Your Rebuild Opinion? Next Move Coming?

[Snuggs]

Everyone is is overpaid in free agency. It is how it works. If your primary goal in life is not to overpay for players, don't sign UFAs

C'mon.... what's even going on? 9 million seemed legit?

Everyone knows what you posted, but to the extent you over pay and who you over pay is something else.

9 million... That contract is one of the worst signed as soon as the ink touches.

Red Wings needs are top talent which there isn't much of in UFA, You don't have to go overpay someone for a middle six role this year. Wings have plenty knocking on the door than can fill the bottom roles and low minutes of this team and signing guys like Bennett/Garvikov to be your top players isn't going to make this team so much better than teams with top players already on them. IMO, we're still trying to get Top line players to match other teams and until Red Wings do, they'll look similar to what/how they play now.

This idea we're going to out depth teams is a falsie imo, you'd have to have 3 lines as good as our top line now to out match most teams' depth.

I think they'll have to trade their way out of this situation but it's just me. Maybe there's some UFA that's a great buy at any price, but I'm not seeing it.

Without a major talent brought in, I actually don't think this team will be much better than the team you saw this year, or the year prior.

 

[SCD]

Just think, this time next year we will finally be done paying Abdelkader.

Be careful what you wish for.........

 

[dalem177]

Just think, this time next year we will finally be done paying Abdelkader.

Be careful what you wish for.........

 

[JohanFranzenstein]

If motherf***ers are suggesting paying Gavrikov (again, who I am very high on) $9mil, they should have no problem giving Marner $12-$14mil.

 

[Rzombo4 prez]

C'mon.... are you arguing to argue or what's even going on? 9 million seemed legit?

Everyone knows what you posted, but to the extent you over pay and who you over pay is something else.

9 million... That contract is one of the worst signed as soon as the ink touches.

Red Wings needs are top talent which there isn't much of in UFA, You don't have to go over pay someone for a middle six role this year. We've got plenty knocking on the door than can fill the bottom roles and low minutes of this team and signing guys like Bennett/Garvikov to be your top players isn't going to make this team so much better than teams with top players already on them. IMO, we're still trying to get Top line players to match other teams and untill we do we'll look similar to what/how they play now.

I think they'll have to trade there way out of this situation but it's just me. Maybe there's some UFA that's a great buy at any price, but I'm not seeing it.

Is nine high? By today's cap, yes, but the cap is also expected to hit $113 million by the start of the 2027 season. If you think we aren't paying anyone more than Seider and Larkin, you will be disappointed and no one will sign in Detroit. I think in a vacuum Garvikov is a solid #3 who could probably play top pair with a really strong partner. I like him in our org because we really need a defense-first, top 4 defensemen. In this market with so few good available defensemen and everyone with cap space, I think he probably does get $8-$9mm. It is simple supply and demand.

The Wings do need top-end talent, especially at the forward position. They also need one more solid top 4 defensemen in the near and long term. We also wouldn't be signing Garvikov to be a top player. If he walked in the door tomorrow, I would consider him the third best defensemen on the team.

But we can always pass on him, and tell ourselves that next year will be different. We can also continue to bitch and moan about Copp and Compher's contracts even though we can't spend the cap space we already have.

 

[Winger98]

Pionk just got $7m to re-sign in Winny. If Gavrikov wants to really push for the biggest deal he can get, anything between $8 and $9 million seems possible.

I still like going after fabbro for a RD and Lindgren for a LD, but I'd also be comfortable walking into next season with Ed/Albert/Chia down the left side and Wally/Buium on call from GR.

 

[HisNoodliness]

Is nine high? By today's cap, yes, but the cap is also expected to hit $113 million by the start of the 2027 season. If you think we aren't paying anyone more than Seider and Larkin, you will be disappointed and no one will sign in Detroit. I think in a vacuum Garvikov is a solid #3 who could probably play top pair with a really strong partner. I like him in our org because we really need a defense-first, top 4 defensemen. In this market with so few good available defensemen and everyone with cap space, I think he probably does get $8-$9mm. It is simple supply and demand.

The Wings do need top-end talent, especially at the forward position. They also need one more solid top 4 defensemen in the near and long term. We also wouldn't be signing Garvikov to be a top player. If he walked in the door tomorrow, I would consider him the third best defensemen on the team.

But we can always pass on him, and tell ourselves that next year will be different. We can also continue to bitch and moan about Copp and Compher's contracts even though we can't spend the cap space we already have.

I have to wonder if teams have become more conservative about that 110+ million cap projection. Those projections assumed economic stability. Recessions are really bad for sports. The NHL in particular is very heavily gate driven. The dying American and Canadian economies with further increased hardship for the middle class should be pretty rough for a league that depends heavily on those people to buy tickets.

I think you'll see a lot of GMs afraid of signing Gavrikov to 9 and then learning that he's actually worth ~5. You hate to end up in Toronto's position where you sign all of your players to big contracts that should age well and then see your team right up against a flat cap for years.

 

[Snuggs]

Is nine high? By today's cap, yes, but the cap is also expected to hit $113 million by the start of the 2027 season. If you think we aren't paying anyone more than Seider and Larkin, you will be disappointed and no one will sign in Detroit. I think in a vacuum Garvikov is a solid #3 who could probably play top pair with a really strong partner. I like him in our org because we really need a defense-first, top 4 defensemen. In this market with so few good available defensemen and everyone with cap space, I think he probably does get $8-$9mm. It is simple supply and demand.

The Wings do need top-end talent, especially at the forward position. They also need one more solid top 4 defensemen in the near and long term. We also wouldn't be signing Garvikov to be a top player. If he walked in the door tomorrow, I would consider him the third best defensemen on the team.

But we can always pass on him, and tell ourselves that next year will be different. We can also continue to bitch and moan about Copp and Compher's contracts even though we can't spend the cap space we already have.

No I fully expect players to get paid more for sure, but they'll actually have to be better than those two players. It's not what I'd actually do but I'd rather chase down Noah Dobson on an offer-sheet and lose the picks for the same money long-term. He's way better and younger.

I think I agree with you on everything in this post honestly, outside of the value of Garvikov.

I think Garvikov would be a new name we string along with the likes of Copp/Compher/Chiarot/Husso. At the time seemed like good ideas, long-term look stupid.

(Just my opinion, we'll see how things playout, maybe he's brought in for a Roy type deal which would be alright)

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

Everyone is is overpaid in free agency. It is how it works. If your primary goal in life is not to overpay for players, don't sign UFAs

Agreed. It’s the nature of the beast to “overpay” because that’s what happens when you have a good player available and are trying to sign them to a mediocre team.

You just hope they don’t turn out to be Holls, Tarasenkos and Gustaffsons.

 

[HoweFan]

I know we will be signing some new FA
‘s but I hope the kids get a chance. Danielson should help us at least on the PK. ASP is exactly what we need on the blue line. Take a chance on him and don’t send him to GR. It’s time for Mazur. At least one of the three big prospects on D should be able to compete as a 5-6 dman. I hope Cossa can contribute. They have to find out at some point. I look forward to next year because I think we will be better

 

[DoMakc]

Dont see how marner fits into the team.

Raymond Kane and Mitch are too similar. And with Buch and Lombardi on the way we have the playmaker winger covered.

I like Bennett not to play center but to play the puck retrieval/net front role for the Larkin Raymond line. We have a massive hole on our top line. Bennett would be a great complimentary piece. I'd pay him 8 mill.

I wonder if Compher or Copp could play that role instead?

The only other move Id make is signing Orlov to round out the top 4.

Then you have to trust the kids can provide the depth.


Bennett-Larkin-Raymond
DCat-Kasper-Kane
Danielson-Copp-Tarasenko
Rasmussen-Compher-Mazur

or

Compher-Larkin-Raymond
DCat-Kasper-Kane
Danielson-Copp-Tarasenko
Mazur-Rasmussen-Berggren

Orlov-Seider
Edvinsson-ASP
Chiarot-Johansson

MBN or Mazur are much closer to NHL than Lombardi or Buchelnikov and way more projectable. Especially Lombardi is a longshot fot Top 6. On the other hand, this team needs another forward who can drive the offense on a line, a replacement for Kane, who while great on PP, more of a passanger 5-on-5. Player Marner caliber are not making to UFA that often, I'd rather pay him 14 mil Marner than whatever will take to sign Bennett (let's assume more than 7), which in my opinion is too much for a 29-year-old who managed to score a new career high of 51 in his UFA year to play rather replaceble role of third . I'd rather play Copp/Compher with Larkin, the drop off shouldn't be that high since we talk about piano puller here.

I think this looks better than above:

Compher-Larkin-Raymond
DeBrincat-Kasper-Marner
Söderblom/Mazur-Copp-Kane
Rasmussen-Somebody Who- Kills Penalties

 

[Rzombo4 prez]

No I fully expect players to get paid more for sure, but they'll actually have to be better than those two players. It's not what I'd actually do but I'd rather chase down Noah Dobson on an offer-sheet and lose the picks for the same money long-term. He's way better and younger.

I think I agree with you on everything in this post honestly, outside of the value of Garvikov.

I think Garvikov would be a new name we string along with the likes of Copp/Compher/Chiarot/Husso. At the time seemed like good ideas, long-term look stupid.

(Just my opinion, we'll see how things playout, maybe he's brought in for a Roy type deal which would be alright)

I am totally on board with offer-sheeting RFAs. I just don't think it will work because everyone has cap dollars.

I don't fault you for wanting to buy quality. I think we have enough good young players (or at least young players trending in a positive direction) that we can afford to be selective.

 

[Run the Jewels]

Is nine high? By today's cap, yes, but the cap is also expected to hit $113 million by the start of the 2027 season. If you think we aren't paying anyone more than Seider and Larkin, you will be disappointed and no one will sign in Detroit. I think in a vacuum Garvikov is a solid #3 who could probably play top pair with a really strong partner. I like him in our org because we really need a defense-first, top 4 defensemen. In this market with so few good available defensemen and everyone with cap space, I think he probably does get $8-$9mm. It is simple supply and demand.

The Wings do need top-end talent, especially at the forward position. They also need one more solid top 4 defensemen in the near and long term. We also wouldn't be signing Garvikov to be a top player. If he walked in the door tomorrow, I would consider him the third best defensemen on the team.

But we can always pass on him, and tell ourselves that next year will be different. We can also continue to bitch and moan about Copp and Compher's contracts even though we can't spend the cap space we already have.

Gavrikov this summer.
Kyle Connor next summer.

 

[stillwater]

I've been avoiding commenting here, because I didn't want to bring people down. I've been pro-tank for a while and it's been painful to watch, as we've climbed from a possible 7th spot, to 12th.

And there were plenty of people here saying what I would have said: Just lose these last few games, sit Larkin and Seider, blah blah blah.

So now that the unpleasantness of the death throes of the season are over, back to the original prompt of this post --

Next move for the rebuild:

In my opinion, and I'm not trying to be cruel -- the most important thing we could do is get some of these guys to sports psychologists.

When the games counted the most, we folded as a team, and some of these guys completely collapsed. I don't think it's a character issue with any of them -- I don't think there's anyone here (save maybe Kane) who cares too much about themselves and their stats, and not enough about the team, and winning. And Kane remained effective when the heat was on. Then when games didn't matter, the team played loose and won.

It's not that they don't care, it's that they care too much, and they're not able to take that pressure and use it constructively. I won't call them out by name, but there are 4 or 5 crucially important guys on this team that need to learn how to harness that pressure and rise to big occasions. Maybe a sports psychologist can help.

Good grief, the Red Wings have a psychologist staff.

So does basically every other pro sports franchise.

 

[USAHockey97]

C'mon.... what's even going on? 9 million seemed legit?

Everyone knows what you posted, but to the extent you over pay and who you over pay is something else.

9 million... That contract is one of the worst signed as soon as the ink touches.

Red Wings needs are top talent which there isn't much of in UFA, You don't have to go overpay someone for a middle six role this year. Wings have plenty knocking on the door than can fill the bottom roles and low minutes of this team and signing guys like Bennett/Garvikov to be your top players isn't going to make this team so much better than teams with top players already on them. IMO, we're still trying to get Top line players to match other teams and until Red Wings do, they'll look similar to what/how they play now.

This idea we're going to out depth teams is a falsie imo, you'd have to have 3 lines as good as our top line now to out match most teams' depth.

I think they'll have to trade their way out of this situation but it's just me. Maybe there's some UFA that's a great buy at any price, but I'm not seeing it.

Without a major talent brought in, I actually don't think this team will be much better than the team you saw this year, or the year prior.

Agree with this. Wings have a lot of depth prospects. I just don’t see anyone who moves the needle as much as is needed on the forward end.

 

[USAHockey97]

Is nine high? By today's cap, yes, but the cap is also expected to hit $113 million by the start of the 2027 season. If you think we aren't paying anyone more than Seider and Larkin, you will be disappointed and no one will sign in Detroit. I think in a vacuum Garvikov is a solid #3 who could probably play top pair with a really strong partner. I like him in our org because we really need a defense-first, top 4 defensemen. In this market with so few good available defensemen and everyone with cap space, I think he probably does get $8-$9mm. It is simple supply and demand.

The Wings do need top-end talent, especially at the forward position. They also need one more solid top 4 defensemen in the near and long term. We also wouldn't be signing Garvikov to be a top player. If he walked in the door tomorrow, I would consider him the third best defensemen on the team.

But we can always pass on him, and tell ourselves that next year will be different. We can also continue to bitch and moan about Copp and Compher's contracts even though we can't spend the cap space we already have.

Larkin’s salary cannot be the bar anymore. Wings will need to sign an elite player to justify going higher. If they overpay for another Copp just because the salary cap goes up, I’m not sure that will sit well.

 

[The Real Pastafarian]

Good grief, the Red Wings have a psychologist staff.

So does basically every other pro sports franchise.

Then that's where we most urgently need to upgrade, before addressing LD or 2C with free agents.

 

[stillwater]

Then that's where we most urgently need to upgrade, before addressing LD or 2C with free agents.

Right, okay.

Can't wait until next spring when Dylan Larkin gets to lift the Stanley Cup and then hand it off directly to the newly established sports psychologist, as opposed to say ... Patrick Kane.

 

[RedHawkDown]

C'mon.... what's even going on? 9 million seemed legit?

Everyone knows what you posted, but to the extent you over pay and who you over pay is something else.

9 million... That contract is one of the worst signed as soon as the ink touches.

Red Wings needs are top talent which there isn't much of in UFA, You don't have to go overpay someone for a middle six role this year. Wings have plenty knocking on the door than can fill the bottom roles and low minutes of this team and signing guys like Bennett/Garvikov to be your top players isn't going to make this team so much better than teams with top players already on them. IMO, we're still trying to get Top line players to match other teams and until Red Wings do, they'll look similar to what/how they play now.

This idea we're going to out depth teams is a falsie imo, you'd have to have 3 lines as good as our top line now to out match most teams' depth.

I think they'll have to trade their way out of this situation but it's just me. Maybe there's some UFA that's a great buy at any price, but I'm not seeing it.

Without a major talent brought in, I actually don't think this team will be much better than the team you saw this year, or the year prior.

Gavrikov is a top 5-10 defensive defenseman in the league. He would be absolutely perfect beside ASP allowing Ed and Seider to play together. Anybody comparing him to Copp/Compher is out to lunch and has likely never watched LA play a game. Those deals were trash the second they were signed and we were rightly ridiculed on the main boards for them. Gavrikov is 10x the player of both these guys.

There's also zero chance he gets 9M. This makes no sense. Neal Pionk just signed a 6-year extension at 7M per year as a pending UFA and he's better offensively than Gavrikov but slightly worse defensively. He's also an RHD which is a premium. There is zero shot Gavrikov gets 2M more than him.

Chychrun signed an 8-year deal for 9M playing an OFD role on Washington, and has been a far better player than Gavrikov his entire career while also being 3 years younger.

All these guys aren't stupid, they also know the cap is about to rise. These recent extensions to pending UFAs should give you an idea for what guys will sign for in the off-season.

Gavrikov will most likely come in at around 6.5-7.5 for 5-6 years.

 

[datsyukfan]

Gavrikov is a top 5-10 defensive defenseman in the league. He would be absolutely perfect beside ASP allowing Ed and Seider to play together. Anybody comparing him to Copp/Compher is out to lunch and has likely never watched LA play a game. Those deals were trash the second they were signed and we were rightly ridiculed on the main boards for them. Gavrikov is 10x the player of both these guys.

There's also zero chance he gets 9M. This makes no sense. Neal Pionk just signed a 6-year extension at 7M per year as a pending UFA and he's better offensively than Gavrikov but slightly worse defensively. He's also an RHD which is a premium. There is zero shot Gavrikov gets 2M more than him.

Chychrun signed an 8-year deal for 9M playing an OFD role on Washington, and has been a far better player than Gavrikov his entire career while also being 3 years younger.

All these guys aren't stupid, they also know the cap is about to rise. These recent extensions to pending UFAs should give you an idea for what guys will sign for in the off-season.

Gavrikov will most likely come in at around 6.5-7.5 for 5-6 years.

Couldn’t agree more, and I sign that all day every day. He’s kind of the perfect fit imo.

 

[ElProfessor]

The biggest disappointments I’ve had in the Yzerplan — the biggest mistakes he’s made — were Sergachev and Chychrun.

Two young LHD’s who would’ve been great long-term top-pair LHD partners for Seider. Who both got traded at last yr’s draft for almost nothing.

Was very, very disappointed Yzerman was either out of the loop, or didn’t match for either.

Recap:

-Sergachev (7yrs on $8.5M/yr deal): 2nd, 7th, Connor Geekie (1st Rd pick, 14pts in 52 games as a rookie this yr), JJ Moser (24, 14pts in 54 games this yr).

…Think we could’ve beat that ^ without giving up any our previous or future 1st Rd picks.

-Chychrun: 3rd and Nick Jensen (34).

…Obviously could’ve blown that ^ out of the water.

Hell, we could’ve gotten both and had the best D in hockey for the next decade

Sergachev—Seider
Edvinsson—Chychrun
Johansson—ASP

(Might’ve had to give up Johansson to get Sergachev)

Point being….

I really hope Yzerman doesn’t miss out on whoever this draft’s Sergachev and Chychrun are

 

[stillwater]

Yeah, and once again, in hindsight, after the fact, with 20-20 laser vision and all, I kinda wish that God would have thrown in an eighth (I mean, it's just one more day) day and worked a little harder to predict and fix some of the bullshit that's come about since he made those big mistakes in the Godplan.

 

[wingsfannnn9191]

The biggest disappointments I’ve had in the Yzerplan — the biggest mistakes he’s made — were Sergachev and Chychrun.

Two young LHD’s who would’ve been great long-term top-pair LHD partners for Seider. Who both got traded at last yr’s draft for almost nothing.

Was very, very disappointed Yzerman was either out of the loop, or didn’t match for either.

Recap:

-Sergachev (7yrs on $8.5M/yr deal): 2nd, 7th, Connor Geekie (1st Rd pick, 14pts in 52 games as a rookie this yr), JJ Moser (24, 14pts in 54 games this yr).

…Think we could’ve beat that ^ without giving up any our previous or future 1st Rd picks.

-Chychrun: 3rd and Nick Jensen (34).

…Obviously could’ve blown that ^ out of the water.

Hell, we could’ve gotten both and had the best D in hockey for the next decade

Sergachev—Seider
Edvinsson—Chychrun
Johansson—ASP

(Might’ve had to give up Johansson to get Sergachev)

Point being….

I really hope Yzerman doesn’t miss out on whoever this draft’s Sergachev and Chychrun are

Who would you have given up for sergachev??? Its easy to look at geekiest stats now and say we could have done better

Would you have given up kasper or Danielson??? That woulda been the price

 

[wingsfannnn9191]

What are the chances werenski gets fed up and demands cbj to trade him back home ?? 0% lol I just noticed hes a ufa after 3 more seasons, for some reason I thought he still had lots more to go

Werenski seider
Edvinsson asp

Wont happen but that damm that be nice ... signing him as a ufa at 30 till 37-38 would scare me

I'll settle for quinn hughes in 2 yrs and Kyle connor next year

 

[ElProfessor]

Sergachev (7yrs on $8.5M/yr deal):
-2nd
-7th
-Connor Geekie (1st Rd pick, 14pts in 52 games as a rookie this yr)
-JJ Moser (24, 14pts in 54 games this yr)

Johansson (hopefully not), Wallinder or Buium is an upgrade to match over Moser.

Mazur and a 2nd matches Geekie. Can throw some extras in too.

Wouldn’t have been hard to beat at all