Prospect Info: 2013-2014 Rangers Prospects Thread *Part IV* (Player Stats in Post #1; Updated 6/17)

[Clown Fiesta]

yeah i think the biggest thing kreider realized is its not important to go top speed all the time. change of speed is more important...and he realized hes a big guy, he can play with these nhlers...more importantly he can dominate nhlers if he wants to.

His hands are absolutely brutal though. If he works on that he'll be far more dangerous in tight. Although his hand eye is fantastic, some of those deflections were amazing. He just can't handle a puck in tight.

 

[Ail]

Am well aware of this Ail, stop taking me literally ugh.

Was directed at chosen who seemed to require some sort of reinforcement as to why Duclair is a stud muffin.

You're spot on though, he has matured a great deal in a few short years, that is huge with these kinds of players IMO. A lot of talented younger players that never want to put in the work who end up busting.

No I know, sorry man. That was one of those I agree with you but raspansing anyway for those who seem to be in doubt for whatever reason, posts.

 

[chosen]

The fact that he scored 99 points in 59 QMJ games, up from 50 points in 55 games the year before.

The fact that only 5 players outscored him in QMJ this year, and the two that have already been drafted were both first round picks, Drouin and Mantha, two grade A prospects.

He's a third round pick that performed just slightly less stupendously than two first rounders in the same league at almost the same age (Drouin is a little older, Mantha is a little younger).

Given that it's only been a year, I have trouble thinking of a way that it could have gone better so far. Yeah, it's early in the process, but given that he's at the point he's at, he's shown nothing but promise since being drafted.

In what way is that not a great pick? In what way has it not worked out? Obviously he's not in the NHL, but it looks like the Rangers got a talent in the third that, for the level they're at currently, can perform with good first round selections.

Duclair may work out some day, but until you play as a regular in the NHL, nothing has worked out, yet. McIlrath has not worked out yet, either, despite some here being convinced he will stick next year.

 

[chosen]

We have to develop some star scoring forwards of our own at some point right? I mean I've been watching this team since I was a little kid and I have yet to see it happen (thanks for giving away Marc Savard, Neil Smith). Granted, Stepan's very good and Kreider could take that next step, but the next homegrown star forward to actually spend most of his career with our team will be the first since the GAG line days.

Kovalev was that. Team didn't have the patience to stick it out, rightly or wrongly.

 

[chosen]

Right now? Literally nothing. He says the right things, has a great attitude after his supposed off-ice issues, and oh yeah, he can play. So far so great, just have to hope last year was not a fluke. Personally I feel like he is what we saw last year. We'll see.

Why do fans often care what a player says? It means nothing.

I'm a Bills fan. They have Marcel Dareus. Every time he screws up he says all the right things and people compliment his attitude. Then he screws up again.

We don't know Duclair's attitude. Hopefully, it is good.

We don't know anything about his future, yet. Last season's on-ice is promising, but he is a long ways off from being a success.

 

[Zil]

Kovalev was that. Team didn't have the patience to stick it out, rightly or wrongly.

Yeah, we've given away lots of guys who would qualify: Savard, Amonte, Weight, Middleton. Some of those deals helped us win in 94, but Savard and Middleton were unnecessary and dumb trades.

 

[effen]

Yeah, we've given away lots of guys who would qualify: Savard, Amonte, Weight, Middleton. Some of those deals helped us win in 94, but Savard and Middleton were unnecessary and dumb trades.

Revisionist history with Savard. He was slow, weak, and got trucked more times than I can count by the Bobby Holiks of the world.

He got flipped essentially for a 23 year old Jan Hlavac who promptly had 47 goals in 2 years for the Rangers after being one of Europe's best forwards, and a move up from 11 to 4 on the 1st round. New York was losing Gretzky that offseason and the idea was to sign a top 2 center to go with Nedved with that money, iirc.

Then came the Fleury/Kamensky pain train but it didn't really matter as the NYR developed Mike York who immediately had the same impact in the same role.

Savard washed out of Calgary, got traded for scraps, and promptly got to play with Heatley and Kovalchuk. That never happens here, and he never becomes the player he did.

 

[Blue Blooded]

Revisionist history with Savard. He was slow, weak, and got trucked more times than I can count by the Bobby Holiks of the world.

He got flipped essentially for a 23 year old Jan Hlavac who promptly had 47 goals in 2 years for the Rangers after being one of Europe's best forwards, and a move up from 11 to 4 on the 1st round. New York was losing Gretzky that offseason and the idea was to sign a top 2 center to go with Nedved with that money, iirc.

Then came the Fleury/Kamensky pain train but it didn't really matter as the NYR developed Mike York who immediately had the same impact in the same role.

Savard washed out of Calgary, got traded for scraps, and promptly got to play with Heatley and Kovalchuk. That never happens here, and he never becomes the player he did.

I never get why Fleury always gets so much flak around here. Yes there were off-ice problems, but his on-ice play was good. Plus he was a UFA in the pre-cap era, how did the acquisition hurt the team in any way, shape, or form?

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Duclair may work out some day, but until you play as a regular in the NHL, nothing has worked out, yet. McIlrath has not worked out yet, either, despite some here being convinced he will stick next year.

True, but the talent is there. He's performing at MJ level, which is great. His numbers are almost similar to Huberdeau's and Grigorenko's at that level. The potential is there. Now let's hope he can make the step up in a year or 2

 

[nyr2k2]

Why do fans often care what a player says? It means nothing.

I'm a Bills fan. They have Marcel Dareus. Every time he screws up he says all the right things and people compliment his attitude. Then he screws up again.

We don't know Duclair's attitude. Hopefully, it is good.

We don't know anything about his future, yet. Last season's on-ice is promising, but he is a long ways off from being a success.

Duclair's attitude is good enough to go from being suspended his first season to being named an alternate captain in this season. The reports on his maturity and psychological development were all glowing.

 

[eco's bones]

Savard was an ongoing locker room issue. By the time he was moved he'd pissed off practically everyone. It's funny--because really on ice if Savard compares to anyone it would be Stepan only a little bit slower than Stepan. Savard started to grow up after he left the Rangers. People **** about Stepan here all the time.

Kovalev was just a frustrating player here. A legit first line player but never really the guy--kind of like Rick Nash so far. Who could take a team and lead it. He was an inconsistent player and he played his best as a complimentary player to the likes of Messier, Leetch, Lemieux, Jagr.

Middleton got moved by Emile Francis. Esposito was lonely. Espo had come to New York with Carol Vadnais in the Park, Ratelle deal. Vadnais wasn't the most likable guy. The Rangers wanted their best player to be happy so they traded Middleton for Ken Hodge. Hodge had been Boston's first line right wing on Espo's line for years. Hodge if I remember right even had had. A 100+ point a year. A season or two. He **** the bed here. He was getting old. He wound up in the minors and then out of hockey altogether. Middleton went on to be a big star. To me Middleton is HOF worthy but he's not in the HOF as of yet anyway. The Rangers for the several years after would bring in ex-Bruins to keep Espo happy--like Dallas Smith or Don Awrey.

 

[eco's bones]

Duclair looks like he could be a very good NHL player but it's still too early. Great wheels and maneuverability and the hands seem to be there. Size shouldn't be an issue either. Very hopeful about him but people here should temper their expectations a little for now.

 

[jerseyjinx94]

Kovalev was just a frustrating player here. A legit first line player but never really the guy--kind of like Rick Nash so far. Who could take a team and lead it. He was an inconsistent player and he played his best as a complimentary player to the likes of Messier, Leetch, Lemieux, Jagr.

Uh, Kovalev was never a legit first liner with the Rangers. He topped out with us at like 24 goals. And this was the 90s and early aughts.

Kovalev is probably my favorite player from my childhood. He had all the talent in the world. I think Rick Nash is a terrible comparison. Kovalev was just an enigma when he put on the Rangers sweater. Let him put on a Pittsburgh or Montreal sweater, though, and he was a legit first liner. I'll never forget how he didn't perform in that 03-04 season and got traded RIGHT after we re-acquired him.

Seriously:

NYR: 9 years, .288 GPG
PIT: 6 years, .414 GPG
MTL: 5 years, .328 GPG.

PPG?

NYR: .670
PIT: .969
MTL: .840

 

[Ola]

Savard washed out of Calgary, got traded for scraps, and promptly got to play with Heatley and Kovalchuk. That never happens here, and he never becomes the player he did.

Mmh, I am not necessarily saying that this isn't correct, but Savard was a real special player still.

I remember his first pre-season here in NY, not all details but the broader picutre and I saw several of those pre-season games on tape. He was the type that looked to be waaaay in over his head in most areas, then he stepped of the ice with 2-3 pts.

He was definitely -- always -- compareable to like the Granlund kid in Minny, there was less room in the game for players like that, but he was still special.

 

[Kakko]

Duclair may work out some day, but until you play as a regular in the NHL, nothing has worked out, yet. McIlrath has not worked out yet, either, despite some here being convinced he will stick next year.

Yes, Duclair is not a success yet

At the same time, McIlrath is not a failure yet

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Yes, Duclair is not a success yet

At the same time, McIlrath is not a failure yet

True, but it's hard not to get a little excited and be a little bit optimistic when our 3rd round pick puts up 99 points at CHL level.

 

[Beacon]

Savard was a huge offensive talent. Nobody in the juniors could figure out a way to stop him. Yet he fell to the 4th round because he was small and weak, and couldn't care less about defense. He was a poor man's Gretzky in that he had a huge career despite lacking the physical tools of a superstar, but being able to think and see like nobody's business.

Kovalev was just the opposite: amazing skater who could skate fast in a straight line or do a spinorama, great shot, good size, unlimited energy, but no brain. Considering that his career lasted two decades, Kovalev could've scored 1,500+ points if he had Savard's brain.

 

[Raspewtin]

True, but the talent is there. He's performing at MJ level, which is great. His numbers are almost similar to Huberdeau's and Grigorenko's at that level. The potential is there. Now let's hope he can make the step up in a year or 2

He plays on the same team as Grigs and completely outperformed him this year.

He didn't need anybody to make him better, he lost half his team's forward corps to the WJC's and injuries. He put his team on his back and it made him better.

 

[Beacon]

A little OT, but the same draft we took Savard in the 4th, we also picked Dube in the second round. Dube was almost as good offensively as Savard, but faster and better overall. I had very high hopes for him. But the 90s was the era of clutch and grab, so it was hard to play for a finesse player. He tried to gain 15 pounds one summer, but that only slowed him down. Then he went to Switzerland (where he went to boarding school as a child) for a single season and he's still playing there.

If he were a few years younger, he'd have made it in the post-lockout era. In fact, had he returned in 2005, he'd probably have made it as a good player. But by then he was already 28 and set in Switzerland where he made almost an NHL-level salary, so he never became an NHL player.

 

[haveandare]

Duclair may work out some day, but until you play as a regular in the NHL, nothing has worked out, yet. McIlrath has not worked out yet, either, despite some here being convinced he will stick next year.

You can look at it however you want.

I personally don't think of it as NHL player = good pick, non NHL player = bad pick, and nothing in between that and the draft matters. Yes, that's the ultimate test, but for players who just haven't gotten along enough to have that chance, leaning on that as the only judgement of a pick means you can't talk about them very much at all.

Call it whatever you want, a third round pick developed way more than he was expected to last year. He scored at the same rate in the same league as two top picks that we'd love to have on this team. My original point was that the Duclair pick may have yielded something like a first round talent in a draft where the team had no first. I still think that.

 

[Beacon]

Honestly can't wait to add Duke and Fast to this team. With Kreider, Hags, MZA, McDonagh, etc, we'll be by far the fastest team in the league.

 

[Zil]

Honestly can't wait to add Duke and Fast to this team. With Kreider, Hags, MZA, McDonagh, etc, we'll be by far the fastest team in the league.

I'm more excited for a kid like Buchnevich than Fast. Adding Skjei in a year or two might be the biggest boost to overall team speed. McDonagh and Moore are the only two on the back end who can really move right now.

 

[Matt4776]

I'm more excited for a kid like Buchnevich than Fast. Adding Skjei in a year or two might be the biggest boost to overall team speed. McDonagh and Moore are the only two on the back end who can really move right now.

Long-term, if one of Buchnevich or Duclair make it to be consistent plus-NHL players, we are in fantastic shape.

Kreider
Hagelin
Duke/Buch

That's great LW depth (especially with our current depth at RW), and Pouliot is the perfect player to hold the fort for 2-3 years.

 

[Zil]

Long-term, if one of Buchnevich or Duclair make it to be consistent plus-NHL players, we are in fantastic shape.

Kreider
Hagelin
Duke/Buch

That's great LW depth (especially with our current depth at RW), and Pouliot is the perfect player to hold the fort for 2-3 years.

Haggerty making it as an effective offensive player would be huge. We need a big, right handed finisher. Supposedly he has some speed too.

 

[Brooklyn Rangers Fan]

Haggerty making it as an effective offensive player would be huge. We need a big, right handed finisher. Supposedly he has some speed too.

Really excited to see Haggerty play with pros. That shot would be lethal even if he was a lefty - as a righty, he could be an incredibly effective weapon on the powerplay...