seeing his totals from previous years. He also was thought of very highly before this year

Sounds to me more like just a great player who fell because of a medical problem not necessarily lack of upside

 

[jbeck5]

Interview after the Norris, Karlsson says 'you know' about forty times. I guess he's a little slow too...

nah, he's too quick. He's slowing down to make sure we can keep up

 

[SenzZen]

I have watched White for 2 years in the midwest, NCAA games and Internationally. This guy is very skilled. Actually highly skilled. When you play at the NTDP you play in a system and you stay in that system or you don't play. White also is extremely explosive but was pigeon holed into playing with Bracco for two years. White played the 200 ft game while Bracco waited on the Wall for White to get the puck up to him. White had to hump it back up into the play as Bracco waits at center ice. His job was to get to the net. If ever out in front of Bracco he had to slow down and wait. Bracco slows the game down and White had to control his various levels of speed to help make the line successful.

This past season White developed mono which he came tried to come back from to early which then caused him to relapse. He continued to play not realizing the mono caused his spleen to enlarge. He had to take more time off until his spleen recovered. The spleen caused him to drop a lot of weight. When he did come back he was obviously not as strong and couldn't take more time off until the season ended. He hurt his wrist during his comeback game against University of North Dakota. He continued to play with it hurt but couldn't shoot - hence why he was passing the puck off to Bracco and going hard to the net. It was all he could do. Wrist finally recovers and he gets some strength back by U18 worlds - he's then back to 75% and he dominates - Sweden, Canada and then the Golden goal in Finland in OT. USA played him 20 lbs underweight and not feeling well all season and he still managed a pt per game and was named 2nd best player overall on USA at U18 Worlds. He was only second to Auston Matthews.

Another side note. I saw him play against Barzal head to head several shifts, and White shut him down easily and out skated Barzal. He had a hat trick and killed the 5 on 3 for USA when score was 2-1 going into the 3rd. I think Ottawa will really enjoy this guy. One thing he is not is unskilled.

Thanks for the background on him. I hope he pans out.

 

[guyzeur]

I have watched White for 2 years in the midwest, NCAA games and Internationally. This guy is very skilled. Actually highly skilled. When you play at the NTDP you play in a system and you stay in that system or you don't play. White also is extremely explosive but was pigeon holed into playing with Bracco for two years. White played the 200 ft game while Bracco waited on the Wall for White to get the puck up to him. White had to hump it back up into the play as Bracco waits at center ice. His job was to get to the net. If ever out in front of Bracco he had to slow down and wait. Bracco slows the game down and White had to control his various levels of speed to help make the line successful.

This past season White developed mono which he came tried to come back from to early which then caused him to relapse. He continued to play not realizing the mono caused his spleen to enlarge. He had to take more time off until his spleen recovered. The spleen caused him to drop a lot of weight. When he did come back he was obviously not as strong and couldn't take more time off until the season ended. He hurt his wrist during his comeback game against University of North Dakota. He continued to play with it hurt but couldn't shoot - hence why he was passing the puck off to Bracco and going hard to the net. It was all he could do. Wrist finally recovers and he gets some strength back by U18 worlds - he's then back to 75% and he dominates - Sweden, Canada and then the Golden goal in Finland in OT. USA played him 20 lbs underweight and not feeling well all season and he still managed a pt per game and was named 2nd best player overall on USA at U18 Worlds. He was only second to Auston Matthews.

Another side note. I saw him play against Barzal head to head several shifts, and White shut him down easily and out skated Barzal. He had a hat trick and killed the 5 on 3 for USA when score was 2-1 going into the 3rd. I think Ottawa will really enjoy this guy. One thing he is not is unskilled.

Why people are loosing weight when they have an enlarged spleen? They can't eat as much as they would normally:

"Some people with an enlarged spleen experience no symptoms and the problem is only discovered during a routine physical exam. If you are very slim, however, it may be possible for you to feel your enlarged spleen through your skin.

A common symptom of an enlarged spleen is a feeling of pain or discomfort in the upper abdomen, where the spleen is located.

You might also experience a feeling of fullness after only eating a small amount. This usually happens when the spleen becomes enlarged to the point that it presses on the stomach."