With the 14th overall selection in the 2023 NHL Entry Draft, the Pittsburgh Penguins select…

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Worthless for us. Not for rebuilding Winnipeg.

You don't think they can get a better return than the 14th and some C-tier prospect like Pickering for arguably the best goalie in the world? I'll just say I disagree.

 

[PensandCaps]

You don't think they can get a better return than the 14th and some C-tier prospect like Pickering for arguably the best goalie in the world? I'll just say I disagree.

Goalies aren't worth much. He doesn't even have a contract long term. 14th+B prospect is fair value.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

Goalies aren't worth much. He doesn't even have a contract long term. 14th+B prospect is fair value.

Uh huh.

 

[SomeDude]

I still don't see how it is wise to pay virtually all of our assets of any value for a goalie that is going to eat up a ton of cap space to play him in front of a mediocre team and defense.

Use the assets/cap space to improve the team and put a competent but unspectacular goalie tandem behind them.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

And there's zero reason for Hellebuyck, at 30, to re-sign with a team full of 36 year olds that hasn't been out of the 1st round since 2018.

Dude wants a Cup. He's leaving a borderline 1st round exit/outside of the playoffs team because he wants a Cup. If Winnipeg sent him here, it'd be for everything not nailed down, and he'd walk anyway.

Think he's gonna go to LA, Buffalo, Ottawa or NJ. All teams that could use Hellebuyck in the here and now, and for the remainder of his career, who have more attractive (and expendable) assets than this organization imo. But I get it, it's fun to dream. We all do it every summer, coming up with these super ambitious plans to get the team back into the thick of things just for mid-July to roll around and reality to hit.

 

[BusinessGoose]

A reliable goalie can cover a lot of warts from your skaters

A shaky goalie would make Lidstrom look bad

 

[SomeDude]

A reliable goalie can cover a lot of warts from your skaters

A shaky goalie would make Lidstrom look bad

Adin friggen Hill just won the Stanley Cup.

 

[Jag68Sid87]

As much as I want a first this year, I would take 3 seconds for Granlund and 14.

Yzerman does not do this, I don't think. So it matters little.

On Michkov, I don't think it matters whether a team decides to take him before Washington. If it is true that he only wants Washington, then he holds the bag. You can draft him, but you might also wind up wasting a high pick or trading him for pennies on the dollar.

 

[PensandCaps]

Uh huh.

You think a rental goalie is getting that much? in what world? Look at any goalie trade of the past decade. They're not bringing in hauls.

 

[Ulf5]

You think a rental goalie is getting that much? in what world? Look at any goalie trade of the past decade. They're not bringing in hauls.

I would think a trade comes with an extension. Who knows what goes through some of these GMs minds though.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I still don't see how it is wise to pay virtually all of our assets of any value for a goalie that is going to eat up a ton of cap space to play him in front of a mediocre team and defense.

Use the assets/cap space to improve the team and put a competent but unspectacular goalie tandem behind them.

Because someone like Hellebuyck is so good that he'll be able to mask the mediocre team and defense in front of him.

 

[SomeDude]

Because someone like Hellebuyck is so good that he'll be able to mask the mediocre team and defense in front of him.

Seems to have worked well in Winnipeg. They also generally have had superior rosters to our current situation.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Seems to have worked well in Winnipeg. They also generally have had superior rosters to our current situation.

No they didn't.

Also Winnipeg has won more playoff series since the Penguins 2017 cup win than the Penguins have won.

 

[SomeDude]

No they didn't.

Also Winnipeg has won more playoff series since the Penguins 2017 cup win than the Penguins have won.

Our current roster is not very good. We have 2 aging superstars who are still very good players but no longer capable of carrying a team, a very good winger in Guentzel, a good top 6 winger in Rakell, Letang and bunch of mediocrity on D and F depth. That is generally a worse, or at least comparable, team than Winnipeg has iced up until this point.

Hellebucyk is a very good goalie and would make a ton of sense for a team like Carolina or LA to go all-in on. I don't see it for the Pens. We're better off using the assets and cap space elsewhere.

 

[Peat]

Seems to have worked well in Winnipeg. They also generally have had superior rosters to our current situation.

Our current roster is not very good. We have 2 aging superstars who are still very good players but no longer capable of carrying a team, a very good winger in Guentzel, a good top 6 winger in Rakell, Letang and bunch of mediocrity on D and F depth. That is generally a worse, or at least comparable, team than Winnipeg has iced up until this point.

I am confused. Who's had better rosters, Pittsburgh or Winnipeg?

Hellebucyk is a very good goalie and would make a ton of sense for a team like Carolina or LA to go all-in on. I don't see it for the Pens. We're better off using the assets and cap space elsewhere.

The cap space is about 1m over what a starting goalie will get next year. Probably add another 3.5m in years after, which may or may not matter. Even so, that's basically having an extra top six/top four guy over an ELC. It's not a massive boost.

Asset value is unknown of course.

 

[SomeDude]

I am confused. Who's had better rosters, Pittsburgh or Winnipeg?

I'm saying that the current Pens roster is not better than what Hellebucyk has had in front of him so far in his career. While being consistently one of the best goalies in the league, he has not been able to carry those Jets teams very far outside of 1 conference finals. I don't know why anyone thinks he could carry the current Pens team anywhere.

 

[PensandCaps]

No they didn't.

Also Winnipeg has won more playoff series since the Penguins 2017 cup win than the Penguins have won.

Kinda proving his point? They've had better teams.

I'm saying that the current Pens roster is not better than what Hellebucyk has had in front of him so far in his career. While being consistently one of the best goalies in the league, he has not been able to carry those Jets teams very far outside of 1 conference finals. I don't know why anyone thinks he could carry the current Pens team anywhere.

And that 2017-18 team was stacked and a legit cup threat.

 

[Peat]

I'm saying that the current Pens roster is not better than what Hellebucyk has had in front of him so far in his career. While being consistently one of the best goalies in the league, he has not been able to carry those Jets teams very far outside of 1 conference finals. I don't know why anyone thinks he could carry the current Pens team anywhere.

Fair.

Still, that's every single player they can add on their lonesome. It's all about the sum total of the additions.

Which I get is your point. That for a team with a lot of needs, maybe you don't want to put too much into any one need.

I just don't think we should rule out Hellebuyck as the guy when we don't know prices - for him, for other goalies, for wings, for anyone. It's not like there's a whole ton of competent goalies out there right now to make it sure you can score one on the cheap.

 

[PensandCaps]

Fair.

Still, that's every single player they can add on their lonesome. It's all about the sum total of the additions.

Which I get is your point. That for a team with a lot of needs, maybe you don't want to put too much into any one need.

I just don't think we should rule out Hellebuyck as the guy when we don't know prices - for him, for other goalies, for wings, for anyone. It's not like there's a whole ton of competent goalies out there right now to make it sure you can score one on the cheap.

Getting Helle and getting even anything positive from the bottom 6 would go a long way. Like, trading for Helle can work if Dubas finds cap and assets to be able to revamp the bottom 6 too. That said, i expect more young cheap players to be in the bottom 6 now, guys like Puus are gonna get chances now.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Our current roster is not very good. We have 2 aging superstars who are still very good players but no longer capable of carrying a team, a very good winger in Guentzel, a good top 6 winger in Rakell, Letang and bunch of mediocrity on D and F depth. That is generally a worse, or at least comparable, team than Winnipeg has iced up until this point.

Hellebucyk is a very good goalie and would make a ton of sense for a team like Carolina or LA to go all-in on. I don't see it for the Pens. We're better off using the assets and cap space elsewhere.

My point is that Winnipeg's roster was not actually good and Hellebuyck made that mediocre team look much better. The Penguins roster is better than the rosters the Jets have had because the Jets rosters have not been good for the most part.

It's not an endorsement of the Penguins by saying their roster is better than Winnipeg's, Winnipeg was mostly just carried by Hellebuyck over the years. Their 2017-2018 team is the only team I would actually call "good" and better than what the Penguins have today.

The Jets have been mediocre ever since Byfuglien and Little retired (LTIRetired in Little's case) and Trouba left., so basically since the start of the 2019-2020 season.

 

[Jacob]

What’s the point of clearing cap space with one of our few assets? We’ll then have to overpay for UFAs and still hope and pray they sign here.

 

[BusinessGoose]

Adin friggen Hill just won the Stanley Cup.

I'm not sure if this is an argument for a team being hot or a goalie being hot?

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

I don't think a team is gonna pay the price Winnipeg is gonna ask, and likely get, for Hellebuyck without being a place he will re-sign. He wants a Cup, a team like Pittsburgh is not a place he's going to want to re-sign at. There's no reason to even entertain the idea of trading for Hellebuyck, imo, even though he'd be a great get for this team. Don't think the Pens have the assets, nor do I think they'd pay to get him knowing he won't stick around. /shrug

But it's almost July and we're half a decade into no hockey for months by this point in the calendar, so I get it. Boredom and ambition.

 

[Pens x]

That said, i expect more young cheap players to be in the bottom 6 now, guys like Puus are gonna get chances now.

Sully is still here, bud.

 

[Zbynek]

I still don't see how it is wise to pay virtually all of our assets of any value for a goalie that is going to eat up a ton of cap space to play him in front of a mediocre team and defense.

Use the assets/cap space to improve the team and put a competent but unspectacular goalie tandem behind them.

Yes because that worked so well for the Cup hopeful Hurricanes who got absolutely smoked in 4 games by the Panthers and their 10 million dollar goalie.

The other issue with that is we currently have 0/2 competent goalies, so we're talking twice the work to shuffle the cards.

Pay the price now on Helle and the goalie position is once and for all sorted. There's still cap for a 1LD and shiny new pieces for the 3rd line. You have the rest of Geno/Sid's window to sort out the rest of the team, but a Connor Hellebuyck only becomes available once in a blue moon.

Pull the trigger and get the best goalie this franchise has ever had.