Player Discussion William Nylander

[hamzarocks]

He has been fine man, you just cant seem to see the difference between being a bad player versus being an overpaid player.

Also, you conveniently ignored my other response that mentioned other elite talent with the same price tag or higher being at a similar pace this early in the season, proving how pointless it is to measure a players worth based on 7 regular season games.

Ofcourse 88, 16, amd 34 arent bad players?

If they were bad we would have been the Calgary flames last year with a 10+M 50-60 pt player

They are potentially overpaid at 13.25M, 11.5M and 11M. The leafs cant afford these three guys to be overpaid for even short stretches

We have tavares probably as a 8M+ dead cap

Rielly looms 3M overpaid at the moment.

Its 7 games sure, but it needs to be established the core 3 have failed early on. If they recover and finish top 7 or 8ish in the league in pts then I will be very happy with their reg season play and they will be worth it for reg season.

They either need to dominate the reg season like mentioned above, or if they produce below expectations and pay grade then they better light it up come playoffs.

Cant suck and underperform in both, that is how you become John tavares.

 

[Confucius]

The line of McMann -- Domi -- Nylander has been by far the Leafs best trio. Willy doesn't need an + $11 mil #1C to drive offense for the Leafs on his own line.

The trio have combined for 8 goals 9 assists 17 points and a +15 +/-

View attachment 920533

The weakest link defensively in Leafs top 12 scorers is Marner who is the only negative +/- player at -2 being on the ice for more goals against that goals for at 5v5 even strength.

If I were to agree with you that Marner has been our weakest link so far this season because of his minus 2, would you agree he’s been our strongest playoff performer the last 3 years based on his plus 11 over those games?

Nylander - last 3 seasons -1, career +1
Tavares - last 3 seasons -1, career as a leaf -9
Mathews- last 3 seasons +5, career +2
Marner- last 3 years +11, career +10

 

[notDatsyuk]

Nylander hasnt been our best player on most nights, no idea where you are getting that from

Best players

Stolarz
Tanev
OEL

Everyone else is after those three.

Matthews has been the best player soem games but has a pitiful 5 pts in 7 games.

Nylander has been best in some games and has 7 in 7 same as marner

All three are way too low which has driven us to a 4-3 record when we should be 6-1 or 7-0.

We are 1 game away from ~10% of the season (8/82).

Last year he came out blazing and was basically producing at will. He needs to be doing more of that to avoid becoming the next John tavares.

He has all the time to bounce back, but don't pretend his play & production is tolerable for a 11.5M player

I might give you OEL, but Willy's been the best forward most nights.

I'm not sure he needs to 'bounce back' from 7 games.

If you want to look at small sample sizes (and likely more relevant): since they removed his anchor, he has 5 goals and 7 points in 5 games - an 82 goal and 115 point pace.

 

[hamzarocks]

I might give you OEL, but Willy's been the best forward most nights.

I'm not sure he needs to 'bounce back' from 7 games.

If you want to look at small sample sizes (and likely more relevant): since they removed his anchor, he has 5 goals and 7 points in 5 games - an 82 goal and 115 point pace.

Hopefully that pace (ofcourse goals not being 82 lol) is what he plays at this year

115 pace from here on out with 45-50G will be worth every penny of his deal

Every game matters for this team. Need to win the division and get a wild card matchup

Extremely unconfident we beat BOS or FLR in a 7 game series. Win the divisiom amd get Tampa or WSH type team

For that 88/34/16 need to be clicking at that 115 pt pace you mentioned for basically all of the year

 

[Jojalu]

Hopefully that pace (ofcourse goals not being 82 lol) is what he plays at this year

115 pace from here on out with 45-50G will be worth every penny of his deal

Every game matters for this team. Need to win the division and get a wild card matchup

Extremely unconfident we beat BOS or FLR in a 7 game series. Win the divisiom amd get Tampa or WSH type team

For that 88/34/16 need to be clicking at that 115 pt pace you mentioned for basically all of the year

I would say who cares how many points the get if they can actually win the Cup. Then it doesn't matter how much any of them are paid.

 

[thewave]

If I were to agree with you that Marner has been our weakest link so far this season because of his minus 2, would you agree he’s been our strongest playoff performer the last 3 years based on his plus 11 over those games?

Nylander - last 3 seasons -1, career +1
Tavares - last 3 seasons -1, career as a leaf -9
Mathews- last 3 seasons +5, career +2
Marner- last 3 years +11, career +10

It's because Keefe had him out for every empty net opportunity.

 

[francis246]

It's because Keefe had him out for every empty net opportunity.

The Leafs scored a total of three empty net goals in the playoffs over the last three years (2021-2023). This includes one empty-net goal in the 2021 playoffs, two in 2022, and none in 2023.

Gotta check 2024. And who was out there

 

[notDatsyuk]

Goals have never and wont ever matter for me

I need ross finish

58 goals wont be preserved so hopefully can break 100 pts or so

Hes about 3.5M overpaid so far this year. Very early so has time tk bounce back

So Tavares, who had been a ppg player once in his previous three seasons, and averaged 0.93 ppg with 98 goals, was worth 14.7% of the cap, but Nylander, who has been a ppg player in two of his previous three seasons (missed the other by one point), and averaged 1.08 ppg with 114 goals, is worth 9.1%?

 

[hamzarocks]

So Tavares, who had been a ppg player once in his previous three seasons, and averaged 0.93 ppg with 98 goals, was worth 14.7% of the cap, but Nylander, who has been a ppg player in two of his previous three seasons (missed the other by one point), and averaged 1.08 ppg with 114 goals, is worth 9.1%?

When have I ever said Tavares was 14.7% of the cap?

His 88 pt year where he was 16th in scoring ad 22nd in ppg he was probably a 9M player at best though even that was high

He was a 7M-8M from 2020-2023

He has been a 4M these past season and 7 gamrd

Nylander should have come in at 9.5M or maybe 10M tops

Tavares is the worse case scenerio for nylander. If he ends a ~ppg player in current scoring environment at 11.5M hes an albatross

Luckily 7 games is small sample still

 

[Confucius]

The Leafs scored a total of three empty net goals in the playoffs over the last three years (2021-2023). This includes one empty-net goal in the 2021 playoffs, two in 2022, and none in 2023.

Gotta check 2024. And who was out there

Marner has never scored an empty net playoff goal
And we didn’t score 1 last year

 

[francis246]

Marner has never scored an empty net playoff goal
And we didn’t score 1 last year

There you have it. Data collected lol

 

[thewave]

Marner has never scored an empty net playoff goal
And we didn’t score 1 last year

So +3 and then he probably has a couple +2 or +3 from jumping on the ice before a goal or skating slowly off the ice on a shift change.

So really they are about the same +/-

 

[notDatsyuk]

When have I ever said Tavares was 14.7% of the cap?

His 88 pt year where he was 16th in scoring ad 22nd in ppg he was probably a 9M player at best though even that was high

He was a 7M-8M from 2020-2023

He has been a 4M these past season and 7 gamrd

Nylander should have come in at 9.5M or maybe 10M tops

Tavares is the worse case scenerio for nylander. If he ends a ~ppg player in current scoring environment at 11.5M hes an albatross

Luckily 7 games is small sample still

I didn't say you said that.

That was what he got.

At least try to respond to what I said. Better yet, don't.

 

[hamzarocks]

I didn't say you said that.

That was what he got.

At least try to respond to what I said. Better yet, don't.

Why are you posting stupid shit that I didnt say or argue

Just posting b/c?

I get nylander is your boy but Riding for him like this is a new level.

 

[BraveCanadian]

So +3 and then he probably has a couple +2 or +3 from jumping on the ice before a goal or skating slowly off the ice on a shift change.

So really they are about the same +/-

So now we’re just going to totally make things up?

 

[Confucius]

So +3 and then he probably has a couple +2 or +3 from jumping on the ice before a goal or skating slowly off the ice on a shift change.

So really they are about the same +/-

I see, never give up…
Oh and we have only 2 empty netters in the last 3 years. Franci246 went back 4 years, as he had 3 years but not last season’s.

 

[thewave]

So now we’re just going to totally make things up?

It's +/- it's practically totally made up to begin with.

 

[ACC1224]

So now we’re just going to totally make things up?

Now?

 

[Mess]

If I were to agree with you that Marner has been our weakest link so far this season because of his minus 2, would you agree he’s been our strongest playoff performer the last 3 years based on his plus 11 over those games?

Nylander - last 3 seasons -1, career +1
Tavares - last 3 seasons -1, career as a leaf -9
Mathews- last 3 seasons +5, career +2
Marner- last 3 years +11, career +10

Defensively we can all agree that Marner is not the weakest link Defensively come playoff time, but its GOALS that decide WINS and LOSSES in the playoffs and Leafs struggle to score more than 2 goals for a game in many recent outings.

It should also be evidently clear that Marner is the WEAKEST offensive player when it comes to goal scoring come playoff time of the core 4 forwards. Marner has scored a mere 11 goals over 8 seasons and 9 playoff rounds, including going goalless across 18 straight playoff games and 3 playoff series including the embarrassing losses to CBJ and MON first round exits. Had Marner managed even a single KEY goal in those series could the outcome have been different for the Leafs between bowing out early and continuing on?

Getting paid like a top 10 player in the NHL has to be about more than just defensively however as that is only 1 side of the coin, of not being on the ice for more goals against then for. I can show you dozens upon dozens of players that have a +10 +/- playoff rating over their careers and not getting paid $11 mil dollars to just prevent goals against.

Example:
Former Leaf Zach Hyman for example scored 16 playoff goals just last playoff year alone and was a +12 +/- while making only $5 mil AAV vs Marner 11 playoff goals career and +10 +/- combined.

 

[thewave]

Defensively we can all agree that Marner is not the weakest link Defensively come playoff time, but its GOALS that decide WINS and LOSSES in the playoffs and Leafs struggle to score more than 2 goals for a game in many recent outings.

It should also be evidently clear that Marner is the WEAKEST offensive player when it comes to goal scoring come playoff time of the core 4 forwards. Marner has scored a mere 11 goals over 8 seasons and 9 playoff rounds, including going goalless across 18 straight playoff games and 3 playoff series including the embarrassing losses to CBJ and MON first round exits. Had Marner managed even a single KEY goal in those series could the outcome have been different for the Leafs between bowing out early and continuing on?

Getting paid like a top 10 player in the NHL has to be about more than just defensively however as that is only 1 side of the coin, of not being on the ice for more goals against then for. I can show you dozens upon dozens of players that have a +10 +/- playoff rating over their careers and not getting paid $11 mil dollars to just prevent goals against.

Example:
Former Leaf Zach Hyman for example scored 16 playoff goals just last playoff year alone and was a +12 +/- while making only $5 mil AAV vs Marner 11 playoff goals career and +10 +/- combined.

View attachment 920689 View attachment 920690

Don't stop there. The best part is Hyman scored more goals in a single playoff run than Marner in his career. That was done in less than half the playoff games Marner played in. Oh and was done deeper where the competition is harder.

Nylander is getting the goals we need to move on. He is clutch. He is important even if overpaid.

 

[ULF_55]

Leafs need a Kucherov, heck even Kessel stepped up in the toughest games.

Kessel was never mistaken for a Selke candidate just a winner.

 

[Its not your fault]

Ofcourse 88, 16, amd 34 arent bad players?

If they were bad we would have been the Calgary flames last year with a 10+M 50-60 pt player

They are potentially overpaid at 13.25M, 11.5M and 11M. The leafs cant afford these three guys to be overpaid for even short stretches

We have tavares probably as a 8M+ dead cap

Rielly looms 3M overpaid at the moment.

Its 7 games sure, but it needs to be established the core 3 have failed early on. If they recover and finish top 7 or 8ish in the league in pts then I will be very happy with their reg season play and they will be worth it for reg season.

They either need to dominate the reg season like mentioned above, or if they produce below expectations and pay grade then they better light it up come playoffs.

Cant suck and underperform in both, that is how you become John tavares.

JT did his thing and we made out okay but that was funny. Lol

 

[notDatsyuk]

Why are you posting stupid shit that I didnt say or argue

Just posting b/c?

I get nylander is your boy but Riding for him like this is a new level.

You said "When have I ever said Tavares was 14.7% of the cap?"

I said "I didn't say you said that."

It has nothing to do with Nylander or anyone else - don't blame me for calling you out on your mistake.

 

[Dekes For Days]

It's because Keefe had him out for every empty net opportunity.

He wasn't on the ice for any of the Leaf's EN playoff goals during the Keefe era.

 

[Aashir Mallik]

Head in ass mode. Brutal turnover for the 4th goal

He got paid and checked out