Your Rebuild Opinion? Next Move Coming?

[Frk It]

For THIS season. Just because I agree with this TDL approach and overall trajectory of the future doesn't mean this year wasn't a waste. We took a step back.

Ok thanks for clarifying, bc I was genuinely pretty confused with your stance.

 

[minimal]

I also find the notion that people will be willing to give Draper (first-time GM) three years of slack and patience. Unless Yzerman straight up leaves, everyone's going to assume he's the Wizard of Oz pulling strings from behind the curtains. In which case, why bother with the change? Seriously, this just makes me fear we're becoming Buffalo 2.0.

 

[RED WINGS STOMP]

I can see some truth to these rumors, Yzerman moving to prez and Draper GM makes sense in some ways. Getting more prospects up sounds great, do it.

Trading Larkin........ man, it better be worth it. Like the package Vancouver got for Miller wouldn't be enough for me. If he wants Columbus, Cayden Lindstrom has to be coming back along with more pieces. Montreal, you have to hand over Dedimov+ which I am sure they have no interest in.

Also, if you trade Larkin, you had better be right about Nate Danielson.

 

[Steve Yzerlland]

Ok thanks for clarifying, bc I was genuinely pretty confused with your stance.

I get that. My basic point was I agree with him not burning assets for a playoff berth chase. I like where our cap space is long term and prospect pool. I hate what he did from last year to now and we are paying for it. No more f***ing plugs and bandaids.Use our prospects. Its cheaper and gives the fan base hope. Hope that helps.

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

I can see some truth to these rumors, Yzerman moving to prez and Draper GM makes sense in some ways. Getting more prospects up sounds great, do it.

Trading Larkin........ man, it better be worth it. Like the package Vancouver got for Miller wouldn't be enough for me. If he wants Columbus, Cayden Lindstrom has to be coming back along with more pieces. Montreal, you have to hand over Dedimov+ which I am sure they have no interest in.

Also, if you trade Larkin, you had better be right about Nate Danielson.

If one of Danielson or Kasper becomes a 70 point center then Larkin can get dangled and moved for the right deal.
If both become that type of center? Larkin can pack his bags the next day and get us a solid LD and prospects.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

Lots of speculation in recent weeks.. it would be interesting to hear from fans from this type of forum, what their expectations truly were in June of 2019, when the Draft Rebuild was announced??

Most hockey people think they’re actually ahead of schedule. Especially without having any Lottery picks. Unfortunately that’s not always how expectations work.

Generally, if you’re on this type of site, you’re more of an in-depth fan than those just reading Mlive or the Detroit News everyday, like your typical casual fans…

Problem is, there’s a lot more of those casual fans, than those who know the sport in-depth. More than any other major sport, because frankly, most of its fans couldn’t tie a pair of skates. Including in Canada, which might surprise some Americans.

Like it or not, good or bad, right or wrong, the pressure is on Steve Yzerman and the current regime to start delivering. At least more pressure than we’ve ever seen on Yzerman.

Or is it??

That I’ll get to in a second, because some of what I’m hearing, would be the Detroit Red Wings buying time for the front office to complete the rebuild..

The big problem is, they really aren’t done with their rebuild. We’re barely watching the first wave of prospects entering the NHL. Changing course today would be catastrophic for their long term success.

A couple of quick facts…

A “GREAT DRAFT” is getting ONLY THREE 200+ game NHLers. A “GOOD” Draft? One or two.

It then takes an average of 4 years before those prospects play NHL games. 5-6 years for most NHL quality Dmen.

That’s just to play in the NHL. That’s why we’re only now seeing the first big wave of prospects getting ready to become everyday NHLers.

At best, after 6 years, they’d have about 6 players already playing at various levels, on their NHL team. Currently there’s 6 Yzerman drafted players, correct?

That really is best case scenario. The fact they have 4 of those kids who look like they’re of the “Star Variety” is a huge compliment to their drafting strategy. The system is also loaded. All done with only ONE Top 5 pick.

All that said, your normal rebuild needs more than what they have to be sustainable long-term. Even though they’ve yet to have a top pick bust on them. The complete opposite is happening. They’re hitting on their top picks. Kasper just being the newest example and there’s several more to come.

The good thing is, internally, including ownership, Detroit truly believes they need another 2-3 years to keep collecting high-end prospects, and real importantly, ease a pretty large number of prospects into the lineup over the next 2 years. Next year likely being the biggest influx.

What happens with every rebuild, the year they bring in the most rookies, etc??

Teams take a significant step backwards in the standings. Just look at Ottawa and the NJ Devils in recent years. The old “One step backwards, two steps forward” saying is very true.

Not to mention, depending on how the young players do next season, you almost always need a year or two, to make a couple of trades and signings, to really call the rebuild “Complete.” To “even out” the roster.

All of the trades and UFA signings since 2019, minus Debrincat, have been of the “filler player” variety. It’s pointless to judge those signing because of two things really.

First of all, no great free agents ever sign with rebuilding teams, and secondly, they haven’t had the ammunition to make good core trades because they need every high pick they’ve had.

Finally, and very importantly, where the media, podcasters, and the impatient casual fans go terribly wrong??

You quite literally, do NOT want to win during your rebuilding years!!! That’s why you don’t make core trades yet, sign top free agents, or go crazy at any trade deadline.. It’s why Yzerman did nothing at the deadline..

You lose all leverage in the draft if you win too much. You’ll be picking 15th-20th rather than Top 10, and extending the rebuild time. Last year, and likely this year as well, that’s been the case. They actually won too much.

Unfortunately in many ways, the playoff run last season has damaged their rebuild, more than helped it.

It created ridiculous expectations this year from the core media and fans. There’s a lot more of those casual fans, now demanding results, than there are hockey folks who understand what a rebuild needs to look like, and how time consuming a rebuild is.

Well, from what I’m hearing, it’s pretty likely Detroit is set to almost come out and announce, they’ll likely be taking a step backwards next season, as the roster will see an influx of rookies. If they don’t announce it, they’ll certainly leak that being the case.

Not a bad year to go backwards though. Not with Gavin McKenna at the top of the draft, as well as a Swedish kid named Ivar Stenberg, brother of Blues prospect Otto Stenberg.

You might be a little disappointed they internally expect to go backwards next year, or are now asking yourself, how they’ll be able to do so and have Yzerman survive this mounting pressure??

That’s a big question and why many are hearing what we are hearing….

Basically…. Don’t be surprised if right after the season, but more likely, right after the draft, if Yzerman steps down as General Manager and moves into the pretty much vacated spot of Jimmy Devellano, as President of Hockey Operations, and they name Kris Draier the new General Manager.

In doing so, the speculation is, they believe that will buy them another 3 years (Honeymoon for Draper) to complete their rebuild, and give the team it’s best chance to win consistently over the next 10-15 years. Hopefully adding another 2 very high-end prospects.

For those who don’t know, after this draft, there’s 3 Drafts in a row with a Franchise altering player at the top of the draft. MCKenna in 2026, followed by DuPont in 2027 and a kid named Maddox Schultz I’ve watched several times this year, heading the 2028 draft.

The expectation from the front office and ownership is, 2 more years of Top 10 picks, and then a big jump in the 2027-2028 season, as their big wave of prospects will be entering their 2nd and 3rd NHL season. Where we historically see the big jump.

If they play the kids next year and have a great season, even better. That will mean more of their kids are immediate impact NHL players. In 2027-2028 ASP, Edvinsson and Seider will also be entering their big prime years. Same with Kasper, Raymond and others up front.

That’s the speculation I’m hearing from scouts and evaluators. That Detroit isn’t ready to call the rebuild over, but the unexpected expectations after last season, is likely going to cause some changes in the front office. Mostly to buy time, they feel they still need.

Just while I’m on here tonight, I can say, I’ve heard the Larkin speculation but nobody has heard it from any legit source.

I will say, it does happen. Players from bad teams go to these events like 4Nations, the Olympics, etc, and they do get recruited by other players, or figure out they want to play more meaningful hockey sooner than their team will be playing at that level, etc..

I doubt he actually approached Yzerman prior to the deadline, and if he does this summer, I’m sure they won’t have any problems accommodating his request.

If he really thinks Columbus or LA is his best option for his career, I’m sure Yzerman or Draper will make him happy. They won’t go out of their way to plead with him to stay, if he wants out. That I can say with absolute certainty. There were more than a couple in that front office who would’ve preferred to trade Larkin than sign him last year.

After his 4Nations performance, they can name their price in many ways. It would cost LA Byfield, plus 2 other Grade A assets, and Columbus can expect to pay a massive price as well, if it’s so important to play with Werenski down in Columbus. Carolina? Same thing. All 3 of those teams have plenty to offer in a trade for a Larkin.

As for what they might do this summer?? I do think they’ll look at some of the arbitration eligible players, especially Dmen like York, Byrum, K’Andre Miller, and Samberg, and see if they’re available. Those teams have no choice but to sign long term contracts or trade those players this summer. They can’t afford any of them going to arbitration. The player will win a massive 1-2 year deal, and walk away for free after the contract. If there’s one of those they’d like more than others, it’s likely Samberg but I think they’d like to get their hands on a Cam York as well. He’d obviously come much cheaper.

The big thing to watch for is Yzerman though. I’ve heard it from several people that he’s not going to sit there and take all the negative press. While I doubt he just up and quits, taking Jimmy Devellano’s role he had for 25 years, is one of the best jobs in the sport. Running the Detroit Red Wings NEVER being able to be fired??

It’s the goal for these former players. They love the GM jobs too but the ultimate job is what Shanahan, Sakic and Blake now have. From the day Stevie was brought back, that’s been the plan. That he’d be the manager and after the team is back on firm ground, he’d take Jimmy D’s spot as President. The timing probably couldn’t be much better because the media and those casual fans I talked about, will automatically give Draper 3 years before putting any pressure on him to perform.

It’ll be an interesting beginning of the summer for Detroit. I’d call it a 50/50 chance Draper is the Manager after the Draft.

I have heard a few of these floating around. I had more heard it as a next summer plan than this summer. I wonder if the hostile press conferences have sped this up.

Not a lot gets out, but tons of this checks out with people I have heard real facts from over the years.

I am a proponent of changing this path should a Marner or someone like that be there for the taking.

I have trouble believing Larkin ever walks in and asks is the other part, which yes I have heard the same they won’t talk him out of it. But I would still be a little surprised if he actually does request it. I know he is hyper competitive but I really struggle to see this one.

 

[Unfriendly Ghost]

It's annoying how much the Lions' success has changed people's attitudes around town. It's win now or you're useless. Not every sport works like football.

 

[DanielMarois]

22-23: Yzerman has a plan, the 24-25 season is when things will get good.

24-25: Yzerman has a plan, just needs more time

28-29: Yzerman's plan was always to keep Larkin for ten years and then trade him for a 2nd round pick once the kids are ready, which they will be next year.

 

[better Red than Dead]

Lots of speculation in recent weeks.. it would be interesting to hear from fans from this type of forum, what their expectations truly were in June of 2019, when the Draft Rebuild was announced??

Most hockey people think they’re actually ahead of schedule. Especially without having any Lottery picks. Unfortunately that’s not always how expectations work.

Generally, if you’re on this type of site, you’re more of an in-depth fan than those just reading Mlive or the Detroit News everyday, like your typical casual fans…

Problem is, there’s a lot more of those casual fans, than those who know the sport in-depth. More than any other major sport, because frankly, most of its fans couldn’t tie a pair of skates. Including in Canada, which might surprise some Americans.

Like it or not, good or bad, right or wrong, the pressure is on Steve Yzerman and the current regime to start delivering. At least more pressure than we’ve ever seen on Yzerman.

Or is it??

That I’ll get to in a second, because some of what I’m hearing, would be the Detroit Red Wings buying time for the front office to complete the rebuild..

The big problem is, they really aren’t done with their rebuild. We’re barely watching the first wave of prospects entering the NHL. Changing course today would be catastrophic for their long term success.

A couple of quick facts…

A “GREAT DRAFT” is getting ONLY THREE 200+ game NHLers. A “GOOD” Draft? One or two.

It then takes an average of 4 years before those prospects play NHL games. 5-6 years for most NHL quality Dmen.

That’s just to play in the NHL. That’s why we’re only now seeing the first big wave of prospects getting ready to become everyday NHLers.

At best, after 6 years, they’d have about 6 players already playing at various levels, on their NHL team. Currently there’s 6 Yzerman drafted players, correct?

That really is best case scenario. The fact they have 4 of those kids who look like they’re of the “Star Variety” is a huge compliment to their drafting strategy. The system is also loaded. All done with only ONE Top 5 pick.

All that said, your normal rebuild needs more than what they have to be sustainable long-term. Even though they’ve yet to have a top pick bust on them. The complete opposite is happening. They’re hitting on their top picks. Kasper just being the newest example and there’s several more to come.

The good thing is, internally, including ownership, Detroit truly believes they need another 2-3 years to keep collecting high-end prospects, and real importantly, ease a pretty large number of prospects into the lineup over the next 2 years. Next year likely being the biggest influx.

What happens with every rebuild, the year they bring in the most rookies, etc??

Teams take a significant step backwards in the standings. Just look at Ottawa and the NJ Devils in recent years. The old “One step backwards, two steps forward” saying is very true.

Not to mention, depending on how the young players do next season, you almost always need a year or two, to make a couple of trades and signings, to really call the rebuild “Complete.” To “even out” the roster.

All of the trades and UFA signings since 2019, minus Debrincat, have been of the “filler player” variety. It’s pointless to judge those signing because of two things really.

First of all, no great free agents ever sign with rebuilding teams, and secondly, they haven’t had the ammunition to make good core trades because they need every high pick they’ve had.

Finally, and very importantly, where the media, podcasters, and the impatient casual fans go terribly wrong??

You quite literally, do NOT want to win during your rebuilding years!!! That’s why you don’t make core trades yet, sign top free agents, or go crazy at any trade deadline.. It’s why Yzerman did nothing at the deadline..

You lose all leverage in the draft if you win too much. You’ll be picking 15th-20th rather than Top 10, and extending the rebuild time. Last year, and likely this year as well, that’s been the case. They actually won too much.

Unfortunately in many ways, the playoff run last season has damaged their rebuild, more than helped it.

It created ridiculous expectations this year from the core media and fans. There’s a lot more of those casual fans, now demanding results, than there are hockey folks who understand what a rebuild needs to look like, and how time consuming a rebuild is.

Well, from what I’m hearing, it’s pretty likely Detroit is set to almost come out and announce, they’ll likely be taking a step backwards next season, as the roster will see an influx of rookies. If they don’t announce it, they’ll certainly leak that being the case.

Not a bad year to go backwards though. Not with Gavin McKenna at the top of the draft, as well as a Swedish kid named Ivar Stenberg, brother of Blues prospect Otto Stenberg.

You might be a little disappointed they internally expect to go backwards next year, or are now asking yourself, how they’ll be able to do so and have Yzerman survive this mounting pressure??

That’s a big question and why many are hearing what we are hearing….

Basically…. Don’t be surprised if right after the season, but more likely, right after the draft, if Yzerman steps down as General Manager and moves into the pretty much vacated spot of Jimmy Devellano, as President of Hockey Operations, and they name Kris Draier the new General Manager.

In doing so, the speculation is, they believe that will buy them another 3 years (Honeymoon for Draper) to complete their rebuild, and give the team it’s best chance to win consistently over the next 10-15 years. Hopefully adding another 2 very high-end prospects.

For those who don’t know, after this draft, there’s 3 Drafts in a row with a Franchise altering player at the top of the draft. MCKenna in 2026, followed by DuPont in 2027 and a kid named Maddox Schultz I’ve watched several times this year, heading the 2028 draft.

The expectation from the front office and ownership is, 2 more years of Top 10 picks, and then a big jump in the 2027-2028 season, as their big wave of prospects will be entering their 2nd and 3rd NHL season. Where we historically see the big jump.

If they play the kids next year and have a great season, even better. That will mean more of their kids are immediate impact NHL players. In 2027-2028 ASP, Edvinsson and Seider will also be entering their big prime years. Same with Kasper, Raymond and others up front.

That’s the speculation I’m hearing from scouts and evaluators. That Detroit isn’t ready to call the rebuild over, but the unexpected expectations after last season, is likely going to cause some changes in the front office. Mostly to buy time, they feel they still need.

Just while I’m on here tonight, I can say, I’ve heard the Larkin speculation but nobody has heard it from any legit source.

I will say, it does happen. Players from bad teams go to these events like 4Nations, the Olympics, etc, and they do get recruited by other players, or figure out they want to play more meaningful hockey sooner than their team will be playing at that level, etc..

I doubt he actually approached Yzerman prior to the deadline, and if he does this summer, I’m sure they won’t have any problems accommodating his request.

If he really thinks Columbus or LA is his best option for his career, I’m sure Yzerman or Draper will make him happy. They won’t go out of their way to plead with him to stay, if he wants out. That I can say with absolute certainty. There were more than a couple in that front office who would’ve preferred to trade Larkin than sign him last year.

After his 4Nations performance, they can name their price in many ways. It would cost LA Byfield, plus 2 other Grade A assets, and Columbus can expect to pay a massive price as well, if it’s so important to play with Werenski down in Columbus. Carolina? Same thing. All 3 of those teams have plenty to offer in a trade for a Larkin.

As for what they might do this summer?? I do think they’ll look at some of the arbitration eligible players, especially Dmen like York, Byrum, K’Andre Miller, and Samberg, and see if they’re available. Those teams have no choice but to sign long term contracts or trade those players this summer. They can’t afford any of them going to arbitration. The player will win a massive 1-2 year deal, and walk away for free after the contract. If there’s one of those they’d like more than others, it’s likely Samberg but I think they’d like to get their hands on a Cam York as well. He’d obviously come much cheaper.

The big thing to watch for is Yzerman though. I’ve heard it from several people that he’s not going to sit there and take all the negative press. While I doubt he just up and quits, taking Jimmy Devellano’s role he had for 25 years, is one of the best jobs in the sport. Running the Detroit Red Wings NEVER being able to be fired??

It’s the goal for these former players. They love the GM jobs too but the ultimate job is what Shanahan, Sakic and Blake now have. From the day Stevie was brought back, that’s been the plan. That he’d be the manager and after the team is back on firm ground, he’d take Jimmy D’s spot as President. The timing probably couldn’t be much better because the media and those casual fans I talked about, will automatically give Draper 3 years before putting any pressure on him to perform.

It’ll be an interesting beginning of the summer for Detroit. I’d call it a 50/50 chance Draper is the Manager after the Draft.

Kris Draper being the GM would not please me. I don’t think he’s done much in the way of drafts or anything else to show he’s deserving

 

[better Red than Dead]

It's annoying how much the Lions' success has changed people's attitudes around town. It's win now or you're useless. Not every sport works like football.

The Tigers success as well as the improvement of the Red Wigs peers like MTL and Ottawa more so than the Lions

 

[Pavels Dog]

22-23: Yzerman has a plan, the 24-25 season is when things will get good.

24-25: Yzerman has a plan, just needs more time

28-29: Yzerman's plan was always to keep Larkin for ten years and then trade him for a 2nd round pick once the kids are ready, which they will be next year.

Team was pretty good in 23-24 though. And since the coaching change a playoff caliber team this year.

 

[jkutswings]

your strategy signs a doug hamilton getting detroit into playoffs only to be crushed while hamilton ages out of prime before detroits window opens . yzermans strategy instead gets him kasper whom is going to be one of the players that opens the window in his career prime and maybe be around for 20 years of a great red wing career ! yzermans gunning for a dynasty rather than creating a flawed going nowhere roster just to get into playoffs

At no point did his post say to rush to sign anybody halfway decent at all costs. The problem is that you're imagining one extreme, while Yzerman appears to be very close to the other extreme.

I am VERY pessimistic that the Wings will find top half of the lineup talent from their draft picks going forward. They've already been extremely fortunate in how well they've hit on first rounders - my expectations for picks in 2025/26/27 are much closer to another Rasmussen/Veleno than another Raymond/Seider.

But even if they do manage to land 1-2 more good pieces, that still is not at all mutually exclusive to packaging SOME of their draft capital to swing a trade or two. Again, not just for the sake of making a deal, but breaking some eggs to land one or more very good NHL players that fit the timeline.

It isn't rushing things and it isn't ruining anything. It's simply using all available paths to improve the team... which is the job of the GM.

 

[SantosHalper]

Plus he’s getting older.

That hasn't stopped Louie

 

[Henkka]

In order to take step backwards you need to take step forward first, i don't remember it happening.

I also don't see them competing for 1 overall picks with Raymond, Kasper, Seider, Edvinsson on roster, even if they decide to trade Larkin and DeBrincat. Beyond that i don't see the point, what is written in original post is a page from Sabres playbook - i don't think it is very succesful. If they just promote Danielson, Mazur, Lombardi and Buyum or Wallinder that actually will improve on ice product significantly, because they get rid of dead weight.

What Yzerman or Draper or whoever is tasked with it needs to do is actually to step forward, not backward - this team needs a long-term replacement for Kane, and one is currently available with Marner. I think it is time to get aggressive - get rid of all junk that was compiled on D - Chiarot, Gustafsson, Holl. Get somebody like Orlov who can be a good stop gap - think long-term Seider/Edvinsson/Johansson/ASP are going to be good enough of Top4, get a proper 4th line with players who have purpose like ability to kill penalties. I think that is enough.

They really have so huge load of cap space available, that ven some buyouts could gome to play. Or just keep the guys and waive them, with any losing "risk".

There's 20 million for upgrades, to replace Petry, Kane and Craig Smith from next season roster.

And you still could waive Holl, keep him as a spare guy, and let the contract die after the season. You could also waive Gustafsson. Just sign a legit Top4 guy

 

[19 for president]

I could see Yzerman bumping up and Draper taking over eventually... I just mostly disagree with their (team??) assessment that this would buy them time. Casual fans don't know who Draper is and diehards know this means nothing in terms of the franchises direction. Casual Wings slappies will follow Yzerman because he is Yzerman, they aren't going to lemming for Draper. This is not dumping no name Lalonde. Unless we can convince Scotty Bowman to come out of retirement there is not a single person out there that could take over the Wings GM role and not have a drop in presence/cachet.

Now as long as whomever is in charge addresses our need for a top 4 dman I'm down to let the kids fight it out on offense. I'd also like to see Holl, Tank and Compher dealt or in Holl's case bought out because I don't think either brings a lot to this team. As long as the Wings are playing a semi exciting brand of hockey I'm down. I just am not willing to watch a repeat of the train wreck that was most of this year, which has largely been disappointing vets being disappointing.

If we rock something like:

Mazur-Larkin-Ray
DBC-Kasper-Kane
Soderblom-Danielson-Bergy
Ras-Copp-Watson (or a good 4th line pker)

New Guy- Seider
Ed- Aljo
Chia- ASP
Gus

or
Mazur-Larkin-Ray
DBC-Kasper-Buchelnikov/Berg
Soderblom-Danielson-Berg/MBN
Ras-Copp- Watson (or a good 4th line pker)

Ed-Seider
New Guy- ASP/Aljo
Chia- ASP/Aljo

I think most people would be ok with that. Heck I'm even pro have Cossa backup Mrzaek or Talbot and getting him into the mix. Ehlers and Marner are the only two top end forwards on the market that really interest me. Maybe Tavares on a short term deal. Bennett and Boeser I think will get severely overpaid for what they'd bring to a team that isn't a cup contender yet. Gavrikov and Provorov interest me on D. I think getting a steady D presence to play with the kids is huge. One needs to be acquired via trade if they can't get a guy as a UFA. I like a few of those RFA dmen Pete mentioned but we need a solid defensive dman. Chiarot cannot be a top 4 dman for this team anymore.

 

[Our Lady Peace]

My opinion:

I think we've stuck to a plan that Yzerman has said from the start; "this will take a while". I can't recall if he alluded directly to building through the draft there at that time, but it has evidently been done. Particularly our 1st round picks, AKA our most valuable assets

It feels like forever, but the "over-ripening" of our top prospects has made them that much more NHL ready, quicker. What we have seen from Seider, Raymond, Edvinsson, and now Kasper (all still under age 24) has been extremely promising considering the lack of a top 3 pick

...And to that point; our picks have been and continue to make very strong cases as top 3 players from their respective drafts. If the "plan" is to do our amateur scouting due diligence and then develop carefully, well, I think we've done just that

Cossa, Danielson, and ASP have all been over-ripening this season. While they may not make an immediate impact if they're all on the Big Club next year, they will gain traction much faster for us than players that get rushed

Now, our picks outside round 1 have been hit and miss, quite literally. It's been awesome seeing AlJo prove himself this season, at a position of weakness for us. Many other picks are still naturally going to take long as he has (maybe not as quite) to come up and be a solid contributor. Many others are sadly going to, and already have, bust

The rest of the rebuild like trades and signings have obviously had their hits and misses. We've discussed this fervently. I love Debrincat and what he brings to this franchise for a small guy. Kane too and the reuniting of him and Cat has been part of what's made Wings hockey actually fun to watch again. Amongst those additions, there's a lot of work to be done with our roster. Additions and subtractions must be done this summer. It's abundantly clear some players are clearly not working out, and Yzerman knows this

I believe Steve wants this team competitive fast. He can also be too pragmatic at times. Maybe he swings for what he wants this draft/offseason. Doing so with Cat was a great move and the right move. We'll see if there's a suitable trading partner that he won't have to mortgage our best young homegrown talent for, or a FA that he won't be sacrificing a wasteful amount of long term cap on

I genuinely believe the team is shaping up to be a silent beast eventually. That may not be until 2028-2030 unfortunately. Hopefully we see playoffs next year. I really do. But this shit takes a while... There have been other franchises past and present that absolutely had no direction and some lucked out and made something with it while others... Have not

Next move coming? I think a spicy trade involving a LHD coming our way and something of draft assets + B-tier prospects going the other way

 

[schuelma24]

My opinion:

I think we've stuck to a plan that Yzerman has said from the start; "this will take a while". I can't recall if he alluded directly to building through the draft there at that time, but it has evidently been done. Particularly our 1st round picks, AKA our most valuable assets

It feels like forever, but the "over-ripening" of our top prospects has made them that much more NHL ready, quicker. What we have seen from Seider, Raymond, Edvinsson, and now Kasper (all still under age 24) has been extremely promising considering the lack of a top 3 pick

...And to that point; our picks have been and continue to make very strong cases as top 3 players from their respective drafts. If the "plan" is to do our amateur scouting due diligence and then develop carefully, well, I think we've done just that

Cossa, Danielson, and ASP have all been over-ripening this season. While they may not make an immediate impact if they're all on the Big Club next year, they will gain traction much faster for us than players that get rushed

Now, our picks outside round 1 have been hit and miss, quite literally. It's been awesome seeing AlJo prove himself this season, at a position of weakness for us. Many other picks are still naturally going to take long as he has (maybe not as quite) to come up and be a solid contributor. Many others are sadly going to, and already have, bust

The rest of the rebuild like trades and signings have obviously had their hits and misses. We've discussed this fervently. I love Debrincat and what he brings to this franchise for a small guy. Kane too and the reuniting of him and Cat has been part of what's made Wings hockey actually fun to watch again. Amongst those additions, there's a lot of work to be done with our roster. Additions and subtractions must be done this summer. It's abundantly clear some players are clearly not working out, and Yzerman knows this

I believe Steve wants this team competitive fast. He can also be too pragmatic at times. Maybe he swings for what he wants this draft/offseason. Doing so with Cat was a great move and the right move. We'll see if there's a suitable trading partner that he won't have to mortgage our best young homegrown talent for, or a FA that he won't be sacrificing a wasteful amount of long term cap on

I genuinely believe the team is shaping up to be a silent beast eventually. That may not be until 2028-2030 unfortunately. Hopefully we see playoffs next year. I really do. But this shit takes a while... There have been other franchises past and present that absolutely had no direction and some lucked out and made something with it while others... Have no

Next move coming? I think a spicy trade involving a LHD coming our way and something of draft assets + B-tier prospects going the other way

Great post.

I genuinely don't think they're that far away from at least getting to the level of a competitive playoff team. The #1 priority this summer has to get a legit top 4 LD. You make that happen, all of a sudden you're slotting everyone better and hopefully by the following year your top 4 is set for the long term with ASP.

Similarly, obviously have to upgrade at forward and again if you can do that, everyone gets slotted more appropriately. Imagine Elmer as a 3rd line menace full time. Rass on the 3rd/4th line instead of the top 6.

I haven't liked a lot of Yzerman's FA moves but I'm *hoping* it was more about him being patient and not wanting to overcommit term and money.

Now, with the cap increase and the space he has available, I do think this summer he needs to make a major move or two. At a minimum he needs to upgrade the D.

 

[deca guard]

At no point did his post say to rush to sign anybody halfway decent at all costs. The problem is that you're imagining one extreme, while Yzerman appears to be very close to the other extreme.

I am VERY pessimistic that the Wings will find top half of the lineup talent from their draft picks going forward. They've already been extremely fortunate in how well they've hit on first rounders - my expectations for picks in 2025/26/27 are much closer to another Rasmussen/Veleno than another Raymond/Seider.

But even if they do manage to land 1-2 more good pieces, that still is not at all mutually exclusive to packaging SOME of their draft capital to swing a trade or two. Again, not just for the sake of making a deal, but breaking some eggs to land one or more very good NHL players that fit the timeline.

It isn't rushing things and it isn't ruining anything. It's simply using all available paths to improve the team... which is the job of the GM.

i was re emphasing the point ive constantly made here that 'rushing' to sign top ufa in the early stages of a rebuild doesnt get you a championship , but it hurts your future because you draft 18 instead of 8 . rushing to get into playoffs with a faulty team which plays a round or two but never gets you near a championship could cost you a foundation player like kasper , a player that you wont draft at 18 and also a player you'll never sign in his prime as his team will sign him long term = IMPORTANT CORE PLAYER . its obviously how yzerman sees it or he would have offered top ufa like hamilton n johnny hockey top dollar , but he realized that if doing so it would cost him shots in the draft at players like kasper n danielson which thusly would detract from long term success so he didnt rush to improve record at the cost of the future . THATS WHY DAY ONE HE SAID ITS GOING TO TAKE A LONG TIME ! but by functioning in this dynasty building mode he has put the cry babys here into tantrum mode cuz they wanna trash talk and play super fan with their team in playoffs , then they can brag . mean while yzermans rocked the draft floor like crazy ands loaded the depth chart up with all kinds of excellent prospects but here in cry baby central its nothing but critics !!!!!!!!!!!

 

[jkutswings]

i was re emphasing the point ive constantly made here that 'rushing' to sign top ufa in the early stages of a rebuild doesnt get you a championship , but it hurts your future because you draft 18 instead of 8 . rushing to get into playoffs with a faulty team which plays a round or two but never gets you near a championship could cost you a foundation player like kasper , a player that you wont draft at 18 and also a player you'll never sign in his prime as his team will sign him long term = IMPORTANT CORE PLAYER . its obviously how yzerman sees it or he would have offered top ufa like hamilton n johnny hockey top dollar , but he realized that if doing so it would cost him shots in the draft at players like kasper n danielson which thusly would detract from long term success so he didnt rush to improve record at the cost of the future . THATS WHY DAY ONE HE SAID ITS GOING TO TAKE A LONG TIME ! but by functioning in this dynasty building mode he has put the cry babys here into tantrum mode cuz they wanna trash talk and play super fan with their team in playoffs , then they can brag . mean while yzermans rocked the draft floor like crazy ands loaded the depth chart up with all kinds of excellent prospects but here in cry baby central its nothing but critics !!!!!!!!!!!

I understand your point and I agree that before this year, it was not the time to be aggressive with free agency. I'm not even advocating free agency as a major option now, but at some point it can't JUST be the draft.

Overall my point is that even if this team goes full youth mode next year, they're never having another top ten draft pick in this iteration of the rebuild, so access to additional foundational players is close to zero and it is time to begin using additional options more regularly.

 

[RRhoads]

Future looks bright, if you ask me. From the way out, goalies are covered, we need a top 4 LD, and forwards should be covered as well. I think Kasper can be the 2C we need. Danielson and Plante will also be good. We can afford to add a winger in the top 6 through FA if we need to.

If you compare this season to last seaseon, it is offense that has taken a huge hit.
GF is down about 0.5 goals per game. Goals against is also down, by about 0.2 goals per game, which is surprising considering we have one of the worst PKs in the history of the NHL.

 

[Voodoo Glow Skulls]

Lots of speculation in recent weeks.. it would be interesting to hear from fans from this type of forum, what their expectations truly were in June of 2019, when the Draft Rebuild was announced??

Most hockey people think they’re actually ahead of schedule. Especially without having any Lottery picks. Unfortunately that’s not always how expectations work.

Generally, if you’re on this type of site, you’re more of an in-depth fan than those just reading Mlive or the Detroit News everyday, like your typical casual fans…

Problem is, there’s a lot more of those casual fans, than those who know the sport in-depth. More than any other major sport, because frankly, most of its fans couldn’t tie a pair of skates. Including in Canada, which might surprise some Americans.

Like it or not, good or bad, right or wrong, the pressure is on Steve Yzerman and the current regime to start delivering. At least more pressure than we’ve ever seen on Yzerman.

Or is it??

That I’ll get to in a second, because some of what I’m hearing, would be the Detroit Red Wings buying time for the front office to complete the rebuild..

The big problem is, they really aren’t done with their rebuild. We’re barely watching the first wave of prospects entering the NHL. Changing course today would be catastrophic for their long term success.

A couple of quick facts…

A “GREAT DRAFT” is getting ONLY THREE 200+ game NHLers. A “GOOD” Draft? One or two.

It then takes an average of 4 years before those prospects play NHL games. 5-6 years for most NHL quality Dmen.

That’s just to play in the NHL. That’s why we’re only now seeing the first big wave of prospects getting ready to become everyday NHLers.

At best, after 6 years, they’d have about 6 players already playing at various levels, on their NHL team. Currently there’s 6 Yzerman drafted players, correct?

That really is best case scenario. The fact they have 4 of those kids who look like they’re of the “Star Variety” is a huge compliment to their drafting strategy. The system is also loaded. All done with only ONE Top 5 pick.

All that said, your normal rebuild needs more than what they have to be sustainable long-term. Even though they’ve yet to have a top pick bust on them. The complete opposite is happening. They’re hitting on their top picks. Kasper just being the newest example and there’s several more to come.

The good thing is, internally, including ownership, Detroit truly believes they need another 2-3 years to keep collecting high-end prospects, and real importantly, ease a pretty large number of prospects into the lineup over the next 2 years. Next year likely being the biggest influx.

What happens with every rebuild, the year they bring in the most rookies, etc??

Teams take a significant step backwards in the standings. Just look at Ottawa and the NJ Devils in recent years. The old “One step backwards, two steps forward” saying is very true.

Not to mention, depending on how the young players do next season, you almost always need a year or two, to make a couple of trades and signings, to really call the rebuild “Complete.” To “even out” the roster.

All of the trades and UFA signings since 2019, minus Debrincat, have been of the “filler player” variety. It’s pointless to judge those signing because of two things really.

First of all, no great free agents ever sign with rebuilding teams, and secondly, they haven’t had the ammunition to make good core trades because they need every high pick they’ve had.

Finally, and very importantly, where the media, podcasters, and the impatient casual fans go terribly wrong??

You quite literally, do NOT want to win during your rebuilding years!!! That’s why you don’t make core trades yet, sign top free agents, or go crazy at any trade deadline.. It’s why Yzerman did nothing at the deadline..

You lose all leverage in the draft if you win too much. You’ll be picking 15th-20th rather than Top 10, and extending the rebuild time. Last year, and likely this year as well, that’s been the case. They actually won too much.

Unfortunately in many ways, the playoff run last season has damaged their rebuild, more than helped it.

It created ridiculous expectations this year from the core media and fans. There’s a lot more of those casual fans, now demanding results, than there are hockey folks who understand what a rebuild needs to look like, and how time consuming a rebuild is.

Well, from what I’m hearing, it’s pretty likely Detroit is set to almost come out and announce, they’ll likely be taking a step backwards next season, as the roster will see an influx of rookies. If they don’t announce it, they’ll certainly leak that being the case.

Not a bad year to go backwards though. Not with Gavin McKenna at the top of the draft, as well as a Swedish kid named Ivar Stenberg, brother of Blues prospect Otto Stenberg.

You might be a little disappointed they internally expect to go backwards next year, or are now asking yourself, how they’ll be able to do so and have Yzerman survive this mounting pressure??

That’s a big question and why many are hearing what we are hearing….

Basically…. Don’t be surprised if right after the season, but more likely, right after the draft, if Yzerman steps down as General Manager and moves into the pretty much vacated spot of Jimmy Devellano, as President of Hockey Operations, and they name Kris Draier the new General Manager.

In doing so, the speculation is, they believe that will buy them another 3 years (Honeymoon for Draper) to complete their rebuild, and give the team it’s best chance to win consistently over the next 10-15 years. Hopefully adding another 2 very high-end prospects.

For those who don’t know, after this draft, there’s 3 Drafts in a row with a Franchise altering player at the top of the draft. MCKenna in 2026, followed by DuPont in 2027 and a kid named Maddox Schultz I’ve watched several times this year, heading the 2028 draft.

The expectation from the front office and ownership is, 2 more years of Top 10 picks, and then a big jump in the 2027-2028 season, as their big wave of prospects will be entering their 2nd and 3rd NHL season. Where we historically see the big jump.

If they play the kids next year and have a great season, even better. That will mean more of their kids are immediate impact NHL players. In 2027-2028 ASP, Edvinsson and Seider will also be entering their big prime years. Same with Kasper, Raymond and others up front.

That’s the speculation I’m hearing from scouts and evaluators. That Detroit isn’t ready to call the rebuild over, but the unexpected expectations after last season, is likely going to cause some changes in the front office. Mostly to buy time, they feel they still need.

Just while I’m on here tonight, I can say, I’ve heard the Larkin speculation but nobody has heard it from any legit source.

I will say, it does happen. Players from bad teams go to these events like 4Nations, the Olympics, etc, and they do get recruited by other players, or figure out they want to play more meaningful hockey sooner than their team will be playing at that level, etc..

I doubt he actually approached Yzerman prior to the deadline, and if he does this summer, I’m sure they won’t have any problems accommodating his request.

If he really thinks Columbus or LA is his best option for his career, I’m sure Yzerman or Draper will make him happy. They won’t go out of their way to plead with him to stay, if he wants out. That I can say with absolute certainty. There were more than a couple in that front office who would’ve preferred to trade Larkin than sign him last year.

After his 4Nations performance, they can name their price in many ways. It would cost LA Byfield, plus 2 other Grade A assets, and Columbus can expect to pay a massive price as well, if it’s so important to play with Werenski down in Columbus. Carolina? Same thing. All 3 of those teams have plenty to offer in a trade for a Larkin.

As for what they might do this summer?? I do think they’ll look at some of the arbitration eligible players, especially Dmen like York, Byrum, K’Andre Miller, and Samberg, and see if they’re available. Those teams have no choice but to sign long term contracts or trade those players this summer. They can’t afford any of them going to arbitration. The player will win a massive 1-2 year deal, and walk away for free after the contract. If there’s one of those they’d like more than others, it’s likely Samberg but I think they’d like to get their hands on a Cam York as well. He’d obviously come much cheaper.

The big thing to watch for is Yzerman though. I’ve heard it from several people that he’s not going to sit there and take all the negative press. While I doubt he just up and quits, taking Jimmy Devellano’s role he had for 25 years, is one of the best jobs in the sport. Running the Detroit Red Wings NEVER being able to be fired??

It’s the goal for these former players. They love the GM jobs too but the ultimate job is what Shanahan, Sakic and Blake now have. From the day Stevie was brought back, that’s been the plan. That he’d be the manager and after the team is back on firm ground, he’d take Jimmy D’s spot as President. The timing probably couldn’t be much better because the media and those casual fans I talked about, will automatically give Draper 3 years before putting any pressure on him to perform.

It’ll be an interesting beginning of the summer for Detroit. I’d call it a 50/50 chance Draper is the Manager after the Draft.

Detroit is not getting a lottery pick. But yes, I agree, better drafts.

 

[norrisnick]

Detroit is not getting a lottery pick. But yes, I agree, better drafts.

Nothing quite says "f*** you, quit bitching about the lottery" like being given 5th overall in a weak draft because you jumped up. I could see it...

Or if you're responding to "the horoscope of the next few years" nonsense, ya. We can't be nearly bad enough to naturally be in the good spots. That ship sailed when Ray and Mo made the show.

 

[Voodoo Glow Skulls]

Nothing quite says "f*** you, quit bitching about the lottery" like being given 5th overall in a weak draft because you jumped up. I could see it...

Or if you're responding to "the horoscope of the next few years" nonsense, ya. We can't be nearly bad enough to naturally be in the good spots. That ship sailed when Ray and Mo made the show.

I stopped trusting the draft after Pittsburgh got Crosby.

Markets get top players.

 

[Hockeyfan2390]

I stopped trusting the draft after Pittsburgh got Crosby.

Markets get top players.

And New York getting Lafreniere. And Chicago getting Bedard (and another WC).

 

[norrisnick]

I stopped trusting the draft after Pittsburgh got Crosby.

Markets get top players.

Pitt got Crosby because they aren't a market. They were a whisker from getting the boot to Kansas City. They only show up for a marquee name.