2013 NHL Draft Thread III (6/30, 3PM EDT)

[EDM]

Why buy him out? Grant the guy his wish. Let him rot in Russia and let us use our first round picks on guys who actually want to play in the NHL. Why are we wasting our time pining for a young jerk who wants to be a spoiled Russian?

 

[Sore Loser]

Is there any way we can buy him from them? Or trade them a player?

The Jackets spent an exorbitant amount to get Nikolai Zherdev over after drafting him in 2003 ... and look where that got them. I don't see them making a large financial investment on a Russian teen again anytime soon, but anything is possible. As for "trading" them a player, that would violate nearly every contractual rule in the IIHF.

Why buy him out? Grant the guy his wish. Let him rot in Russia and let us use our first round picks on guys who actually want to play in the NHL. Why are we wasting our time pining for a young jerk who wants to be a spoiled Russian?

Wow ...

My stance on the whole thing: If Jarmo and co. do their homework - which I absolutely suspect they will do - and Nichuskin falls to them at #14, then if he's drafted, my belief is that he will eventually come over. Some damn good Russians have gone this route (most notably: Evgeni Malkin) ... but there have been some clear misses also. My suspicion is that another team will snatch him up before we even pick; I mentioned in my little blurb that Carolina may be a prime candidate at their spot, because they already have a little bit of a Russian contingency going, and could use a big, talented winger like that.

Whatever the case, I don't have him terribly high on my want list, out of fears that he will never come over. I'd rather take a more sure thing.

 

[major major]

Why buy him out? Grant the guy his wish. Let him rot in Russia and let us use our first round picks on guys who actually want to play in the NHL. Why are we wasting our time pining for a young jerk who wants to be a spoiled Russian?

What makes him a spoiled young jerk?

Lots of European players stay in Europe for a couple years. Not that big a deal, and even if he decides to stay there long-term, which would be unfortunate for his draft team, it doesn't tell you much about him as a person.

 

[major major]

The Jackets spent an exorbitant amount to get Nikolai Zherdev over after drafting him in 2003 ... and look where that got them. I don't see them making a large financial investment on a Russian teen again anytime soon, but anything is possible. As for "trading" them a player, that would violate nearly every contractual rule in the IIHF.



Wow ...

My stance on the whole thing: If Jarmo and co. do their homework - which I absolutely suspect they will do - and Nichuskin falls to them at #14, then if he's drafted, my belief is that he will eventually come over. Some damn good Russians have gone this route (most notably: Evgeni Malkin) ... but there have been some clear misses also. My suspicion is that another team will snatch him up before we even pick; I mentioned in my little blurb that Carolina may be a prime candidate at their spot, because they already have a little bit of a Russian contingency going, and could use a big, talented winger like that.

Whatever the case, I don't have him terribly high on my want list, out of fears that he will never come over. I'd rather take a more sure thing.

I'd take Nichushkin as high as 7th. He's ridiculously talented, and probably will come over. If not for the risk he'd be top-5.

I'd be curious what our Russian writers have to say about Nichushkin's character, and the chances he'll cross the pond.

I think the big reason I feel this way is that its not that hard to get second-line, second-pair level guys through trade and free-agency. It's harder to get top line guys. And it's way harder to get top-line guys with elite upside, and they're damn near unsignable for Columbus, so we should shoot for that caliber of player even if you only have a 50/50 shot of the player joining the team.

 

[CBJx614]

Somebody posted in the TB thread that Yzerman was really impressed by Nichushkin

 

[major major]

Somebody posted in the TB thread that Yzerman was really impressed by Nichushkin

If Yzerman takes Nichushkin at 3 (man has he picked a lot of Russians), what would folks offer Carolina for the 5th spot (where at minimum Barkov will be available)?

For Barkov I'd offer Murray straight up (not going to debate this though I know many of you won't be happy with the suggestion), or JJ++, Tyutin++, or actually any of our defenceman++.

Perhaps something like JJ + Letestu + our 1st for Barkov. That might actually be not big enough of an offer, considering Barkov looks like he'll be the next Kopitar.

 

[CBJx614]

If Yzerman takes Nichushkin at 3 (man has he picked a lot of Russians), what would folks offer Carolina for the 5th spot (where at minimum Barkov will be available)?

For Barkov I'd offer Murray straight up (not going to debate this though I know many of you won't be happy with the suggestion), or JJ++, Tyutin++, or actually any of our defenceman++.

Perhaps something like JJ + Letestu + our 1st for Barkov. That might actually be not big enough of an offer, considering Barkov looks like he'll be the next Kopitar.

I dont think I would give away JJ, our best player for the money, and a potential roster player for Kopitar.

 

[Timeless Winter]

I wouldn't take Nichushkin with any of our 1sts.

You guys remember Filatov?? End of discussion.

Draft players with good attitudes and strong work ethic that can score goals.

Some teams have good luck with Russians, not the Jackets.

 

[CBJWerenski8]

Some teams have good luck with Russians, not the Jackets.

Didn't have a problem with your post until this. Anisimov, Tyutin, Bobrovsky, Nikitin. All Russian, all important. If you're talking about drafting and developing Russians, what, have we drafted like 5? I can only think of 5 (The guy who died in the Lokomotive crash, Zherdev, Filatov, Mayorov, Mozyakin). I wouldn't take him unless its with our mid first or late first because of all the talent he has, but I'm not avoiding him because he's Russian. All the talk of wanting to only play in the KHL is BS, he wants to play in the NHL and the only thing holding him back is the 2 year deal he has.

 

[EDM]

It is not "because he is Russian" for the love of Gordie Howe. It is because he is Russian, is currently under contract to stay in Russia for 2 more years, and because he has made statements and actions, such as discussed in the last two pages which strongly suggest a sense of entitlement. Those are all a bad combination to waste on a first round pick. If Steve Yzerman wants to throw away his first round pick on a guy who, at a minimum, will not set his feet on North American soil for 2 years, more power to Steve Yzerman.

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

I'd be curious what our Russian writers have to say about Nichushkin's character, and the chances he'll cross the pond.

The sad thing is that this is the third edition of the draft thread. This very topic was covered in one of the previous two.

Ok, I'm bored.

Exactly.

 

[EspenK]

Forgetting for a minute the trade talk I'm warming to the idea of taking Pulock if he is available. Why? All of the forwards that will most likely be available then are 50/50 chances while Pulock seems to be thought of a more likely than not success.

Also,adding another solid D will help with future trades (see there's the minute) because our D corps will have some added depth.

 

[Roadman]

Forgetting for a minute the trade talk I'm warming to the idea of taking Pulock if he is available. Why? All of the forwards that will most likely be available then are 50/50 chances while Pulock seems to be thought of a more likely than not success.

Also,adding another solid D will help with future trades (see there's the minute) because our D corps will have some added depth.

Mr K

What happened to offense, offense, offense? This is a very different tune for you.

 

[alphafox]

Hey everyjust one, i was talking to a friend last night about what the jackets should do at the draft and was lamenting the fact that we couldn't move up to grab a Mackinnon or Barkov. He pointed out that Gaborik could be a piece that would get us a pick like that (though it might require a package). What would you guys think of trading him at the draft? Personally i like it because i think this team is still a 2 years+ from cup contention and we would likely be better served by whoever we draft than Gaborik. Maybe something like

Gaborik, Savard and our 2nd for Tampa's 1st and a third

 

[Roadman]

Hey everyjust one, i was talking to a friend last night about what the jackets should do at the draft and was lamenting the fact that we couldn't move up to grab a Mackinnon or Barkov. He pointed out that Gaborik could be a piece that would get us a pick like that (though it might require a package). What would you guys think of trading him at the draft? Personally i like it because i think this team is still a 2 years+ from cup contention and we would likely be better served by whoever we draft than Gaborik. Maybe something like

Gaborik, Savard and our 2nd for Tampa's 1st and a third

I do believe Gaborik has a NTC. If I remember correctly, not going back to find it, there was a pic of his signed waiver and it said specifically that this waiver was for this transaction only and the clause remains in effect after the completion of the trade.

 

[MaximusT]

Why buy him out? Grant the guy his wish. Let him rot in Russia and let us use our first round picks on guys who actually want to play in the NHL. Why are we wasting our time pining for a young jerk who wants to be a spoiled Russian?

wow who pissed in your lemonade? Spoiled Russian?
If you had the option of making an extra couple of million at 18-19 playing against professional players instead of boys in the CHL, wouldn't you do the same?

Come to the NHL ready to make an immediate impact.

 

[pete goegan]

... we would likely be better served by whoever we draft than Gaborik.

That is not a certainty, by any stretch, and highly debatable in the short run. Personally, I'd very much enjoy watching a full season of a healthy Gaborik, especially if Jarmo can add a bit more scoring help for him in the top six. Putting all our hopes for improvement, next year, on a 19-20 year old prospect smacks of a Doug-esque approach to team development, to me. Sure, I'd like to add prospects of that caliber to the system, but I'd prefer not to do it at the expense of the only legitimate top-liner on the team.

 

[Double-Shift Lasse]

The first edition of the 2013 draft thread was started in August of 2012. I swear to god we have nothing left to discuss, so we're making up crazy **** now.

 

[alphafox]

Lol, at least there are some honest opinions. BTW, below is a link that does a pretty good job of assigning value to draft picks. It might help in our endless trading up discussions


http://toomanymenonthesite.com/2012/12/04/nhl-draft-pick-value-chart/

 

[Samkow]

Hey everyjust one, i was talking to a friend last night about what the jackets should do at the draft and was lamenting the fact that we couldn't move up to grab a Mackinnon or Barkov. He pointed out that Gaborik could be a piece that would get us a pick like that (though it might require a package). What would you guys think of trading him at the draft? Personally i like it because i think this team is still a 2 years+ from cup contention and we would likely be better served by whoever we draft than Gaborik. Maybe something like

Gaborik, Savard and our 2nd for Tampa's 1st and a third

No offense, but that's awful.

Without going into the value of it, Tampa couldn't make that work, cap wise.

 

[EDM]

Maximux, if you took the time to read about many of the comments which Nichuskin has made you would see this is not a matter of spoiled lemonade. It is a matter of wasting another first round pick on another young Russian with lots of potential to be another prima donna and we have had enough of those in our draft history. There are plenty of other solid prospects from which to pick in the first round. If he is still on the board in the third round (not very likely), sure take a flyer on him at that level. But not in the first round when other options abound.

 

[JacketsFanWest]

Why buy him out? Grant the guy his wish. Let him rot in Russia and let us use our first round picks on guys who actually want to play in the NHL. Why are we wasting our time pining for a young jerk who wants to be a spoiled Russian?

Just to clarify, Nichushkin has said he's willing to play in the NHL, but he wants to model his career after former teammate and friend, Evgeny Kuznetsov who has stayed in Russia 2 years after being drafted.

But it's one thing if he wants to stay in his hometown with his family (he just turned 18) and another if he wants to head to Moscow.

There's rumors that Kuznetsov also wants to be traded to Dynamo, so maybe there's something going on with Traktor, and Nichushkin wanted the trade. But this is something that Jarmo, JD and company thoroughly need to research and find out what's going on.

I do think they know they aren't ready to play in the NHL, don't want to play in the CHL for pocket money and the AHL hasn't successfully developed any 18 year old European players. So their goal is to make as much money as possible early in their careers, which is playing in the KHL, maybe in Moscow over Chelyabinsk.

 

[KJ Dangler]

So Cory Pronman has released his final 2013 rankings, here is the link, and I have embedded his top 50 for discussion. Obviously I have never seen any of these players live, would be interested in Sore Loser's takes.

http://www.hockeyprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=1522

The 2013 draft class is a very strong one, with a fantastic top end, good depth in terms of the top tier of prospects, and quality overall depth. And while there is no top goaltending prospect like Andrei Vasilevski from 2012, the goaltending crop is still good.

You normally can get above-average prospects up until the top or middle of the second round in a standard draft class. This year, I would say that applies up until the beginning or middle of the third round. There are normally about eight to 10 top-end prospects in a draft class, where this year, I count 16 of them. There are six or seven elite prospects available, depending on how you view Sean Monahan.

The tiers, in terms of where I see a drop off in prospect value, is after the top three of Drouin, MacKinnon, and Jones, and after Nichushkin and Barkov at five—though Nichushkin can arguably be slotted into either of those tiers. Lindholm is also on a tier by himself, tightly grouped between the other two. There is also a dropoff after Zadorov at 16, and after that a steady marginal decline in prospect value begins until the end of the draft rankings.

If you have any questions about anything in these rankings you can reach me at [email protected] or at my Twitter account @coreypronman.

Introduction - A description of the methodology of these rankings.

Prospects 1-5

1. Jonathan Drouin, Left Wing, Halifax-QMJHL*
2. Nathan MacKinnon, Center, Halifax-QMJHL*
3. Seth Jones, Defense, Portland-WHL*
4. Valeri Nichushkin, Right Wing, Traktor-KHL*
5. Aleksander Barkov, Center, Tappara-SM-Liiga*

Prospects 6-10

6. Elias Lindholm, Center, Brynas-SEL*
7. Sean Monahan, Center, Ottawa-OHL*
8. Rasmus Ristolainen, Defense, TPS-SM-Liiga*
9. Max Domi, Center, London-OHL*
10. Hunter Shinkaruk, Center, Medicine Hat-WHL*

Prospects 11-15

11. Darnell Nurse, Defense, Sault Ste. Marie-OHL*
12. Ryan Pulock, Defense, Brandon-WHL*
13. Andre Burakowsky, Left Wing, Malmo-Allsvenskan*
14. Bo Horvat, Center, London-OHL*
15. Alexander Wennberg, Center, Djurgardens-Allsvenskan*

Prospects 16-20

16. Nikita Zadorov, Defense, London-OHL*
17. Pavel Buchnevich, Left Wing, Severstal-KHL*
18. Adam Erne, Left Wing, Quebec-QMJHL*
19. Valentin Zykov, Right Wing, Baie-Comeau-QMJHL*
20. Josh Morrissey, Defense, Prince Albert-WHL*

Prospects 21-30

21. Robert Hagg, Defense, MODO-SEL
22. Anthony Mantha, Left Wing, Val-d'Or-QMJHL
23. Madison Bowey, Defense, Kelowna-WHL
24. Artturi Lehkonen, Left Wing, KalPa-SM-Liiga
25. J.T. Compher, Center, USA Under-18-USHL
26. Mirco Mueller, Defense, Everett-WHL
27. Jacob De La Rose, Left Wing, Leksands-Allsvenskan
28. Steven Santini, Defense, USA Under-18-USHL
29. Curtis Lazar, Center, Edmonton-WHL
30. Shea Theodore, Defense, Seattle-WHL

Prospects 31-40

31. Frederik Gauthier, Center, Rimouski-QMJHL
32. Nicolas Petan, Center, Portland-WHL
33. Morgan Klimchuk, Left Wing, Regina-WHL
34. Laurent Dauphin, Center, Chicoutimi-QMJHL
35. Ian McCoshen, Defense, Waterloo-USHL
36. Chris Bigras, Defense, Owen Sound-OHL
37. Anthony Duclair, Left Wing, Quebec-QMJHL
38. Connor Hurley, Center, Edina-US High School
39. Jason Dickinson, Center, Guelph-OHL
40. Jimmy Lodge, Right Wing, Saginaw-OHL

Prospects 41-50

41. William Carrier, Left Wing, Cape Breton-QMJHL
42. Ryan Hartman, Right Wing, Plymouth-OHL
43. Marko Dano, Center, Slovan Bratislava-KHL
44. Kerby Rychel, Left Wing, Windsor-OHL
45. Anton Slepyshev, Left Wing, Salvat Yulaev-KHL
46. Juuso Ikonen, Left Wing, Blues-SM-Liiga
47. Michael McCarron, Right Wing, USA Under-18-USHL
48. Nick Sorensen, Right Wing, Quebec-QMJHL
49. Dillon Heatherington, Defense, Swift Current-WHL
50. Peter Cehlarik, Left Wing, Lulea-SEL

 

[major major]

Hey everyjust one, i was talking to a friend last night about what the jackets should do at the draft and was lamenting the fact that we couldn't move up to grab a Mackinnon or Barkov. He pointed out that Gaborik could be a piece that would get us a pick like that (though it might require a package). What would you guys think of trading him at the draft? Personally i like it because i think this team is still a 2 years+ from cup contention and we would likely be better served by whoever we draft than Gaborik. Maybe something like

Gaborik, Savard and our 2nd for Tampa's 1st and a third

I'd do it, and Tampa would laugh at it.

 

[major major]

Maximux, if you took the time to read about many of the comments which Nichuskin has made you would see this is not a matter of spoiled lemonade. It is a matter of wasting another first round pick on another young Russian with lots of potential to be another prima donna and we have had enough of those in our draft history. There are plenty of other solid prospects from which to pick in the first round. If he is still on the board in the third round (not very likely), sure take a flyer on him at that level. But not in the first round when other options abound.

What did he say?