Your Rebuild Opinion? Next Move Coming?

[minimal]

A few facts for your consideration:

• Yzerman committed $116m in total salary through free agency in the summers of 2022 & 2023.
• As of February 28, 2024 the team was in 6th place, 4 points behind Toronto and Carolina, pacing to put up 99 points and be +31 in goal differential.
• Team faceplanted from February 29-April 11, 2024 and bottled a playoff spot.
• LOL at claiming Larkin was "important enough and a good enough leader to pull the team within an inch of the playoffs". The team lost 15 of 20 games to bottle a playoff spot. FACT. Try to wave this away, but results are results and this is a results business.
• Did it once again this year when Copp got inured, but of course Yzerman should have done more, it's impossible to ask precious Dylan to help get a team across the line. Instead Marco kicks f**king ass:
• After Copp went down, Kasper put up 10 goals 7 assists and was +8.
• After Copp went down, Larkin put up 6 goals, 6 EVS assists and was -15.

I'd be OK with Larkin if he didn't throw a pity party for himself every time someone sticks a microphone in front of him. That's not leadership and the fact the team wilted down the stretch two years in a row isn't a good sign for him as a leader. I know you'll make every excuse possible for him and I guess that's fine, but the facts don't support your view that Larkin is some sort of great leader. As I said earlier, I think he was all pissy during his end of season presser because he didn't like what he heard from Todd in their final meeting before he cleaned out his locker.

Do you support him continuing to whine the way he did in his last presser? Is that the type of leadership you want for the Red Wings?

Christ dude, I can throw out a bunch of stats without context, too. You can quote me salary spent without saying the players it was spent on, or games they lost without saying how many games Larkin was actually on the ice for (if you are actually talking about that 2024 stretch where he was injured and actively not in the lineup). And yeah, never said that he can't be criticized for his play down the stretch this season, but you keep harping on stuff without any context at all and then acting holier-than-thou about someone that clearly gives a shit about the organization and team.

Yeah, I take Larkin as the captain over Seider or Raymond or whoever else on the team right now. Looking forward to cheering him on next season.

 

[wingsfannnn9191]

Tarasenko has been saying that?
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Old Power Forward on the decline.

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I like the aggression.

Sorry I meant I been saying it for a while that's what I would do to get rid of tarasenko

Sure but if he was still the same he wouldn't be available. Has 1 less year than compher. We dont need 2 of copp and compher ....

Just came to my mind thought might not be a good idea simply for the possibility of the kreider kasper kane line.... kkk line lmao we'd never be able to play the 3 together

 

[stillwater]

Yeah, Larkin has his warts, no one is perfect.

He does a lot of things I don't care for.

But, he's the captain and will remain the captain of the Red Wings.

There's a lot of other priorities than switching up the captain.

He's not without fault, but if this team had more depth, his slumps wouldn't appear so lengthy.

So much depends on him because of lack of depth.

 

[Voodoo Glow Skulls]

Sorry I meant I been saying it for a while that's what I would do to get rid of tarasenko

Sure but if he was still the same he wouldn't be available. Has 1 less year than compher. We dont need 2 of copp and compher ....

Just came to my mind thought might not be a good idea simply for the possibility of the kreider kasper kane line.... kkk line lmao we'd never be able to play the 3 together

Good idea.

I think a "kkk" line would really catch on.

Look up Kreider. There's a reason the Rangers want to dump him.

 

[RED WINGS STOMP]

Yeah, Larkin has his warts, no one is perfect.

He does a lot of things I don't care for.

But, he's the captain and will remain the captain of the Red Wings.

There's a lot of other priorities than switching up the captain.

He's not without fault, but if this team had more depth, his slumps wouldn't appear so lengthy.

So much depends on him because of lack of depth.

I am of the same mind on Larkin and I am not on board with the trade talk stuff for the most part.

We haven't had anything remotely close to a quality 2 C since the Zetterberg Datsyuk days. Larkin has had to do ALL of the heavy lifting at C. Now, we might finally have a player capable of helping lighten his load in Kasper and the idea is, go back to square one now?

I feel like Kasper could be a huge help on these March collapses. Maybe a fresher Larkin helps make the team better in March? I would rather try that route first then going off the rails with a Larkin trade.

 

[wingsfannnn9191]

Good idea.

I think a "kkk" line would really catch on.

Look up Kreider. There's a reason the Rangers want to dump him.

What's the reason?? Just seen he and zibanejad are on the block ,the 2nds term is way too long to ever consider

Thing is with these guys you'll never have them be made available when they're doing good. Call for kyle connor and jets will way no thanks we're gonna try to resign him

I wouldn't be shocked if kreider scores 25 next season. More importantly compher would be gone. I'd have to check to see who else might be available ... as for simply getting rid of compher I'd be shocked if we called someone and they offered a 4th for him. If that happens I obviously do that

 

[ElProfessor]

I am of the same mind on Larkin and I am not on board with the trade talk stuff for the most part.

We haven't had anything remotely close to a quality 2 C since the Zetterberg Datsyuk days. Larkin has had to do ALL of the heavy lifting at C. Now, we might finally have a player capable of helping lighten his load in Kasper and the idea is, go back to square one now?

I feel like Kasper could be a huge help on these March collapses. Maybe a fresher Larkin helps make the team better in March? I would rather try that route first then going off the rails with a Larkin trade.

Trade Larkin. He’s too old for the rebuild. Seider is ready to be captain. Larkin will net two 1sts and more, and be worth it. Overpay Matt Duchene (82pts to Larkin’s 70 this yr) on a 3yr deal to replace him until the picks mature. Easy-peasy.

Ditto DeBrincat. Too old for the rebuild, and a FA soon too. And he’ll also net you two 1sts. Overpay to get Tavares (74pts to DeBrincat’s 70) on a 3yr deal to replace him until the picks mature. Easy easy.

 

[ElProfessor]

-Trade Larkin for a 2025 1st, 2026 1st, and ?
-Trade DeBrincat for a 2025 1st and 2026 1st.

-Sign Orlov (3yrs, $21M)
-Sign Tavares (3yrs, $18M)
-Sign Marchand (3yrs, $18M)
-Sign Duchene (3yrs, $15M)
-Resign Kane (2yrs, $10M)

-3 1st Rd Picks: C, W, D

2025-26 Wings: Seider 24

TAVARES—DUCHENE—Raymond
MARCHAND—Kasper—Kane
Soder—Danielson—Mazur
Ras—Copp—Compher
Tank

Edvinsson—Seider
ORLOV—Johansson (ASP mid-yr)
Chiarot—AHL FA (Johansson mid-yr)
Gustafsson, Holl

Mrazek, Talbot

**********

-3 1st Rd Picks: W, W, D

2026-27 Wings: Seider 25

TAVARES—Kasper—Raymond
Buchelnikov—Danielson—MBN
MARCHAND—DUCHENE—Kane
Soder—Copp—Mazur
Compher, Ras

Edvinsson—Seider
ORLOV—ASP
Wallinder—Johansson

Cossa, ???

**********

2027-28 Wings: Seider 26

Buchelnikov—Kasper—Raymond
2025 1st—Danielson—MBN
TAVARES—2025 1st—DUCHENE
MARCHAND—Compher—Mazur
Soder, Ras

Edvinsson—Seider
2025 1st—ASP
ORLOV—Johansson
Wallinder

Cossa, Augustine

**********

2028-29 Wings: Seider 27

2025 1st—Kasper—Raymond
2026 1st—Danielson—MBN
Buchelnikov—2025 1st—2026 1st
Soder—???—Mazur

Edvinsson—Seider
2025 1st—ASP
Johansson—2026 1st
Wallinder

Cossa, Augustine

 

[lilidk]

If Larkin so frustrated with Yzerman , he should ask for trade and Red Wings will start new rebuild, but this time it will be short, maybe 3 more years. He should understand that not much Yzerman could do at trade deadline, I even want him to sell some guys like Rasmussen and Tarasenko, don't know who could take them, but whatever.

 

[13to40]

Talbot was perfectly average this season. Average in goals against percentage, average in goalie point shares, slightly above average quality start percentage, bang average in really bad starts. Anyone focusing on PK save percentage on a team with historically bad PK stats should be embarrassed.

Not sure if you actually watched any games or not, but the powerplay being god awful more often than not was because the goalie was unable to stop a beach ball… or as I’ve mentioned a few hundred times this season: or from Justin Holl being on the ice.

But sure don’t put any of the blame on the goaltender.

There is a fine line between having a good goalie who will take you into the playoffs and win you games VS a pile of crap in nets: being a bridge gap in hopes for the future goaltending prospects to develop.

This team’s goaltending quality is on the lower end and nowhere near playoff calibre.

 

[Chris Langlois]

Trade Larkin. He’s too old for the rebuild. Seider is ready to be captain. Larkin will net two 1sts and more, and be worth it. Overpay Matt Duchene (82pts to Larkin’s 70 this yr) on a 3yr deal to replace him until the picks mature. Easy-peasy.

Ditto DeBrincat. Too old for the rebuild, and a FA soon too. And he’ll also net you two 1sts. Overpay to get Tavares (74pts to DeBrincat’s 70) on a 3yr deal to replace him until the picks mature. Easy easy.

This is dumb mentality. Cat is too old for the rebuild? So you trade him and bring in an older Tavares? Good thing you're not in charge.

 

[nbwingsfan]

Meh. Kasper's undisputably better as a rookie than Larkin was. I'm very excited to see where he goes.

And I've always felt Danielson was a better prospect than Kasper (as 95% of posters here agreed before Lalonde was fired).

Idk why you take me liking two of our kids as some sort of hatred of Larkin. But to each his own

And Raymond was better than Kaprizov at the same age and as rookies…it means nothing.

The chances Danielson ends up better than Larkin is very, very low.

 

[RedHawkDown]

A few facts for your consideration:

• Yzerman committed $116m in total salary through free agency in the summers of 2022 & 2023.
• As of February 28, 2024 the team was in 6th place, 4 points behind Toronto and Carolina, pacing to put up 99 points and be +31 in goal differential.
• Team faceplanted from February 29-April 11, 2024 and bottled a playoff spot.
• LOL at claiming Larkin was "important enough and a good enough leader to pull the team within an inch of the playoffs". The team lost 15 of 20 games to bottle a playoff spot. FACT. Try to wave this away, but results are results and this is a results business.
• Did it once again this year when Copp got inured, but of course Yzerman should have done more, it's impossible to ask precious Dylan to help get a team across the line. Instead Marco kicks f**king ass:
• After Copp went down, Kasper put up 10 goals 7 assists and was +8.
• After Copp went down, Larkin put up 6 goals, 6 EVS assists and was -15.

I'd be OK with Larkin if he didn't throw a pity party for himself every time someone sticks a microphone in front of him. That's not leadership and the fact the team wilted down the stretch two years in a row isn't a good sign for him as a leader. I know you'll make every excuse possible for him and I guess that's fine, but the facts don't support your view that Larkin is some sort of great leader. As I said earlier, I think he was all pissy during his end of season presser because he didn't like what he heard from Todd in their final meeting before he cleaned out his locker.

Do you support him continuing to whine the way he did in his last presser? Is that the type of leadership you want for the Red Wings?

Perfectly said. Agree with everything.

 

[RedHawkDown]

Christ dude, I can throw out a bunch of stats without context, too. You can quote me salary spent without saying the players it was spent on, or games they lost without saying how many games Larkin was actually on the ice for (if you are actually talking about that 2024 stretch where he was injured and actively not in the lineup). And yeah, never said that he can't be criticized for his play down the stretch this season, but you keep harping on stuff without any context at all and then acting holier-than-thou about someone that clearly gives a shit about the organization and team.

Yeah, I take Larkin as the captain over Seider or Raymond or whoever else on the team right now. Looking forward to cheering him on next season.

Why?

 

[Air Budd Dwyer]

I've felt a bit skeptical of Larkin's ability to lead this team for quite some time. I don't know how to explain it but it's like, you get a feeling just from looking at someone lol. Then he's weeping in front of the whole hockey world because his teammate was traded. Yzerman, Lidstrom, even Zetterberg would've never done that. He just comes across as soft. Not taking anything away from him as a player, he's a fine hockey player. I'm just not sold on him being the captain.

Obviously my opinion probably isn't based in reality and what goes on behind closed doors with this team. Even if I'm wrong here, I'll refuse to back off this opinion!

 

[ElProfessor]

This is dumb mentality. Cat is too old for the rebuild? So you trade him and bring in an older Tavares? Good thing you're not in charge.

You trade him for two first rd picks and sign a vet to a 3yr deal to offset the loss until the prospects are ready.

Yes.

 

[ElProfessor]

And Raymond was better than Kaprizov at the same age and as rookies…it means nothing.

The chances Danielson ends up better than Larkin is very, very low.

Did someone say Danielson was going to be better than Larkin?

And based on what are they “very, very low”.

He’s 19, he was drafted 6 slots higher than Larkin and just had a much better rookie yr in GR than Kasper did last yr…who just had a much better NHL rookie yr than Larkin did.

And what is this glorification of Larkin anyways? His highest ever point total is 79 three yrs ago.

Raymond has 80 this yr.

Larkin’s best yr ever would be 30th in pts this yr.

34 yr old Matt Duchene who we could replace him with for $3M less per yr had 82pts this yr.

34yr old Tavares who we could replace him w for $3M less per yr had 74pts this yr…better than Larkin’s 2nd best season ever, 73.

Larkin’s a really good player, and a good two-way player. But he’s always just been sort of a borderline #1/#2 center on a contender level player. It’s not the most impossible thing to replace, or for Kasper/Danielson to aspire to

Larkin’s game is a speed game too. He’s gonna be 29 next yr. The odds of him ever reaching 79pts again are low. He’s probably already on his downside.

 

[Pavels Dog]

I've felt a bit skeptical of Larkin's ability to lead this team for quite some time. I don't know how to explain it but it's like, you get a feeling just from looking at someone lol. Then he's weeping in front of the whole hockey world because his teammate was traded. Yzerman, Lidstrom, even Zetterberg would've never done that. He just comes across as soft. Not taking anything away from him as a player, he's a fine hockey player. I'm just not sold on him being the captain.

Obviously my opinion probably isn't based in reality and what goes on behind closed doors with this team. Even if I'm wrong here, I'll refuse to back off this opinion!

As a captain you’re either an emotionless robot or get accused of being ”soft”.. very little in between.

Larkin’s biggest problem might be that he cares too much. I think 4 nations showed how good he can be when he doesn’t have the weight of a franchise on his shoulders and an entire fanbase looking for him to be the perfect captain that drags a mediocre roster into the playoffs.

 

[FMichael]

As a captain you’re either an emotionless robot or get accused of being ”soft”.. very little in between.

Larkin’s biggest problem might be that he cares too much. I think 4 nations showed how good he can be when he doesn’t have the weight of a franchise on his shoulders and an entire fanbase looking for him to be the perfect captain that drags a mediocre roster into the playoffs.

Unlike previous players who wore the C - I feel DBoss has had the least amount of talent (in terms of teammates) to play with and the burden of trying to carry this franchise is showing.

 

[nbwingsfan]

Did someone say Danielson was going to be better than Larkin?

And based on what are they “very, very low”.

He’s 19, he was drafted 6 slots higher than Larkin and just had a much better rookie yr in GR than Kasper did last yr…who just had a much better NHL rookie yr than Larkin did.

And what is this glorification of Larkin anyways? His highest ever point total is 79 three yrs ago.

Raymond has 80 this yr.

Larkin’s best yr ever would be 30th in pts this yr.

34 yr old Matt Duchene who we could replace him with for $3M less per yr had 82pts this yr.

34yr old Tavares who we could replace him w for $3M less per yr had 74pts this yr…better than Larkin’s 2nd best season ever, 73.

Larkin’s a really good player, and a good two-way player. But he’s always just been sort of a borderline #1/#2 center on a contender level player. It’s not the most impossible thing to replace, or for Kasper/Danielson to aspire to

Larkin’s game is a speed game too. He’s gonna be 29 next yr. The odds of him ever reaching 79pts again are low. He’s probably already on his downside.

Danielson is 20, and will be 21 when the season starts next year. Want to tell me how many points Larkin had at 21? If that’s what you’re basing this on, the Danielson is WAY behind Larkin at the same age.

In what world are you signing Duchene for $3M less than Larkin? Why is he signing for the same damn money Copp got?

 

[Henkka]

As for having better prospects and players? Yeah, Stevie's been here 7 freakin years. Of course it's better, it's not good enough. Next year will be year #8 without playoffs for Stevie unless he goes big in UFA.

The years are meaningless, if you don't understand the starting point.

Sorry I meant I been saying it for a while that's what I would do to get rid of tarasenko

Sure but if he was still the same he wouldn't be available. Has 1 less year than compher. We dont need 2 of copp and compher ....

Getting rid of this and that is not probably the way to go. We will get rid of certain guys as their contracts will end. But waiting that to happen before - you just get yourself disappointed.

Adding better talent and slotting existing guys to smaller role - that's the way to go.

 

[wingsfannnn9191]

The years are meaningless, if you don't understand the starting point.



Getting rid of this and that is not probably the way to go. We will get rid of certain guys as their contracts will end. But waiting that to happen before - you just get yourself disappointed.

Adding better talent and slotting existing guys to smaller role - that's the way to go.

Adding better talent means we need to get rid of deadweight to make room including for the kids . Tarasenko isn’t a fit . I think at double retention in the summer when everyone’s making moves at under 1.2 million someone takes a chance on him ....I could be wrong but at that price I’d be surprised

 

[Henkka]

Adding better talent means we need to get rid of deadweight to make room including for the kids . Tarasenko isn’t a fit . I think at double retention in the summer when everyone’s making moves at under 1.2 million someone takes a chance on him .... I could be wrong but at that price I’d be surprised

What would you be ready to pay for these? They won't happen for free.

Sending away picks or prospects?

 

[wingsfannnn9191]

What would you be ready to pay for these? They won't happen for free.

Sending away picks or prospects?

Well like I said I dont think it would be hard to get a 3rd team involved in a double retention. Teams do those moves at the deadline all the time

We get the "futures" for moving tarasenko and the 2nd team gets the 4th or 5th.

 

[Oddbob]

Hilarious at the outrage to Larkin who as captain almost guaranteed is talking for the majority of the rosters view on what did or didn't happen at the deadline. If you think Larkin is the only Wing who wasn't happy with improvements at the deadline or before, then you are out to lunch.

Larkin has been answering all these questions all season and at the end of the season for most of his career even before he became captain. That would wear any person, good leader, bad leader, in whatever else. Having to answer the same questions is nauseating just listening to it, now imagine having to be the one who has to do it, all bloody year long, after every loss and so on.

How a person answers questions in the media doesn't tell us even one little thing about whether or not they are a good leader. We as fans don't know one way or the other if he is good or not, because we aren't in the room.

I for one, want a captain who is upset at how things went, if they went bad, and if we the fans know this team was sorely lacking, then much more involved players of said team know it far more than us.

Also, I will again also add, that those against him are way overdoing words said to media, which is stuff he has to do, not wants to do, so they (players) are just answering the best they can to get the interview over with.