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Yzerman End of Season pressconference

Agree on 2015-2018. You can't miss that badly in the 1st round 4 years in a row entering a rebuild and not pay for it.

The last point however is like saying you're struggling to pay rent because you didn't pull a winning lottery ticket.

The 2nd rounds in 2019 and 2020 were particularly good. Only 8 from 19 haven’t played yet, and 10 from 2020.

Detroit had 2 picks in 2019 and 3 in 2020. They went 1 for 5 with Johansson. The rest are busts or trending that way.
 
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How did they miss on 2nd round in 2019 if Johansson was playing in top 4 last year?

See my post. We went 1/5 when the hit rate in those 2nd rounds combined was about 70%.

If Detroit went 3/5 I wouldn’t be complaining.
 
See my post. We went 1/5 when the hit rate in those 2nd rounds combined was about 70%.
Wooooaaaahhhhh.... I'm gonna need you to define how you come up with hit rate

EDIT: I guess you mention it in the post before as "played a game in the NHL"

We are not a Nikita Alexandrov or Samuel Bolduc or Matthew Robertson or Artemi Kniazev or Egor Afanasyev or Raphael Lavoie or Mads Sogaard away from ramping up this rebuild to Stanley Cup contender. Being gifted a few NHL games doesn't make you a good NHL player. I see like 3 or 4 players that improve our team
 
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Wooooaaaahhhhh.... I'm gonna need you to define how you come up with hit rate

EDIT: I guess you mention it in the post before as "played a game in the NHL"

We are not a Nikita Alexandrov or Samuel Bolduc or Matthew Robertson or Artemi Kniazev or Egor Afanasyev or Raphael Lavoie or Mads Sogaard away from ramping up this rebuild to Stanley Cup contender. Being gifted a few NHL games doesn't make you a good NHL player. I see like 3 or 4 players that improve our team
I'm hesitant to relitigate the Holland era, but with decent scouts you could've easily had a Norris winning d-man who played right in your back yard. You could have drafted a scoring line center in Nick Suzuki rather than Michael Rasmussen.

The general defense for our sh*tty drafting under Holland was that there are no high quality NHL players where we draft. There clearly were, but we were busy blowing our best draft capital on busts.
 
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See my post. We went 1/5 when the hit rate in those 2nd rounds combined was about 70%.

If Detroit went 3/5 I wouldn’t be complaining.
Still a little premature to write-off Wallinder.

2022 may be Yzerman's best year with the potential of 4 of the first 5 making the team.
 
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Soooo, about that...
Yeah, this is such a fantastic post, top shelf ... perfectly, purposely obtuse. Pretty clearly, you saw none of it.

The game's result doesn't change my admiration of how the Blues played. There's never been an NHL team admired for their effort, who's never lost a game.

Two goals against with Hellebuyck pulled, including the latest tying goal ever scored in Stanley Cup history, vs the team that won the President's trophy, on the road.
 
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Wooooaaaahhhhh.... I'm gonna need you to define how you come up with hit rate

EDIT: I guess you mention it in the post before as "played a game in the NHL"

We are not a Nikita Alexandrov or Samuel Bolduc or Matthew Robertson or Artemi Kniazev or Egor Afanasyev or Raphael Lavoie or Mads Sogaard away from ramping up this rebuild to Stanley Cup contender. Being gifted a few NHL games doesn't make you a good NHL player. I see like 3 or 4 players that improve our team

Nice cherrypicking. Most of these guys have just been breaking into the league over the last 2 seasons. But there’s been hits.

Peterka, Kochetkov, Lacombe, Faber, Cuylle, Lohrei all look pretty decent. There’s a few others that you’ll see a growing impact from others like Keven, Colangelo, Heinemen, etc.

I’m not crazy enough to expect a team’s 2nd rounder into becoming a 60+ point forward or top pair defender, but solid a solid 3rd liner? That’s a great outcome when picking in the 40s.
 
Nice cherrypicking. Most of these guys have just been breaking into the league over the last 2 seasons. But there’s been hits.

Peterka, Kochetkov, Lacombe, Faber, Cuylle, Lohrei all look pretty decent. There’s a few others that you’ll see a growing impact from others like Keven, Colangelo, Heinemen, etc.

I’m not crazy enough to expect a team’s 2nd rounder into becoming a 60+ point forward or top pair defender, but solid a solid 3rd liner? That’s a great outcome when picking in the 40s.
I'm only taking exception to the claim that 70% of 2nd round picks from those 2 years are hits.

You listed 9 names there. You're confident you can list 34 more guys from the 2nd round of those 2 drafts that will be solid 3rd liners??
 


Pat Caputo didn't hold back on Yzerman's terrible FA signings.

It's an entirely fair question to ask: It's understandable to sign some veteran placeholders while the kids develop...but why choose free agents that neither produce much nor are tough to play against?

If the ugly truth is that the team is too cheap to pay for a tier of free agent that will actually help, then don't expect anyone but the hardcore fans to stick with the product until they start winning more games.
 
It's an entirely fair question to ask: It's understandable to sign some veteran placeholders while the kids develop...but why choose free agents that neither produce much nor are tough to play against?

If the ugly truth is that the team is too cheap to pay for a tier of free agent that will actually help, then don't expect anyone but the hardcore fans to stick with the product until they start winning more games.
And their contracts are all unmovable and way too long.
 
It's an entirely fair question to ask: It's understandable to sign some veteran placeholders while the kids develop...but why choose free agents that neither produce much nor are tough to play against?

If the ugly truth is that the team is too cheap to pay for a tier of free agent that will actually help, then don't expect anyone but the hardcore fans to stick with the product until they start winning more games.

I wish he would have been a bit more critical of himself during the presser instead of the don't worry we're building a long-term contender and the players now have to play better.
 
re: bottom six signings

I get wanting to inject more physical play and a rougher identity into the bottom6 by signing a guy or two but...we need more help in the top9. And we might not be able to get out from Compher and Tank, and I (personally) don't want to see us throwing good assets after bad to move them.

I'd focus on upgrading the top9, either thru signings and/or with kids, and if we have the most expensive 4th line in the league, that's what happens. If we're eating cap, buying a guy out, etc., it should be Holl. I'm way more comfortable with Ras-Compher-Tank as our fourth line than Holl on our bottom pairing.
 
I'm not sure exactly what you're referring to.

Someone has previously stated that Ras is one of the most physical players on the team. If it wasn't you and I'm confusing you with someone else, I apologize. I assumed it was the same person making that claim but there might be two?

Even if it's the only time you've made the statement, it's still false.

If you're wanting citations proving Ras doesn't bring more physically than any other player on the team, Seider and Kasper have more hits than Ras. It's a bad metric for physicality but even using the one most advantageous to Ras, it's false. Other players who bring more physically include Seider, Chiarot, Fischer, Motte, Watson, Shine, Smith...

My comment was asking for proof that we have more physical forwards. I ask for that because he consistently is among the top couple of forwards in Hits. If you're going to argue he isn't among the most physical forwards on the team the last 4 years bring something to the table to support that claim.

As a point of clarity, in previous posts I've called him the most physical forward. He's nowhere near Seider/Chairot, or even Edvinsson's level. Admittedly, I was still posting within that context and I don't think I noted that distinction in the post you quoted, so apologies for the miscommunication there on my part.

As a matter of fact, Adam Erne is the only Detroit Red Wings forward has put up more hits than Rasmussen more than once. Ras is always in the top 2 or 3 for forwards in hits.

Motte is not physical at all.

Ill concede guys like Watson and Shine are "more physical" but they are AHLers so who gives a f***. Smith? Craig? definitely not. Giavani, I guess, but again, he can't hold down an NHL roster spot so who cares.

Kasper's emergence has been nice. I look forward to the day when we have multiple NHL forwards who are consistently more physical than Rasmussen. We're not there yet but Kasper is a nice step in that direction. FWIW, Ras put up more hits/60.

If we want to be a more physical team, the most effective way to get there is start by shipping out the least physical guys, not one who is always at the top of the forward group in hits.

Again, I'm not arguing he's a monster but I disagree with making him the whipping boy. Berggren, Tarasenko, Motte, Smith, Veleno, Fischer all contributed less to this team. Guys like Copp, Compher, don't bring much physciality at all.


He has scored 15g ONCE and has never reached 35pts…

You're technically correct. Personally, I think its more nuanced than that. For example, in terms of win contributions, is there a material difference between scoring 33 points in 75 games and 35 points in 82 games?

Further, he has 49 goals in his last 288 games. So he has scored 15 and he averages 14 goals every 82 games. He's put up 110 points over the same period. That's 31 points every 82 games. He put up 29 in 56 games during the covid season and followed it up with a 33 point season. If you want to hold a global pandemic and a season where he came 2 points shy in 75 games against him, have at er. I'd argue that if you dwell to much on those platitudes you're missing the capability of the player.

FWIW, These numbers includes this most recent season which actually drags the numbers down a touch as it was his worst season since establishing himself as a full time forward. I think he can bounce back to that form he's demonstrated the previous 3 seasons.
 
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My comment was asking for proof that we have more physical forwards. I ask for that because he consistently is among the top couple of forwards in Hits. If you're going to argue he isn't among the most physical forwards on the team the last 4 years bring something to the table to support that claim.

As a point of clarity, in previous posts I've called him the most physical forward. He's nowhere near Seider/Chairot, or even Edvinsson's level. Admittedly, I was still posting within that context and I don't think I noted that distinction in the post you quoted, so apologies for the miscommunication there on my part.

As a matter of fact, Adam Erne is the only Detroit Red Wings forward has put up more hits than Rasmussen more than once. Ras is always in the top 2 or 3 for forwards in hits.

Motte is not physical at all.

Ill concede guys like Watson and Shine are "more physical" but they are AHLers so who gives a f***. Smith? Craig? definitely not. Giavani, I guess, but again, he can't hold down an NHL roster spot so who cares.

Kasper's emergence has been nice. I look forward to the day when we have multiple NHL forwards who are consistently more physical than Rasmussen. We're not there yet but Kasper is a nice step in that direction. FWIW, Ras put up more hits/60.

If we want to be a more physical team, the most effective way to get there is start by shipping out the least physical guys, not one who is always at the top of the forward group in hits.

Again, I'm not arguing he's a monster but I disagree with making him the whipping boy. Berggren, Tarasenko, Motte, Smith, Veleno, Fischer all contributed less to this team. Guys like Copp, Compher, don't bring much physciality at all.




You're technically correct. Personally, I think its more nuanced than that. For example, in terms of win contributions, is there a material difference between scoring 33 points in 75 games and 35 points in 82 games?

Further, he has 49 goals in his last 288 games. So he has scored 15 and he averages 14 goals every 82 games. He's put up 110 points over the same period. That's 31 points every 82 games. He put up 29 in 56 games during the covid season and followed it up with a 33 point season. If you want to hold a global pandemic and a season where he came 2 points shy in 75 games against him, have at er. I'd argue that if you dwell to much on those platitudes you're missing the capability of the player.

FWIW, These numbers includes this most recent season which actually drags the numbers down a touch as it was his worst season since establishing himself as a full time forward. I think he can bounce back to that form he's demonstrated the previous 3 seasons.
That was a lot to type out just to end up saying he’s still never once scored 15g/35pts in the same season.
 
That was a lot to type out just to end up saying he’s still never once scored 15g/35pts in the same season.

It wasn't much typing. Took a minute or so.

Do you think there is much difference, in terms of win contributions, between scoring 33 points in 75 games and 35 points in 82 games?

29 point in 56 games is a good season - better than 60-70% of the league. 33 in 75 is damn solid too.
 
It wasn't much typing. Took a minute or so.

Do you think there is much difference, in terms of win contributions, between scoring 33 points in 75 games and 35 points in 82 games?

29 point in 56 games is a good season. 33 in 75 is damn solid too.
And here we thought you were attempting to make Ras look valuable. :huh:
 
And here we thought you were attempting to make Ras look valuable. :huh:

Have you read a single one of my posts? Pretty sure every one on the topic says something along the lines of "I disagree with him being the whipping boy" or "he's useful" or "I'm not calling him a monster"

A guy that is going to be around 15 goals and 30+ points in your bottom 6 while being top twoish among forwards in hits is a useful piece.
 
It wasn't much typing. Took a minute or so.

Do you think there is much difference, in terms of win contributions, between scoring 33 points in 75 games and 35 points in 82 games?

29 point in 56 games is a good season - better than 60-70% of the league. 33 in 75 is damn solid too.
It doesn’t change it was an exaggerated point.

29 in 56 is good. It’s also not something he’s ever come close to replicating over a full season.

33 in 75 is okay. Would want more from a guy who really offers little else other than being tall.

Also this missed time just means that someone even worse has to enter the lineup.
 
It doesn’t change it was an exaggerated point.

29 in 56 is good. It’s also not something he’s ever come close to replicating over a full season.

33 in 75 is okay. Would want more from a guy who really offers little else other than being tall.

Also this missed time just means that someone even worse has to enter the lineup.

Again, Id argue focusing too much on platitudes miss capability at times. It's not like we are talking about a bandaid or a tiny sample size here. That was back to back seasons where he missed a total of 5 games racking up 62 points in 131 games while being a top 2 forward in hits.

I'm not worried about missed time... Since becoming a full time forward he hasn't missed more than 7 games in a season.

This year was a step back for sure. but if you want to disregard his best season we should also disregard his worst season. I think he bounces back to that previously demonstrated form.
 
Have you read a single one of my posts? Pretty sure every one on the topic says something along the lines of "I disagree with him being the whipping boy" or "he's useful" or "I'm not calling him a monster"

A guy that is going to be around 15 goals and 30+ points in your bottom 6 while being top twoish among forwards in hits is a useful piece.

I feel like you're leaning heavily on the hits stat, which isn't a great metric for determining physicality. All hits are not created equal. Soderblom doesn't have the hit totals because he only played a partial season but has hit players much harder than Rasmussen ever has. Ras's hardest hit was when he stood there and Hughes ran into him.

In his first NHL season, 6'1" 183 lbs Marco Kasper became a more physical player than Ras, which highlights what a disappointment Rasmussen is. The Wings desperately need size and toughness and one of the biggest players on the team is 10-ply.
 
I feel like you're leaning heavily on the hits stat, which isn't a great metric for determining physicality. All hits are not created equal. Soderblom doesn't have the hit totals because he only played a partial season but has hit players much harder than Rasmussen ever has. Ras's hardest hit was when he stood there and Hughes ran into him.

In his first NHL season, 6'1" 183 lbs Marco Kasper became a more physical player than Ras, which highlights what a disappointment Rasmussen is. The Wings desperately need size and toughness and one of the biggest players on the team is 10-ply.

Care to provide a better metric for evaluating how much physicality someone brings? Or am I supposed to just trust your feelings?
 

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