cbjthrowaway
Registered User
- Jul 4, 2020
- 2,012
- 4,963
doesn’t matter how hard you shoot the puck if you can’t get it off quickly or locate it.
Player Discussion: Yegor Chinakhov
- Thread starter ViD
- Start date
I don't think I saw Chinakhov in those tables for fastest players, but I assumed that was because he didn't play enough in the sample period.
To be clear, I don't think he has an accuracy issue. He can pick a corner. His go to on the rush and shootout is the five hole next to the heel of the goalie's stick - that's the smallest one!
For someone to shoot close to 10% at the distance he shoots from, that's pretty good. He was at 15% last year and to start this year.
What we saw when Chinakhov came back from injury was a slower release, he was over thinking it and trying to make the perfect shot.
cbjthrowaway
Registered User
- Jul 4, 2020
- 2,012
- 4,963
fair point — he’s an excellent shooter on breakaways and shootouts.
my point here though is that the shot speed metrics aren’t all that translatable to production.
it reminds me of the moneyball scene where the scouts are talking about a guy having a beautiful swing and the ball jumping off his bat, to which billy beane replies “if he’s such a good hitter, why doesn’t he hit good”
he’s talented, but is that the same thing as being good? there are far less gifted players who are far more impactful on NHL ice.
jack roslovic has some of the best tools i’ve seen on a blue jackets player, but he never became good.
that’s why chinakhov’s injury stuff is such a big deal to me. he has loud tools, but he’s missed the game speed reps to learn how to apply them toward impacting the game.
and some guys — roslovic, boqvist, milano, etc — never learn how to use their tools to actually generate impact. they’re all potential until suddenly they’re not.
Iron Balls McGinty
Registered User
- Aug 5, 2005
- 8,725
- 8,332
Kind of equates to my hatred of exit velocity and ball speed on hits in baseball.
I don't care how hard a guy hits a ball if he hits it right to the left fielder. As the old Willie Keeler adage goes, "Hit it where they ain't" It doesn't matter how far or how hard a home run goes. it still counts the same amount no matter what.
Not directly relating this to Chinakov's skill at all but in general people get to tied up in metrics these days and don't use their eyes to see if a guy is producing or not. We know he's capable of producing but health has prevented him from being consistent.
cbjthrowaway
Registered User
- Jul 4, 2020
- 2,012
- 4,963
at least exit velo and spin rate are correlated with better outcomes.
i have yet to see anything to indicate that shot speed is. if anything i bet it’s correlated with shooting from farther away and thus only applies to inherently low-danger shots.
Iron Balls McGinty
Registered User
- Aug 5, 2005
- 8,725
- 8,332
I put an asterisk on that statement. A baseball hitter can put a 106 MPH speed on a ball in the gap and its a double or triple. Or he can hit it right at the 2nd baseman for a line out.
A guy might have a 97 mph wrist shot but if he shoots it right at the goalies chest its not going to get through him.
Accuracy probably means more than speed in the majority of cases.
Holy f***, go watch some game video of the guy to remember how he actually plays.
Multiple Jack Roslovic “comparisons” and talking positive about his “tools” while at the same time attacking Chinakhov’s ability in any way….. Roslovic/Boqvist/Milano…..INSANE.
He THINKS the game completely better than guys like Roslovic and Laine. While having just as good or better “tools”. He’s much better defensively and plays more physical than ALL these guys.
You guys sound like me arguing against Laine and his shit shot selection and shooting ability.
The problem is that it was actually true regarding Laine. This nonsense about Chinakhov is old fashioned biased BS.
You guys just want EA Sports Shatty Laine one timers!!!
The problem is that it was actually true regarding Laine. This nonsense about Chinakhov is old fashioned biased BS.
You guys just want EA Sports Shatty Laine one timers!!!
Iron Balls McGinty
Registered User
- Aug 5, 2005
- 8,725
- 8,332
In theory I actually kind of agree with bus.
Even though we drafted him when nobody had a f’ing clue who he was I think he’s talented.
The difference is I am willing to move on from him if it improves the team since we’ve spent a good bit of time having some success without and doesn’t need him to become a winner if we can fix other needs. I don’t want to move on just for the sake of moving on but his inability to stay on the ice raises concern.
If he stays and has a full year to eliminate those concerns. Wonderful. But I need to see some consistent results.
Even though we drafted him when nobody had a f’ing clue who he was I think he’s talented.
The difference is I am willing to move on from him if it improves the team since we’ve spent a good bit of time having some success without and doesn’t need him to become a winner if we can fix other needs. I don’t want to move on just for the sake of moving on but his inability to stay on the ice raises concern.
If he stays and has a full year to eliminate those concerns. Wonderful. But I need to see some consistent results.
cbjthrowaway
Registered User
- Jul 4, 2020
- 2,012
- 4,963
OldGoaltender
Registered User
I don’t think anyone is saying this. What we are saying is the guy could be McDavid but if he’s only played in half the games and missed the other half then his value might look great on paper but paper doesn’t play on ice,
spintheblackcircle
My cat would be a Tkachuk
- Mar 1, 2002
- 66,611
- 14,488
Xoggz22
Registered User
Not the player comparison I would have used given half the folks on here are also suggesting to trade Boone.
Xoggz22
Registered User
Very interesting thread... I don't believe i have seen one person suggest Chinakhov isn't talented, only injured far too much. Yet the argument seems to be about his talent? I love the kids but I love guys who play 70+ games a year too.
It's all about the availability, not the ability
It's all about the availability, not the ability
KJ Dangler
Registered User
IDK, you tell me.
Here we go with the love/hate shit. The opinions are clearly “polarized”. You mean the team lacks prima donna’s after the Laine trade? Wake me up after Elvis is gone.
And while people SAY they think he’s skilled (whoop de do) they still overall mostly underestimate his ability or skills and half the people or more seemingly think he’s “expendable”, or should be moved because of his time missed. Saying he isn’t near Marchenko in value or skill is DISRESPECTFUL and inaccurate. Same in regards to Chinakhov and Shatty Laine. This is YEARS of this stuff again. All I’m doing is defending Chinakhov, someone who I thinks is both extremely skilled and a very good player, while at the same time taking up a SMALL amount of the teams cap hit.
The team is nowhere near needing to limit money spent at this point. This was a huge reason why people defended Laine getting paid $8-9 million dollars, AND HIS CAP HIT, to not play, or even play like shit.
I don’t make bets, I make promises and guarantees. How about you come up with a list of ANYTHING I’ve actually been wrong about. Good luck.
spintheblackcircle
My cat would be a Tkachuk
- Mar 1, 2002
- 66,611
- 14,488
Chinakhov
62 games-14 pts
30 games-13 pts
53 games-29 pts
30 games-15 pts
Marchenko
59 games-25 pts
78 games-42 pts
79 games-74 pts
If any GM in the NHL thinks they are close to talent and value in 2025, they may be in the wrong business
spintheblackcircle
My cat would be a Tkachuk
- Mar 1, 2002
- 66,611
- 14,488
You made the accusation, don't come back with that passive aggressive stuff.
You accuse people, have the courage to say what it is.
Buddy, I’m not in your (or any others) head. What I’m saying is these bogus opinions are showing SOME type of bias. I’ve been down that road and accused over and over of it myself. And then time, the future and REALITY meet.
Also, you’re somebody who a day ago claimed I was somebody who would give Harvey Weinstein a “pass” or some shit. NO, that’s the mindless parroting groupthink that we often see here and everywhere else in society, like all the people who DID give that guy a pass for years, from ALL the people who benefited or didn’t want to look bad.
I am the guy who speaks out, no matter what “the majority” have to say, or if it’s a popular opinion. I’m the one who calls out Merzlikins or Laine, or Weinstein/Epstein and local Ohio hero Les Wexner, before I’m told to shut up and sit down, and the TRUTH is removed/forgotten until it undoubtedly comes back up in the future.
Control > Courage
Xoggz22
Registered User
I do think it could be part. It's been noted he's had a back issue dating back to his draft year as I recall (it is not recent, but can't recall the exact timeline) and it's supposedly not structural. To me that seems to imply a possible imbalance or issue with his hamstrings that could be training related. I am definitely no expert. A former athlete with a lot of PT support, but, yes, I think that could absolutely be part. I mean we've seen how good he CAN be, just unfortunate that we can't get somethign consistent because he's no on the ice enough. How long do you wait?
Seems to be the NHL equivalent to Christian Watson of the Packers.
KJ Dangler
Registered User
I think and maybe it’s wishful thinking , but Don came in saw a major issue plaguing this franchise really since Jarmo came in , identified there were major problems , and took decisive actions to change the situation . This involved some longstanding people with the organization . So , being that Yegor was the first person Don signed when he got here , he understands the talent … I think you have to let it play out this year .. Like I said , the kid just turned 24 in February. He’s also put on a ton of muscle the past 2 years .. it would be foolish in my mind to include him in any trade at this point , I can honestly see him becoming a star player in the league .
cbjthrowaway
Registered User
- Jul 4, 2020
- 2,012
- 4,963
spoken like someone who is afraid of having patrik laine as their profile pic on here for a year.
if you truly thought it was a guarantee you’d take the bet and say there’s no downside. it’s as simple as that.
spintheblackcircle
My cat would be a Tkachuk
- Mar 1, 2002
- 66,611
- 14,488
Didn't take long to find this one from you in 2021.
"Also, any talk regarding moving Jones should make it ‘ok’ to talk about moving the lesser player in Werenski."
Viqsi
"that chick from Ohio"
The thread is being derailed and this has to stop. This is about Chinakhov, not about persecution complexes and personal grudges. Move on. Thanks.
Users who are viewing this thread
Latest posts
-
Seravalli: Andersson and Flames “not on the same page” for contract extension (54 Viewers)- Latest: Captain97
-
-
-
-
Canucks & NHL News, Rumours, and & Fantasy GM | Let the Silly Season Commence (90 Viewers)
- Latest: credulous