2014 CBJ Offseason Thread II (All proposals, "blog" rumors, speculation in here)

[CBJx614]

So it seems Minnesota isn't necessarily a lock for Vanek. If we can get him for 4 or 5 years, it gives us another top 6 player and also allows players like Bjorkstran, Rychel, and any other young wingers a chance to develop a little more without needing to be rushed on to the squad and would really force players to play their way on.

 

[major major]

So it seems Minnesota isn't necessarily a lock for Vanek.

I have little interest in Vanek after watching him all playoffs. He has no intensity.

If we can get him for 4 or 5 years, it gives us another top 6 player and also allows players like Bjorkstran, Rychel, and any other young wingers a chance to develop a little more without needing to be rushed on to the squad and would really force players to play their way on.

I don't think that's relevant. Those guys aren't going to take top line scoring spots in the next couple years either way.

 

[CBJx614]

I have little interest in Vanek after watching him all playoffs. He has no intensity.



I don't think that's relevant. Those guys aren't going to take top line scoring spots in the next couple years either way.

People also said Jenner wasn't going to be on the team any time soon either, yet he started his NHL career on the first line. Bjorkstrand like Atkinson probably won't be on the team until he can be a top 6 player full time, which definitely could be in the next few years if he fills out and proves this year in Portland that he is the man. As for Rychel if he just improves in a few areas he most definitely has the potential to play his way onto the team. Not saying he will be a top 6 player, but it's not unreasonable to think he could be in the next few years.

All that being said JK and JD aren't going to sign or trade for anyone who isn't the right type of player off and on the ice. It'll be interesting to see how things play out.

 

[Sore Loser]

Considering Howson wanted no part of Yakupov and multiple sources saying he'd never take him, probably the same.

Myself and a lot of others were pretty pissed when that news came out (not that it ended up mattering). Guess we were dead wrong.

If the team had the first overall pick, I think the pressure would have been on Howson to make Yakupov the selection. Popular demand among most (all?) fans was to take a forward; even with the second pick ... had it been the first pick, might ownership and/or someone above Howson (such as Darryl Katz has done in Edmonton) have forced Howson's hand? Even myself, perhaps the biggest Murray promoter on this board, was leaning more towards Galchenyuk because of the need for forwards in our system.

I tip my hat the Howson for making the pick that he thought was correct. We have yet to see the best of any of these players, but at least as of now, Murray certainly looks to be the gem of the bunch. Really goes to show how brilliant and underrated Scott Howson is (looking at you, Mayor Bee) ...

 

[EDM]

Scott Howson with the second pick took the overwhelming consensus second pick, Ryan Murray. So he is brilliant?

 

[Sore Loser]

Scott Howson with the second pick took the overwhelming consensus second pick, Ryan Murray. So he is brilliant?

Go back to the 2012 Draft threads and tell me he took the overwhelming consensus pick at #2.

 

[CBJx614]

Go back to the 2012 Draft threads and tell me he took the overwhelming consensus pick at #2.

I can honestly I was upset with the pick, I wanted Galchenyuk. And I actually don't think we could have gone wrong either way. But Murray is more of a backbone type player than Galchenyuk would have been for us.

 

[Sore Loser]

Did a quick thread search and found this gem prior to the lottery:

Edmonton wins it, drafts Yakupov and assembles greatest offense in NHL history.

...strikingly prophetic, while being completely off the mark. Impressive.

 

[major major]

I would love for this to happen, but the only issue I see with the moves to add Stastny and Eberle is that we are going to have to pay up for Dubi Foligno and Bob over the next two years when their contracts expire, and that could handcuff the team financially. Not to mention give raises to Cam, Calvert, Boone etc.

So I drank too much coffee and finally got around to projecting the Stastny-Eberle roster to 2017-18:

FORWARDS
Boone Jenner ($4.100m) / Ryan Johansen ($7.851m) / Jordan Eberle ($6.000m)
Nick Foligno ($4.100m) / Paul Stastny ($6.600m) / Oliver Bjorkstrand ($2.000m)
Matt Calvert ($2.500m) / Brandon Dubinsky ($6.000m) / Alex Wennberg ($3.000m)
Derek MacKenzie ($1.400m) / Mark Letestu ($1.250m) / Marko Dano ($0.925m)
Michael Chaput ($0.707m) / Nathan Horton ($5.300m)

I assume lots of guys will have earned substantial raises. It's a bit arbitrary choosing which of the prospects will pan out. Safe to say, if several of them make the lineup, that pushes other guys out, and if one or two of them quickly becomes a star, that means bigger RFA salaries than I have marked here. But we still have the flexibility to ship other guys out. In this scenario Horton is the odd man out, and there could be a trade or retained salary transaction if we need more cap room.

DEFENSEMEN
Jack Johnson ($4.357m) / David Savard ($2.250m)
Ryan Murray ($4.000m) / Cody Goloubef ($2.000m)
Tim Erixon ($2.251m) / Dalton Prout ($0.693m)
Veteran Insurance defender ($2.000m) /

I like this defence group a lot. I think they'll be well above average in 4 years.

GOALTENDERS
Sergei Bobrovsky ($5.625m)
Anton Forsberg ($0.655m)
BUYOUTS
Mike Commodore ($1.142m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(estimations for 2014-15)
SALARY CAP: $71,100,000; CAP PAYROLL: $76,704,476; BONUSES: $238,333
CAP SPACE (23-man roster): -$5,604,476

It wouldn't let me take Commy off the books, so the payroll here is actually closer to $75m. So cap space is surprisingly not that much of an issue, because the cap is projected to be way beyond that by then. Roster space is more the issue, but that lets us pick the best players and offload the others. Good team problems.

 

[Tulipunaruusu*]

Last season Jakupov was taking his first steps on way to Hockey Hall of Fame while Murray missed most of the season... Matter of timeline, this review.

If Edmonton sell him on low value tide it's nothing more than poor development on their part which someone else will hopefully profit from.

 

[stevo61]

I remember being so happy to lose the lottery. I thought it was a bit of a joke but I wanted Murray and as Sore Loser pointed out there may have been some pressure to draft Yakupov even though I don't think he actually would have. I wanted Galchenyuk if Murray was gone but I wasn't scared of our offense, I like the idea of building from the net out. With the power of hindsight I would have had Trouba as my 2nd choice but like many I didn't think he would be the player he is becoming

 

[Sore Loser]

Some of the thoughts I'm seeing on Murray, from people on this very board:

Alot of the fanbase says they're done if they take him (Murray) (Im also on there boards searching for news)

If Edmonton passes on Yakupov and takes Murray, how much more valuable does #2 become?

**** this. I hate this inept organization. We're going to not even attempt to get the one stud in this draft bc we feel like waiting another 4 years on a POTENTIAL top liner when we could throw Methot and 2nd at EDM and give us a potential top liner THIS year.

If Niles trades down and passes on a chance to nab Galchenyuk in hopes of Forsberg evolving, man, that would suck worse than having a chance to nab Yakupov and passing on him, in my opinion.

Maybe this is just me, and I've said this before, but I don't get why Howson doesn't just stand pat and take Galchenyuk at #2. IMO, he's the 2nd best player in the draft as of today, and will be one of the 2 best players that emerges from this draft when you look back on it in 10 years. It's clear he doesn't want Galchenyuk if he wants to trade down, because there's no way he gets past #3

This Tweet was easily the most popular post in the thread:

@EricSmithHockey: Rumor that #CBJ might be targeting Galchenyuk according to USA Today http://t.co/agaLxWyo #NHLDraft

Finally a voice of reason.

Fred Glover wins the thread with this one though:

I will go on record saying that I think that the Jackets want Murray, and if he isn't available, then they try to trade down.

These are all pre-draft, obviously ... I'll show some posts of after the pick next.

 

[stevo61]

So I drank too much coffee and finally got around to projecting the Stastny-Eberle roster to 2017-18:

FORWARDS
Boone Jenner ($4.100m) / Ryan Johansen ($7.851m) / Jordan Eberle ($6.000m)
Nick Foligno ($4.100m) / Paul Stastny ($6.600m) / Oliver Bjorkstrand ($2.000m)
Matt Calvert ($2.500m) / Brandon Dubinsky ($6.000m) / Alex Wennberg ($3.000m)
Derek MacKenzie ($1.400m) / Mark Letestu ($1.250m) / Marko Dano ($0.925m)
Michael Chaput ($0.707m) / Nathan Horton ($5.300m)

I assume lots of guys will have earned substantial raises. It's a bit arbitrary choosing which of the prospects will pan out. Safe to say, if several of them make the lineup, that pushes other guys out, and if one or two of them quickly becomes a star, that means bigger RFA salaries than I have marked here. But we still have the flexibility to ship other guys out. In this scenario Horton is the odd man out, and there could be a trade or retained salary transaction if we need more cap room.

DEFENSEMEN
Jack Johnson ($4.357m) / David Savard ($2.250m)
Ryan Murray ($4.000m) / Cody Goloubef ($2.000m)
Tim Erixon ($2.251m) / Dalton Prout ($0.693m)
Veteran Insurance defender ($2.000m) /

I like this defence group a lot. I think they'll be well above average in 4 years.

GOALTENDERS
Sergei Bobrovsky ($5.625m)
Anton Forsberg ($0.655m)
BUYOUTS
Mike Commodore ($1.142m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(estimations for 2014-15)
SALARY CAP: $71,100,000; CAP PAYROLL: $76,704,476; BONUSES: $238,333
CAP SPACE (23-man roster): -$5,604,476

It wouldn't let me take Commy off the books, so the payroll here is actually closer to $75m. So cap space is surprisingly not that much of an issue, because the cap is projected to be way beyond that by then. Roster space is more the issue, but that lets us pick the best players and offload the others. Good team problems.

I think Heatherington will for sure be on our roster then and possibly Reilly. I think Sore Loser is the only other one as excited for Heatherington as I am. Barring some huge setback in development he should be a real good 2nd pair shutdown guy. Reilly may have more of an issue translating but I'm actually hoping for these 2 together if all goes well in the future

 

[major major]

I think Heatherington will for sure be on our roster then and possibly Reilly. I think Sore Loser is the only other one as excited for Heatherington as I am. Barring some huge setback in development he should be a real good 2nd pair shutdown guy. Reilly may have more of an issue translating but I'm actually hoping for these 2 together if all goes well in the future

Good catch. Do you think Heatherington is a good bet to surpass Prout? Albeit Heatherington is a left shooter.

 

[Sore Loser]

Right after the Yakupov pick:

Watch us take Murray when we have 7 capable dmen already...

We better get Galchenyuk.

If Howson takes Muuray, he wants us to set the low goal total for the next 10 years

And then, the pick is made...

****ing idiot

Ole' Safe pick Howson

That's ****ing stupid. Am I the only one that hates this pick? Too high for him imo

******* you Howson.

MTL must be thrilled.

Howson punted here. Look, Murray seems like a good kid, but when you picking this high, you shouldn't be leaving potential on the table for the sake of "safety"....

After that, some of the pro-pick guys start coming out. Of note, I am paraphrasing only the bad. There was about a 70/30 split of people who wanted Galchenyuk over Murray ... of the 70%, I'd say it was about 50/50 as far as people who were accepting of the pick. The other say, 35% of people, were just outright pissed that we took Murray.

Really, the pressure was on from the media for Columbus to take a forward as well. Murray was no way the consensus #2 pick ... if Galchenyuk had not been injured prior to the end of the year, he would have been the consensu #2 pick. But as it stood, they were pretty neck and neck.

 

[Sore Loser]

Good catch. Do you think Heatherington is a good bet to surpass Prout? Albeit Heatherington is a left shooter.

In 3-4 years, sure.

 

[CBJx614]

Right after the Yakupov pick:







And then, the pick is made...













After that, some of the pro-pick guys start coming out. Of note, I am paraphrasing only the bad. There was about a 70/30 split of people who wanted Galchenyuk over Murray ... of the 70%, I'd say it was about 50/50 as far as people who were accepting of the pick. The other say, 35% of people, were just outright pissed that we took Murray.

Really, the pressure was on from the media for Columbus to take a forward as well. Murray was no way the consensus #2 pick ... if Galchenyuk had not been injured prior to the end of the year, he would have been the consensu #2 pick. But as it stood, they were pretty neck and neck.

Depending on how his lost season went he could have potentially gone #1.

 

[stevo61]

Good catch. Do you think Heatherington is a good bet to surpass Prout? Albeit Heatherington is a left shooter.

He's a better skater and passer. Not nearly as physical but probably one of the better players in the CHL right now with his stick. Personally I'm pretty confident he'll be the better player down the road

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

After that, some of the pro-pick guys start coming out. Of note, I am paraphrasing only the bad. There was about a 70/30 split of people who wanted Galchenyuk over Murray ... of the 70%, I'd say it was about 50/50 as far as people who were accepting of the pick. The other say, 35% of people, were just outright pissed that we took Murray.

Really, the pressure was on from the media for Columbus to take a forward as well. Murray was no way the consensus #2 pick ... if Galchenyuk had not been injured prior to the end of the year, he would have been the consensu #2 pick. But as it stood, they were pretty neck and neck.

We've gotten all haywire with the point we're making re: taking Murray at #2. Is the comparison Yakupov or Galchenyuk? Based on what I've seen of Galchenyuk, I don't think we'd be disappointed if Howson had taken him instead of Murray.

I don't think I'm in any of the posts you quoted, but I was pretty heavy for Gally. I wasn't thrilled with the pick - although I knew Ryan was going to be good. This is not me re-complaining - I'm fine with Murray and where he's at and where he's headed and how he fits looking to the future.

I'm just saying that, while I'm OK giving Howson "credit" or whatever, I don't think he could have gone wrong with that pick.

 

[Crede777]

My hope was that Howson would do something "safe." I wanted Galchenyuk but understood if they took Murray (viewing Gally as the best forward available and Murray as the can't-miss pick).

That said, I've been concerned about Murray's injuries these past 2 seasons. He needs to stay healthy this year or else it could become an issue.

As for Yakupov, the problem is only partly him. A lot of it is the fact that Edmonton took him. Have Yakupov go to a team with more of a core in place and he'd be an absolute stud. Not that I think we should trade for him as that would set our team back due to the high cost. Also Jarmo was pretty clear that he has no interest in players like Yakupov (and Gaborik apparently). If Jarmo had his way, we'd have 13 forwards like Dubinsky, which is something that I disagree with him on. I think teams need a pure goal scorer or two and that teams built like Nashville or St. Louis can do well in the regular season but end up being 1st or 2nd round exits most of the time. I'd love for us to get and fully support a "flashy" top line winger and leave the character / grinding stuff to others. We had Gaborik but we never really patient enough with him. Should have held off on judging him until he became fully healthy even if that took up till a week before his contract was up.

 

[Kev22]

Must be a slow news day if you guys are arguing about the 2012 draft. I think we'll all be fine with Ryan Murray.

Since no one liked my idea yesterday and I've said that I think the first round pick is as good as traded, I'll ask everyone here.

What will the Jackets do with their first round pick? My vote is trade it as part of a package to make this club better. I'm interested in hearing everyone's opinion.

 

[stevo61]

My hope was that Howson would do something "safe." I wanted Galchenyuk but understood if they took Murray (viewing Gally as the best forward available and Murray as the can't-miss pick).

That said, I've been concerned about Murray's injuries these past 2 seasons. He needs to stay healthy this year or else it could become an issue.

As for Yakupov, the problem is only partly him. A lot of it is the fact that Edmonton took him. Have Yakupov go to a team with more of a core in place and he'd be an absolute stud. Not that I think we should trade for him as that would set our team back due to the high cost. Also Jarmo was pretty clear that he has no interest in players like Yakupov (and Gaborik apparently). If Jarmo had his way, we'd have 13 forwards like Dubinsky, which is something that I disagree with him on. I think teams need a pure goal scorer or two and that teams built like Nashville or St. Louis can do well in the regular season but end up being 1st or 2nd round exits most of the time. I'd love for us to get and fully support a "flashy" top line winger and leave the character / grinding stuff to others. We had Gaborik but we never really patient enough with him. Should have held off on judging him until he became fully healthy even if that took up till a week before his contract was up.

Jarmo was pretty big in drafting Tarasenko. He seems to be building a team with smart 2 way play that can win close games and then start infusing skill. You need to find a balance between the 2 and now is the time to start introducing the skill

 

[major major]

Must be a slow news day if you guys are arguing about the 2012 draft. I think we'll all be fine with Ryan Murray.

Since no one liked my idea yesterday and I've said that I think the first round pick is as good as traded, I'll ask everyone here.

What will the Jackets do with their first round pick? My vote is trade it as part of a package to make this club better. I'm interested in hearing everyone's opinion.

Draft the highest player available on Jarmo's list.

 

[stevo61]

Must be a slow news day if you guys are arguing about the 2012 draft. I think we'll all be fine with Ryan Murray.

Since no one liked my idea yesterday and I've said that I think the first round pick is as good as traded, I'll ask everyone here.

What will the Jackets do with their first round pick? My vote is trade it as part of a package to make this club better. I'm interested in hearing everyone's opinion.

I doubt there are many people who are opposed to the 1st being traded but if it is it needs to be for an upgrade not to move cap space. Im thinking will keep it but wont be surprised either way

 

[EspenK]

Draft the highest player available on Jarmo's list.

I agree this is most likely. I could also see us trading down a few spots to get an additional pick but I think that is about a 10% chance.