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12'/13' Draft Thread: Offensive flash is a beauty but defensive presence rules.

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Rockinz said:
Im surprised people are not talking about Valeri Nichushkin!!!

GREAT skater, strong on his skates, solid 2 way game and HUGE offensive upside.

Heard from a scout that he is probably the most underrated player at the draft.

If we are in a 5-10 spot he would be a great addition.
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I'm surprised for all the Galchenyuk fans drooling over his skill set last year, there has been so little fanfare for Nichuskin this year.

Valari has a rare skill set, a powerful skater, a strong player, has a power game he is not shy using, the kid could be a wrecking ball in the NHL one day when he matures. He tantalizes you with the potential to make game altering plays. Not many have this ability.

He may even challenge Drouin for 3rd in my rankings one day.

We have only seen a small glimse of his raw ability, but what abilities they are. If we draft 3rd, we better take a look at him and I think Nonis would.

 
Interactif said:
I'm surprised for all the Galchenyuk fans drooling over his skill set last year, there has been so little fanfare for Nichuskin this year.

Valari has a rare skill set, a powerful skater, a strong player, has a power game he is not shy using, the kid could be a wrecking ball in the NHL one day when he matures. He tantalizes you with the potential to make game altering plays. Not many have this ability.

He may even challenge Drouin for 3rd in my rankings one day.

We have only seen a small glimse of his raw ability, but what abilities they are. If we draft 3rd, we better take a look at him and I think Nonis would.

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You had a Russian (Girgorenko) playing in Canada last year, and stated that teams would be scared off by the "Russian factor". Here, you have a Russian playing IN RUSSIA, but teams are going to look at taking him in the top 3?!

LOL:handclap::laugh::help:
 
ErnieLeafs said:
Nice try at fitting this conveniently into your argument, but unfortunately, it's hard to play dumb when it's pretty clear that we're talking about Nichushkin, from your last post, and the post by Finnish.....

Why do you keep saying "if you watched the WJC..."? .... I did. YOU didn't watch a single game Finland played, and probably haven't taken the time to watch any of Tappara's games on firstrowsports have you? Right, so you haven't the slightest idea about anything Barkov related, except that you don't like him because .... well...... I guess none of us know why.

Right. I know what I SAW, and since I didn't have TSN to watch, through you, I got a good analysis of what Mackenzie thought of the draft crop.
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For your information I've seen them all play, I don't know why you say this since you PM's me and I told you already. You are falling into the same trap as last year.

You are fixated on drafting a Center, that you are oblivious to all good prospects around you and it doesn't matter what a prospect does in your eyes, even better one's you are still going to pump a Gally or Barkov's tires due to this preference of yours.

If you don't want to listen to me look at all lists, Jones is ahead of Barkov, and it may only be a matter of time when Nichuskin is side by side or past Barkov too. Too bad we can't use Button's list of Barkov 3rd and Nichuskin 5th, what is he you said? Creates lists for conversation?
 
ErnieLeafs said:
You had a Russian (Girgorenko) playing in Canada last year, and stated that teams would be scared off by the "Russian factor". Here, you have a Russian playing IN RUSSIA, but teams are going to look at taking him in the top 3?!

LOL:handclap::laugh::help:
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No other prospect in the tourney could have made that play, a game winning highlight reel OT goal . You must have been impressed by his power, speed, and finish.
 
Interactif said:
For your information I've seen them all play, I don't know why you say this since you PM's me and I told you already. You are falling into the same trap as last year.

You are fixated on drafting a Center, that you are oblivious to all good prospects around you and it doesn't matter what a prospect does in your eyes, even better one's you are still going to pump a Gally or Barkov's tires due to this preference of yours.

If you don't want to listen to me look at all lists, Jones is ahead of Barkov, and it may only be a matter of time when Nichuskin is side by side or past Barkov too. Too bad we can't use Button's list of Barkov 3rd and Nichuskin 5th, what is he you said? Creates lists for conversation?
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Lol. I've maintained throughout the year that yes, I want a center, but I'm open to whoever, dependant on where we pick.

Most lists look at MacK, Jones, and Barkov as elite players, with potential franchise upside. In this case, it becomes a preference of what you're looking for in a player. I prefer what Barkov brings to the table over Jones, and I prefer what MacKinnon brings over Jones as well. That's my preference out of the guys in that tier. Simple as that.

You can't even argue my other post, because it points to the MAJOR flaw in your argument. If the "Russian factor" plays into a kid who was physically playing his junior hockey in NA, and stated his intent to do so long term, it absolutely applies to a guy who is playing in Russia. But.... That doesn't apply in this case, right? Because somehow he'll go 3rd, despite this.... It must be his intagibles, or maybe that you like THIS Russian.... LOL.

Anyways, my bad, to the rest of you here, for allowing this troll job to go on.

Someone tell me about Gauthier?
 
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ErnieLeafs said:
Lol. I've maintained throughout the year that yes, I want a center, but I'm open to whoever, dependant on where we pick.
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Now we have it on record, sorry I don't believe the second part. You would take Gally over Rielly I am sure in a second, maybe even Bobby Orr if he had been in last year's draft. Joke there.

You can't even argue my other post, because it points to the MAJOR flaw in your argument. If the "Russian factor" plays into a kid who was physically playing his junior hockey in NA, and stated his intent to do so long term, it absolutely applies to a guy who is playing in Russia.
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When did I say I was scared of Grigorenko not coming over to play in the NHL? Not me never said that.
 
Holy crap does Drouin look dynamic so far tonight. I've said I lean MacKinnon but if Jo plays like this in the second half...
 
blasted_Sabre said:
I still take MacKinnon if were given the chance. Strength down the middle yada yada yada.....
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Atleast you are honest about it, I would take the best player I deem that can help this franchise win a cup in the next decade. To me it's Jones, and I don't care what position he plays, makes no difference, he is the biggest difference maker in the draft.
 
Interactif said:
Atleast you are honest about it, I would take the best player I deem that can help this franchise win a cup in the next decade. To me it's Jones, and I don't care what position he plays, makes no difference, he is the biggest difference maker in the draft.
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I dont see it anymore then in MacKinnon. He had the better WJC for sure, but given top line minutes MacK would have shown a lot more IMO.
 
Always take BPA when picking 1st overall. If two players are seen as equal, then you can look at position.
 
Interactif said:
Now we have it on record, sorry I don't believe the second part. You would take Gally over Rielly I am sure in a second, maybe even Bobby Orr if he had been in last year's draft. Joke there.



When did I say I was scared of Grigorenko not coming over to play in the NHL? Not me never said that.
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Do I need to go back 42 pages and quote you on the "Russian factor" and all of your talk about Russians and question marks last year? Really?

I'm pretty sure everyone here remembers.

Give it a rest. Two things you do well, contradict yourself, and play dumb.

You have it on record that I want a center from the last two drafts anyways, i'm not saying i don't. I never once denied my preference for a center. you're arguing with what I may be implicating (in you head). Look above at the person who says when all things are subjectively equal, you go on preference. It's clear that there are a top 3 of elite players in this draft, and I want one of the two elite centers... So...?

Bobby Orr? Sensationalism at its finest...
 
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Mackinnon is BPA and will be the biggest impact player in the draft, he's what you want in a player. One of the most explosive players I've ever seen, impossible to predict, he's gifted offensively and he's a heart player.

Jones on the other hand, while a good skater, is easy to shut down offensively because of the lack of creativity to his game. Defensively he's one of the best for his age group, however he needs to be more confident in his decision making, there are times where he doesn't fully commit because he is unsure, and that split second is a huge difference compared to junior and the pros.
 
FishManSam said:
Mackinnon is BPA and will be the biggest impact player in the draft, he's what you want in a player. One of the most explosive players I've ever seen, impossible to predict, he's gifted offensively and he's a heart player.

Jones on the other hand, while a good skater, is easy to shut down offensively because of the lack of creativity to his game. Defensively he's one of the best for his age group, however he needs to be more confident in his decision making, there are times where he doesn't fully commit because he is unsure, and that split second is a huge difference compared to junior and the pros.
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First paragraph says it all. If by some miracle we draft at #1, MacKinnon or bust.
 
ErnieLeafs said:
Do I need to go back 42 pages and quote you on the "Russian factor" and all of your talk about Russians and question marks last year? Really?

I'm pretty sure everyone here remembers.

Give it a rest. Two things you do well, contradict yourself, and play dumb.

You have it on record that I want a center from the last two drafts anyways, i'm not saying i don't. I never once denied my preference for a center. you're arguing with what I may be implicating (in you head). Look above at the person who says when all things are subjectively equal, you go on preference. It's clear that there are a top 3 of elite players in this draft, and I want one of the two elite centers... So...?

Bobby Orr? Sensationalism at its finest...
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The Russian factor is a fact amongst NHL scouts and GM's including your fav Grant Sonnier. but it wasn't the overriding factor why I preferred a defenceman last year. You don't think the KHL is not a factor to Russian prospects? Regardless if I like a prospect enough I don't make this a huge deal as much as you think.

As for wanting a Center, you admitted this, we all know this here, to the point of being tunnel visioned on better prospects. Seth Jones is the best 1-2 prospects in this draft, with Mackinnon. Just slightly ahead of him right now but it's these 2 and the rest. The fact you would take Barkov over him speaks of this blindness. And this is proof you have tunnel vision when you see a big Center. As I said you wouldn't give a second thought of taking Gally over Rielly or Murray.

As for me addressing hockey fans on the leafs board are dumb, certainly not all are, there are some very good posters on here, look at my friends list. There are many, I enjoy talking to that I think have good opinions. The fact I am conversing with you should tell you something.

But there are some blind homer fans also, one's that would balk at trading a borderline #2C for a All star #1 Franchise Goalie. And this is illogical especially in this league when you cannot win a thing without a bone fide #1G. Correct?
 
Dreakmur said:
No other prospect could have walked around Ryan Murphy?
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Just listen to Bob Mckenzie, Murphy got a lot of blame for this, but this is a world class player, who did the same thing against Seth Jones earlier in the tourney also. Rielly was there but couldn't get back to stop him from cutting in front of the net. That's 3 pretty good defence man.

I think Nichuskin is the 3rd best prospect this year, he's behind Drouin only because of what Drouin did in at the WJC, in the end Nichuskin is no worse than #4 IMO.
 
Dreakmur said:
No other prospect could have walked around Ryan Murphy?
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LOL. So true.

Interactif said:
Just listen to Bob Mckenzie, Murphy got a lot of blame for this, but this is a world class player, who did the same thing against Seth Jones earlier in the tourney also. Rielly was there but couldn't get back to stop him from cutting in front of the net. That's 3 pretty good defence man.

I think Nichuskin is the 3rd best prospect this year, he's behind Drouin only because of what Drouin did in at the WJC, in the end Nichuskin is no worse than #4 IMO.
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3rd? I know you have Jones at 1, Drouin in there somewhere. Where is MacKinnon? Please don't tell me the 4th line details at the WJC has soured you so much on MacKinnon that he is 4th in your eyes. Or do tell me that and I will know where your opinion sits with me.
 
The Naz said:
LOL. So true.



3rd? I know you have Jones at 1, Drouin in there somewhere. Where is MacKinnon? Please don't tell me the 4th line details at the WJC has soured you so much on MacKinnon that he is 4th in your eyes. Or do tell me that and I will know where your opinion sits with me.
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Cream of the crop

Jones
Mackinnon

Next Best off the top of my head

Drouin
Nichushkin

Next best list haven't given it too much thought this early

Monahan

Any of these 5 and the team's that draft these guys have done very well.
 
Interactif said:
Cream of the crop

Jones
Mackinnon

Next Best off the top of my head

Drouin
Nichushkin

Next best list haven't given it too much thought this early

Monahan


Any of these 5 and the team's that draft these guys have done very well.
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Well I agree with everything but Nichuskin. And I'd put Lindholm and Barkov with Monahan. I'd put VN a step back with Hunter Shinkaruk. I think he could be a great sniper like Skinner, while VN I'm guessing will be a solid 2nd line Center like Berglund.

But I still think I'd take MacKinnon 1st, as I think it's always less risky taking forwards. Sometimes a D's dominance in Jr doesn't translate as well to the pros. Schenn and EJ come to mind. It's just slightly more risky. Offensive and Defensive skills for D are sometimes harder to carry over.

But to have Jones pan out as projected for the Leafs would be amazing. We'd either have excellent trade bait in one our top 4 or a top 4 to rival any in hockey.

Jones - Reilly
Phaneuf - Gardiner
Gunnarson - Finn
Percy


How amazing could that be. Even if Jones isn't as good as Phaneuf (who I'm very high on) it's still a fantastic top 4. He'd still be our 2nd best, and anchor a very solid 2nd pair.
 
The Naz said:
Well I agree with everything but Nichuskin. And I'd put Lindholm and Barkov with Monahan. I'd put VN a step back with Hunter Shinkaruk. I think he could be a great sniper like Skinner, while VN I'm guessing will be a solid 2nd line Center like Berglund.

But I still think I'd take MacKinnon 1st, as I think it's always less risky taking forwards. Sometimes a D's dominance in Jr doesn't translate as well to the pros. Schenn and EJ come to mind. It's just slightly more risky. Offensive and Defensive skills for D are sometimes harder to carry over.

But to have Jones pan out as projected for the Leafs would be amazing. We'd either have excellent trade bait in one our top 4 or a top 4 to rival any in hockey.

Jones - Reilly
Phaneuf - Gardiner
Gunnarson - Finn
Percy


How amazing could that be. Even if Jones isn't as good as Phaneuf (who I'm very high on) it's still a fantastic top 4. He'd still be our 2nd best, and anchor a very solid 2nd pair.
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Be amazing if we get Nichuskin, trade Grabo for Luongo and sign Getzlaf as our #1C with either Zajac or Weiss as our #2C, and either Kadri or Colborne as #3C next season.

There we are #1G, #1C, #2C and we still have Reilly, Gardiner, Finn, Nilsson and Percy ready to join our Defence. If only it worked out this way, pretender to contender in a year. Just one half year of pain to endure for the big picture.
 
Interactif said:
Be amazing if we get Nichuskin, trade Grabo for Luongo and sign Getzlaf as our #1C with either Zajac or Weiss as our #2C, and either Kadri or Colborne as #3C next season.

There we are #1G, #1C, #2C and we still have Reilly, Gardiner, Finn, Nilsson and Percy ready to join our Defence. If only it worked out this way, pretender to contender in a year. Just one half year of pain to endure for the big picture.
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So I guess you would mean tank this year with the loss of Grabovski. I know your not high on him, but without him, we are screwed this year. Bozak, Connolly and McClement as our top 3? Maybe this would be the year Connolly doesn't get hurt? :laugh:
 
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