2013 NHL Draft Thread III (6/30, 3PM EDT)

[georgiabluejacket]

I'd say 2-1-2 on those picks.

Who are the first 2? Cause outside of Nash, none of the other 4 have shown to be hits. I'll agree Johansen has looked good and Murray could be(why I had them as the last 2) but Klesla & especially Zherdev were swings and misses, so 1-2-2 with the last 2 obviously able to swing it in our favor.

Compare that to our history after drafting in the top 5. LeClaire. lol..Picard. lol..Filatov..lol.Voracek. (good but not here). Brassard (star crossed career). Moore...time will tell. I liked him but not a top pairing guy. Tops out as a 2nd pairing guy on some teams probably.

None of these were top 5 picks. Leclaire, Picard were #8. Filatov & Brass were #6, but the point still remains that outside of Nash our high draft picks have not been anything special(Johansen & Murray currently exempt from previous statement)

 

[georgiabluejacket]

How about Wiznewski and our 1st rnd pick for Edmonton's 1st. Oil need experienced help on the blue line and can hardly afford to pay off all of these first rnd picks they've acquired over the last several years.

Wiz has a NTC in his contract. Don't know why people on here keep putting his name in trade discussions cause he's not going anywhere

 

[Sore Loser]

Who are the first 2? Cause outside of Nash, none of the other 4 have shown to be hits. I'll agree Johansen has looked good and Murray could be(why I had them as the last 2) but Klesla & especially Zherdev were swings and misses, so 1-2-2 with the last 2 obviously able to swing it in our favor.

While Klesla was never anything dominant, I will argue that he has had a generally decent career as a second pairing defenseman. While that doesn't always equate to a top-4 pick, at least we came away with a player there.

 

[georgiabluejacket]

The folks who drafted in the past are not here anymore so our history is irrelevant.

Our history is never irrelevant. It's still our history. Was it irrelevant when Maclean finally got fired and Howson took over? Nope, cause the same boneheaded type moves were made. Do I trust the new regime more than I ever did Howson? You bet your sweet bippy I do, which is why I LOVE the fact we have 3 1st rounders cause we will find "building blocks"

And other than Zherdev, Nash & Klesla are legitimate NHLers although Nash hasn't been the kind of overall #1 pick that everyone expected and the jury is still out on Murray & Joey.

Never said they weren't "legitimate NHLers" but Klesla was not worth the #4 pick. Hell we traded a #4 pick to Carolina, who then took Andrew Ladd. Is he an NHLer? yep. Was he worth a #4 pick? Hell no.

 

[georgiabluejacket]

Then why would they trade for Wisniewski? He makes way too much money and isn't really the type of defenseman (IMO) they need. They would probably be more interested in Tyutin and maybe even Nikitin.

I think Edmonton would definately trade down for an NHL ready defenseman, but the only one's we have they'd be interested in(Tyutin/JMFJ) we aren't trading. Don't think Nikitin would be enough, but hey if Edmonton want's a 1st & Nikitin, then hello Monahan/Lindholm.

 

[Cash for Nash]

Who are the first 2? Cause outside of Nash, none of the other 4 have shown to be hits. I'll agree Johansen has looked good and Murray could be(why I had them as the last 2) but Klesla & especially Zherdev were swings and misses, so 1-2-2 with the last 2 obviously able to swing it in our favor.




None of these were top 5 picks. Leclaire, Picard were #8. Filatov & Brass were #6, but the point still remains that outside of Nash our high draft picks have not been anything special(Johansen & Murray currently exempt from previous statement)

I wouldn't call Klesla being a swing and a miss.....I'm never a fan of drafting a defenseman in the top 5 anyway though. Save that crap for free agency. Which is why I expect Ryan Murray to be the next Bobby Orr

 

[Jackets16]

I think Edmonton would definately trade down for an NHL ready defenseman, but the only one's we have they'd be interested in(Tyutin/JMFJ) we aren't trading. Don't think Nikitin would be enough, but hey if Edmonton want's a 1st & Nikitin, then hello Monahan/Lindholm.

No doubt. I was just pointing out guys they may want.

 

[Cash for Nash]

While Klesla was never anything dominant, I will argue that he has had a generally decent career as a second pairing defenseman. While that doesn't always equate to a top-4 pick, at least we came away with a player there.

Yep...No doubt. My thoughts exactly.

 

[db2011]

None of these were top 5 picks. Leclaire, Picard were #8. Filatov & Brass were #6, but the point still remains that outside of Nash our high draft picks have not been anything special(Johansen & Murray currently exempt from previous statement)

You misread it, that was his point.

What's a bippy?

 

[major major]

Never said they weren't "legitimate NHLers" but Klesla was not worth the #4 pick. Hell we traded a #4 pick to Carolina, who then took Andrew Ladd. Is he an NHLer? yep. Was he worth a #4 pick? Hell no.

I'll assume you just haven't watched the Jets for a while. Ladd is a stud point-per-game captain. He would have led this Jackets team in scoring by 16 points.

I'm with you on this one. Not sure why there's a "we must trade away our core players to get a unknown commodity in the top 4, cause that has no potential to backfire" attitude. I'm confident we can come away with at least 2 amazing players with our 3 1st rounders while a couple of the "can't miss" top 4 fail spectacularily.

You should try being a little more reflective. All I've posted is my assessment of the relative risks of different positions in the draft, I've never asserted for a second that my position is risk-free. You on the other hand, go from accusing me of ignoring risk to making the boldest risk-free assertions yet.

Chutzpah!

Do I trust the new regime more than I ever did Howson? You bet your sweet bippy I do, which is why I LOVE the fact we have 3 1st rounders cause we will find "building blocks"

And here it is again. Hubris and chutzpah, no acknowledgment of risk.

 

[InjuredChoker]

I'll assume you just haven't watched the Jets for a while. Ladd is a stud point-per-game captain. He would have led this Jackets team in scoring by 16 points.

Ladd has never had ppg season, though he came close this year.

Best before this shortened season was 59 in 81 two years ago.

 

[SaintMorose]

Flames fan coming in peace!
Not sure if this would be helpful to another team with 3 picks in the first round but Abbotsford Heat on our board made a great draft order thread if anyone wants to reference it.

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=1424159

Note if the Rangers or Kings lose out before the conference final the worst either can now pick is 21. Might even be better than that but I haven't done all the maths

 

[Jackets16]

Thanks

 

[EspenK]

Flames fan coming in peace!
Not sure if this would be helpful to another team with 3 picks in the first round but Abbotsford Heat on our board made a great draft order thread if anyone wants to reference it.

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=1424159

Note if the Rangers or Kings lose out before the conference final the worst either can now pick is 21. Might even be better than that but I haven't done all the maths

I don't see the Rangers at 21-its either 17,18,19 or 27-30.
Straight up if all teams below them (and the Rangers too) don't make the final 4 they are 19th,only way they move better is if Detroit or Ottawa make it to the final 4.

The way I understand it the final 4 pick 27-30, then Division champs,then it just falls back to the rest in the order they finish.

Just when I think I have it figured out someone posts something that clouds the picture.

Anyone?

 

[Sore Loser]

Wow!!!

http://www.ontariohockeyleague.com/article/london-knights-win-2013-robertson-cup/143942

Bo Horvat scored with less than one second remaining in regulation to lift the London Knights to a thrilling Robertson Cup title with a 3-2 win over the Barrie Colts in Game 7 of the Rogers OHL Championship Series Monday night in London.

Horvat finished the game with two goals and was named the recipient of the Wayne Gretzky ’99’ Award as MVP of the 2013 OHL Playoffs with 23 points netting 16 goals including three game-winners in the Championship Series.

Remember what I was saying about character guys in this draft? This is the type of guy that we could potentially draft at #14 ... and this is the kind of guy that is the reason that I'm against all of the chatter of paying a huge sum to move up 10 spots.

 

[georgiabluejacket]

I'll assume you just haven't watched the Jets for a while. Ladd is a stud point-per-game captain. He would have led this Jackets team in scoring by 16 points.

Injured Choker already took care of this for me.

You should try being a little more reflective. All I've posted is my assessment of the relative risks of different positions in the draft, I've never asserted for a second that my position is risk-free. You on the other hand, go from accusing me of ignoring risk to making the boldest risk-free assertions yet.

Chutzpah!

So giving up multiple first, plus our first from last year for one pick is less of a risk than keeping what amounts to 4 draft picks? Alrighty then

Let's look at it this way. There's a lottery being held with 30 possible outcomes(envelopes). Some of these envelopes are thick & big. Some of them are very thin. Now all of the envelopes might have big money in them, or none of them might have big money in them. Would you rather have one big thick envelope, or 3 smaller, envelopes + the big thick envelope you've had sitting in your desk since last year?

Now what is more likely to happen?
1. The big thick envelope has nothing in it
OR
2. The 3 small ones & the big envelope from last year have nothing in it


Now, it could be a situation where this year's big has a roll of 100's or just a roll of 1's. Could be little 3 have $1000 checks in them or B-day cards from Grandma. I venter it is in our teams best interest to continue to build a strong foundation rather than look for a savior & I believe that our management know what the crap they are doing. That's not a risk, that's a belief. Chutzpah!(whatever the crap that's supposed to mean)

 

[georgiabluejacket]

You misread it, that was his point.

What's a bippy?

Yeah, I did misread it

 

[georgiabluejacket]

Wow!!!

http://www.ontariohockeyleague.com/article/london-knights-win-2013-robertson-cup/143942





Remember what I was saying about character guys in this draft? This is the type of guy that we could potentially draft at #14 ... and this is the kind of guy that is the reason that I'm against all of the chatter of paying a huge sum to move up 10 spots.

I was not a fan of this guy(Domi man myself) until I watched game 5 this weekend. I don't even think you need to draft him #14 as I think he may still be there at L.A.'s pick, which once again reiterates your point of being able to build this team without having to move up. With Domi, Horvat, Mantha, Wenneberg, Gauthier, Rychel, Hartman, & maybe even Shinkaurek available at #14 & beyond

But to continue about Horvat. With his team down 3 games to 1. He scores 2 goals. Down 3-2, goal & an assist. 3-3, 2 goals including game winner. The man is a player with "marbles"

I'm starting to get a "take Domi & Horvat" attitude towards this draft cause Dale Hunter has shown an ability of getting his players to perform in the NHL: Nash, Tavares, Perry, Kadri, Kane, Josh Anderson , Gagner. He had 3 #1's in a 9 year period. That's impressive.

 

[georgiabluejacket]

I don't see the Rangers at 21-its either 17,18,19 or 27-30.
Straight up if all teams below them (and the Rangers too) don't make the final 4 they are 19th,only way they move better is if Detroit or Ottawa make it to the final 4.

The way I understand it the final 4 pick 27-30, then Division champs,then it just falls back to the rest in the order they finish.

Just when I think I have it figured out someone posts something that clouds the picture.

Anyone?

Your right, Need to root for Det/Ott/ & SJ this round. If my math is right that'd leave us with 14,17, & 20.

 

[georgiabluejacket]

No doubt. I was just pointing out guys they may want.

I wonder if a commerative Scott Howson plate setting would be enough sweetner for a deal Maybe throw in a free comb-over

In all seriousness though. Would you do a #14 & Erixon? I'm not sold on the kid for some reason & I think Edmonton might prefer a Erixon/Ristolainen draft than a Nurse one. That way we could target a Monahan/Lindholm at 7. Horvat at NYR pick. Gauthier/Hartman at L.A.'s. That'd be draft for us in the middle.

 

[Jackets16]

Wow!!!

http://www.ontariohockeyleague.com/article/london-knights-win-2013-robertson-cup/143942





Remember what I was saying about character guys in this draft? This is the type of guy that we could potentially draft at #14 ... and this is the kind of guy that is the reason that I'm against all of the chatter of paying a huge sum to move up 10 spots.

Yeah, I am with you, but you already know that. I would love to have a top 2 pick this year, but we don't and I am more than happy getting 3 players in the first round. There are too many good players who fit our system to trade our first rounders to move up into the top 8 or so.

 

[Jackets16]

I wonder if a commerative Scott Howson plate setting would be enough sweetner for a deal Maybe throw in a free comb-over

In all seriousness though. Would you do a #14 & Erixon? I'm not sold on the kid for some reason & I think Edmonton might prefer a Erixon/Ristolainen draft than a Nurse one. That way we could target a Monahan/Lindholm at 7. Horvat at NYR pick. Gauthier/Hartman at L.A.'s. That'd be draft for us in the middle.

No, I wouldn't. I am not giving up a good, young defender to move up 7 spots.

 

[Nordique]

No, I wouldn't. I am not giving up a good, young defender to move up 7 spots.

Erixon has too much potential for that.

 

[Roadman]

No, I wouldn't. I am not giving up a good, young defender to move up 7 spots.

Agreed

First, not entirely sure either Monahan or Lindholm would be available at 7.

Second after the top tier, there really doesn't seem to be a significant difference among the next dozen or so prospects. Before I get jumped, note I said significant. I am sure to those that have favorites and to those scouts whose job it is to ascertain those differences there are, but in looking at scouting reports and mocks and projections, after those top 7/8 it goes all over the place.

This would indicate, at least to me, that in the area the CBJ are drafting it's going to be a matter of preference. Probably coming down to perceived fit for an organization, be it character, position, or skill set.

Given that, unless the F/O has an individual that they just have to have, I suspect they won't be expending assets to move. There are too many quality players to think that a number of them won't be available in the draft positions they presently occupy.

 

[Jackets16]

Agreed

First, not entirely sure either Monahan or Lindholm would be available at 7.

Second after the top tier, there really doesn't seem to be a significant difference among the next dozen or so prospects. Before I get jumped, note I said significant. I am sure to those that have favorites and to those scouts whose job it is to ascertain those differences there are, but in looking at scouting reports and mocks and projections, after those top 7/8 it goes all over the place.

This would indicate, at least to me, that in the area the CBJ are drafting it's going to be a matter of preference. Probably coming down to perceived fit for an organization, be it character, position, or skill set.

Given that, unless the F/O has an individual that they just have to have, I suspect they won't be expending assets to move. There are too many quality players to think that a number of them won't be available in the draft positions they presently occupy.

We may even move back with one of our first rounders to pick up a few extra picks.