Player Discussion: Yegor Chinakhov

[cbjthrowaway]

doesn’t matter how hard you shoot the puck if you can’t get it off quickly or locate it.

 

[majormajor]

Yes, the stats show Werenski is the fastest skater, Fantilli is faster as well, amongst others.

I don't think I saw Chinakhov in those tables for fastest players, but I assumed that was because he didn't play enough in the sample period.

doesn’t matter how hard you shoot the puck if you can’t get it off quickly or locate it.

To be clear, I don't think he has an accuracy issue. He can pick a corner. His go to on the rush and shootout is the five hole next to the heel of the goalie's stick - that's the smallest one!

For someone to shoot close to 10% at the distance he shoots from, that's pretty good. He was at 15% last year and to start this year.

What we saw when Chinakhov came back from injury was a slower release, he was over thinking it and trying to make the perfect shot.

 

[cbjthrowaway]

To be clear, I don't think he has an accuracy issue. He can pick a corner. His go to on the rush and shootout is the five hole next to the heel of the goalie's stick - that's the smallest one!

fair point — he’s an excellent shooter on breakaways and shootouts.

my point here though is that the shot speed metrics aren’t all that translatable to production.

it reminds me of the moneyball scene where the scouts are talking about a guy having a beautiful swing and the ball jumping off his bat, to which billy beane replies “if he’s such a good hitter, why doesn’t he hit good”

he’s talented, but is that the same thing as being good? there are far less gifted players who are far more impactful on NHL ice.

jack roslovic has some of the best tools i’ve seen on a blue jackets player, but he never became good.

that’s why chinakhov’s injury stuff is such a big deal to me. he has loud tools, but he’s missed the game speed reps to learn how to apply them toward impacting the game.

and some guys — roslovic, boqvist, milano, etc — never learn how to use their tools to actually generate impact. they’re all potential until suddenly they’re not.

 

[Iron Balls McGinty]

fair point — he’s an excellent shooter on breakaways and shootouts.

my point here though is that the shot speed metrics aren’t all that translatable to production.

it reminds me of the moneyball scene where the scouts are talking about a guy having a beautiful swing and the ball jumping off his bat, to which billy beane replies “if he’s such a good hitter, why doesn’t he hit good”

he’s talented, but is that the same thing as being good? there are far less gifted players who are far more impactful on NHL ice.

jack roslovic has some of the best tools i’ve seen on a blue jackets player, but he never became good.

that’s why chinakhov’s injury stuff is such a big deal to me. he has loud tools, but he’s missed the game speed reps to learn how to apply them toward impacting the game.

and some guys — roslovic, boqvist, milano, etc — never learn how to use their tools to actually generate impact. they’re all potential until suddenly they’re not.

Kind of equates to my hatred of exit velocity and ball speed on hits in baseball.

I don't care how hard a guy hits a ball if he hits it right to the left fielder. As the old Willie Keeler adage goes, "Hit it where they ain't" It doesn't matter how far or how hard a home run goes. it still counts the same amount no matter what.

Not directly relating this to Chinakov's skill at all but in general people get to tied up in metrics these days and don't use their eyes to see if a guy is producing or not. We know he's capable of producing but health has prevented him from being consistent.

 

[cbjthrowaway]

Kind of equates to my hatred of exit velocity and ball speed on hits in baseball.

at least exit velo and spin rate are correlated with better outcomes.

i have yet to see anything to indicate that shot speed is. if anything i bet it’s correlated with shooting from farther away and thus only applies to inherently low-danger shots.

 

[Iron Balls McGinty]

at least exit velo and spin rate are correlated with better outcomes.

i have yet to see anything to indicate that shot speed is. if anything i bet it’s correlated with shooting from farther away and thus only applies to inherently low-danger shots.

I put an asterisk on that statement. A baseball hitter can put a 106 MPH speed on a ball in the gap and its a double or triple. Or he can hit it right at the 2nd baseman for a line out.

A guy might have a 97 mph wrist shot but if he shoots it right at the goalies chest its not going to get through him.

Accuracy probably means more than speed in the majority of cases.

 

[thebus88]

fair point — he’s an excellent shooter on breakaways and shootouts.

my point here though is that the shot speed metrics aren’t all that translatable to production.

it reminds me of the moneyball scene where the scouts are talking about a guy having a beautiful swing and the ball jumping off his bat, to which billy beane replies “if he’s such a good hitter, why doesn’t he hit good”

he’s talented, but is that the same thing as being good? there are far less gifted players who are far more impactful on NHL ice.

jack roslovic has some of the best tools i’ve seen on a blue jackets player, but he never became good.

that’s why chinakhov’s injury stuff is such a big deal to me. he has loud tools, but he’s missed the game speed reps to learn how to apply them toward impacting the game.

and some guys — roslovic, boqvist, milano, etc — never learn how to use their tools to actually generate impact. they’re all potential until suddenly they’re not.

Holy f***, go watch some game video of the guy to remember how he actually plays.

Multiple Jack Roslovic “comparisons” and talking positive about his “tools” while at the same time attacking Chinakhov’s ability in any way….. Roslovic/Boqvist/Milano…..INSANE.

He THINKS the game completely better than guys like Roslovic and Laine. While having just as good or better “tools”. He’s much better defensively and plays more physical than ALL these guys.

 

[thebus88]

You guys sound like me arguing against Laine and his shit shot selection and shooting ability.

The problem is that it was actually true regarding Laine. This nonsense about Chinakhov is old fashioned biased BS.

You guys just want EA Sports Shatty Laine one timers!!!

 

[Iron Balls McGinty]

In theory I actually kind of agree with bus.

Even though we drafted him when nobody had a f’ing clue who he was I think he’s talented.

The difference is I am willing to move on from him if it improves the team since we’ve spent a good bit of time having some success without and doesn’t need him to become a winner if we can fix other needs. I don’t want to move on just for the sake of moving on but his inability to stay on the ice raises concern.

If he stays and has a full year to eliminate those concerns. Wonderful. But I need to see some consistent results.

 

[cbjthrowaway]

Holy f***, go watch some game video of the guy to remember how he actually plays.

Multiple Jack Roslovic “comparisons” and talking positive about his “tools” while at the same time attacking Chinakhov’s ability in any way….. Roslovic/Boqvist/Milano…..INSANE.

He THINKS the game completely better than guys like Roslovic and Laine. While having just as good or better “tools”. He’s much better defensively and plays more physical than ALL these guys.

so what you’re saying is that you’re accepting the bet i proposed, right?

 

[OldGoaltender]

You guys sound like me arguing against Laine and his shit shot selection and shooting ability.

The problem is that it was actually true regarding Laine. This nonsense about Chinakhov is old fashioned biased BS.

You guys just want EA Sports Shatty Laine one timers!!!

I don’t think anyone is saying this. What we are saying is the guy could be McDavid but if he’s only played in half the games and missed the other half then his value might look great on paper but paper doesn’t play on ice,

 

[spintheblackcircle]

The problem is that it was actually true regarding Laine. This nonsense about Chinakhov is old fashioned biased BS.

What bias?

 

[Xoggz22]

Boone and Yegor have played 84 /83 games in past 2 seasons …

Not the player comparison I would have used given half the folks on here are also suggesting to trade Boone.

 

[Xoggz22]

Very interesting thread... I don't believe i have seen one person suggest Chinakhov isn't talented, only injured far too much. Yet the argument seems to be about his talent? I love the kids but I love guys who play 70+ games a year too.

It's all about the availability, not the ability

 

[KJ Dangler]

Very interesting thread... I don't believe i have seen one person suggest Chinakhov isn't talented, only injured far too much. Yet the argument seems to be about his talent? I love the kids but I love guys who play 70+ games a year too.

It's all about the availability, not the ability

You think the training staff, conditioning , etc is a factor in this ?

 

[NotCommitted]

@thebus88 What on earth are you trying to do here and why, it reeks desperate to stir some "controversy" around a player no one even hates. I guess now that team lacks any polarizing players you need to try make Chinakhov into one?

 

[thebus88]

What bias?

IDK, you tell me.

@thebus88 What on earth are you trying to do here and why, it reeks desperate to stir some "controversy" around a player no one even hates. I guess now that team lacks any polarizing players you need to try make Chinakhov into one?

Here we go with the love/hate shit. The opinions are clearly “polarized”. You mean the team lacks prima donna’s after the Laine trade? Wake me up after Elvis is gone.

And while people SAY they think he’s skilled (whoop de do) they still overall mostly underestimate his ability or skills and half the people or more seemingly think he’s “expendable”, or should be moved because of his time missed. Saying he isn’t near Marchenko in value or skill is DISRESPECTFUL and inaccurate. Same in regards to Chinakhov and Shatty Laine. This is YEARS of this stuff again. All I’m doing is defending Chinakhov, someone who I thinks is both extremely skilled and a very good player, while at the same time taking up a SMALL amount of the teams cap hit.

The team is nowhere near needing to limit money spent at this point. This was a huge reason why people defended Laine getting paid $8-9 million dollars, AND HIS CAP HIT, to not play, or even play like shit.

so what you’re saying is that you’re accepting the bet i proposed, right?

I don’t make bets, I make promises and guarantees. How about you come up with a list of ANYTHING I’ve actually been wrong about. Good luck.

 

[thebus88]

What bias?

IDK, you tell me.

@thebus88 What on earth are you trying to do here and why, it reeks desperate to stir some "controversy" around a player no one even hates. I guess now that team lacks any polarizing players you need to try make Chinakhov into one?

Here we go with the love/hate shit. The opinions are clearly “polarized”. You mean the team lacks prima donna’s after the Laine trade? We still have a “goalie problem”.

And while people SAY they think he’s skilled (whoop de do) they still overall mostly underestimate his ability or skills and half the people or more seemingly think he’s “expendable”, or should be moved because of his time missed. Saying he isn’t near Marchenko in value or skill is DISRESPECTFUL and inaccurate. Same in regards to Chinakhov and Shatty Laine. This is YEARS of this stuff again. All I’m doing is defending Chinakhov, someone who I thinks is both extremely skilled and a very good player, while at the same time taking up a SMALL amount of the teams cap hit.

The team is nowhere near needing to limit money spent at this point. This was a huge reason why people defended Laine getting paid $8-9 million dollars, AND HIS CAP HIT, to not play, or even play like shit.

 

[spintheblackcircle]

.Saying he isn’t near Marchenko in value or skill is DISRESPECTFUL and inaccurate.

Chinakhov

62 games-14 pts
30 games-13 pts
53 games-29 pts
30 games-15 pts

Marchenko
59 games-25 pts
78 games-42 pts
79 games-74 pts

If any GM in the NHL thinks they are close to talent and value in 2025, they may be in the wrong business

 

[spintheblackcircle]

IDK, you tell me.

You made the accusation, don't come back with that passive aggressive stuff.

You accuse people, have the courage to say what it is.