Post-Game Talk: Wild @ Jets | MTS Centre | Thu Sep 19, 7pm

[han316]

But we're talking about Exhibition man. What are we talking about? Exhibition? We're talking about Exhibition, man. We're talking about Exhibition. We're talking about Exhibition. We ain't talking about Regular Season. We're talking about Exhibition, man. When you come to the arena, and you see them play, you see them play don't you? You've seen them give everything They've got, right? But we're talking about Exhibition right now. We talking about Exhibition

 

[Ossific]

Someone should redo the Jim Mora video. Pre-Season?! You want to talk about Pre-Season?! How about lets try to win a training camp scrimmage first.

 

[wpgsilver]

This thread is comical.

 

[DEANYOUNGBLOOD17]

But we're talking about Exhibition man. What are we talking about? Exhibition? We're talking about Exhibition, man. We're talking about Exhibition. We're talking about Exhibition. We ain't talking about Regular Season. We're talking about Exhibition, man. When you come to the arena, and you see them play, you see them play don't you? You've seen them give everything They've got, right? But we're talking about Exhibition right now. We talking about Exhibition

Practice

 

[DEANYOUNGBLOOD17]

"Playoffs"............."Playoffs"..............."Playoffs".......................................

......."Im just hoping we win another game"

 

[Joe Hallenback]

So, by that logic, they wouldn't be motivated in the playoffs, either. Strange logic.

I think that players are motivated by playing in meaningful games, and pre-season games aren't meaningful. So I am not surprised at a lack of intensity.

Players are also motivated by trying to make a team, so many of the veteran Jets are probably unmotivated by a pre-season game.

My comment about Noel had nothing to do with the Jets showing a lack of motivation last night - that's on the players. I am concerned with the overall body of Noel's work, and a growing concern that he hasn't been learning and improving his own coaching approach at the NHL level. I admit that I could be completely wrong, but coaching does make a difference in the NHL and I don't see any signs that the Jets have an edge in that area, and several signs that they might be out-coached too often.

Here is my take on your comment and a lot of comments on these boards. What experience gives you the ability to determine that the coaching approach isn't at the NHL level. What signs would give him an edge over other coaches.

Do you know what organization has put the most coaches into the NHL currently? Its the one that is currently running this team. They have a pretty amazing track record of NHL coaches and I think last year they had 4 of them in the NHL Vigneault,Carlye,Arniel and Noel.

Ill give them slack for now. They seem to know when the right time to cut loose coaches is from their AHL days.

 

[Zhamnov10]

I thought that the main goal of pre-season is to iron out any issues that will prevent you from winning games in the regular season? I just hate apathy and mediocrity in anything, especially sports. It drives me crazy to see talented people coast.

I do understand what you're saying, but I get a little high strung with sports and competition of any kind.

Exactly they should be ironing out the pp since day 1 because one of the main reasons for not making the playoffs was our special teams

 

[han316]

Practice

 

[han316]

Exactly they should be ironing out the pp since day 1 because one of the main reasons for not making the playoffs was our special teams

Just exactly how do you iron out the pp when you have almost 60 players at camp on day 1?

 

[surixon]

Here is my take on your comment and a lot of comments on these boards. What experience gives you the ability to determine that the coaching approach isn't at the NHL level. What signs would give him an edge over other coaches.

Do you know what organization has put the most coaches into the NHL currently? Its the one that is currently running this team. They have a pretty amazing track record of NHL coaches and I think last year they had 4 of them in the NHL Vigneault,Carlye,Arniel and Noel.

Ill give them slack for now. They seem to know when the right time to cut loose coaches is from their AHL days.

Fair enough! Having said that Vignealt was only here for a year so its hard to say that we successfully put him in the show. I quite liked arniel when he was here and was shocked he didn't do better in the show. So really the only great coach that we have produced is Carlyle IMO. So I'm not as ready to give the org as much slack with coaches as you are. Its a different ball game coaching in the NHL than AHL.

 

[DEANYOUNGBLOOD17]

????

 

[Gump Hasek]

The Jets actually have a pretty good system and one that is employed by the Stanley cup winners Chicago. A very high temp forecheck with 2 men deep pressuring the puck at all times in the offensive zone. Once they retrieve the puck they will employ a cycle that will include the D men pinching at will.

They also want to stay "high" in the neutral zone and have the wingers funnel everything to the middle. This should allow for quick transitions on turnovers that should lead to odd man breaks.

Their defensive zone coverage is a fairly standard triangle down low where the 2 defense men and center try to form triangles to help support the puck and also provide coverage on passing lanes. They don't want the wingers cheating down low in the defensive zone and prefer them to stay high with the off puck winger watching for guys sneaking into the high slot.

When they follow the system plan and work hard, because these systems require a very high tempo to maintain, they are usually are pretty effective. LLW really work this too their advantage because of their combination of size,speed and skill.

I also think this is why a guy like Jokinen had a rough time last year as he doesn't seem to excel in a high tempo system. Which also means that guys like Frolik and Seto should excel in this system as Frolik played it in Chicago and Seto has the physical and skill prereqs to do it.

This is a great post, Joe, well done. It might serve a few of Noel's many critics here to read and comprehend the information contained within. It is difficult to find much wrong with the systems deployed by the Jets under Noel - aside from their weak pp last season. Noel's problem has mainly been in my own view that he has been saddled with a weak roster over the past two seasons, though this year it appears they've more horses in place now to move beyond being just a one line team.

 

[Whileee]

Here is my take on your comment and a lot of comments on these boards. What experience gives you the ability to determine that the coaching approach isn't at the NHL level. What signs would give him an edge over other coaches.

Do you know what organization has put the most coaches into the NHL currently? Its the one that is currently running this team. They have a pretty amazing track record of NHL coaches and I think last year they had 4 of them in the NHL Vigneault,Carlye,Arniel and Noel.

Ill give them slack for now. They seem to know when the right time to cut loose coaches is from their AHL days.

...ummm, are we only allowed to post positive opinions? I didn't get the memo. If so, we need another forum.

I probably have as much experience / knowledge as many of the folks who praise Noel, and there are people with much more experience than I who also have expressed their concerns. So, should we only credit inexperienced and unqualified posters who support Noel?

Chevy just got his deal extended to five years from now. In signing the core of players and extending Chevy, Chipman has indicated how he likes the core and Chevy's work, and wants to have stability.

Noel's contract has not been extended beyond this year, as yet. Do you think that the Jets' ownership and management are convinced that Noel has shown them that he is the answer as Jets' coach? If so, what evidence do you have for that?

 

[Gump Hasek]

Noel's contract has not been extended beyond this year, as yet.

Actually, yes it has. He had one year left on his deal and that was extended by another year; his deal runs through to the end of the 14/15 season. He was essentially given the coming two seasons to show an improvement in their record.

http://www.cbc.ca/sports/hockey/nhl/jets-give-coach-claude-noel-1-year-contract-extension-1.1395036

 

[Whileee]

Actually, yes it has. He had one year left on his deal and that was extended by another year; his deal runs through to the end of the 14/15 season. He was essentially given the coming two seasons to show an improvement in their record.

http://www.cbc.ca/sports/hockey/nhl/jets-give-coach-claude-noel-1-year-contract-extension-1.1395036

Thanks... I missed that. I was overseas at the time.

 

[Bartho]

Will Noel be an AHL coach with no system when the Jets win, or is that just reserved for when they lose?

 

[wpgsilver]

Will Noel be an AHL coach with no system when the Jets win, or is that just reserved for when they lose?

Criticism of Noel has been taking place win or lose. A lot of people have legitimate gripes about his coaching style regardless of a particular result.

 

[surixon]

Will Noel be an AHL coach with no system when the Jets win, or is that just reserved for when they lose?

His system at ES and in PK is fine. However the team has no semblence of a pp and a decent amount of blame falls on the coaching staff for this.

I also don't believe that he has shown the ability to adapt his system mid game as of yet which IMO seperates the great coaches from the mediocre.

 

[Grind]

This is a great post, Joe, well done. It might serve a few of Noel's many critics here to read and comprehend the information contained within. It is difficult to find much wrong with the systems deployed by the Jets under Noel - aside from their weak pp last season. Noel's problem has mainly been in my own view that he has been saddled with a weak roster over the past two seasons, though this year it appears they've more horses in place now to move beyond being just a one line team.

I won't disagree, it's a good post and Noels system does seem to be a generally effective one, or at the very least "ok".

The biggest issue I've had (and most other Noel critics i think) with Noel has been his player usage. Continually doing things that not only "look" ineffective/bad/stupid but also have not been the "statistically" advantageous moves. As mentioned Pavelec on back to backs, kanes linemates, and continual changing of player combinations that are working but "riding out" ones that aren't (except for late in a game).

 

[Joe Hallenback]

I think good criticism is the weak PP or playing Pavlec in back to backs. I think those arguments have merit and are worth debating. Many people who are not Noel fans will do just that and I can respect them for their opinion based on those kinds of arguments.

I just can't respect an opinion when people are not even trying to properly debate it with people.

 

[Bartho]

His system at ES and in PK is fine. However the team has no semblence of a pp and a decent amount of blame falls on the coaching staff for this.

I also don't believe that he has shown the ability to adapt his system mid game as of yet which IMO seperates the great coaches from the mediocre.

I'm certainly not going to argue that the PP isn't in need of serious work, and I agree that much of the responsibility does rest with the coaches. I just find all these over the top, knee-jerk reactions to a preseason loss to be ridiculous.

 

[Guardian17]

I was really disappointed with last night's game.

The Jets are a soft team and easy to play against.

I do not know how we can correct this before the season starts.

 

[truck]

This is a great post, Joe, well done. It might serve a few of Noel's many critics here to read and comprehend the information contained within. It is difficult to find much wrong with the systems deployed by the Jets under Noel - aside from their weak pp last season. Noel's problem has mainly been in my own view that he has been saddled with a weak roster over the past two seasons, though this year it appears they've more horses in place now to move beyond being just a one line team.

My big issue with the system is that the players Noel trusts to play they system (Wright, Jokinen and GST) have been consistently less effective than the players that have landed in his dog house.

My hope is that this changes when the personnel and system are more in tune, but I am not certain that this will be the case. Only time will tell.

Having a solid system is one thing. Application is another.

 

[peg]

I'm not sure if this has been discussed, but I was not a fan of Noel benching Wheeler. Wheeler knows what he has to do and needs time to shake the rust off. He doesn't always burn it up at the beginning of the season if my memory is correct Having him sit on the bench was imho counter-productive.

As a general comment. I think motivation was a HUGE factor in yesterdays game. As much as we would like the boys to play every game as if the playoffs were in the balance, we had a bunch of our regulars, secure in their future roll, playing against a bunch of hungry kids desperately trying to make it into the show. If this was a game that really counted the talent difference would have been clear.

 

[SensibleGuy]

Somebody should tell Noel and the players not to worry about last night because it sounds to me like they viewed the game just like I did - as another example of them playing down to a weaker opponent. We all know its just pre-season and nothing to get overly worked up about, but its worrisome nonetheless...